PDA

View Full Version : Assassin's Creed Rogue Story Comments/Questions [spoilers]



JustPlainQuirky
12-27-2014, 03:14 AM
I beat Rogue once and watched a cutscene movie twice.

These are comments/questions I made while watching.

If anyone could answer these, that would be great. I just want to get this all clear before I make a review, if any.

I bolded the ones i want answered most.

Also sorry for bad english.

Comments:

-Nice parallel between intro and ending. Starts off with recap of the creed and ends with recap of templar motto

-"My name is ___ and this is my story" Ubi, pls. This is an annoying cliche phrase. And I'm pretty sure Desmond already said that. *groans*

-Nice conversation between Haytham and Adewale. Specifically the topic of Edward. It's nice to hear the difficulties of balancing philosophy and blood relations be vocalized.

-"I make my own luck" It was cute the first time. No more, please. It was repeated so much it was embarrassing.

-Some dialogue felt not cliche but.....not unique either..... ex: trouble just follows me around

-Something is wrong with the textures or something....The faces come off as pixely and dry. Lacks the polish that was present in ACIV.

-Loved eavesdropping and hearing important conversations in the homestead. Not sure how much this is done in other AC games but this is the first time I noticed/invested in it. Made the world really feel alive.

-LOOOOOOVE Hope's character design. Love it. I'd cosplay it if only I had the proper body shape.

-Def some questionable voice acting (most notably Benjamin, William Johnson (did his VA change?), Achilles, and Chasseur. They just sounded....bad at times...Is it just me?

-Kesegewasse's battle was hilariously awkward. He literally ran in circles regardless of where Shay was. I'd just stand there and he'd run right past me.

-Colonel Monroe was such a sweetie pie. I loved him.

-Lots of people hated Gist but I found his intentional obnoxiousness endearing. I suppose it's because of the delivery.

-Melanie, Violet, and Otso Berg were surprisingly super interesting and I wanted to hug them all

-I loved pretty much all the characters in general. They all had unique character and character designs. Someone obviously put a lot of love and care to these characters.

-Really stupid how in the end Otso Berg threatens the Abstergo Employee with a gun to join the templars. Now he'll never know if the employee is trustworthy. Should have hid the gun then pulled it out if refused. Alas, couldn't happen because silent protagonist.

-Haiti was mentioned a thousand times in this game. Also there were viking elements (ice, costume, etc) Also Eseosa (someone from Haiti) also exists later in the time period. Possible foreshadow of viking and/or haiti game? An official Ubi survey already asked about vikings but there is already so much mentioned about Haiti in and outside Rogue that it feels like we might see a game there. Or in the very least, a chronicles game

Edit: Nvm. Didn't realize FC took place in Haiti


Questions:

-The part where Shay said "perhaps we'll start a revolution of our own." confused me. This is referencing the french revolution, right? So what, did Shay provoke the revolution in some way or is he just saying that?

-That one french assassin keeps calling Shay a cabbage farmer. I checked the wiki and it said Shay was a sailor with his dad. Is that just a random insult or was Shay originally a cabbage farmer? (which was common at the time)

-Shay seems pretty old by the end of Rogue. And he's playable. So either he doesn't have kids or he has kids at a very old age. So it's possible Shay's DNA was received from a blood vile or something?

-Achilles says "we have the responsibility to decide the future of the world". That statement is made in defense of his attempt to retrieve PoEs that resulted in killing thousands of people. Sacrificing people's lives for the sake of manipulating the path the world takes. That sounds a bit templar-y, no? Shay even says it's a "mad grab for power." But then HE joins the templars which is all about grabbing power. IM SO CONFUSED OTL

-Y NO DLC OR NOVEL FOR ROGUE? QAQ *cries*

-Benjamin says the precursor box was retrieved from Egypt. Future setting foreshadow?

-What exactly ARE the PoE in Rogue? Seeds from trees? What was the point of their existence? Would they eventually grow to usable PoE? Did Ezio give Shao Jun a box that lead her to earthquakes? Sounds messed up. Explanation pls.

-Did Shay just assume Monroe was right when he said the gas the outlaws were making were for innocent civilians? Because they are controlled by Hope who is an assassin, presumably trying to protect the innocent. So I'm a bit confused here. Either Hope is a hypocrite or Shay just blindly believes everything he's told, no?

-I heard somewhere that it is stated on record that Connor is the first native american assassin. But Kesegewasse is clearly stated as an assassin. What gives? Retcon?

-Shay joined templars to save lives but the templars are all about making sacrifices if necessary. Including lives of the innocent. This felt like a huge contradiction. I would like this to be explained by anyone who can explain it.

-Why was Shay not mentioned in Haytham's journal? This was mentioned in an email but it's never addressed. It's like the devs have no clue how to explain it or are foreshadowing something. I don't need a direct answer. I would just like to know if this will be answered eventually. Otherwise it just feels like a plot hole.

