PDA

View Full Version : So present day in Unity is First person or Third person. It's still not clear



ALTAIR-KRATOS2
07-09-2014, 01:29 PM
I have this doubt, they are saying is new and different from black flag, and is the player the main character, i hope they don't do is just a game in our "animus"(console) i wish more TWCB plot and stuff like that, maybe there is some kind of customisation in present day to create ourselves and live our story but everyone of us living the same story. Do you know what i mean?.I like third person much more than third person because AC is not a first person game. If anyone knows something new. Please comment. Have a nice day guys. :)

SHADOWGARVIN
07-09-2014, 01:52 PM
I think it will be first person like in AC4. I believe they said this in an interview.

king-hailz
07-09-2014, 02:29 PM
No it isnt first person, or third person.

They have said that before AC Unity you always played as a character in the modern day, first desmond and then this abstergo emplyee...

Now you will play as yourself. You wont be controlling anything in first or third person... there will be no modern day enviroment.

You will put the game, and the animus will start... before you would exit the animus and go somewhere else where you then quit the game.

In this game you exit the animus by taking out the disk.

Understand?

JustPlainQuirky
07-09-2014, 02:32 PM
It's neither.

There basically is no modern day at all anymore.

Unless you count an interface and a voice over (and maybe skype chat) as modern day.

It's a silly pretend-your-console-is-an-animus gimmick.

At least that's what interviews implied.

SHADOWGARVIN
07-09-2014, 02:39 PM
It's neither.

There basically is no modern day at all anymore.

Unless you count an interface and a voice over (and maybe skype chat) as modern day.

It's a silly pretend-your-console-is-an-animus gimmick.

At least that's what interviews implied.

That sounds horrible!! The people who liked the modern day story will be so upset!

JustPlainQuirky
07-09-2014, 02:45 PM
Like I said not confirmed, but likely is the case based on interviews.

Let's hope otherwise.

king-hailz
07-09-2014, 03:01 PM
That sounds horrible!! The people who liked the modern day story will be so upset!

Well we are upset...

Jexx21
07-09-2014, 03:45 PM
I actually think it may turn out pretty good, and we don't have the full information yet so I can't actually judge.

Dome500
07-09-2014, 04:51 PM
If it it is really as it is implied I will hate it.

Because in this case they can talk all they want but modern day basically doesn't exist anymore then.

roostersrule2
07-09-2014, 04:54 PM
It's neither.

There basically is no modern day at all anymore.

Unless you count an interface and a voice over (and maybe skype chat) as modern day.

It's a silly pretend-your-console-is-an-animus gimmick.

At least that's what interviews implied.Really?

That's it?

That's pathetic, MD used to be my number one reason for buying AC, I loved the whole Desmond story, then it all went to **** and so did AC really. It's never been the same without that mystery surrounding the series.

marvelfannumber
07-09-2014, 04:56 PM
That sounds horrible!! The people who liked the modern day story will be so upset!

I could care less at this point, I stopped being interested in the Modern Day story after Brotherhood. You know with the big build ups that get no conclusion, new plot points getting introduced out of nowhere etc.

Unless Patrice somehow comes back of unless Shaun is somehow involved in the story I don't care at all if it is still there or not.

JustPlainQuirky
07-09-2014, 04:59 PM
I REALLY want clarification on it though.

I hope Loomer specifically asks a lead developer if it really will be interface-based or actually let you play someone. I'd even prefer the invisible abstergo employee.

@marvel

Yeah I also am sick of all build up with little to no payoff.

roostersrule2
07-09-2014, 05:03 PM
Why we haven't got linear, awesome, action set pieces in MD is beyond me.

JustPlainQuirky
07-09-2014, 05:04 PM
Eh, I'm against the idea of set pieces.

But I guess it's a personal preference thing.

Jexx21
07-09-2014, 05:06 PM
AC4's modern day had plenty of mystery and things for you to uncover...

I think that from what we heard of it, ACU's modern day has pretty good potential.

