PDA

View Full Version : Tired of being Worked



bonogun
07-07-2004, 12:48 AM
I need info on some basic principles with IL2fb. What is prop pitch? When should I be messing with fuel mixture and why? Combat flaps, what when and why? How much does throttle power have to do with speed? (flying level, I seem to have the same speed at 70% as I do at 100%). Is there a respected website, or source of information to tutor me on this and more?

Please help, I'm tired of being TOTALY shut down after two weeks of play.

bonogun
07-07-2004, 12:48 AM
I need info on some basic principles with IL2fb. What is prop pitch? When should I be messing with fuel mixture and why? Combat flaps, what when and why? How much does throttle power have to do with speed? (flying level, I seem to have the same speed at 70% as I do at 100%). Is there a respected website, or source of information to tutor me on this and more?

Please help, I'm tired of being TOTALY shut down after two weeks of play.

FI-Aflak
07-07-2004, 12:59 AM
Fuel Mixture: How much of what goes into your cylinders is fuel. At 100% or higher, you are giving your engine as much gas as it can handle at the power setting. Up high, where the air is thinner, you want to cut that back to 80 or even 70% in some aircraft. If you start trailing brown streaks from your exhaust with no damage or overheat, your mixture is overrich and you need to cut it back. Some A/C have auto and you don't need to worry. I think its mostly soviet craft that you need to do this manually.

Prop Pitch: the angle of your prop blades. A high pitch is a flatter angle, the prop spins faster and moves less air per rotation, its like 1st gear, use for climbing and acceleration. Lower it gradually at high alt or level flight. Note: prop pitch is not always prop pitch. On the american planes like the jug and mustang, it controls the speed of the constant speed prop, so 100% is always more power than 95%.

Flaps: things on the bottoms of your wings that lower to give more lift at the expense of greatly increased drag. Lower them to takeoff for takeoff, landing for landing (though don't use them and come in faster for a damaged-wing landing). In combat, lower them to combat only in a slow turning fight, or use them in emergencies to get out of dives (though you will probably lock your flaps when you do that.) Don't forget to raise them when you are finished.

power and speed: there isn't a huge difference between level flight at 110 and at 70, it comes out in acceleration, climb, and combat. Online you are usually doing one of the three, offline, when you are cruising to your target, 70 is usually an OK power setting.

BlakJakOfSpades
07-07-2004, 01:11 AM
have nothign really to add, just wanna c if my sig is working http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif good job answerin that dudes questoins tho aflak, i thought i knew all there was to know...but u proved me wrong

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v344/BlakJakofSpades/ae776415.jpg
Are those accurate roundels? lol

BlakJakOfSpades
07-07-2004, 01:16 AM
2 things, first off sorry for not posting in the official sig test thread (always saw that, never thought about what it was) and secondly my sig exceeded the guidelines, well hope its all in order now

http://img78.photobucket.com/albums/v344/BlakJakofSpades/10f1c8ff.jpg
Are those accurate roundels? lol

bonogun
07-07-2004, 08:25 AM
thanks so much for your detailed responce. Your explanaition of fuel mixture was more of what it is, then what it effects. Please anyone, describe somethings I may notice by not adjusting the mixture. For example. He stated that I might see brown trails coming from engine without it overheating, meaning I'm running rich. BUT HOW is running rich, effecting my flight or engine.

Prop pitch is covered well, thank you. However, the last two lines, from the word "Note:" do no make any sense to me.

Overall, I would say that online I allways feel like Im chugging along at 2 to 3 hundred knots, while I'm being raped by guys swooping and climbing with unlimited ammounts of speed and power.

Here is a description of my most recent example online and then I'll close. Any additions to this post are apreciated
I was being chased for what seemed for a long time. I'm fairly good and evading, I think that's why. I was flying a spitfire, and the enemy had a bf109. At diferent times, my pursuer would climb climb climb away from me, as if to confuse or loose me. I don't think he was doing it gain speed, because he was never off my tail. The most frustrating thing, is that it seemed as the bf109 climbed behind me, the distance between us never got that great at all. Like he could climb 200 ft without loosing forward momentum.