----

Overall I loved the story. I watched it as a movie twice. That's how much I loved it. But these are some things I need clarified to fully comprehend the installment.

That's all. Please reply if you can answer any of the questions or want to comment on my thoughts.

Or feel free to post your thoughts on the story.

Ureh
12-27-2014, 03:30 AM
They could have given a button prompt thingy at the end, when Berg points the gun at you. Something like if you accept then Berg gives you a ring, if you refuse then Shaun and Rebecca jump through the window and save you. :p I guess they wanted a cliffhanger... leave it up to our imagination?


-Shay joined templars to save lives but the templars are all about making sacrifices if necessary. Including lives of the innocent. This felt like a huge contradiction. I would like this to be explained by anyone who can explain it.
I don't think Shay's opposed to taking lives, just those he deems necessary. When he was an Assassin, he didn't really seem to have too many problems taking life cause he thought it was for the greater good. Becoming a Templar didn't change his stance on killing. He probably turned against the Assassins cause their actions basically led to genocide. So all the assassins and people he killed were justified - in his eyes - cause they stood in the way of his retribution.


Did Shay just assume Monroe was right when he said the gas the outlaws were making were for innocent civilians? Because they are controlled by Hope who is an assassin, presumably trying to protect the innocent. So I'm a bit confused here. Either Hope is a hypocrite or Shay just blindly believes everything he's told, no?
I haven't played the game yet so I'm not sure if there's something that could validate Monro's claims (someone here probably knows!). It looked like Shay just took his word about the gas. One thing is for sure though, Hope did create a cure or antidote or whatever you call it. Which may or may not mean that she had more of it just in case innocents are accidentally affected by the gas (sort of like a contingency plan if they can't control it). Or maybe it was just for her if there's a lab accident..


-What exactly ARE the PoE in Rogue? Seeds from trees? What was the point of their existence? Would they eventually grow to usable PoE? Did Ezio give Shao Jun a box that lead her to earthquakes? Sounds messed up. Explanation pls.

I'm just gonna guess that they just serve as "anchors" to stabilise the earth. The twcb might've created them to combat the next global catastrophe when the magnetic field becomes unstable. Or maybe the earth was unstable more than 75000 years ago and the first civ installed those "anchors" to make the planet habitable.Or they might have an ulterior function? :p

Namikaze_17
12-27-2014, 04:31 AM
-The part where Shay said "perhaps we'll start a revolution of our own." confused me. This is referencing the french revolution, right? So what, did Shay provoke the revolution in some way or is he just saying that?

It can't be the FR. It was made clear that Germain was the Mastermind.

Sure, Shay could've been behind-the-scenes, but you'd think he would've mentioned or referenced at least. :rolleyes:

So this leads me to believe he launches/ is planning an attack sometime later against the Colonial Assassins
( because he sounded pissed when he said American) or the Assassins in general.

Otherwise, he probably retired, settled down, or got killed.


That one french assassin keeps calling Shay a cabbage farmer. I checked the wiki and it said Shay was a sailor with his dad. Is that just a random insult or was Shay originally a cabbage farmer? (which was common at the time)

You mean Chevalier.

And it beats me. Most likely Shay was...it would definitely give him a backstory though.



Shay seems pretty old by the end of Rogue. And he's playable. So either he doesn't have kids or he has kids at a very old age. So it's possible Shay's DNA was received from a blood vile or something?

Most likely blood vile...

But if Ezio had kids in his 50's, there's a possibility of Shay having some too.


Adewale says "we have the responsibility to decide the future of the world". That statement is made in defense of his attempt to retrieve PoEs that resulted in killing thousands of people. Sacrificing people's lives for the sake of manipulating the path the world takes. That sounds a bit templar-y, no? Shay even says it's a "mad grab for power." But then HE joins the templars which is all about grabbing power. IM SO CONFUSED OTL

This is probably a result of Adewale being less pure after many years.

Especially since he's probably seen years of bloodshed and death, it's easy for your philosophy to get a little wonky.

Regarding Shay? Different Era, Different Templars.

It's easy for Shay to have this perception when there are members like Gist, Monroe, and Haytham rather than the Borgias.

Though the Templars did do questionable acts as well, and it would've been nice to see Shay's reaction to that.

But with only SIX sequences there's only so much you can do.




Y NO DLC OR NOVEL FOR ROGUE? QAQ *cries*

Beats me. But it sucks.

Both would be very essential to tie up loose ends right now. -__-


Benjamin says the precursor box was retrieved from Egypt. Future setting foreshadow?

Possibly.

But leave it to Ubi to mess it up eventually. :rolleyes:


What exactly ARE the PoE in Rogue? Seeds from trees? What was the point of their existence? Would they eventually grow to usable PoE? Did Ezio give Shao Jun a box that lead her to earthquakes? Sounds messed up. Explanation pls.

Ezio, in my opinion, is very stupid for even giving Shao Jun the box. Regardless if he did or didn't know its power or purpose.

Regarding your question, I guess the box? It did lead to a precursor site.




