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RACFrankenstein
09-10-2004, 02:48 AM
Hey all. I'm just looking for opinions here. Today was payday and I find myself with a little extra in the pay envelope. I've been wanting a new video card for quite some time and I just can't seem to decide which one is better for me. I wanna play in perfect mode but I also want to be current when Pacific Fighter comes out as well. I'm looking at the 9800 Pro and the GeForce 6800 (there's about $100 CDN difference between the two) Which one would be best to pick up? Can I save myself the $100 bucks and still get a good card or should I go for gold? My system's an AMD Athelon 64 3200+ with 1 Gig of ram as of right now. All opinions are welcome.

RACFrankenstein
09-10-2004, 02:48 AM
Hey all. I'm just looking for opinions here. Today was payday and I find myself with a little extra in the pay envelope. I've been wanting a new video card for quite some time and I just can't seem to decide which one is better for me. I wanna play in perfect mode but I also want to be current when Pacific Fighter comes out as well. I'm looking at the 9800 Pro and the GeForce 6800 (there's about $100 CDN difference between the two) Which one would be best to pick up? Can I save myself the $100 bucks and still get a good card or should I go for gold? My system's an AMD Athelon 64 3200+ with 1 Gig of ram as of right now. All opinions are welcome.

olaleier
09-10-2004, 02:50 AM
Dosh out for the 6800, you'll get the lovely vertex shaded water effects in PF and it'll last you a while.

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WUAF_Badsight
09-10-2004, 03:05 AM
comparing the 6800 to the Raedeon 9800 ?

dude your system has the best gaming CPU & a Gig of ram is all games need at the moment

why limit your rig ?

go for the 6800 & make it an Ultra . . . . . do it now

there always will be something better coming along , get the least graphic ******ation possible when your ready to buy

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Sam311
09-10-2004, 03:37 AM
id say save your money and get the 9800 with the xt core. Wait a few more months before you shell out all your money for ati's latest and greatest http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif You wont be disappointed. Im running a 9700pro with 2xaa and 2xaf at 1024x768, the only time the fps will ever go below 40 is when there is a bunch of explotions on the screen.

tfu_iain1
09-10-2004, 03:46 AM
ah yes, but when PF comes out he won't get to enjoy the lovely shader 3.0 effects... which with a rig like that he'd want to

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WUAF_Badsight
09-10-2004, 04:49 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Sam311:
id say save your money and get the 9800 with the xt core. Wait a few more months before you shell out all your money for ati's latest and greatest http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

if you wait , . . . . . . you always will be waiting

ill buy whatever is the best card .. . . . . & at the moment the 6800 is no worse than the X800 at 1024 (but faster in some tests , slower in others) but definantly better than the 9800's

no ATI card has PS3.0 or SLI ability at the moment (neither are really needed at the moment but why back a card that doesnt have support for either , when both are in the future of GPU,s)

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Sam311
09-10-2004, 05:01 AM
ati already supports about 90% of the ps 3.0 features

ps 3.0 is a marketing gimake anyway

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33779888

Tvrdi
09-10-2004, 05:06 AM
If u want to save ur money - pick 9800Pro...its best buy compared to 6800..BUT, If u want best performance - pick 6800 Ultra..my friend got 6800 Ultra, and boy, that card rocks with FB....

cheers
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Beirut
09-10-2004, 05:09 AM
Well I just bought a 9800 Pro a few short months ago and I'm going to be mighty upset if it gimps out on PF. Not upset at the card, upset that PF is that far ahead of the curve.

I think that for the majority of us, the 9800 series is still considered high-end. The 6800s, for now, are the ultra-high-end toys that very few of us can afford.

I'm going to get an AMD64-3000 CPU (the cheapest 64) & MB. Now with that and my 9800, the way I see it, PF better run pretty damn well, otherwise, what's left to do but just give up.

I like the advanced eye-candy, but let's not make it so advanced that only 5% of the players can have it. If that's the case, that they have all this time to build the game, could they not put in more effort tightening the code to make the game run smoother? I remember acomment about Max Payne (graphically advanced at the time) loading up in seconds because it was written in tight code.

