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Skirlasvoud
08-14-2014, 06:53 PM
I frequent Eurogamer from time to time and today, I read this piece: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-08-14-ubisoft-only-vocal-minority-complains-about-number-of-assassins-creed-games

Immediately, I tripped over the term "Vocal Minority".


Now, first off, let me just clarify where I'm coming from: I have relatively warm feelings towards AC, though I can't say I'm a fan. Sadly, I have discerning tastes and I pick up certain iterations only when I feel like it. I finished 1. Finished 2 just before the release of black flag after it had gathered 2 years of dust. Also finished Black Flag and I thought it was great. Didn't get anything else, though I'm still curious about Liberty. I shan't be doing multiplayer and honestly, I'm not following Ubisoft closely enough to know what or when the next game is going to be. Something about Paris I saw on Eurogamer, dunno. Therefore, this post is not about discussing AC in any way and I have no real feelings towards the series, or the speed at which new games arrive. If Ubisoft tells me it wants to release a new AC every week, I would feel just as strongly about that as Ubisoft telling me the series is cancelled forever, namely; very little. If Ubisoft wants to go Henry Ford on the series and bury the market, they can go ahead and I'll just pick and choose between the iterations whenever I have time and cash.


No, what irks me far more, is the term "vocal minority", because, I hate that term. I bitterly resent any developer, publisher or third world dictator who uses it to marginalize critique. There's no such thing as a "vocal majority" when it comes to critique among customers since the majority of displeased customers will simply give up on a product instead of make themselves heard. There's no way of knowing a discontent "vocal minority" isn't a discontent "silent majority". Even if there's more positive noise than negative, than that's only because the former sticks around where the latter drops off.

I'd say that the moment there's enough discontent among the playerbase, when there's enough people taking the time to voice their opinion about things going too fast - since apparently these people (unlike me) have bought and want to continue bying more than their fair share of sequels - for a developer to label these people merely a "vocal minority" that something has already gone wrong and stuff has hit the fan. You're just doing a half-assed PR job.

Dear Ubisoft: Just because I and millions of others with no outspoken opinion about the series occasionally buy your product, DOESN'T mean that we're part of your huge army of fans, allowing you to brand your probably more loyal, caring detractors as a "vocal minority".


Yours truly,

Signed:
Overwhelming grand majority of indifferent players who normally don't bother interacting with you and whose opinions you can't be sure of and/or shouldn't care about.

JustPlainQuirky
08-14-2014, 07:26 PM
Dear Ubisoft: Just because I and millions of others with no outspoken opinion about the series occasionally buy your product, DOESN'T mean that we're part of your huge army of fans, allowing you to brand your probably more loyal, caring detractors as a "vocal minority".


http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130202070054/glee/images/7/74/Applause-crowd.gif

CSKarasu
08-14-2014, 07:37 PM
Well said OP, I totally agree. It's an excuse frequently used by developers so they can stick their fingers in their ears to valid complaints.

I'd say this is the fundamental problem with the triple A game business, they no longer have to work to keep customer satisfaction.

JustPlainQuirky
08-14-2014, 07:38 PM
I remember Darby dismissing some concerns about AC in a loomer podcast because of "vocal minority"

Broke my heart.

It's often brought up regarding modern day.

SpiritOfNevaeh
08-14-2014, 07:38 PM
Interesting point OP. Just because there are a lot of people complaining about something doesnt mean they're the majority.


I remember Darby dismissing some concerns about AC in a loomer podcast because of "vocal minority"

Broke my heart.

What and when was this?

JustPlainQuirky
08-14-2014, 07:40 PM
@humble

I'd have to rewatch the podcast. (in total it's like 2-4 hours long with darby) but I distinctly remember him stating he and the devs had to learn to "drown out" what we people on the forums say about things because we're the "vocal minority" or something.

SpiritOfNevaeh
08-14-2014, 07:47 PM
@humble

I'd have to rewatch the podcast. (in total it's like 2-4 hours long with darby) but I distinctly remember him stating he and the devs had to learn to "drown out" what we people on the forums say about things because we're the "vocal minority" or something.

OMG Are you serious? Now I need to watch that now...

JustPlainQuirky
08-14-2014, 07:48 PM
it might not be in the specific 2 part one, but I'm 99% sure I heard it on a loomer podcast.

i don't think darby was on an initiates podcast. #illchecklatercuzimbusy

edit: it might have actually been on an ACIV interview. #illupdatelaterwhenifindit

CSKarasu
08-14-2014, 07:53 PM
@humble

I'd have to rewatch the podcast. (in total it's like 2-4 hours long with darby) but I distinctly remember him stating he and the devs had to learn to "drown out" what we people on the forums say about things because we're the "vocal minority" or something.

Well to be fair forums are the vocal minority. Think about how many outspoken critics of Call of Duty there are within the gaming sites and yet it always sells ridiculously well.

Don't get me wrong., I don't think it's right at all to dismiss peoples opinions on games, it's a matter of judging signal to noise, but it looks like Ubisoft is taking the stance that none of it is useful.

JustPlainQuirky
08-14-2014, 07:58 PM
Well to be fair forums are the vocal minority. Think about how many outspoken critics of Call of Duty there are within the gaming sites and yet it always sells ridiculously well.

Don't get me wrong., I don't think it's right at all to dismiss peoples opinions on games, it's a matter of judging signal to noise, but it looks like Ubisoft is taking the stance that none of it is useful.

Ah no I'm not saying we aren't different from the masses in terms of critiques/complaints. That much is true.

It's just that catering to the (dare I say) "more passionate" fans sounds like it's not a priority.