Did Shay just assume Monroe was right when he said the gas the outlaws were making were for innocent civilians? Because they are controlled by Hope who is an assassin, presumably trying to protect the innocent. So I'm a bit confused here. Either Hope is a hypocrite or Shay just blindly believes everything he's told, no?

Perhaps both? I dunno. -__-


I heard somewhere that it is stated on record that Connor is the first native american assassin. But Kesegewasse is clearly stated as an assassin. What gives? Retcon?

Technically he was a mercenary that aided the Brotherhood as someone said. ( Can't remember who said it...maybe Shay?)

So Connor is still the first Native Assassin. ;)


Shay joined templars to save lives but the templars are all about making sacrifices if necessary. Including lives of the innocent. This felt like a huge contradiction. I would like this to be explained by anyone who can explain it.

At the time, the Templars were probably the lesser of two evils to Shay. Even look at how Haytham takes Shay's warning about the precursor sites into account unlike Achilles.

But like I said, a scene or book about Shay's reaction to Templar actions would definitely be needed to clear this up.



Why was Shay not mentioned in Haytham's journal? This was mentioned in an email but it's never addressed. It's like the devs have no clue how to explain it or are foreshadowing something. I don't need a direct answer. I would just like to know if this will be answered eventually. Otherwise it just feels like a plot hole.

Like I keep saying, I just don't think Shay was worth mentioning to Haytham.

People forget the Journal was about his PERSONAL life where only the most important people in his life are talked about.
( I.e Edward, Jenny, Connor)

Besides he only Shay knew for a few minutes and sent him away for over a decade.

Not to mention he met/discovered Connor afterwards. :rolleyes:

JustPlainQuirky
12-27-2014, 04:37 AM
@nami



Regarding Shay? Different Era, Different Templars.


oooo that makes sense!

But regarding the Kasegewasse thing.

On a website, he is said to be a mercenary, but in GAME he is stated to be an assassin TWICE.

So that's why I'm confused.

And regarding forsaken, Ubisoft made it clear through an abstergo email that Shay SHOULD have been mentioned.

So he was, according to Ubi, worth mentioning.

Ureh
12-27-2014, 04:39 AM
Oh yeah the Shaanxi earthquake occured during Jiajing's reign (he's the guy that ordered the death of all the Chinese assassins. Might be related to the box.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1556_Shaanxi_earthquake
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jiajing_Emperor

GoldenBoy9999
12-27-2014, 04:41 AM
Sorry Mayrice, I didn't see this before. I'm typing responses now. :)

JustPlainQuirky
12-27-2014, 04:41 AM
Oh yeah the Shaanxi earthquake occured during Jiajing's reign (he's the guy that ordered the death of all the Chinese assassins. Might be related to the box.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1556_Shaanxi_earthquake
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jiajing_Emperor

OMFG

http://media.247sports.com/Uploads/Assets/339/211/3211339.gif

EZIO YOU ARE SUCH A ****

Namikaze_17
12-27-2014, 04:49 AM
oooo that makes sense!

Can't tell if it's sarcasm or... :rolleyes:


But regarding the Kasegewasse thing.

On a website, he is said to be a mercenary, but in GAME he is stated to be an assassin TWICE.

Well this is confusing....

Achilles seemed to know him well too, so It's possible he was an Assassin.

Though he acted like a Mercenary in my opinion.

But then again, Bartolomeo was an Assassin but he didn't wear the hood and that.

But Kesegowasse did. -__-

Ugh, at any rate, he's just an ally. *Shrugs*



And regarding forsaken, Ubisoft made it clear through an abstergo email that Shay SHOULD have been mentioned.

So he was, according to Ubi, worth mentioning.

This is why Ubi should come out and confirm this.

Because it could've went either way with Haytham. -__-

JustPlainQuirky
12-27-2014, 04:56 AM
Nah wasn't being sarcastic. I didn't think about the context of different templars. Though templars in general (as stated by Darbs senpai) are very "end justifies the means" kinda peeps. Hence why templars don't get desynched for killing innocents. So it's odd to me with such a key feature of the templars coexisting with a templar who is seemingly openly against such a mentality if that makes sense.

Kesegewasse is an assassin. It's stated in-game he is. Right here:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NsUrbOT1mKQ

1:08:50 timestamp

"Ay Colonel. He's one of Achilles men. An assassin....as I was"


This is why Ubi should come out and confirm this.

Because it could've went either with Haytham. -__-

I'd ask a dev on twitter (along with ezio shao jun thing), but I'm trying to avoid pestering them too much.

Relying on ComDevs to speak up on forums like they said they would after Unity mess is handled. (which I guess it isn't yet)

Namikaze_17
12-27-2014, 05:03 AM
Nah wasn't being sarcastic. I didn't think about the context of different templars. Though templars in general (as stated by Darbs senpai) are very "end justifies the means" kinda peeps. Hence why templars don't get desynched for killing innocents. So it's odd to me with such a key feature of the templars coexisting with a templar who is seemingly openly against such a mentality if that makes sense.

