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Hawgdog
09-08-2003, 09:01 PM
Peeeeeeeeee-yew. Still stinks.
Maybe I've been lead to believe the p-47 could roll quickly and snap like a whip. Dam hollywood movies. I guess it aint so, cause I know UBI models the planes correctly.
Wish it rolled like the movie I watched. Dam hollywood liars.

well, back the hurricane!

<center></script>P-47 Jug-whiner extrodanair
Vulching can be a contact sport
When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
Sig limitations and bad roll rates rule
http://users.zoominternet.net/~cgatewood/assets/images/sharkdog.gif





Message Edited on 09/08/0304:02PM by Hawgdog

Hawgdog
09-08-2003, 09:01 PM
Peeeeeeeeee-yew. Still stinks.
Maybe I've been lead to believe the p-47 could roll quickly and snap like a whip. Dam hollywood movies. I guess it aint so, cause I know UBI models the planes correctly.
Wish it rolled like the movie I watched. Dam hollywood liars.

well, back the hurricane!

<center></script>P-47 Jug-whiner extrodanair
Vulching can be a contact sport
When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
Sig limitations and bad roll rates rule
http://users.zoominternet.net/~cgatewood/assets/images/sharkdog.gif





Message Edited on 09/08/0304:02PM by Hawgdog

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 09:06 PM
Wait a minute HD, are you saying the Jug rolls worse in 1.11 than 1.1??? If so, THAT SUCKS!!!

ZG77_Nagual
09-08-2003, 09:10 PM
The d10 has a quite nice roll - and elevator response at high speeds is one of the best in the game.

http://pws.chartermi.net/~cmorey/pics/p47janes.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 09:12 PM
So you are trying to judge flight model roll rates based on films of unknown playback speed?



<edit> that sounded a little more pointed than I wanted it too - just trying to figure out the true roll rate - don't take it as a flame...



Message Edited on 09/08/0302:15PM by Virga

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 09:50 PM
John Wayne says the roll rate on the P-47 is wrong. That should be all the proof we need../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

25th_Buzz
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
<center>
http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 09:52 PM
faustnik wrote:
- Wait a minute HD, are you saying the Jug rolls worse
- in 1.11 than 1.1??? If so, THAT SUCKS!!!
-
HEY, only HeavyDelta deserves to be called HD for short!!!! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif



1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.
2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye
shall be judged: and with what
measure ye mete, it shall be
measured to you again.

http://acompletewasteofspace.com/forum/templates/subSilver/images/logo_phpBB.gif (http://acompletewasteofspace.com/forum/index.php)

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 09:56 PM
BuzzU wrote:
- John Wayne says the roll rate on the P-47 is wrong.
- That should be all the proof we need../i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif -
- 25th_Buzz
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- <center>
http://www.vfa25.com/sigs/buzz.jpg -
-

I agree with buzz if ain't good enough for the Duke then Its just no damm good.

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 09:56 PM
HawgDog has been around for a while too. Maybe they should duel for it! P-40s at 2000 meters.

Hunter82
09-08-2003, 10:06 PM
ehhh hemm Mr HawgDawg or can I call you Dawg for short?


GET OVER 300 BEFORE YOU TRY AND ROLL YOU FNEB.....


we thank you for your continued support.

=======================================
Ubisoft IL2/Lock On Moderator
ATI Catalyst Driver Beta Tester
Hunter82 wrote:"I did not have technical relations with that question"
Mudmovers (http://www.mudmovers.com/) </center>
=======================================

Hawgdog
09-08-2003, 10:17 PM
Hunter82 wrote:
- ehhh hemm Mr HawgDawg or can I call you Dawg for
- short?
-
-
- GET OVER 300 BEFORE YOU TRY AND ROLL YOU FNEB.....
-


Have you flown it? I was well over 300, upwards of 400. It rolled better at slower speeds. And you can call me by my first name, Mr. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

I'll duel for it. I've been messing around offline, and we all know thats different. But the dora rolls like a fiend, and the P. 47 rolls like an IL2.
No, I didnt make movies or write down speeds, weather conditions, or if different skins made any diff....it still sucks.....
John Wayne said it best. "uh-huh"



<center></script>The original HawgDog, dont be fooled by fneb imitations
Vulching can be a contact sport
When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
http://users.zoominternet.net/~cgatewood/assets/images/sharkdog.gif



Message Edited on 09/08/0305:21PM by Hawgdog

Hunter82
09-08-2003, 10:44 PM
I flew it last night as you were diddling around with your sound /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif High roll rate is much improved over 1.0 but maybe a tad slower than needed......you fix your sound yet?