Cheers

BitwiseOp
07-07-2004, 09:23 AM
The biggest in game disadvantage of an over rich mixture seems to be the smoke trails make you more visible to the bad guys http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif Burning a rich mixture should probably gunk up your engine after a while (because all the fuel is not being ignited) but I don't know if this is modelled in the game. You don't get chewed out by your crew chief anyway :P

I believe that constant speed props adjust the pitch automatically to maintain constant RPM, so your prop pitch control in a P-47 is actually a control that alters RPM, which causes the prop pitch to change, rather than a prop pitch control that causes the RPM to change. Confused? You will be.

Fighting online you are going to meet people who have mastered the fine art of energy fighting. These are the guys who always seem to have power to maneuver - it's a matter of learning to manage your energy state - and it takes a lot of practice.

Golden rules are to not pull hard maneuvers unless you absolutely have to. Any maneuver that disrupts the airflow over your wings bleeds off speed. Once energy is 'lost' it takes time to regain. The single most helpful trick is to learn to maneuver in the vertical plane. Convert altitude to speed and vice versa.

The 109 could outclimb a Spit I believe (I guess it depends on the relative marks but in general 109's were better in a dive / climb and spits were better in a turn).

horseback
07-07-2004, 09:24 AM
Mixture settings affect two things,AFIK; fuel use and engine temp. The richer your mix, the more fuel you're using. In a limited range aircraft like a Spit, this can be a problem, unless your piloting skills are similar to mine, and you never have to worry about landing anyway.

Also, the richer your mix, the hotter your engine runs, and unless you have it firewalled (100% throttle or more most of the time), it's very inefficient and wears your engine down quicker. You'll probably notice as time goes on that your engine starts to get sluggish and overheat if you're running it too hard for too long.

This could happen in an extended climb or in combat, and in Real Life, WWII pilots (particularly early war Soviets) had to monitor their engines carefully, even in combat, while dodging bullets and flak. You might also want to work your radiator settings too, in those cases.

cheers

horseback

"Here's your new Mustangs, boys. You can learn to fly'em on the way to the target. Cheers!" -LTCOL Don Blakeslee, 4th FG CO, February 27th, 1944

Tooz_69GIAP
07-07-2004, 11:16 AM
Go look at this site:

http://people.ee.ethz.ch/~chapman/il2guide/index.htm

A ton of really useful stuff compiled by my squad mate Chap (Michapma in the forums)

whit ye looking at, ya big jessie?!?!

http://www.baseclass.modulweb.dk/69giap/fileadmin/Image_Archive/badges/69giap_badge_tooz.jpg
Za Rodinu!

Petition to stop the M3 motorway through the Tara-Skryne Valley in Co. Meath, Ireland (http://www.petitiononline.com/hilltara/petition.html)

NorrisMcWhirter
07-07-2004, 11:35 AM
Richer the mix = overheating?

I thought it was the other way around.

Lean mixture certainly overheats spark plugs, usually leads to an overheated engines and can cause pre-ignition engine damage.

Any incorrect mixture should decrease engine performance but over rich mixture will use more fuel and, over time, can reduce power by fouling the plugs.

Also, I seem to recall reading somewhere that engines are often cooled by running rich mixtures for short times.

Cheers,
Norris

================================================== ==========

: Chris Morris - Blue Jam :
http://cabinessence.cream.org/

: More irreverence :
http://www.tvgohome.com/

: You've seen them... :
www.chavscum.co.uk (http://www.chavscum.co.uk)

horseback
07-07-2004, 12:03 PM
Norris

I stand corrected on the mixture overheat issue; a richer mix does run cooler.