Kesegewasse is an assassin. It's stated in-game he is. Right here:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NsUrbOT1mKQ

1:08:50 timestamp

"Ay Colonel. He's one of Achilles men. An assassin....as I was"



I'd ask a dev on twitter (along with ezio shao jun thing), but I'm trying to avoid pestering them too much.

Relying on ComDevs to speak up on forums like they said they would after Unity mess is handled. (which I guess it isn't yet)


Ah, good. :)


Well maybe Connor is the first of his tribe? -__-

I don't know...Kesegowasse seem like cross-breed or something.

Still not convinced he was an Assassin. Or at least a full one.



Yeah, you do that.

We really need to clean this up. ^^

GoldenBoy9999
12-27-2014, 05:34 AM
-"I make my own luck" It was cute the first time. No more, please. It was repeated so much it was embarrassing.

I felt the same way. At first it was cool, but it did become embarrassing. He says it in the first 30 seconds of the game, and carries on towards the end.


-I loved pretty much all the characters in general. They all had unique character and character designs. Someone obviously put a lot of love and care to these characters.

Yes, they were great. I noticed that in a preview even before the game released. They're my favorite characters of an AC game so far.


-Really stupid how in the end Otso Berg threatens the Abstergo Employee with a gun to join the templars. Now he'll never know if the employee is trustworthy. Should have hid the gun then pulled it out if refused. Alas, couldn't happen because silent protagonist.

I hated this part. It's the reason I can't appreciate any of the good things about Berg. It really hurt his character for me.

It also made me less attached to Violet and Melanie because of how the whole ordeal went down.


-Haiti was mentioned a thousand times in this game. Also there were viking elements (ice, costume, etc) Also Eseosa (someone from Haiti) also exists later in the time period. Possible foreshadow of viking and/or haiti game? An official Ubi survey already asked about vikings but there is already so much mentioned about Haiti in and outside Rogue that it feels like we might see a game there. Or in the very least, a chronicles game

A Haiti game would be really similar to an AC4 game. And actually, we've already had one. Remember Freedom Cry? It was set in Port au Prince, Haiti. I like that place now.

I could see a Chronicles game there for Eseosa, but I'd rather not. I want him and Connor and his other buddies in a different setting.


-The part where Shay said "perhaps we'll start a revolution of our own." confused me. This is referencing the french revolution, right? So what, did Shay provoke the revolution in some way or is he just saying that?

It really seemed like they were talking about the French Revolution. Any Average Joe with common sense will probably come to that conclusion. We're hardcore fans and we don't really know if he's talking about the FR, or some other, completely non-mentioned one. If they're leading onto something, it's cryptic.


-That one french assassin keeps calling Shay a cabbage farmer. I checked the wiki and it said Shay was a sailor with his dad. Is that just a random insult or was Shay originally a cabbage farmer? (which was common at the time)

I don't know, I thought it was an insult. I asked on the AC wiki. We'll see if we get an answer.


-Shay seems pretty old by the end of Rogue. And he's playable. So either he doesn't have kids or he has kids at a very old age. So it's possible Shay's DNA was received from a blood vile or something?

When he's playable, you can still go to New York and stuff and the Great Fire has not happened. This means he's playable before he goes to France after Charles, when he's not old. Right?


-Adewale says "we have the responsibility to decide the future of the world". That statement is made in defense of his attempt to retrieve PoEs that resulted in killing thousands of people. Sacrificing people's lives for the sake of manipulating the path the world takes. That sounds a bit templar-y, no? Shay even says it's a "mad grab for power." But then HE joins the templars which is all about grabbing power. IM SO CONFUSED OTL

The Templars and Assassins aren't completely different. Adewale may be more aligned with the Templars than others. He was a pirate at one point. Maybe Adewale was just trying to cover for himself? :confused:

I wouldn't say Shay is completely hip with how the Templars operate. He says he has his own creed or whatever and he has his own ideals. IIRC, Shay doesn't go about getting that much power, he just takes out some people he deems unsafe to mankind. He isn't confined to the Templars ideals.


-Y NO DLC OR NOVEL FOR ROGUE? QAQ *cries*

I don't know. I want one too. Maybe they don't have enough people for all of that? :rolleyes:


-Benjamin says the precursor box was retrieved from Egypt. Future setting foreshadow?

I hope not. Many people request Egypt, but I wonder how many know about the French series. Some of the books are ABOUT an Assassin in Egypt. It seems like Ubisoft's answer to fan requests.


-What exactly ARE the PoE in Rogue? Seeds from trees? What was the point of their existence? Would they eventually grow to usable PoE? Did Ezio give Shao Jun a box that lead her to earthquakes? Sounds messed up. Explanation pls.

I've seen this debated before. My guess is that the First Civilization installed them to cut down on the amount of natural disasters like Earthquakes or something. I don't think they grow really.