Hawgdog wrote:
- Hunter82 wrote:
-- ehhh hemm Mr HawgDawg or can I call you Dawg for
-- short?
--
--
-- GET OVER 300 BEFORE YOU TRY AND ROLL YOU FNEB.....
--
-
-
- Have you flown it? I was well over 300, upwards of
- 400. It rolled better at slower speeds. And you can
- call me by my first name, Mr. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif
-
- I'll duel for it. I've been messing around offline,
- and we all know thats different. But the dora rolls
- like a fiend, and the P. 47 rolls like an IL2.
-
- No, I didnt make movies or write down speeds,
- weather conditions, or if different skins made any
- diff....it still sucks.....
- John Wayne said it best. "uh-huh"
-
-
-
-
- <center></script>The original HawgDog, dont be
- fooled by fneb imitations
- Vulching can be a contact sport
- When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
- <img
- src="http://users.zoominternet.net/~cgatewood/asse
- ts/images/sharkdog.gif">
-
-
-
- Message Edited on 09/08/03 05:21PM by Hawgdog



=======================================
Ubisoft IL2/Lock On Moderator
ATI Catalyst Driver Beta Tester
Hunter82 wrote:"I did not have technical relations with that question"
Mudmovers (http://www.mudmovers.com/) </center>
=======================================

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 10:57 PM
.

Message Edited on 09/08/0311:06PM by AeroBob

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 10:58 PM
The P-47D-27 roll rate is still horridly wrong. In fact, I think it's worse. Now at 360km/h IAS the thing rolls in 10 seconds.

I suppose Oleg just has his mind made up that this is the way he wants it to perform. Too bad.

Regards,

SkyChimp

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/sig.jpg

Hunter82
09-08-2003, 11:09 PM
I`ll try D27 later on tonight...

=======================================
Ubisoft IL2/Lock On Moderator
ATI Catalyst Driver Beta Tester
Hunter82 wrote:"I did not have technical relations with that question"
Mudmovers (http://www.mudmovers.com/) </center>
=======================================

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 11:09 PM
SkyChimp wrote:
- The P-47D-27 roll rate is still horridly wrong. In
- fact, I think it's worse. Now at 360km/h IAS the
- thing rolls in 10 seconds.


I get it at around six seconds, 360km/h IAS, 1000m.

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 11:12 PM
Never flew the P-47 much until I DL that USAAF Offline Campaign last night. First three missions .. I noticed that every time I fire the guns ... the engine noise drops to almost nothing. Is everyone getting the same thing? Or has this been fixed in 1.11?

<center>http://www.medals.org.uk/united-kingdom/images/uk654.jpg

Hawgdog
09-08-2003, 11:12 PM
Hunter82 wrote:
- I flew it last night as you were diddling around
- with your sound High roll rate is much
- improved over 1.0 but maybe a tad slower than
- needed......you fix your sound yet?

I didnt get the latest patch until this morning. The beta was a better roller than whatever is out now.

sound is still fnebbed, even worse, echo all the time, making me nuts.
mebbe fly tonight, server is good and strong, how many? 25,26 total? plenty of targets

<center></script>The original HawgDog, dont be fooled by fneb imitations
Vulching can be a contact sport
When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
http://users.zoominternet.net/~cgatewood/assets/images/sharkdog.gif



<center></script>The original HawgDog, dont be fooled by fneb imitations
Vulching can be a contact sport
When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
http://users.zoominternet.net/~cgatewood/assets/images/sharkdog.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 11:40 PM
it was supposed to be improved (Oleg said so through Ian Boys), but can't say I noticed.

maybe you should turn down your hardware acceleration. I had echoes for a while and that seemed to do it. I turned it back up now and sound is fine again.

http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_07.gif


She turned me into a newt, but I got better.

