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Deniro_JG52
03-11-2004, 12:38 PM
I'm a regular visitor of Oleg's ready room and today i finnaly found a good reason to register. Why, oh why have you not included a Croat campaign?

Deniro_JG52
03-11-2004, 12:38 PM
I'm a regular visitor of Oleg's ready room and today i finnaly found a good reason to register. Why, oh why have you not included a Croat campaign?

WWTaco
03-11-2004, 01:46 PM
Yeah I'm croatian- 3rd genration in Amermica..

Where's the sheep and pitchforks?????


S!

Taco

Cossack13
03-11-2004, 02:01 PM
Are you volunteering to design one?

http://www.tolwyn.com/~cossack/White13.gif
What ever you do, do
NOT buy an Alienware!

Tvrdi
03-11-2004, 02:46 PM
yes we need croatian markings :-)

pozdrav

Deniro_JG52
03-11-2004, 03:23 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Cossack13:
Are you volunteering to design one?

http://www.tolwyn.com/~cossack/White13.gif
What ever you do, do
NOT buy an Alienware!
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


No, i don't have the time or the skill for it. I am only awed by the fact that Slovak campaign was included, but Croat wasn't. I think Croats downed about twice more Russian planes than Slovaks so IMHO Croats should be in the AEP and not Slovaks.

Btw.

Did someone noticed bad FM of Ta-152H-1 at low altitudes?

By some sources (JG/301 anyone?)that plane could out-turn Tempest Fury under 250 m.

One more serious mistake in the object viewer. You can read there that Ta-152's were used for defending Me-262 at take-off and landing but the thruth (again by the words of JG/301 pilots) was different. When JG/301 received Ta-152's there wasn't enough units for the whole squadron so only stabschwarm got them, all others got Me-262 and Doras. What do you think, would highest ranking officers of the whole squadron chose inferior planes for their battle-mounts? I don't think so.


...and now starts the "luftwhiner" crapp...
...common boys, let me have it...

Tvrdi
03-11-2004, 06:22 PM
ur right

Agamemnon22
03-11-2004, 06:57 PM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Deniro_JG52:

One more serious mistake in the object viewer. You can read there that Ta-152's were used for defending Me-262 at take-off and landing but the thruth (again by the words of JG/301 pilots) was different. When JG/301 received Ta-152's there wasn't enough units for the whole squadron so only stabschwarm got them, all others got Me-262 and Doras. What do you think, would highest ranking officers of the whole squadron chose inferior planes for their battle-mounts? I don't think so.

[QUOTE]


Er... that's not the point. The 262 was a dog at low speed and could not avoid incoming fighters while on landing approach. Therefore, Doras and presumably Ta-152's were sent up to cover landing 262's. In fact, some 190's had their bottom surfaces painted red and white stripes, so the airfield AA would know not to shoot them. It's not a question of superiority, its a question of protecting your squadron.

csThor
03-11-2004, 11:36 PM
Ehm no.

The Stabsschwarm of JG 301 was used to provide the units of this Geschwader with Take-off and landing protection. They never did this for Me 262 as JG301 used Fw 190 A-8, A-9 and D-9 at this stage of the war.

Ta 152's protecting Me 262's is a myth.

______________________________

<A HREF="http://www.il2skins.com/?action=list&authoridfilter=csThor" TARGET=_blank>
http://home.arcor.de/csthor/bilder/ubi_sig.jpg </A>

csThor's skins @ Il2skins.com

269GA-Veltro
03-12-2004, 02:05 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Tvrdi:
yes we need croatian markings :-)

pozdrav<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Why not? I agree, but also Yugoslavian would be great. Yes, absolutely agreed.

Croatian Air Force: BF 109, G 50, MC 205 and....

269GA~Veltro
http://ourworld.cs.com/VeltroF/mc202tav4.jpg
www.269ga.it (http://www.269ga.it)

Hristo_
03-12-2004, 03:48 AM
Croatian voice pack would be a logical first step.

Since I'm a Croat, I volnuteer to act as one of the voices.

Malo kajkavskog ne skodi http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://easyweb.globalnet.hr/easyweb/users/ntomlino/uploads/sig.jpg
"Boom and Zoom does NOT equal Hit and Run. Not the same thing, no way, no how. BnZ means I manage my energy state (while judging yours) to keep myself from getting into your sights in the vertical.
Turn and Burn is the first refuge of the uneducated, Hit and Run the last refuge of the incompetent, while BnZ is the sign of a true master of Air Combat."
-Moggy, 666th Internet Daemons

Tvrdi
03-12-2004, 05:21 AM
Hristo, you want to become a member of PE or KroatJG1? ja sam u obe eskadrile :-) pa javi se

PE_Papundek
03-12-2004, 06:01 AM
I second that!
Croats should be included, at least markings if not campaign.