Mr_Shade
07-09-2014, 05:10 PM
I actually think it may turn out pretty good, and we don't have the full information yet so I can't actually judge.

indeed ;)

JustPlainQuirky
07-09-2014, 05:12 PM
Mr_Shade is being shady again.

http://media0.giphy.com/media/s5uIHJUlZNQFq/giphy.gif

I've got my eye on you.

roostersrule2
07-09-2014, 05:12 PM
Eh, I'm against the idea of set pieces.

But I guess it's a personal preference thing.In every part of AC they're bad but imagine running across a train with Desmond, then when you go close to the Abstergo building you jump into it, kill Vidic take the satellite plans and go to stop. As you're stopping the sattelite it launches you blow it up from the inside and the D-man dies. That'd be sick


AC4's modern day had plenty of mystery and things for you to uncover...

I think that from what we heard of it, ACU's modern day has pretty good potential.I know, I mean the series in general, it went after ACR. I just don't care about the MD anymore, I used to buy AC games for the Abstergo-Desmond story arc and stay for the historical part, but now I just wish they'd scrap the MD all together.

Jexx21
07-09-2014, 05:13 PM
If they scrapped the MD altogether then it wouldn't be Assassin's Creed anymore. Gotta have that Animus framing device.

roostersrule2
07-09-2014, 05:15 PM
If they scrapped the MD altogether then it wouldn't be Assassin's Creed anymore. Gotta have that Animus framing device.MD should be

Start of game, man walks into Animus.

End of game, man walks out of Animus.

Shahkulu101
07-09-2014, 05:16 PM
I'd be happy to just load it up and get a little 'welcome to the animus' so that we could keep the animus framing device. Then nothing MD after that - just the console being our animus. No interaction with any modern character.

JustPlainQuirky
07-09-2014, 05:18 PM
I would be more welcome to the new interface animus system if we at least finished the Juno saga TBH

I don't want to 'fight' juno with some hacking minigame

I want to beat the heck out of her with my bloody fists. :p

Jexx21
07-09-2014, 05:21 PM
that would suck

needs Shaun and Rebecca and an Animus database and updates on what's going on in the modern day of the AC universe and what the Assassins and Templars are doing to each other.

E-mail or news network. Would also be awesome to have a few setpieces like climbing the One WTC in AC3. Would love to climb the Eiffel Tower in Unity.

JustPlainQuirky
07-09-2014, 05:22 PM
I want to be involved in the drama.

I don't want to be updated on what I'm missing out on like I'm following Abstergo's twitter or something.

Climbing the Eiffel Tower would be fun. #butnotasasetpiecebecauseimnotafanoftoomanyscripte dsequencesyesimpickyimsorry

Shahkulu101
07-09-2014, 05:23 PM
I bet that we will climb the Eiffel Tower in MD bc reasons I've elaborated on

roostersrule2
07-09-2014, 05:24 PM
I have a new dream AC

Cold War modern day full of awesome set pieces.

Ancient Greece, Rome and Egypt full of open missions.

Desmond comes back as a cyborg and Shaun pisses him off so much he explodes.

Jexx21
07-09-2014, 05:26 PM
I think what they've been doing with the modern day so far is pretty great, sure, AC3 could have done the Brazil and Abstergo missions better, along with giving Cross and Vidic actual assassinations, but as a whole I thought AC3's modern day was the best along with AC4's, followed by ACB's.

Shahkulu101
07-09-2014, 05:26 PM
I have an idea

Zombie's Creed: Return of The Deadmond

roostersrule2
07-09-2014, 05:33 PM
In terms of MD it goes (for me)

ACV (My future game, coming 2015)
ACB
AC4
AC1/AC2/AC3
ACR

Jexx21
07-09-2014, 05:34 PM
I don't think they're numbering the series ever again.

Anyway..

AC4/AC3
ACB
AC1/AC2
ACR

roostersrule2
07-09-2014, 05:39 PM
I don't think they're numbering the series ever again.

Anyway..

AC4/AC3
ACB
AC1/AC2
ACRPerhaps.