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 11:44 PM
The D-27 hasn't been touched as far as I can tell. After a couple hours testing, I am getting a horridly undermodelled roll rate. Hell, it doesn't even roll to a 30lb stick for standard:

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/screwedroll.jpg


Regards,

SkyChimp

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/sig.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 11:48 PM
is a shame...still not all it can be.

is speed ok with d27?



http://www.endlager.net/fis/pix/banners/fis_banner_07.gif


She turned me into a newt, but I got better.

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 11:54 PM
Skychimp, what settings are you flying on? I used the P-47D-27 on 100% fuel and default load settings at 1000m and 360KIAS, and got around about 5/6 secs.

XyZspineZyX
09-08-2003, 11:56 PM
Aerobob, if you are using the arcade guages to judge, that speed is in TAS, not IAS.

I am using the airspeed indicator on the dash.

I'm confident in my numbers, I've ran the test several times.

Regards,

SkyChimp

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/sig.jpg

Hawgdog
09-09-2003, 12:09 AM
cool graph, I have no idea what it means

I used airstart, 25% fuel and kept high E for testing, always from 350-450
It really rolls better under 300 from my half arsed count

sigh..........

<center></script>The original HawgDog, dont be fooled by fneb imitations
Vulching can be a contact sport
When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
http://users.zoominternet.net/~cgatewood/assets/images/sharkdog.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 12:17 AM
I'm happy with it now - the guns *appear* to be more beefy now, and manuverability is enhanced. You can apply water injection/110% power for 10-15 seconds (haven't tried any longer) without overheating and bring back to 100% without much heat trouble at about 1500m. Goes pretty fast with water injection too, but... All tested in the QMB generator and Extreme One's P-47 campaign. Will see how it works online tonight sometime.

I think the offliners will be happy to fly this one! Dogfighters... Eh. Beware. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

BTW, the altitude indicator - the small hand is hundreds of feet and the long hand tens of feet, right? I think I've been reading it right but BlitzPig_DDT got me all confused about it a couple nights ago!

http://www.mechmodels.com/images/klv_ubisig1a.jpg

Hunter82
09-09-2003, 12:17 AM
had 27 people on for the most part all night last night.....not bad and stayed smooth....few more tweaks and it will be set
Hawgdog wrote:
-
- Hunter82 wrote:
-- I flew it last night as you were diddling around
-- with your sound High roll rate is much
-- improved over 1.0 but maybe a tad slower than
-- needed......you fix your sound yet?
-
- I didnt get the latest patch until this morning. The
- beta was a better roller than whatever is out now.
-
- sound is still fnebbed, even worse, echo all the
- time, making me nuts.
- mebbe fly tonight, server is good and strong, how
- many? 25,26 total? plenty of targets


=======================================
Ubisoft IL2/Lock On Moderator
ATI Catalyst Driver Beta Tester
Hunter82 wrote:"I did not have technical relations with that question"
Mudmovers (http://www.mudmovers.com/) </center>
=======================================

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 12:17 AM
I'm new to testing anything seriously like this, so I may well be doing something wrong. I was using the arcade dial to get an exact number (not the red numeric speed readout in the bottom left), as I thought that was the indicated airspeed.

Possibly a stupid question, but isn't the P-47's speedo in MPH, not KM/H?

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 12:20 AM
AeroBob wrote:
- I'm new to testing anything seriously like this, so
- I may well be doing something wrong. I was using
- the arcade dial to get an exact number (not the red
- numeric speed readout in the bottom left), as I
- thought that was the indicated airspeed.
-
- Possibly a stupid question, but isn't the P-47's
- speedo in MPH, not KM/H?
-
-

The arcade gauge is in True Air Speed, for some unknown weird reason. The speed number in the lower left corner is in Indicated Air Speed. Both in km/h.

The airspeed indicator in the cockpit is in mph, but it is also in Indicated Air Speed, precisely what is needed to chart against American graphs.

Regards,

SkyChimp

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/sig.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 12:21 AM
I just wanted to add a few cents

First, I do fly the Jug every day, and it's actualy my favorait plane.

Any way, I have only been using the P-47/27. Am i missing out?


With the 27, i didn't notice any improvent in roll rait with patch 1.1b.

But with the Patch 1.1Fnotright i did notice an improvement in roll rait and manuverablity. The roll rait in 1.11, in my opinion, is the same as 1.1Fnotright.

I have noticed she fly's smoother also. She turns a little better. Speed wise, well i havent noticed a dif.

But, like i said i havent tride the other 47's yet. Am i missing out?