Here's short history of 15/JG52 if someone's
interested:
History of 15/JG52 (http://www.15jg52.com/history_real.asp)

p.s.
Including Yugoslavia isn't really a must, since they had very small impact on war.
History of Yugoslav Aviation (http://www.partizanska-eskadrila.com/PEHistory.htm)

If Parachute is packed right,
an Airman lives to fight another day!

http://adria.fesb.hr/~nbarac/tmp/papun_sm.jpg

Valter_15JG52
03-12-2004, 06:39 AM
Bump!

S!

http://flrcg.rasip.fer.hr/bbruno/il2/v_sig.gif

stelr
03-12-2004, 12:08 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by WWTaco:
Yeah I'm croatian- 3rd genration in Amermica..

Where's the sheep and pitchforks?????


S!

Taco<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hey Taco!! I'm second generation in the USA. My parents had to learn English in school since only Croatian was spoken in the house. As a result I can curse fluently in Croatian. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/59.gif

Big S!

v/r
Stel
AKA "Machek"

http://home.nc.rr.com/stel/LTCSTEL11.jpg

lotharrendulic
03-12-2004, 01:15 PM
I'm of Croatian decent and would love to see some Croatian markings and a campaign. Croatia had several highscoring aces during WWII and were involved in some of the great battles including Stalingrad. Gunter Rall even flew with some Croats as part of JG52 and said they were fine pilots. How about it guys?

P.S. my own great uncle was a German General during WWII hence my user name Lothar Rendulic

Robo.
03-12-2004, 01:15 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Deniro_JG52:
No, i don't have the time or the skill for it. I am only awed by the fact that Slovak campaign was included, but Croat wasn't. I think Croats downed about twice more Russian planes than Slovaks so IMHO Croats should be in the AEP and not Slovaks.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Deniro_JG52 and others - I`m Slovak and actually on from the team which made the Slovak add-on for AEP. Sure you can be awed, but blame yourself for this. We did really a lot to get the Slovaks in there (worked since September on it...). Just look on all the single missions, medals, aircraft skins, new markings, ID numbers, pilot skins, pilot roster BW photoghraps, high quality voicepack and other details we did. I`m really not glad to hear your opinion. You had the chance to do the same, you still can for next patch. Please stop whining. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/mockface.gif Well, Hrvatska add-on would be really cool...

S!

If you need some help, just write.

WereSnowleopard
03-12-2004, 07:30 PM
I did asked that one before and I was told that it was too late to add to AEP at that point. So look like hope that we may have one soon long as we keep post message to ask to be sure that 15./ JG52 not one to be forgetten. One big problem is 15./JG 52 isn't under Croata control but just regiment in German air force. In early stage of Croata air force at home base they go anti-partisan patrols then finally in late stage, they flew fight against enemy planes. That will be hard to model "Kroata" campaign as they fly for German regiment in early then for their own Croata air force in late.

[This message was edited by WereSnowleopard on Fri March 12 2004 at 08:01 PM.]

Hunger
03-12-2004, 08:42 PM
I also vote for the croats, dont forget Italians (Athough they need more planes) and the Bulgarians (They need a map).

Regards
Hunger

thegoose001
03-12-2004, 09:10 PM
i'd never even heard about a Slovak pack being part of AEP.........its still not out in Aus http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

http://www.milartgl.com/m_chernev/DSC00153.jpg
TheGoose
thegoose001@hotmail.com

Robo.
03-12-2004, 11:24 PM
Sure, the Slovak add-on is interesting for small comunity, we all wondered about the fact the Croatians, Romanians and Italians can not organise themselves to do the job. There was huge thread on SimHQ (Starshoy - creator of dgen campaign system), where all the folks were asked to cooperate. Some Croatians there said they will, as far I know.

The 13./JG52 was unit figting within Luftwaffe, too. The Slovaks flew Slovak Air Force Avias B.534, then SAF Emils, then lended Luftwaffe F-4`s, later G-2`s. In 1944 they bought own Gustavs G-6 to protect own airspace. Later, 2 of them fought in the Slovak National Uprising. I see no reason for not implementing them.

Be sure to check it out, the add-on is really in very good quality. I personally think in the best quality when compared to the other nationalities packs. You Croats should be able to understand the voicepack. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif. This was not announced specially, another campaign with voicepack and skins is not as important as new planes are, but all the players in ex Czechoslovakia will appreciate that.

WereSnowleopard
03-13-2004, 08:19 AM
Slovak 13./JG52 already in AEP. I did post my message in ready room about add some new career like Italian. Yea, good idea to add Bulgarians career into.