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lbhskier37
09-10-2004, 05:35 AM
Beirut, this has been happening with games for a long time. When a new game comes out many times the fastest hardware of the time can't even run it. This is how you make a game last a long time (at least graphic engine wise) If game developers don't push the limits of hardware then hardware developers won't push their limit and good stuff will never make it down to the low end. Right now even with the best hardware you can't descently play Doom 3 with everything cranked. It was the same way when IL2 came out.

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OldMan____
09-10-2004, 06:02 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Sam311:
ati already supports about 90% of the ps 3.0 features

ps 3.0 is a marketing gimake anyway

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33779888<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Sm 3.0 is not marketing.. anyone that says that has no knowledge of computer languages theory. Its mathematicaly provable that SM3 is capable of solving things Sm2.0 cannot!! Just until know NO GAME made any Sm 3.0 shaders that cannot be done in 2.0 but it IS possible to do this kind of shaders!!

Wanna a simple example? Make a damage system qhere hits actually deform geometry!! And it keeps acummulating damage from may hits in same spot recursively.

If brute force does not solve your problem... you are not using enough!

TgD Thunderbolt56
09-10-2004, 06:49 AM
6800 Ultra....


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AnalFissure
09-10-2004, 07:22 AM
Even the 6800GT would be a better buy.

The cards aren't even in the same class. Spend the extra 100 and go with the 6800.

The 9800pro is the previous generation, and even then wasn't as good as the 9800XT. The 6800 GT will best even the next generation x800 pro -- perhaps you were confused and this is really the other card you were thinking of getting? Even then, the 6800 wins.

LeChuck59
09-10-2004, 07:32 AM
I have a 6800 GT and it's excellent. If you can find one for under $400, I'd recommend it over the Ultra. The Ultra costs $100 more, takes up two slots and two molex connectors. Not only that, but almost all the GT's out right now are overclocking safely and easily to Ultra clock speeds. I'm running everything, Doom 3, Warhammer, FarCry, and of course IL2 at 16x12 at maximum detail and a little AF and getting very solid fps (40-100, obviously depending on the game and situation).

Get a GT.

robban75
09-10-2004, 07:33 AM
Go for the X800XT, it's faster than the 6800 at the higher resolutions, and it's not as noisy.

The 6800 also requires 480W, the ATI 300W.

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Agamemnon22
09-10-2004, 08:37 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Sam311:
ati already supports about 90% of the ps 3.0 features

ps 3.0 is a marketing gimake anyway

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33779888<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Yes and no. That same effect runs on my 4200 just fine. It may be marginally less pretty than the high-end cards, but the core effect is there. The issue about 3.0 though, is not just features, which it has plenty of, but speed.

To original poster: if you can find a 6800 Ultra and want to spend the cash, that's the best out there at the moment. Second choice would be 6800GT and best bang for the buck being Geforce 6600 (yet to be seen in the wild).

LeChuck59
09-10-2004, 10:02 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by robban75:
Go for the X800XT, it's faster than the 6800 at the higher resolutions, and it's not as noisy.

The 6800 also requires 480W, the ATI 300W.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'd have to disagree there. The XT is slightly faster in some games, namely FarCry. However, in any OpenGL game like Doom 3, Nvidia has a substantial lead. In other next generation games such as Half-Life 2, performance between the two cards is essentially the same. So while it's true that when the two cards were originally launched, the XT was ahead in most situations, with new Nvidia drivers and various optimizations and implementations from the game programmers, the 6800 line is at the very least, equal to the X800 line.

Furthermore, the 6800 line does not require 480watts. The Ultra, with its two molex connectors, requires a solid 400 watt psu. The GT can get by on 300. The original suggestion of 480 watts was just that, a suggestion on the part of Nvidia, and was later ammended because so many people were taking it as solid fact. The 6800 draws little more than the last generation's 9800 XT.

So to recap, the Ultra and the XT perform similarly. The GT beats the Pro and can be overclocked to Ultra clock frequencies. Power requirements should not be considered (unless of course you're putting it in a microatx case).

olaleier
09-10-2004, 02:24 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by robban75:


The 6800 also requires 480W, the ATI 300W.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

A myth.

Nvidia adjusted their recommendation to 350W when the Ultra was released.

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Sam311
09-10-2004, 06:32 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by OldMan____:
Sm 3.0 is not marketing..<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

it is right now in this time nothing but marketing. Look at shader 2.0. Its been out for what? 3 years now and games are just now starting to use it?