Yeah, I really don't get that. Ezio was like "Open this when you feel the need." Yeah right! That thing had to be zapped with electricity to get it to work, and even then it was useless to her.


-Did Shay just assume Monroe was right when he said the gas the outlaws were making were for innocent civilians? Because they are controlled by Hope who is an assassin, presumably trying to protect the innocent. So I'm a bit confused here. Either Hope is a hypocrite or Shay just blindly believes everything he's told, no?

This part was questionable for me. Overall, a lot of Rogue seemed like it portrayed the Assassins badly, so that Shay's actions would be justified.

Either Monroe was lying to get Shay to perform his missions, or this is inaccurate representation of Assassins. They were cooking death gas in huge vats for god's sake.

The Assassins were doing tons of crazy stuff, like hiring gangs to terrorize the innocent populace.


-I heard somewhere that it is stated on record that Connor is the first native american assassin. But Kesegewasse is clearly stated as an assassin. What gives? Retcon?

This is a contradiction. There were multiple Native American assassins before Connor like: Atasá:ta's father, Bahlam, Ah Tabai and Opía Apito.


-Shay joined templars to save lives but the templars are all about making sacrifices if necessary. Including lives of the innocent. This felt like a huge contradiction. I would like this to be explained by anyone who can explain it.


He felt like he was saving lives, the best he could. He did it his own way. Templars may sacrifice some innocents, but that doesn't mean Shay has to. I can't remember any times when Shay really kills innocents.


-Why was Shay not mentioned in Haytham's journal? This was mentioned in an email but it's never addressed. It's like the devs have no clue how to explain it or are foreshadowing something. I don't need a direct answer. I would just like to know if this will be answered eventually. Otherwise it just feels like a plot hole.


I think he should have been mentioned. I just want an explanation.

Haytham joined Shay in the downfall of the Colonial Templars. Shay's actions would have had a major impact on Haytham's life and profession. There'd be a lot less threat to his safety, and he wanted to take them down as well. I mean, he'd have to mentioned that his enemies are dead, right? Or that the Colonial Assassins are being wiped out. Who is he mentioning? Monroe... Gist? Is he just taking all the credit for himself?

Edit:



Well maybe Connor is the first of his tribe? -__-

I don't know...Kesegowasse seem like cross-breed or something.

Still not convinced he was an Assassin. Or at least a full one.


Nope, Atasá:ta's father was Kanien'kehá:ka and he was an Assassin. I'm glad Ubisoft shoehorned him in like that, out of all the other tribes, and completely contradicted them self. :rolleyes:

Not really. He was born in the village and raised like all the others. He even looks completely Native to me. His face is very rough for his age, presumably from the outdoors life.

Well, he was a member of the Assassin Order. :rolleyes:

JustPlainQuirky
12-27-2014, 05:52 AM
Freedom Cry takes place in Haiti?

I feel like an idiot now.

#IDontKnowMyLocations

And this game and AC3 are tied for favorite characters. Next in line is AC1 and AC2. ACIV would be next.
The rest kinda suck IMO in terms of characters.

Thanks for asking on AC Wiki.

He's playable when he's young and old in france.

I think Shay just joined templars to stop assassins then slowly overtime absorbed the templar ideals without realizing it.

Namikaze_17
12-27-2014, 05:55 AM
I think Shay just joined templars to stop assassins then slowly overtime absorbed the templar ideals without realizing it.

^ I think that's a good way to look at it.

GoldenBoy9999
12-27-2014, 05:56 AM
Thanks for asking on AC Wiki.

He's playable when he's young and old in france.


You're welcome. :)

Ah, I see what you mean. I first I thought, "He could have had a kid before his trip to France and we wouldn't know," but then I remembered that if the Animus is replaying your memories, you had another kid on down the line. That DNA stuff confuses me sometimes. :p

Namikaze_17
12-27-2014, 06:04 AM
Nope, Atasá:ta's father was Kanien'kehá:ka and he was an Assassin. I'm glad Ubisoft shoehorned him in like that, out of all the other tribes, and completely contradicted them self. :rolleyes:

Not really. He was born in the village and raised like all the others. He even looks completely Native to me. His face is very rough for his age, presumably from the outdoors life.

Well, he was a member of the Assassin Order. :rolleyes:

Well damn. -__-

What was the point of even saying that for Connor when it clearly isn't the case.

SMH, Ubisoft... :rolleyes:

GoldenBoy9999
12-27-2014, 06:28 AM
I have a quick question.

When Haytham assigns Shay with finding the Precursor box, Shay's only lead is that Chevalier ships it out of the colonies. He does this right after he and Hope discover the Arctic Temple I think. When Shay finds Chevalier, does he mention that he doesn't have the box? He just throws him overboard. Was it implied that Chevalier sent the Box out on a different ship?

JustPlainQuirky
12-27-2014, 06:36 AM
Chevalier mentions nothing.

Nothing was implied.

But I don't think anything needed to be, really.