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 12:23 AM
Do you see what`s happening here, good people?

This is a whine that`s TRYING to take off. There`s nothing to whine about, but its doing its best to catch and take hold....


/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif




"Tis better to work towards an Impossible Good, rather than a Possible Evil."

SeaFireLIV.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 12:25 AM
So does that mean you're taking the roll rate at 360mph IAS?

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 12:30 AM
Don't waste your time. Just like with the 190 cockpit view, once you get the official "you is wrong" response, all the data in the world won't change his mind.

It was a big plane, so of course it was a ponderous beast with no redeeming value. Even though all the top US ETO aces flew it as did many in the Med and PTO -- but we know this was Western Propaganda. Only La7 and Yak3 were true world beaters.

If you want an interesting, objective anlysis, read Flight Journal Magazine from a few months back. They ranked WW2 fighters based on several factors. Neither P-51 nor Yak/Lagg got top honors.

#1 was the Jug, #2 190... Interesting...

Maybe in the future somone else will pick up the WW2 mantle and we'll get truth as opposed to a highly personal and flawed representation -- albeit a visually stunning one... Which is what IL2's epitaph will read in about a year or so when things run their course and people move on to new product.

Too bad though. A properly modelled Jug would have been a terrfic addition to this sim. For the real deal you'll have to dust off Janes WW2F and install the latest skins. Even though it's dated and visually not as good as IL2/FB -- though the latest skins bring it very close in many respects -- they did a terrific job modelling the Jug.

SkyChimp wrote:
- The D-27 hasn't been touched as far as I can tell.
- After a couple hours testing, I am getting a
- horridly undermodelled roll rate. Hell, it doesn't
- even roll to a 30lb stick for standard:
-
<img
- src="http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/screwedro
- ll.jpg">
-
-
-
- Regards,
-
- SkyChimp
-
http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/sig.jpg
-

Hawgdog
09-09-2003, 12:31 AM
Yup, the P-47 is better than it used to be.

Its an American IL2

You will die if you fight online in DF servers with it. You'll get a kill or two but its not competitive!

SeaFireLIVhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gifo you see what`s happening here, good people?

This is a whine that`s TRYING to take off. There`s nothing to whine about, but its doing its best to catch and take hold....

dude stay outta the thread if you dont like it-




<center></script>The original HawgDog, dont be fooled by fneb imitations
Vulching can be a contact sport
When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
http://users.zoominternet.net/~cgatewood/assets/images/sharkdog.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 12:34 AM
AeroBob wrote:
- So does that mean you're taking the roll rate at
- 360mph IAS?
-
-

Check out the chart I posted. The red line is the roll rate at the corresponding Indicated Air Speeds. Only at VERY low speedsm 160 mph IAS, does it exceed the proper roll rate,, and it erroneously drops from there.

Regards,

SkyChimp

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/sig.jpg


Message Edited on 09/09/0303:35AM by SkyChimp

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 12:38 AM
What you need are some guys that try to outdive you or dive with you from 6000m... /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

http://www.mechmodels.com/images/klv_ubisig1a.jpg

Hawgdog
09-09-2003, 12:39 AM
SkyChimp wrote:
-
- Check out the chart I posted. The red line is the
- roll rate at the corresponding Indicated Air Speeds.
- Only at VERY low speedsm 160 mph IAS, does it
- exceed the proper roll rate,, and it erroneously
- drops from there.
-


yeah, thats what my hillybilly observation told me earlier posted.....
If you love the plane, its an observation, if you dont its a whine? Or is it the other way around?

<center></script>The original HawgDog, dont be fooled by fneb imitations
Vulching can be a contact sport
When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
http://users.zoominternet.net/~cgatewood/assets/images/sharkdog.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 12:50 AM
I'm not saying the D-27 is not improved at all. It is. It turns better, dives better, etc... But the most glaring error was the roll rate. And that is as bad as ever.

Regards,

SkyChimp

http://members.cox.net/rowlandparks/sig.jpg

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 12:52 AM
if
john Wayne said it rolls faster FIX IT!!!

Hawgdog
09-09-2003, 12:53 AM
SkyChimp wrote:
- I'm not saying the D-27 is not improved at all. It
- is. It turns better, dives better, etc... But the
- most glaring error was the roll rate. And that is
- as bad as ever.