Paying 100's of dollars to have hardware that is able to use features that wont even be standard for many years is not very smart. and wahts to say that enabling 3.0 in pf on nvidia hardware will not bring the game to a crawl? what about that?

Heavy_Weather
09-11-2004, 07:42 AM
either one of these cards are great, keep in mind that these companies are competitors so both cards are gonna play the same, like mentioned above, both cards have its pros and cons for different games. personally i'd say go with the one thats gonna save you some cash, if you want to sit and micromanage everything regarding shaders and pipelines blah blah blah, then you'll never get a new card http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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reddevil49
09-11-2004, 08:53 AM
I'm running the BFG 6800GT OC and do like the preformce increase I got in FB. Was able to run perfect for the first. The only problem I found was on the driver end of things. The 61.77 and down are just junk. After I installed them could not load the Finland map and they totally crashed the game and corrupted XP files as well as game files forcing a format.Now running the new 66.31 driver and so far things seem to be running smooth. I know a lot of people running the 9800pro and they just love them. So its six of one half a dozen of the other, but it all boils down to what your budget can handle. Just my two cents worth.

OldMan____
09-11-2004, 10:56 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Sam311:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by OldMan____:
Sm 3.0 is not marketing..<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

it is right now in this time nothing but marketing. Look at shader 2.0. Its been out for what? 3 years now and games are just now starting to use it?

Paying 100's of dollars to have hardware that is able to use features that wont even be standard for many years is not very smart. and wahts to say that enabling 3.0 in pf on nvidia hardware will not bring the game to a crawl? what about that?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I work in game development, and our current project will support SM 3.0. And no Sm 3.0 does not diminish performance in ANYTHING on 6800 series. When you run SM 2.0 software in these cards they run in in same pipeline used to 3.0. Usually using SM 3.0 is increasing performance if the shader is implemented to take advantage of SM 3.0

If brute force does not solve your problem... you are not using enough!

Maple_Tiger
09-11-2004, 11:05 AM
I just called the local computer store here in Fredricton NB.

Geforce 6800 Ultra. #699.99

Geforce 6800 GT. #499.00

9800 Pro. #399.00

These prices are redicualas. We Canadians are being ripped off! lol

I bet I can order anyone of these online for atleast #200 less.

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RACFrankenstein
09-11-2004, 11:46 AM
Hey all.

Thanks very much for all your input. It was very valuable. In the end I decided to go with the 9800 Pro. I chose it for several reasons:

1) The power supply in my system could handle it easily but I might have had to up it for the 6800
2) The price difference on paper wasn't much (9800 Pro $350, 6800 $400) but when it came to tracking one down, I couldn't find a 6800 in Toronto for under $439 and I managed to find a 9800 Pro for $269.
3) I've had ATI cards in the past and I wanted to stick with something I know.
4) With the cheaper price, I can now afford a TrackIR 3 AND the 9800 Pro whereas with the 6800 it was the card and nothing left over for the TrackIR 3
5) If I spent the $400+ on a video card, The Bride of Frankenstein would have used my ol' flat topped noggin for a target of the ever present frying pan!

In the end I felt the 9800 Pro was the way to go. Bang for the buck-wise I'm happy with the results (I can now play in Perfect mode and I'm not in the dog house to boot!)

One funny story in my search: I called up one of the local High Tech chains to do a little research (I won't mention the name, suffice to say their innitials are "Best Buy"...woops...)Anyway, I got the computer specialist on the phone (read: I got a 16 year old kid who didn't know or care about computers) and after getting a quote on their prices I asked about their "Best Price" policy. I was informed that they would match any advertised price as long as it was the same model and manufacturer and they could confirm it. I told them that I had found the card at another store for around $80 less than their price. He asked where and when I told him the place he said "Well, we only price match the larger stores like Wallmart, FutureShop and Canadian Tire, we can't compete with the "Big Box" stores..." I almost burst out laughing on the phone!

1) Best Buy IS a big box store! (So are FutureShop, Wallmart and Canadian Tire) So obviously they can't compete with their direct compitition. What's the point of having a price match pollicy if you can't price match your compitition?
2) Of the three stores he mentioned being able to price match, only one (FutureShop) carries the same type of stuff as Best Buy. I'm pretty sure I'm not going to find my computer components at Canadian Tire...