Namikaze_17
12-27-2014, 06:39 AM
Any more questions? :rolleyes:

This place will be swimming with them tomorrow or so.

GoldenBoy9999
12-27-2014, 06:39 AM
Chevalier mentions nothing.

Nothing was implied.

But I don't think anything needed to be, really.

But the Precursor Box was obviously still out there. What I mean is, Chevalier supposedly had the Box on his ship, but Shay does nothing about it. They just sunk it.

Shay spends another 16 years looking for it and so far it seems that it was in the Arctic Ocean. :p I'm just trying to piece together Shay's missing years.

JustPlainQuirky
12-27-2014, 06:46 AM
Shay didnt know he had the box at the time

He probably found out but by then the ship was probably sold somewhere or a crewmember took it

GoldenBoy9999
12-27-2014, 06:54 AM
Shay didnt know he had the box at the time

He probably found out but by then the ship was probably sold somewhere or a crewmember took it

Alright, thanks. That clears things up. :)

Tabbe01
12-27-2014, 07:45 AM
Finished playing Rouge story recently and the connection you made between Rouge and Unity are lovely.
The cutscene was a huge surprise and it made me feel it was worth spending all those hours to finish the story.
More of that.
I love it when you connect the games with each other like with Ezio, best 3 games ever.

GoldenBoy9999
12-27-2014, 11:38 AM
Here's what the person on the wiki said, Mayrice.


I don't think the Cormacs themselves were "cabbage farmers" - they were sailors, seamen. This makes me think the insults is based on a stereotype, though I can't really speak to that: were Irish people commonly thought of as (cabbage) farmers back then?

Hans684
12-27-2014, 01:32 PM
-The part where Shay said "perhaps we'll start a revolution of our own." confused me. This is referencing the french revolution, right? So what, did Shay provoke the revolution in some way or is he just saying that?

Most likely but that Revolution was created by the extremist Templar order under the control of Germain and Shay was not part of his conspiracy. It can easly mean something else, we just have to little to go on to get a proper conclusion. It's a blurred shot.


-That one french assassin keeps calling Shay a cabbage farmer. I checked the wiki and it said Shay was a sailor with his dad. Is that just a random insult or was Shay originally a cabbage farmer? (which was common at the time)

Shay is a low rank Assassin taking orders from a hight rank French Explorer, Sailor and Assassins. He properly considered Shay a peasant, so it's most likely a random insult.


-Shay seems pretty old by the end of Rogue. And he's playable. So either he doesn't have kids or he has kids at a very old age. So it's possible Shay's DNA was received from a blood vile or something?

We know nothing regarding this, someone could have donated blood to Abstergo Entertainment for research, a blood vial or he had a child some time after that.


-Adewale says "we have the responsibility to decide the future of the world". That statement is made in defense of his attempt to retrieve PoEs that resulted in killing thousands of people. Sacrificing people's lives for the sake of manipulating the path the world takes. That sounds a bit templar-y, no? Shay even says it's a "mad grab for power." But then HE joins the templars which is all about grabbing power. IM SO CONFUSED OTL

Adéwalé wasn't as pure as before, the creed that enlightened him ended up blinding him. And Achilles most likely just told him about Shay's "betrayed"(he was just going to take the manuscript to make sure it didn't happen again) but not his warning since Achilles himself didn't belive it. Both orders sacrifice peoples lives, there isn't one protagonist that hasn't killed innocents. Whilst it does sound "Templar-y", there is different level of what makes a Templar(same with Assassins).

Achilles had a mindset of getting it before the Templars(standard Assassin) but his control of the colonies is plain bad. Ezio used mercenaries but they at least had an understanding of the order. But the Assasdins have been useing criminal like that at least since Ezio's time, so it can easly go wrong.

Extremist Templars: All Templars from Unity except Elisé, her father and the guy that sent the leter to her father. Extremist Templar would do anything to reach their goal regardless of how much damage it couses. They care for the Templar goal but not how to reach it, they take it to the extreme. Their the worst kind of Templars.

Corrupt Templar: Someone who don't care for the Templar goal and only themselves, two examples. Borgia, they only wanted power. Hickey, only wanted a simple life(+ money), neither care for the Templar cause but only one of those is bad and that's the Borgia version of corrupt.

Templars: These guys is more in line with Assassins, while they care for the goal their a bit reckless. They care for the people but is willing to sacrifice a few. Ezio is praised and blew up a city cousing countless deaths of innocents and Haytham coused the Boston Massacre, both events is a small sacrifice to reach their goal.

True Templar: True Templar kill as little innocents as possible while caring for both the Templar goal and the people.

Break it down before judging anything.


-Y NO DLC OR NOVEL FOR ROGUE? QAQ *cries*

Novel > DLC. I don't like DLC.


-Benjamin says the precursor box was retrieved from Egypt. Future setting foreshadow?

I think he said it looked like it could be from Egypt but it could be a forshadow.