Though I did find out Mr_shade sends comments/complaints to the dev teams often. (though they do seem to be pick-and-choose) I also know devs like Darbs lurk in the forums often. So they are in the very least listening. Just acknowledgement of complaints and assurance actions might be done would be nice.

A fine example would be the recent "get rid of the blending circle" thread. Whether or not the circle is removed would say a lot concerning ubi's consideration of forum critiques/complaints.

Dome500
08-14-2014, 08:13 PM
Yeah I think the OP is right.
Independently from the franchise, series or developer, branding a mass of people that consists of more than a dozen people as vocal minority is a fools action.
Just because not everyone but only a dozen of those what-the-hell-do-I-know-how-many-thousand people who are not satisfied with an element in the game complain about this element does not mean there are not more people out there who think the same and don't have the time, energy or courage to voice their opinion.

Decisions about fan-feedack should not be based on the number of people complaining, or rather the number of people you actually KNOW are complaining, but rather from the frequency this point of criticism comes up in discussions. I know a developer can not address everything, but dismissing points brought up just because the developer thinks the people complaining are in the minority (Which is almost always the case, because many do not voice their opinion, some others give up pretty fast and don't buy the next game and others only realize it 1 or 2 games later) is always a bad move, because it could make a huge difference in the end.

Anyway, Unity seems to address a lot of criticism that has piled up over the years, so lets see how this series revamp turns out to be.
And please, no developer who wants good PR should ever mention the term "vocal minority". I mean, seriously guys? Shouldn't it be clear that those people you are talking about - especially if they know or think that they are not so much a minority but quite a bunch - are pretty pissed?

Assassin_M
08-14-2014, 08:16 PM
> Thread about not liking being called vocal minority
> OP and others start labeling people and places vocal minorities

JustPlainQuirky
08-14-2014, 08:17 PM
well to be clear it's not the term vocal minortiy that personally bothers me but the attitude towards it.

Assassin_M
08-14-2014, 08:21 PM
well to be clear it's not the term vocal minortiy that personally bothers me but the attitude towards it.
Not talking about you, Mayrice, you're fine. I think disregarding anyone as vocal minority is wrong too.

Shahkulu101
08-14-2014, 08:23 PM
M you called Connor detractors a vocal minority last night

Megas_Doux
08-14-2014, 08:30 PM
M you called Connor detractors a vocal minority last night

That is because the whole "vocal minority" issue might be used to diminish things one does not deem worthy....

For example, the RABID Connor fans here might be considered a "vocal minority" by some......

Assassin_M
08-14-2014, 08:36 PM
M you called Connor detractors a vocal minority last night
I know and I also said Ezio sucks--That said, i have a problem with using the label vocal minority to disregard complaint not the label itself..

Jexx21
08-14-2014, 08:39 PM
Except sometimes some complaints should be disregarded...

Assassin_M
08-14-2014, 08:44 PM
Except sometimes some complaints should be disregarded...
Not disregarded, I disagree...nothing should be disregarded--I think anything should be acknowledged..

Sushiglutton
08-14-2014, 08:44 PM
Is this about some peole complaining that Ubi just copy-pasted AC4, slammed on a cross on the costume and then called it a templar game? If so I'm part of that annoying minority ;)!

Jexx21
08-14-2014, 08:47 PM
Not disregarded, I disagree...nothing should be disregarded--I think anything should be acknowledged..

"This game doesn't have enough action set-pieces and heroic moments. I want something more like Brotherhood and Revelations, they were action packed! I mean, Ezio was a boss and he fought against the corrupt Borgia, he was the hero of Rome! And man, that moment in Revelations where we fought that guy while falling in mid-air, that was bad ***! More things like that please!"

Shahkulu101
08-14-2014, 08:49 PM
"This game doesn't have enough action set-pieces and heroic moments. I want something more like Brotherhood and Revelations, they were action packed! I mean, Ezio was a boss and he fought against the corrupt Borgia, he was the hero of Rome! And man, that moment in Revelations where we fought that guy while falling in mid-air, that was bad ***! More things like that please!"

I acknowledged that

I also think it's stupid - that's how it works

Assassin_M
08-14-2014, 08:50 PM
"This game doesn't have enough action set-pieces and heroic moments. I want something more like Brotherhood and Revelations, they were action packed! I mean, Ezio was a boss and he fought against the corrupt Borgia, he was the hero of Rome! And man, that moment in Revelations where we fought that guy while falling in mid-air, that was bad ***! More things like that please!"
Acknowledged.

Doesn't mean I have to oblige;)

EDIT: ninja'd by Shahk

JustPlainQuirky
08-14-2014, 08:54 PM
Would be great if there was just some button on a thread that when people click it, it's a +1 suggestion to send to the devs. And when a certain amount of points is reached, it's automatically sent to the devs. And maybe the button changes color once the dev recieves/looks over the thread.

#iwouldhaveclickedthehelloutoftheJosephDecreuxThre ad #ofceachpersoncanonlyclickonce

Not gonna happen, but it would be nice.

killzab
08-14-2014, 09:07 PM
I remember Darby dismissing some concerns about AC in a loomer podcast because of "vocal minority"

Broke my heart.

It's often brought up regarding modern day.

That's one of the reasons why I don't like him

lothario-da-be
08-14-2014, 09:07 PM
I have something against the term "vocal minority", the fact that they are vocal means there are a lot of them..

JustPlainQuirky
08-14-2014, 09:09 PM
That's one of the reasons why I don't like him

I love me some darbs.

But I'm not afraid to call out things I consider questionable.

#darbyifyou'rereadingthisIhopethisdoesn'taffectour futureengagement