I think maybe Unity and the next current gen game will be spin offs and the two last gen games will be more relevant to the story. Although if that was the case it would be reversed. I have no idea where the series is going, except for ACV Greece, it's an Yves special.

Jexx21
07-09-2014, 05:41 PM
I don't think Unity is a spin-off....

JustPlainQuirky
07-09-2014, 05:43 PM
I hope if they drop the numbering system, they at least release a final AC5 to mark the end of the juno saga. Q-Q

roostersrule2
07-09-2014, 05:43 PM
I know, there are some flaws to my theory but the series seems all jumbled up.

Amancio has taken all power off me, he now controls Ubisoft.

NondairyGold
07-09-2014, 06:40 PM
Wow you guy's know how to take things off in a tangent :) There's no confirmation on anything regarding the MD yet, yet some of you seem to have written it off completely. I have a feeling we're going to be pleasantly surprised. This is a new beginning after all!

http://www.gameranx.com/updates/id/23009/article/assassin-s-creed-unity-is-the-start-of-a-new-cycle-of-assassin-s-creed-games/

JustPlainQuirky
07-09-2014, 06:43 PM
Better to be skeptical than disappointed, I say.

Kakuzu745
07-09-2014, 06:47 PM
MD became absolutely boring and pointless after ACII...it is amazing the cool background they had in AC became completely destroyed in the sequels...at this point MD is a terminal patient that needs to be put out of their misery.

LatinaC09
07-09-2014, 07:01 PM
Honestly if they did get rid of the MD I wouldn't mind. It gets irritating to get pulled out of the Animus and the story to go hack some computers.

Calvarok
07-09-2014, 07:30 PM
It's likely the entire modern day with take place in the Animus, but that has not been confirmed. stop freaking out, people.

I also really don't get how anyone who says they love the modern day didn't love Black Flag. Practically the main thing you folks complain about is the story feeling too drawn out, but they finally gave us a nice, self-contained one that still laid the groundwork for the future, as well as being a story that kinda paralleled the animus story, with piracy being replaced by hacking and a certain TWCB thread that seemed unconnected actually being part of the modern day.

Jexx21
07-09-2014, 07:51 PM
Better to be skeptical than disappointed, I say.

I actually think it's better to be optimistic because that way you can actually discuss interesting things rather than worry and add more stress.

Calvarok
07-09-2014, 08:09 PM
I actually think it's better to be optimistic because that way you can actually discuss interesting things rather than worry and add more stress.
people who are pessimistic often like to imply that pessimism is a virtue, rather than a state of mind that just makes disappointment feel worse. you can be optimistic without being blind.

UniteUnderPower
07-09-2014, 10:08 PM
It's neither.

There basically is no modern day at all anymore.

Unless you count an interface and a voice over (and maybe skype chat) as modern day.

It's a silly pretend-your-console-is-an-animus gimmick.

At least that's what interviews implied.

If this is true; I think I may be done with the Assassins Creed franchise.

Jexx21
07-09-2014, 10:15 PM
Why? There's a lot that could be done with that sort of modern-day.

JustPlainQuirky
07-09-2014, 10:19 PM
Because an interface prevents you from being directly involved in the action.

I wouldn't quit the franchise, but I would begrudgingly give Ubisoft my money.

Jexx21
07-09-2014, 10:24 PM
Why would you need to be "directly involved in the action?"

It's not required to tell an interesting modern day story, and even so, there's no confirmation that we won't be.

JustPlainQuirky
07-09-2014, 10:31 PM
I just fail to see how an interface based modern day would work.

All I can think of are hacking minigames and narration w/ webcam akin to Titanfall.

And either the plot will be really good but presented in a poor manner, or practically non-existant.

My fear is that it'll be like this:

Assassin-(speaking via voice over or webcam) dude we need your help to find something. go in the animus
Me-plays in animus
Assassin-you're doing a good job keep it up
Me-plays in animus
Juno-occassionally pops up on screen subtly
Me-plays in animus
Assassin-oh no juno is in the system or something but you gotta hack this blah blah encouragement
Me-hacks in minigame then goes back to animus
Juno-appears once again more cleary for forshadow once again
Me-plays animus
Assassin-you did it. you found what we were looking for. Me and the others did this cool stuff blah blah
Me- turns off animus

And I just don't want that. Especially since Ubi basically said 'you' will be the protagonist for several games to come.