-What exactly ARE the PoE in Rogue? Seeds from trees? What was the point of their existence? Would they eventually grow to usable PoE? Did Ezio give Shao Jun a box that lead her to earthquakes? Sounds messed up. Explanation pls.

Shay called them trees. Their purpose is propery to hold the earth, they don't grow. The First Civ. built them like any other POE. Ezio most likely found it somewhere around Constantinople, there was an earthquake there that revealed the first Masyaf Key. So he properly investigated the place and found the box. I'm sure he didn't know what it could do or maybe he knew it had a map so if some lost their way, then they could activate it. Like Shao Jun.


-Did Shay just assume Monroe was right when he said the gas the outlaws were making were for innocent civilians? Because they are controlled by Hope who is an assassin, presumably trying to protect the innocent. So I'm a bit confused here. Either Hope is a hypocrite or Shay just blindly believes everything he's told, no?

That depends on how you define what's "innocent", maybe those innocents where the authority. Or they targeted the people, it's all about who you consider innocent.


-I heard somewhere that it is stated on record that Connor is the first native american assassin. But Kesegewasse is clearly stated as an assassin. What gives? Retcon?

It's not recton, Connor is the first recorded/known native Assassin as stated by AC3. Rogue is like the unrecorded history of both orders, history won't remember it. And Kesegewasse is an Assassin.


-Shay joined templars to save lives but the templars are all about making sacrifices if necessary. Including lives of the innocent. This felt like a huge contradiction. I would like this to be explained by anyone who can explain it.


I should have explained this above. So i pass on this one.


-Why was Shay not mentioned in Haytham's journal? This was mentioned in an email but it's never addressed. It's like the devs have no clue how to explain it or are foreshadowing something. I don't need a direct answer. I would just like to know if this will be answered eventually. Otherwise it just feels like a plot hole.

I don't know.


Feel free to post your thoughts on the story.

It's my new favorite and Unity is my least favorite.

DumbGamerTag94
12-27-2014, 02:53 PM
-That one french assassin keeps calling Shay a cabbage farmer. I checked the wiki and it said Shay was a sailor with his dad. Is that just a random insult or was Shay originally a cabbage farmer? (which was common at the time)
it's actually a derogatory rearm for Irishmen. The Irish were VERY heavily discriminated against until the early 20th century. With the worst of it between the 1600s and mid 1800s. So basically DeVeyandre is just a racist *******(and I know Irish aren't technically a race but I can't find another accurate word to describe how the Irish were treated back then)
I think I recall DeVeyandre calling him a potato eater at one point too.
(I caught a lot of these references because I'm 75% Irish myself)

MegaRock35
12-27-2014, 06:15 PM
-What exactly ARE the PoE in Rogue? Seeds from trees? What was the point of their existence? Would they eventually grow to usable PoE? Did Ezio give Shao Jun a box that lead her to earthquakes? Sounds messed up. Explanation pls.

I saw a random comment on deviantART call it a Shard of Eden. I laughed because that was already a thing, as Captain Kidd's treasure in ACIII. But if you think about it, the things in Rogue are like that on a larger scale. The Money Hole (or whatever that thing on Oak Island is called) collapsed as soon as Connor took the Shard, just like with Shay and the Temple.

If I had to wager a guess, I'd say it magnetically holds those big-*** temples in place so the ground doesn't cave in on it. So the earthquakes probably weren't real earthquakes.

JustPlainQuirky
12-27-2014, 08:07 PM
ah crap i realized i said adewale instead of achilles

Achilles said the responsibility quote. Not Adewale.

Ureh
12-27-2014, 08:33 PM
Yeah I wouldn't be surprised if the death of Abigail and Connor still hung on his shoulders. So Achilles might've said that in haste but he probably meant it in a good way. Sorta like the debates that Ratohnhaketon and Achilles had in AC3. They're basically saying they are the ones that are truly free and empowered to watch this world. The civilians just can't or won't oppose the Templars. Only downside was that Achilles didn't understand the purpose of those "trees" so that kinda made him look bad.

In Shay's point of view, the Templars at the very least are more cautious about those "trees" and they sorta listened to him. Whereas the Assassins just treated him like a novice and disregarded most of his advice and warnings.

Mr.Black24
12-28-2014, 01:23 AM
-The part where Shay said "perhaps we'll start a revolution of our own." confused me. This is referencing the french revolution, right? So what, did Shay provoke the revolution in some way or is he just saying that?
I wonder this myself. Perhaps he gave support in a small manner?


-That one french assassin keeps calling Shay a cabbage farmer. I checked the wiki and it said Shay was a sailor with his dad. Is that just a random insult or was Shay originally a cabbage farmer? (which was common at the time) Joke insults perhaps? I mean they can't say potato farmer because obvious reasons...:rolleyes:


-Shay seems pretty old by the end of Rogue. And he's playable. So either he doesn't have kids or he has kids at a very old age. So it's possible Shay's DNA was received from a blood vile or something? I think kids since there was no mention of blood viles within the states.