Frankenstein: "I'd like to buy a video card for my computer."
Canadian Tire Salesman: "What make is your computer? Ford, GM or Honda?"
Frankenstein: "Uhhhhh....none of the above?"
Candadian Tire Salesman: "Sorry, we're fresh out of video cards...would you like some Snow Tires instead? There on sale..."
Frankenstein: "Nevermind...."

Oh, and to top things off FutureShop is owned by Best Buy so their prices are identical! So as I understand it, they price match places that don't carry the same type of stuff and places that have the exact same prices as they do! Pretty good price match policy ya got there...

Anyway, enough of my rambling on. Thanks again for all your input, it made my decision much less confusing. Now I must go and admire the scenery....

taly01
09-11-2004, 02:59 PM
I had a 9700Pro and went to a 6800 "normal".

Its faster and the screen looks better than the 9700Pro in EVERYTHING can run ALL my games at 4xAA and 8xAF now, but i did need to get a "brand name" 350W power supply for it as it chewed up my home brand 400W one http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

And yeah the 61.77 Nvidia drivers were ****.

Spinne_3.-JG51
09-11-2004, 03:24 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by RACFrankenstein:
Hey all.

Thanks very much for all your input. It was very valuable. In the end I decided to go with the 9800 Pro. I chose it for several reasons:

1) The power supply in my system could handle it easily but I might have had to up it for the 6800
2) The price difference on paper wasn't much (9800 Pro $350, 6800 $400) but when it came to tracking one down, I couldn't find a 6800 in Toronto for under $439 and I managed to find a 9800 Pro for $269.
3) I've had ATI cards in the past and I wanted to stick with something I know.
4) With the cheaper price, I can now afford a TrackIR 3 AND the 9800 Pro whereas with the 6800 it was the card and nothing left over for the TrackIR 3
5) If I spent the $400+ on a video card, The Bride of Frankenstein would have used my ol' flat topped noggin for a target of the ever present frying pan!

In the end I felt the 9800 Pro was the way to go. Bang for the buck-wise I'm happy with the results (I can now play in Perfect mode and I'm not in the dog house to boot!)

One funny story in my search: I called up one of the local High Tech chains to do a little research (I won't mention the name, suffice to say their innitials are "Best Buy"...woops...)Anyway, I got the computer specialist on the phone (read: I got a 16 year old kid who didn't know or care about computers) and after getting a quote on their prices I asked about their "Best Price" policy. I was informed that they would match any advertised price as long as it was the same model and manufacturer and they could confirm it. I told them that I had found the card at another store for around $80 less than their price. He asked where and when I told him the place he said "Well, we only price match the larger stores like Wallmart, FutureShop and Canadian Tire, we can't compete with the "Big Box" stores..." I almost burst out laughing on the phone!

1) Best Buy IS a big box store! (So are FutureShop, Wallmart and Canadian Tire) So obviously they can't compete with their direct compitition. What's the point of having a price match pollicy if you can't price match your compitition?
2) Of the three stores he mentioned being able to price match, only one (FutureShop) carries the same type of stuff as Best Buy. I'm pretty sure I'm not going to find my computer components at Canadian Tire...

Frankenstein: "I'd like to buy a video card for my computer."
Canadian Tire Salesman: "What make is your computer? Ford, GM or Honda?"
Frankenstein: "Uhhhhh....none of the above?"
Candadian Tire Salesman: "Sorry, we're fresh out of video cards...would you like some Snow Tires instead? There on sale..."
Frankenstein: "Nevermind...."

Oh, and to top things off FutureShop is owned by Best Buy so their prices are identical! So as I understand it, they price match places that don't carry the same type of stuff and places that have the exact same prices as they do! Pretty good price match policy ya got there...

Anyway, enough of my rambling on. Thanks again for all your input, it made my decision much less confusing. Now I must go and admire the scenery....<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

LOL... I know exactly what you mean. I walked into BestBuy today to pick up some music. I wanted DVD-Audio, so I asked the guy where they stocked that. He was ....uhhmmm... I think it's over in the Home Entertainment section. After I clarified that I wanted DVD-Audio discs and not a DVD-Video player, he pointed me towards blank DVD media. At this point, I was ready to look for the discs myself, but then my girlfriend pointed the section out to me! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-happy.gif