Yeah, what he said.

<center></script>The original HawgDog, dont be fooled by fneb imitations
Vulching can be a contact sport
When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
http://users.zoominternet.net/~cgatewood/assets/images/sharkdog.gif

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 01:12 AM
Hawgdog wrote:
- Yup, the P-47 is better than it used to be.
-
- Its an American IL2
-
- You will die if you fight online in DF servers with
- it. You'll get a kill or two but its not
- competitive!


lol, with 1.1F or 1.11 you can.

Spend all night with the Jug. If you dont pull any tight turns or meliman or watever you call it after a pass. You can savely fly away.

Yup, i did last night. two kills. I flew back to base and crashed on my lannding lol.

Before i engaged i climbed to an alt of 3800m and headed to the blue base. Once i was close i saw 2 FW's and 2BF;s. They were at about 1500m. I made about 5 or 6 passes, i had 2 kills.


How,? Whel after each pass i would climb, but only slightly. i wanted to make shure i was always going faster then who ever was pursuing. Mean while they were not going as fast as i was, not even close and they also had to climb.

Once i was about 4km away 3 of them gave up, except for one but by the time i turned around he was still 3km hway.

Oops, i get carried away when i talk about the Jug. Sorry.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 01:50 AM
Koro - Take off and climb, watch the altimeter and check it against the speed bar. You'll see it spins too fast for the big hand to be hundreds and the little to be thousands. I'm almost positive that the big hand is tens and the little hand is hundreds.

If for no other reason than the fact that this a/c operated at something like 30,000+ feet and if the little hand was thousands that would still only be 10,000 feet measurable.

Same deal on the P-39 too. Probably even the P-40 and Brewster but I don't use them enough to know.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 03:52 AM
Kinda makes one ponder the fate of the P51, doesn't it?

<center><FONT color="red">[b]BlitzPig_EL</FONT>[B]<CENTER> http://old.jccc.net/~droberts/p40/images/p40home.gif
</img>.
"All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds, wake in the day that it was vanity:
but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act on their dreams with open eyes, to make them possible. "
--T.E. Lawrence

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 04:05 AM
ElAurens wrote:
- Kinda makes one ponder the fate of the P51, doesn't
- it?

Dream on dreamer. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif




<center>
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JOIN OUR SQUAD TODAY!
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XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 05:50 AM
Someone mentioned a downloadable USAAF campaign...

Where is it?

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 06:06 AM
You can get the USAAF campaign at Mudmovers site (located in "fansites" section of official FB page).

<center>
http://www.brooksart.com/Icewarriors.jpg

"Ice Warriors", by Nicolas Trudgian.



Message Edited on 09/09/0305:07AM by kyrule2

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 06:51 AM
American a/c data is "maunfacurer's advertizing data"./i/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif 'You is wrong' if you believe USAAF and NACA data. Only TsAGI and NIIV-VS are correct and to be believed. Unfortunately NDA makes it impossible to divulge their data.


ElAurens wrote:
- Kinda makes one ponder the fate of the P51, doesn't
- it?
-
-

http://a1276.g.akamai.net/7/1276/734/625ed428e022ef/www.harley-davidson.com/PR/MOT/2004/Softail/images/DOM/img_Softail_FXST.jpg

http://www.redneckengineering.com/photogallery/photo23581/curves-done-03.jpg


"Only a dead 'chamber pot' is a good 'chamber pot'!"

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 08:18 AM
So Skychimp, are these tests done with or without rudder?

I definitely agree there is no difference in the roll rate of the 27.

I say we stay after them till they get it right, or else, as El Aurens points out the P51 is bucked for sure.






"We will welcome them with bullets and shoes."

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 10:58 AM
GR142_Astro wrote:
- So Skychimp, are these tests done with or without
- rudder?
-
- I definitely agree there is no difference in the
- roll rate of the 27.
-
- I say we stay after them till they get it right, or
- else, as El Aurens points out the P51 is bucked for
- sure.

Why so? We have the B239 and P39 (unless things
have changed between 1.1f and 1.11) overmodelled
in certain aspects. The 'Oleg hates American planes,
blah blah blah, the P51 won't fly like we want it
to stuff' is such silly paranoia.