-Achilles says "we have the responsibility to decide the future of the world". That statement is made in defense of his attempt to retrieve PoEs that resulted in killing thousands of people. Sacrificing people's lives for the sake of manipulating the path the world takes. That sounds a bit templar-y, no? Shay even says it's a "mad grab for power." But then HE joins the templars which is all about grabbing power. IM SO CONFUSED OTL He means that the responsibility of the Assassin Order to guide people to a better tomorrow. Shay said "mad grab for power" since he confused Achilles' motives for intent killing of innocents affected by the loss of his family. Shay commented how he acted more harsher after they died, believing that it was that event that drove him "mad". After all Achilles sent him to recover a POE, not cause a massacre. In the video you showed, he goes "The operation is delicate, perhaps you-" before being cut off by Shay. He didn't expect an earthquake to happen, however Shay mistook that for intent action.


-Y NO DLC OR NOVEL FOR ROGUE? QAQ *cries*
Welcome to the train of no tomorrow.....:nonchalance:


-Benjamin says the precursor box was retrieved from Egypt. Future setting foreshadow?
Not entirely sure, much curious indeed.


-What exactly ARE the PoE in Rogue? Seeds from trees? What was the point of their existence? Would they eventually grow to usable PoE? Did Ezio give Shao Jun a box that lead her to earthquakes? Sounds messed up. Explanation pls.
:confused:


-Did Shay just assume Monroe was right when he said the gas the outlaws were making were for innocent civilians? Because they are controlled by Hope who is an assassin, presumably trying to protect the innocent. So I'm a bit confused here. Either Hope is a hypocrite or Shay just blindly believes everything he's told, no?
I thought the gas was meant as a weapon against the Templars. Technically Templars are masters of manipulation so they could have buttered Shay up with a lie.

-I heard somewhere that it is stated on record that Connor is the first native american assassin. But Kesegewasse is clearly stated as an assassin. What gives? Retcon?
When Shaun first recorded Haytham and Reginald in AC3, he mistaken them as Assassins, the document was rewritten after the revelation that he was a Templar. If you want to see this, you'll have to start the game all over again lol. Also, since Shaun never heard of Kesegewasse due to the Assassin documents destroyed by the Templars, he thought Connor was the first one. An honest mistake if you will.


-Shay joined templars to save lives but the templars are all about making sacrifices if necessary. Including lives of the innocent. This felt like a huge contradiction. I would like this to be explained by anyone who can explain it.
To be fair, I'm not sure really. However, this is the reason why I don't like the Templars so much.Even if its an innocent bystander, its cool by the Templar if they die. When someone mentions, "Oh but Assassins killed many innocent guards, trying to feed their families" Well being a guard or a soldier has risks, such as being killed! That is the point of being a guard/soldier, risking your life to fight for whatever your allegiance lie.


-Why was Shay not mentioned in Haytham's journal? This was mentioned in an email but it's never addressed. It's like the devs have no clue how to explain it or are foreshadowing something. I don't need a direct answer. I would just like to know if this will be answered eventually. Otherwise it just feels like a plot hole.



I have this theory that in case Charles Lee fails, Shay is Haytham's ace in the hole. Shay is not only intelligent, but also deadly, qualities that Haytham sees as a perfect candidate as a potential Grand Master so he hid is existence away so that his plan can continue on.

JustPlainQuirky
12-28-2014, 03:47 AM
Im guessing what the PoE are is meant to be deliberately ambiguous.

There isn't even an ACWiki article of it. Not even a name.

comicexpress
12-31-2014, 01:04 AM
Am I the only one who misses the online play? It's probably with Unity, but it would have been nice to have it in Rogue too.

I have tried to start the "Initiates" in Rogue, but it keeps telling me to go to aciniates.com and there it gives an error ... please advise.

Ureh
12-31-2014, 07:08 PM
Am I the only one who misses the online play? It's probably with Unity, but it would have been nice to have it in Rogue too.

I have tried to start the "Initiates" in Rogue, but it keeps telling me to go to aciniates.com and there it gives an error ... please advise.

Here, just in case you missed this:

http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/981770-AC-Initiates-Status-Read-the-first-post


Hello Initiates,

We have taken the decision to place AC Initiates in a continued state of maintenance during the holiday period.

The reasoning for this is to minimize the effect from outages to your experience during this time, as well as to allow us work on ensuring the technical stability of the platform.

Although AC Initiates will be in maintenance and thus unavailable to access via the web or console browsers, all gold Initiates chests are now unlocked in game for online players. You will receive an in game error message when attempting to access the ACI website from in-game due to the maintenance. This is expected behaviour, and will be addressed in a future update. However, you will have unrestricted access to all the chests with the golden ACI crest and the rewards within them.

Please note that you won't be able to access the gold Initiates chests if you are playing offline.

Finally, we want to thank you for your continued passion and feedback. We hope you have a pleasant holiday period.

The AC Initiates team.