Valter_15JG52
03-14-2004, 07:46 AM
ROBO, congrats on your work on the Slovakian campaign. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/11.gif I'm from the croatian 15.(Kroat)/JG52 squad and we are very keen on making a croatian campaign, so we've put together a nice ammount of needed game material (skins, markings, photos...), and general historical material regarding that unit (we've even found one of it's surviving aces and met with him). Voice pack is, I think, the only part still missing.

However, I don't have much info regrading the Dynamic Generator, and what is needed to setup that part when making custom-campaigns. If you (or anyone else reading this) could give me some info on that, or point me to somewhere/someone else, we would really appreciate it.

If needed, my e-mail is sturmovikREMOVETHIS@vip.hr.

Thnx, and a big salute! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

15/JG52_Valter

http://flrcg.rasip.fer.hr/bbruno/il2/v_sig.gif

SUPERAEREO
03-14-2004, 08:33 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Hunger:
(...) and the Bulgarians (They need a map).

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yes but the Bulgarians never went to war with the USSR, they only declared war to the USA and UK in December 1941 and didn't fire a shot until November 1942 (against B-24's).
And in August '44 they changed sides and fought the Germans together with the Russians, so maybe there is not much scope for a campaign there if we don't have proper B-24's...

S!



"The first time I ever saw a jet, I shot it down."
Chuck Yaeger

mkubani
03-14-2004, 11:01 AM
Robo has said it already well enough. I am another member from the Slovak team. We have worked on the Slovak campaign for over 5 months! And yes, it is THE BEST MADE CAMPAIGN OF ALL. Just check the quality of our pilot uniforms, single missions, historical Bf-109 skins, pilot photos, etc. You have no idea what a great team effort this was!

And we really owe Oleg, Starshoy, and rest of his team a HUGE THANK YOU for implementing our files. But without our dedication and work, there would be NO SLOVAK CAMPAIGN.

So my suggestion is, if you are Croat, get together and do it! And if you need any advise, our Slovak team would be more than happy to help you.

Valter and the rest of 15./JG 52, visit us here: www.scitech.sk/svz (http://www.scitech.sk/svz) It would be a better place to discuss your campaign at our forum. We all speak English. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

BTW, here is the link for the readme from our final package sent to Oleg:

http://www.scitech.sk/svz/viewtopic.php?t=219

[This message was edited by mkubani on Sun March 14 2004 at 10:18 AM.]

mkubani
03-14-2004, 11:40 AM
Oh yes, I almost forgot. Sure, Slovaks shot down less Soviet planes(cca 200) with less pilots and less planes.

Deniro_JG52, if you don't have the time and skills to do the campaign, then don't complain about somebody else's work and READ THE CREDITS IN AEP TO KNOW MORE ABOUT WHO IS RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT! I am looking forward seeing your name in credits under Croat campaign one day.

BTW, we also didn't have the time and skills, but we did it! So had Polaks, Romanians, and French. That's no excuse for me. If you really want something, you will find a way to do it. End of discussion on my part.

[This message was edited by mkubani on Sun March 14 2004 at 04:57 PM.]

M.Boose
03-15-2004, 04:18 AM
As one from the 3 founders of Slovak addon idea, I can say 'Robo.' and 'mkubani' said all important.

Don't whine http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif and get yourselves working... we will gladly help you. Check our forum.

Rab03
03-15-2004, 04:20 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PE_Papundek:
I second that!
Croats should be included, at least markings if not campaign.

Here's short history of 15/JG52 if someone's
interested:
http://www.15jg52.com/history_real.asp

p.s.
Including Yugoslavia isn't really a must, since they had very small impact on war.
http://www.partizanska-eskadrila.com/PEHistory.htm

If Parachute is packed right,
an Airman lives to fight another day!

http://adria.fesb.hr/~nbarac/tmp/papun_sm.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Agree to Croats, but disagree with Yugoslav/partisan AF/campaign.
Reasons are:
In April 1941, when Germany attacked Yugoslavia, resistance of the non-betraying personel of the YRAF was performed in utmost bravery and the combined losses, by Gen.Lehr's confession counted at approx. 10% of attacking planes destroyed/damaged (should be noted that some planes which wreckages were found, quite unbelieveably, weren't reported lost). Now we have several planes that YRAF possesed (Hurri MkI, Blenheim, Bf-109E, and hopefully some day SM79). On the other hand, this game was originally all about Sturmovik, that is ground attack. Partisan AF fits in this nicely, since it was concentrated on fulfilling this task, support for the ground troops. Beside partisan AF, RAF, USAF, VVS and even some free Italian operated over Yugoslavia, too.
Croatian markings (leafed-like Balkencross), on the other hand, were used during very short period of time.
One more thing: more or less like the Croats in Luftwaffe, Yugoslav crews had their complete units in North Africa, in RAF, complete crews in B-17s of the USAAF, fought in VVS, etc.

