PDA

View Full Version : How does Arno read memories ?



DaZex
11-17-2014, 01:18 PM
Whenever Arno assassinates someone flashes of their memories come to him, at first i believed that was part of the Animus, and that only we, the player get to see that, but then he tells the councils the details that he learned from those memories. Moreover after the mission "The Prophet" he specifically tells the council "In his memories. I say him ... " and the council doesn't even bat an eye. Was this ever explained and I just missed it ?

ace3001
11-17-2014, 01:58 PM
It was never explained. It doesn't make any sense in the narrative context because no other Assassin we know of has been capable of such a feat, not even Desmond who has a higher concentration of first civ DNA than any of the ancestors.

VestigialLlama4
11-17-2014, 02:18 PM
Whenever Arno assassinates someone flashes of their memories come to him, at first i believed that was part of the Animus, and that only we, the player get to see that, but then he tells the councils the details that he learned from those memories. Moreover after the mission "The Prophet" he specifically tells the council "In his memories. I say him ... " and the council doesn't even bat an eye. Was this ever explained and I just missed it ?

Amancio said that it was part of the Eagle Vision, the First Civilization DNA that the Assassins have. The idea is you get memories of the people you kill when they die. He said they wanted to replace the post-kill scene which was always a surreal touch but which people found absurd so he replaced it with something that was still surreal but less immersion-breaking, according to him.

You know, the memory-montage was one of the extremely few things I actually liked in UNITY

ace3001
11-17-2014, 02:32 PM
Amancio said that it was part of the Eagle Vision, the First Civilization DNA that the Assassins have. The idea is you get memories of the people you kill when they die. He said they wanted to replace the post-kill scene which was always a surreal touch but which people found absurd so he replaced it with something that was still surreal but less immersion-breaking, according to him.

You know, the memory-montage was one of the extremely few things I actually liked in UNITYThen how come other Assassins never got to see their victims' memories before?

VestigialLlama4
11-17-2014, 02:45 PM
Then how come other Assassins never got to see their victims' memories before?

Arno's Eagle sense has something different. It's similar to Shay who has this Spider-Sense for when Assassins are nearby. Eagle senses can have variations apparently.

And in the final one, you do talk to the bad guy, and the explanation is all the earlier conversations aren't really happening on the literal plane but in the mental area.

dxsxhxcx
11-17-2014, 03:23 PM
Amancio said that it was part of the Eagle Vision, the First Civilization DNA that the Assassins have. The idea is you get memories of the people you kill when they die. He said they wanted to replace the post-kill scene which was always a surreal touch but which people found absurd so he replaced it with something that was still surreal but less immersion-breaking, according to him.

You know, the memory-montage was one of the extremely few things I actually liked in UNITY

lol... less immersion-breaking? Creating a poor in game excuse for it (IMO) doesn't make it right, the "fact" that EV is (also) becoming too good to be true is immersion-breaking as hell (at least for me), good were the days where we could only see the memories of the Animus user and the Eagle Vision wasn't an all-in-one skill...


Then how come other Assassins never got to see their victims' memories before?

I believe because in the original plan they never had the intention to "upgrade" the Eagle Vision this much, this new trick it can do probably was something created during the development of this game because they didn't have anything better to add..

Pr0metheus 1962
11-17-2014, 03:31 PM
I like the new assassination memory thing - it may still be a little ridiculous, but it does make more sense, in terms of the First Civilization DNA stuff. And at least Amancio finally explained it so that it seems a little more believable.

D.I.D.
11-17-2014, 03:40 PM
I like it. It's still silly, but it's the right kind of silly. I think it ties in well with the weird thing he does before major assassinations. I think it makes more sense to tie in the post-kill visions with all the "high concentration of First Civ DNA" business that to make it a part of the Animus technology (which was full of holes, as an idea, if enjoyably so).

ace3001
11-17-2014, 03:46 PM
I like the new assassination memory thing - it may still be a little ridiculous, but it does make more sense, in terms of the First Civilization DNA stuff. And at least Amancio finally explained it so that it seems a little more believable.

It's not a matter of believability, but the fact that it retcons Assassin abilities irks me.

D.I.D.
11-17-2014, 03:54 PM
It's not a matter of believability, but the fact that it retcons Assassin abilities irks me.

It had to change though. The old way had a conversation happening gratis of the Animus, so you were told this didn't happen but here's what they would have said. Then you go back into "real" life, and your ancestor protagonist carries information with him out of a computer simulation which happened hundreds of years after his death.

I think this is a pretty gentle retcon given that they had such a big hole to bridge, and it's not really a retcon anyway. They've always justified new and different abilities by saying, "... And this one's got the most TWCB DNA yet".

Pr0metheus 1962
11-17-2014, 03:56 PM
It's not a matter of believability, but the fact that it retcons Assassin abilities irks me.

It retcons Assassin abilities? Firstly, that's the first time I've ever seen the word "retcon", so I had to look it up :). Secondly, has this ability ever actually been defined before in such a way that the new explanation can actually be said to be a retcon of it? Even if the answer is yes, personally, I can live with it. It's a minor change after all.

Dev_Anj
11-17-2014, 03:59 PM
I'm curious, where was the ability for an Assassin to talk with a dead target in the middle of several angry guards ever explained? :p Also, regardless of the explanation, it always felt like a jarring method of telling the story, and those sppeches lost their appeal during AC 2 to AC:R, though they partially regained it in AC 3.

dxsxhxcx
11-17-2014, 04:00 PM
I wonder if they are taking these ideas from here:

http://guidetothemasquerade.weebly.com/auspex.html

while I love the universe of Vampire The Masquerade I still think have this kind of ability in AC (IMO) is ridiculous..

the bad guy doesn't want to talk? No problem, let's just kill him and read his memories.. \o/

in the next game we'll be able to read the memories of the targets ancestors as well...

ace3001
11-17-2014, 04:11 PM
It retcons Assassin abilities? Firstly, that's the first time I've ever seen the word "retcon", so I had to look it up :). Secondly, has this ability ever actually been defined before in such a way that the new explanation can actually be said to be a retcon of it? Even if the answer is yes, personally, I can live with it. It's a minor change after all.It's a rather large retcon, actually.
Imagine if Ezio could see Uberto's memories from the get go.

D.I.D.
11-17-2014, 04:13 PM
It's a rather large retcon, actually.
Imagine if Ezio could see Uberto's memories from the get go.

Arno can't do that, though. He has the ability to focus and catch moments of dialogue happening live in that moment from a distance, and the memories come at the point of death.

ace3001
11-17-2014, 04:24 PM
Arno can't do that, though. He has the ability to focus and catch moments of dialogue happening live in that moment from a distance, and the memories come at the point of death.

Uberto is the first target that Ezio takes down. Now think.

steveeire
11-17-2014, 04:41 PM
I wish they'd leave Eagle sense alone, it was different for ever Assassin, Edwards was the best though.

D.I.D.
11-17-2014, 04:44 PM
Uberto is the first target that Ezio takes down. Now think.

Yes, but conveniently Arno doesn't get the person's entire life, just a clutch of fragments of memory that give him a clue about how to proceed. There are lots of times during Unity that Arno could have known everything if he simply saw whatever he wanted.

ace3001
11-17-2014, 04:49 PM
Yes, but conveniently Arno doesn't get the person's entire life, just a clutch of fragments of memory that give him a clue about how to proceed. There are lots of times during Unity that Arno could have known everything if he simply saw whatever he wanted.

Thing is, Ezio got nothing. Not any fragments whatsoever. And not just Ezio. Any previous Assassin could only get what the dying man willingly divulges. Not the case here. Arno gets glimpses into the target's life forcefully.

JustPlainQuirky
11-17-2014, 06:29 PM
They introduced new branches of eagle vision.

It's not a retcon, it's a different variation.

Pr0metheus 1962
11-17-2014, 08:04 PM
I think people are getting way too serious about all of this. It's just a game after all. We're not talking about flaws in Dostoyevsky's Crime and Punishment here. Does it really matter that much that they changed the death exposition thing or why they changed it? The fact is, it changed and we're probably going to have to deal with it if we want to keep playing these games. If some of us can't deal with it, then I guess those people can try to persuade the developers to change it back, or just quit playing.

souNdwAve89
11-17-2014, 09:39 PM
I don't think it's that big of a deal. We have gotten many different versions of the sense. In Revelations, Ezio's Eagle Vision became Eagle Sense, where he can see the trail of the guard's patrol. In AC4, Edward can see guards through walls, and he can't use it while running. In Unity, Arno can only use his Eagle Vision for a short duration. In fact, Amancio said it does tie into the story a little. Amancio said that Arno's Eagle Vision is sporadic and untamed due to lack of training. At the end of the day, it's just another gameplay mechanic.

dxsxhxcx
11-18-2014, 12:58 AM
I don't think it's that big of a deal. We have gotten many different versions of the sense. In Revelations, Ezio's Eagle Vision became Eagle Sense, where he can see the trail of the guard's patrol. In AC4, Edward can see guards through walls, and he can't use it while running. In Unity, Arno can only use his Eagle Vision for a short duration. In fact, Amancio said it does tie into the story a little. Amancio said that Arno's Eagle Vision is sporadic and untamed due to lack of training. At the end of the day, it's just another gameplay mechanic.

so the most overpowered use of Eagle Vision comes from lack of training? I feel bad for the other Assassins now.. :p

boosho
11-18-2014, 02:40 AM
The way I see it is people have different abilities even in real life. Be it evolution, skill or just different genetics. Just because one assassin has an ability doesnt mean they should all have it.

cawatrooper9
11-18-2014, 03:49 AM
Thematically, I like the idea- we are, after all, reliving these Assassins' memories. It's only fitting that the can read their targets' as well. However, with this and the White Room stuff, I'd really appreciate it if the Assassins seemed more aware of what was going, a bit more surprised at their powers (at least at first). Wouldn't Arno at least mention the fact that he's able to absorb others memories when he's killed them the first time it happens?