So it will be either endless forshadow or underwhelming defeat of juno IMO.

Unless you have something to qualm my fears.

UniteUnderPower
07-09-2014, 10:42 PM
Why would you need to be "directly involved in the action?"

It's not required to tell an interesting modern day story, and even so, there's no confirmation that we won't be.

No gameplay in the modern day? No ability to walk around your environment as 'you'? That's one of the main reasons I enjoyed AC4's modern day.

JustPlainQuirky
07-09-2014, 10:44 PM
Maybe Ubi is tricking us. Maybe they're pretending it's an interface so AC IV's modern day looks infinitley better in retrospect. :rolleyes:

Fatal-Feit
07-09-2014, 10:47 PM
I'm down for more first-person modern day. I enjoyed the mysteries, questions, and answers that hacking granted. It gave players more content to circle their heads around instead of the short-linear tale that players were stuck with every year. When we were first introduced to the modern day in AC:1, I was uber excited in the universe. It felt mysterious, and I had tonnes of questions. After AC:1, modern day practically became a TV-series, full of cliches. They dropped the ominous obscurity in favor of grade-B drama and suspense. For me, AC:IV was the modern day players should have gotten from the start. Not only did the ancestor's adventure rentroduced stealth, reinvigorated the moral greyness of the franchise, and dived back into BOTH the minds of the Templar and Assassins, modern day had also given me that uneasy presence of uncertainty. As though I'm only a pebble in this colossal universe that's packed with secrecy. And for me, first-person was sort of genius. It added variety in exploration and kept me feeling like I'm in another world when I leave the animus. Albeit, the dialogues and character exchanges were washed down due to being a silent protagonist, but modern day had always been terrible in that department, IMO. In this case, less was more.

But I know I'm definitely in the minority. If first-person was replaced for that MP-like-animus HUD, I'll still be okay as long as it's packed with MORE content than AC:IV.

Hans684
07-09-2014, 10:49 PM
No gameplay in the modern day? No ability to walk around your environment as 'you'? That's one of the main reasons I enjoyed AC4's modern day.

Only a mind free of impediments is capable of grasping the chaotic beauty of the world.

UniteUnderPower
07-09-2014, 10:53 PM
Removing modern-day in favor of a HUD interface is lazy and a downgrade in comparison to what was introduced in AC4.

LoyalACFan
07-09-2014, 11:24 PM
You know, I'm really getting tired of talking about the old halcyon days of Modern AC. Because to be frank, they were never there. Let's be honest, did anyone ever actually enjoy the Desmond gameplay? No, we were all in it for the cryptic stories, the breadcrumb trail of clues, glyphs, and plot twists. But it was all just smoke and mirrors; cheap narrative tricks that convinced us that it was something better than it really was. We were all in it for the big AC3 payoff; then the big AC3 payoff fell flat on its face, and for some reason people still act like the Juno arc is driving toward an epic grand finale :rolleyes: Been there, done that, folks. Have fun getting emotionally invested in a conclusion that will inevitably suck, because it doesn't even have a f***ing protagonist to carry it anymore. Bland as Desmond was, he was SOMETHING. Now we don't even have him. We have two comic-relief supporting characters left over from the Desmond days, and a villainess who's just floating around in the ether until she's needed to shove another cliffhanger in our face. Come on guys. Modern AC needs to get the Old Yeller treatment.

Jexx21
07-09-2014, 11:28 PM
The last thing AC needs is for modern day to be completely removed.

UniteUnderPower
07-09-2014, 11:34 PM
If I could ask one thing from this series as a passionate and devoted fan, it's to bring Desmond back.

Jexx21
07-09-2014, 11:39 PM
I like Desmond, but I don't think he should be brought back. AC4 closed his story neatly and I thought it was great. All I ask is that they continue to strive for quality content. I loved AC3's and AC4's modern day, and I'm optimistic about where they want to take it with Unity.