Practicality: The main problem for including these campaigns is the map, since all FB maps are mostly without hills, mountains, etc. and are, in general, unsuitable for representing southern parts of Yugoslavia.
Now we have northern part of Croatia, but without Zagreb. Possible solution to map problem could be stretching of Balaton map to the south, or creating the map of northern Yugoslavia, which would extend to some parts of Austria, Hungary, Romania and Bulgary.

And, thanks for the PEHistory link.

jurinko
03-15-2004, 05:31 AM
"No, i don't have the time or the skill for it. I am only awed by the fact that Slovak campaign was included, but Croat wasn't. I think Croats downed about twice more Russian planes than Slovaks so IMHO Croats should be in the AEP and not Slovaks."

Well, me as another member of Slovak campaign/voicepack team can only say, that the Slovak campaign "was not included" by itself, but was DONE by mates here around, and it was quite bunch of work. Recently I asked Croats flying online why they didn´t ask Oleg at least for including the Croat marking and nationality.. they replied "hmm, that´s a good question".. so please stop comparing WWII kills and start to do something. We can give you necessary info on all files which are necessary for the campaign. The links above are valid.

----------------------
Letka.13/Liptow @ HL

Deniro_JG52
03-15-2004, 07:25 AM
Ok guys (Slovaks), my sincere apologies. I never realized you are responsible for Slovak campaign.



And for my felow Croats http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif :

Ajd decki, ako tko ima volje, javite mi se na mail pa da odemo na neku kavu/pivu i pobrinemo se za to da i mi dobijemo svoju kampanju.

mkubani
03-15-2004, 08:51 AM
Apology accepted. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif He he. You got it Deniro. Pivo and pizza is the best way to get the campaign done. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif At least it worked well for us during Slovak voicepack recording. Again, stop by at our Slovak forum if you need any advice with the campaign. I am looking forward to Croat markings which I consider quite cool.

WereSnowleopard
03-15-2004, 09:39 AM
I remember I read to see if we can be make career of Croata however they used to be Allied (Yugoslavia flown export model Me-109E against Luftwaffe's Me-109E) then after Yugoslavia fall, Croata's leader create legion to send some men to luftwaffe to fly 15./JG52 as rest of home base air force fly anti-partisan partol as even Yugoslavia's partisan flown mixed captured/donated planes then in almost end of war they get their own national marking from home base then in final end of war, some pilots defect to Allied and fly against Axis. Should we make only 15./JG52 foreign legion career which carry luftwaffe marking with regional marking of Kroata? or just very short career flying Croata air force with Croatian markings (leafed-like Balkencross) in some Bf-109G-10 and few G-50? Or which career do you prefer most in IL2 simulation?

PE_Papundek
03-15-2004, 11:29 AM
Rab03@ Including Yugoslav-Partisan campaign isn't must since IL2 is all about Eastern Front and I don't recall that YU-Partisans ever flow in Russia http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif
However 15(Kroat)/JG52 did flew on Krim and some other places in Russia, that's why Croatian campaign is must.

S!

If Parachute is packed right,
an Airman lives to fight another day!

http://adria.fesb.hr/~nbarac/tmp/papun_sm.jpg

Rab03
03-16-2004, 01:02 AM
To PE_Papundek:
I wasn't speaking solely about eastern front engagement. My post was about defense of Croatia, since that was the time Croat Bfs got their national markings. And to my knowledge also, there weren't exclusively Yugoslav squarons in VVS (like French Normandia-Niemen), though there were individual pilots-including those that fled from 15 Staffel/Kroat. I just wanted to help with greater goal-the one of getting map of Yugoslavia (northern part that is).

And I plan on making some skins of Kroat staffel http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif, together with partisan Spits, Hurries, etc.

Roy_15JG52
03-16-2004, 03:02 AM
@ Deniro - kada bi napisao svoj mail u kontaktima vjerojatno bi ti se netko i javio ;-)

pogledaj www.15jg52.com (http://www.15jg52.com) i javi se na kontakt mail.

Valter_15JG52
03-16-2004, 04:38 AM
Big thanx to the slovakian team for your responses and help... you'll be the first to see the eventual results http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

S!

http://flrcg.rasip.fer.hr/bbruno/il2/v_sig.gif

Deniro_JG52
03-16-2004, 08:47 AM
My fault guys, sorry.