We have "Oleg hates US planes", "Oleg hates LW planes"
and "The Lagg-3 isn't as good as it should, so Oleg
hates VVS planes". It's ridiculous! I suspect that the
complexity of feeding the data into the FM, with a lot
of planes in the planeset is simply getting away from
the dev team, which is probably why Oleg said that
for the next sim, the FM will be more complex, but the
planeset smaller - more chance of getting the parameters
correct.

With complex interlinked physics equations, it is entirely
possible to get everything apparently performing correctly,
even with some nasty bugs in the implementation of the
equations. I suspect that this is one of the places that
the problem lies. If you correct a bug in one of the
equations when you discover it, it might correct one
aspect of behaviouor in one plane, but then you might
find that the other planes had their parameters adjusted
to get the right performance, but based on that bug. So
you fix a bug, and other FMs end up being broken. It looks
a lot like the sort of behaviour we are seeing here.

The D27, though, looks like it didn't have its parameters
changed. Probably an oversight.

It all suggests too much work for the 1C team, given
their other commitments.

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 11:19 AM
MiloMorai wrote:
- American a/c data is "maunfacurer's advertizing
- data".'You is wrong' if you
- believe USAAF and NACA data. Only TsAGI and NIIV-VS
- are correct and to be believed. Unfortunately NDA
- makes it impossible to divulge their data.


Milo...


The NACA data is totaly correct.

Who invented the word propoganda anyway hmmmmmmm.......


/i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

<center><FONT color="red">[b]BlitzPig_EL</FONT>[B]<CENTER> http://old.jccc.net/~droberts/p40/images/p40home.gif
</img>.
"All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds, wake in the day that it was vanity:
but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act on their dreams with open eyes, to make them possible. "
--T.E. Lawrence

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 11:36 AM
I really don't mind the roll-rate of the P-47D in IL-2 FB. I know the plane is meant for ground attack mostly and really stand little chance in a DF.
Found this interesting article about the P-47 here http://www.americanairpowermuseum.com/htm/p47.htm . If u read that, notice the last paragraph about the P-47N: "The new wing also incorporated larger ailerons and squared-off wingtips. These innovations enhanced the roll-rate of the Thunderbolt and improved the maneuverability."
Maybe some ppl here just want/wish the performance of the N model than the D one? /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif



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Viking Power!
http://kickme.to/viperviking

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 12:48 PM
ElAurens wrote:

- Who invented the word propoganda anyway
- hmmmmmmm.......

Actually, that would be the Roman Catholic Church in about 1622. What's your point? /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

Hawgdog
09-09-2003, 01:10 PM
Ok flew online. The two earlier ones do roll quicker. The earliest one seems to be the handiest, no doubt as it was pointed out- no bomb pilons. The jug is supposed to roll smartly at alts OVER 5K.I'll play with that this morning when everyone else is working here. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif ok, airstarted at 10,000 meters...about the same as at lower alts.
The earlier ones climb quite nicely.
Barnacles- I bet the Duke's roll rate in his grave is twice that of the Jug! /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

<center></script>The original HawgDog, dont be fooled by yelling and whining modelers, they are not god, you are
Vulching can be a contact sport
When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
http://users.zoominternet.net/~cgatewood/assets/images/sharkdog.gif



Message Edited on 09/09/0308:43AM by Hawgdog

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 01:17 PM
LOLOLOLO Hawg. I ahve to agree...except no Hurri for me.



Hawgdog wrote:
- Peeeeeeeeee-yew. Still stinks.
- Maybe I've been lead to believe the p-47 could roll
- quickly and snap like a whip. Dam hollywood movies.
- I guess it aint so, cause I know UBI models the
- planes correctly.
- Wish it rolled like the movie I watched. Dam
- hollywood liars.
-
-
- well, back the hurricane!
-
- <center></script>P-47 Jug-whiner extrodanair
- Vulching can be a contact sport
- When you get to hell, tell 'em Hawgdog sent you
- Sig limitations and bad roll rates rule
- <img
- src="http://users.zoominternet.net/~cgatewood/asse
- ts/images/sharkdog.gif">
-
-
-
-
-
-
- Message Edited on 09/08/03 04:02PM by Hawgdog

XyZspineZyX
09-09-2003, 01:19 PM
Not at all. Look at the NACA charts. We just want proper characteristics for what we have.

However, it would really be nice to get the N and M. /i/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif