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View Full Version : Infrared LED's work fine on standard Webcams



Sabla
01-24-2004, 09:38 PM
I was playing around with a Webcam trying to get Pan2Cam or Freelook working (without much success yet, camera seems to be too slow) and I thought...."I wonder if it would sense the LED from a remote control from a TV set?"
Well...Sure Enough it does!!!
I get a quite distinct dot on the setup screen and it is tracked quite well.
So now I have something useful for a few old remotes that no longer have TV's!!!

So there is evidently nothing special about the one provided with TrackIR I guess, other than an IR emitter built into the camera to reflect IR off of the provided dots.

Makes a great way to test to see if your home-built LED for this function is bad. Grab a remote, hold the power button down and wave it in front of the WebCam. If it moves the cursor, it is sensing just fine!

jba

http://img7.photobucket.com/albums/v18/revwarnut/P40-skulls-small.jpg
Burma Banshees! 10th AF 88th, 89th & 90th FG
Dad was a Crew Chief in the 88th.

Sabla
01-24-2004, 09:38 PM
I was playing around with a Webcam trying to get Pan2Cam or Freelook working (without much success yet, camera seems to be too slow) and I thought...."I wonder if it would sense the LED from a remote control from a TV set?"
Well...Sure Enough it does!!!
I get a quite distinct dot on the setup screen and it is tracked quite well.
So now I have something useful for a few old remotes that no longer have TV's!!!

So there is evidently nothing special about the one provided with TrackIR I guess, other than an IR emitter built into the camera to reflect IR off of the provided dots.

Makes a great way to test to see if your home-built LED for this function is bad. Grab a remote, hold the power button down and wave it in front of the WebCam. If it moves the cursor, it is sensing just fine!

jba

http://img7.photobucket.com/albums/v18/revwarnut/P40-skulls-small.jpg
Burma Banshees! 10th AF 88th, 89th & 90th FG
Dad was a Crew Chief in the 88th.

Waldo.Pepper
01-24-2004, 10:00 PM
Great tip I find that Freelook works better than cam2pan... and there is a new version as well.

tsisqua
01-24-2004, 10:05 PM
New version of Cam2Pan out yesterday.

Tsisqua

http://www.uploadit.org/files/010903-nedChristie.jpg
Tsalagi Asgaya Galvladi

Aaron_GT
01-25-2004, 04:02 AM
I got a cheap web cam to try. So far I am finding
cam2pan tracks better than freelook. I am not sure
how much cam2pan costs, so that might affect my
decision on which one I go for!

I'm having difficulty getting cam2pan to pan
more than about 120 degrees in cockpit. I am sure
there will be some settings in IL2 related to
panning sensitivity, though.

Troll2k
01-25-2004, 04:02 AM
When I was messing with cam2pan a while back I mounted a standard led to the top of my headset.It tracked fine and I could play in the dark.The led runs off an adapter I made that uses a spare usb port.I messed with the camera settings and the mouse sensitivity(in il2 setup) and got it working pretty good.It was only a problem when I was shootings as I put a lot of body english on my deflection shots.This caused my shooting to be off.

Aaron_GT
01-25-2004, 04:03 AM
One problem I am having by using a cheap
web cam is that bright lights (for the
'torch' mode in cam2pan) causes reflections
on the camera lens, and cam2pan tends to
follow those, in the opposite direction to
my head movements, which is very confusing.

Extreme_One
01-25-2004, 05:04 AM
Freelook?

Anyone got a link?

S! Simon
'''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''
Download the RAF campaign folder here (http://www.netwings.org/library/Forgotten_Battles/Missions/index-9.html).

Download the USAAF campaign folder here (http://www.netwings.org/library/Forgotten_Battles/Missions/index-9.html). *NEW* Updated for FB 1.21

http://extremeone.4t.com/images/hurrisig.gif

S 8
01-25-2004, 07:19 AM
http://freelook.org/manual.php

I don´t know about you guys,but I really get tired in my eye muscles.... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gifPov hat is enough for me.

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/ah_113_1073048715.jpg

Extreme_One
01-25-2004, 09:09 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Superluminal:
http://freelook.org/manual.php

I don´t know about you guys,but I really get tired in my eye muscles.... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gifPov hat is enough for me.

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/ah_113_1073048715.jpg <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Cheers mate.

S! Simon
'''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' '''''
Download the RAF campaign folder here (http://www.netwings.org/library/Forgotten_Battles/Missions/index-9.html).

Download the USAAF campaign folder here (http://www.netwings.org/library/Forgotten_Battles/Missions/index-9.html). *NEW* Updated for FB 1.21

http://extremeone.4t.com/images/raf_sig.jpg

PriK
01-25-2004, 11:44 AM
Unfortunately, there is no real comparison to TrackIR when you consider that your webcam only refreshes at 30 or 40hz whereas TIR1 refreshes at 60hz and TIR2 at 100hz.

Try playing your favourite FPS game with a 40hz mouse and see how well you do. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

http://charvel.acwos.com/chbanner.jpg

Sabla
01-25-2004, 02:50 PM
100 Frames per second for the TrackIR2 ehhh??
I didn't know that. I wonder if there is a way to tweak the cheapo webcams?? Or even the TrackIR to a faster rate??
Anyone know?

Thanks for the info.

http://img7.photobucket.com/albums/v18/revwarnut/P40-skulls-small.jpg
Burma Banshees! 10th AF 88th, 89th & 90th FG
Dad was a Crew Chief in the 88th.

PriK
01-25-2004, 04:34 PM
It would be nice to do but unfortunately it isn't possible. The CCD is unique for the TIR and not cheap from what the developers have told me.

The other consideration to keep in mind is that with either method you will never get the FULL effective rate in your games like you would with a mouse because the farther away your source (dot) is away from the receiver, the less resolution is available to translate into movement on the computer. So you end up with much less "effective" refresh rate for your games since you have to accelerate or amplify the relatively small area of movement apparant to the sensor (or CCD)into the full motion required for the game. Software can interpolate in between the samples of movement like the smoothing feature in the TIR drivers but that costs more CPU and introduces lag in movement.

Using a webcam would probably bring in more CPU overhead since it's hardware is not specialized for tracking.

Bottom line is it doesn't hurt to try it out and use it but don't expect it to compare to the real thing.

http://charvel.acwos.com/chbanner.jpg

Sabla
01-25-2004, 05:05 PM
I think I will post a question in the technical section.
But to cover all bases.

Can another type of camera be used?
Perhaps something hooked up to a Video card?
I would think that would result in greater sample rate. Might be harder (??) to adjust for movement tracking, but who knows, it might be easier. (???)
Sounds like a project waiting to be tested.
jba

http://img7.photobucket.com/albums/v18/revwarnut/P40-skulls-small.jpg
Burma Banshees! 10th AF 88th, 89th & 90th FG
Dad was a Crew Chief in the 88th.

WB_Outlaw
01-25-2004, 05:19 PM
Any CCD camcorder, which is all of them, will detect infrared light. Even my 12 year old full size GE VHS camcorder will film in the infrared. Note that I am not talking about thermal imaging, just infrared light sources.

-Outlaw.

lev_lv
01-26-2004, 09:59 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Aaron_GT:
I got a cheap web cam to try. So far I am finding
cam2pan tracks better than freelook. I am not sure
how much cam2pan costs, so that might affect my
decision on which one I go for!

I'm having difficulty getting cam2pan to pan
more than about 120 degrees in cockpit. I am sure
there will be some settings in IL2 related to
panning sensitivity, though.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
To pan more than 120 degrees you have either to adjust or to disable the "cursor limits" on Cam2Pan main window. If you enable the "cursor limits" (recomended in order to keep the program in sync with the sym) then please don't forget to set the center - CTRL + UP or the corresponding button on the main window.

adlabs6
01-26-2004, 11:17 AM
I've had great success with Freelook. I'd been thinking about infrared LED's, since you can easily see the IR from a remote on the camera preview window. Just buy a AA battery bcx and an IR LED, mount on a cap and your set.

For the money, these programs like Cam2Pan ($20) and Freelook (free), plus a cheap webcam can't be beaten. Like was said above, you can see a slightly slower response than something like TrackIR may have, but head tracking isn't worth a hundred dollar bill to me.

http://www.geocities.com/adlabs6/B/bin/sigUBI.GIF
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