BlakJak--those are the correct roundels for a post-VE RAF aircraft, the plain Red/Blue roundels were lower visibility, and served better to complement camouflage. Post-war, the need for camo declined somewhat (for a while).

cheers

horseback

"Here's your new Mustangs, boys. You can learn to fly'em on the way to the target. Cheers!" -LTCOL Don Blakeslee, 4th FG CO, February 27th, 1944

Monson74
07-07-2004, 12:23 PM
When to use combat flaps: You should only lower your flaps when you need them because they'll bleed energy. Use them for quick turning or if you need to slow down. Remember to raise them or you'll quickly become a sitting duck. If you get stuck in a turn fight you might try to lower them even more but be careful - as a rule of thumb: do not aply take-off flaps at speeds exceeding 300km/h.

S!

Monson


"The Zerst├┬Ârers will form an offensive circle." - G├┬Âring

Black Sheep
07-07-2004, 01:25 PM
Out in the real world, the primary effect of an engine running rich is that it produces less and less power as you climb, because the engine is trying to burn a volume of fuel without an adequeate amount of air.

Therefore, you reduce the flow of fuel to the engine, a process known as leaning. The reverse also holds true, pilots must enrich the mixture when descending or face a dropoff in power.

This is noticeable from around 3000ft up or so in an average GA aircraft like a Piper Archer, though I'm pretty certain this isn't modelled in game; or if it is, it's seriously undermodelled.

Bonogun, the main thing is practice - try playing offline for a while against easy AI and up the difficulty as you feel more comfortable with things. Remember that there's no such thing as a born sim pilot and things do get easier with practice.

Good luck and good hunting http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/ilsigs/Nachtjaeger.jpg

jazman777
07-07-2004, 02:09 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Overall, I would say that online I allways feel like Im chugging along at 2 to 3 hundred knots, while I'm being raped by guys swooping and climbing with unlimited ammounts of speed and power.

...

I was being chased for what seemed for a long time. I'm fairly good and evading, I think that's why. I was flying a spitfire, and the enemy had a bf109. At diferent times, my pursuer would climb climb climb away from me, as if to confuse or loose me. I don't think he was doing it gain speed, because he was never off my tail. The most frustrating thing, is that it seemed as the bf109 climbed behind me, the distance between us never got that great at all. Like he could climb 200 ft without loosing forward momentum.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
It's magic. I think it might have something to do with how many times you've posted here, so lot's of "LOL!" and various smiley posts are necessary to raise the post number quickly.

RCAF_Hawk2
07-07-2004, 02:30 PM
I think its modeled in the game moo. I had a enemy plane chasing me the other night in the same plane as me. I pulled away from him at a fair pace and we got to talking about it because i had alittle damage and he had none. we both had 25% fuel at base ,we both had our prop pitch the same the only diff was I had leaned out my mix at high alt so i was pushing a few more rpm at the same pitch as him.So I as far as I can tell its there, if its not I do alot of adjusting for nothing lol

http://www16.brinkster.com/hawkspage/hawkssig.jpg
Your not getting my Buffalo wings

Black Sheep
07-07-2004, 03:12 PM
Ah, okay, maybe it does have an effect then.

I'd pretty much written it off as I've never really noticed any change in performance (it's quite pronounced) nor any change in the engine's tone.

Cheers for the heads up Hawk http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://mysite.wanadoo-members.co.uk/ilsigs/Nachtjaeger.jpg

bonogun
07-08-2004, 10:25 AM
Monson...Thank you for the info on flaps,especialy the "rule of thumb" regarding 300 knts. And big thanks goes to Moo.Cow for the data on fuel mixture. That is PRECISELY the info I needed! You xplained whats hapening to the engine in diferent cases, as well as reasons to make adjustments ;-) I was playing single player last night, and watched my whole squadron blow past me in pursuit of new bogies. We were all flying at same altitude and they didnt go into a dive. They just seemed to put the pedal down and passsed me doing 30 to 40 knts more!

Black Sheep
07-08-2004, 11:47 AM
No problem, glad to help.

Don't forget too that your wingmen may (depending on plane type) engage boost or emergency power to get some extra speed.

Do the AI use boost / WEP ?

I'm assuming they do ?