UniteUnderPower
07-09-2014, 11:53 PM
I like Desmond, but I don't think he should be brought back. AC4 closed his story neatly and I thought it was great. All I ask is that they continue to strive for quality content. I loved AC3's and AC4's modern day, and I'm optimistic about where they want to take it with Unity.

I'm a bit on the edge with the way people are describing ACU's modern day as "basically no more modern day". That scares me as the modern day conspiracy and intrigue are the things that have kept me coming back installment after installment. I own all the main console AC games(besides AC1 and the handhelds, although I did own and beat AC1 several times) and that has been the thing that keeps my coming back. I enjoy the historical aspect of these games GREATLY and I even read through the database entries to find out more about history. Modern day NEEDS to get picked back up off the ground and made into something great. Not an interface that will provide me with little to no gameplay.

NondairyGold
07-09-2014, 11:55 PM
Could someone please point me in the direction of the article you all seem to be referencing? You know the one where they say MD has been reduced to nothing. You guy's are jumping to way too many conclusions based on nothing!!

JustPlainQuirky
07-09-2014, 11:57 PM
Could someone please point me in the direction of the article you all seem to be referencing? You know the one where they say MD has been reduced to nothing. You guy's are jumping to way too many conclusions based on nothing!!

http://www.cinemablend.com/games/Assassin-Creed-Unity-Won-t-Return-Abstergo-Entertainment-64942.html


“So you played this third-person character in the present, and we wanted to go one step beyond that," Ubisoft Montreal senior producer Vincent Pontbriant told gamesTM. "We decided that you’re actually, you the player, are the pilot of the Animus. So you start the game and then at some point you get contacted by the Assassin order to explore the memories of Arno through the Animus, and basically figure stuff out for them in the present."

UniteUnderPower
07-09-2014, 11:57 PM
Could someone please point me in the direction of the article you all seem to be referencing? You know the one where they say MD has been reduced to nothing. You guy's are jumping to way too many conclusions based on nothing!!

I just assumed it was going to be like Black Flag until I read some of the comments people made here.

Jexx21
07-10-2014, 12:00 AM
You say that the modern day conspiracy and intrigue are what keep you coming back? it's funny, because those were mostly delivered by non-gameplay elements.

AC1: cutscenes and emails, hell I can't even say that AC1 actually had any true gameplay, everything it delivered could have been pure cutscenes and e-mails.
AC2: Subject 16 glyphs and cutscenes, with some actual Desmond gameplay but not much
ACB: first game with quality modern day gameplay sequences, continued with glyphs and interactions, brought back e-mails
ACR: weird first person puzzle platforming things for modern day gameplay
AC3: extensive Desmond gameplay, mystery mostly delivered though unlocking the Temple via cutscenes, e-mails also present, as well as in-depth character conversations
AC4: video files, word files, e-mails, sound files, as well as the sequences in general

You can deliver plenty of conspiracy and intrigue without actual gameplay sequences, in fact, I'd argue that you can do it better because it feels more hidden.

JustPlainQuirky
07-10-2014, 12:02 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KKWuR5LLpaU&list=UUfB8dJdMxEofkcybwAskjqQ


Also at the end Amancio emphasizes YOU are the protagonist, not you as an abstergo employee or any other given role. YOU.

How could that be done unless your console was supposed to mimic your animus?

Also I think there was another article that straight out said that the console was supposed to mimic an animus. Lemme see if I can find it

@jexx

not sure why you keep emphasizing emails. I disliked emails the most. I don't want information hidden from me at all. Thats' why I dislike initiates to a degree. I want to have all the key factors presented to me along with everyone else. And I never liked the puzzles btw. Plus character interaction is scaled down drastically in interface form.

Jexx21
07-10-2014, 12:12 AM
I wasn't trying to convince you as you're dead set on a particular thing Mayrice, Unite was talking about conspiracy and intrigue.

JustPlainQuirky
07-10-2014, 12:14 AM
Oh sorry I thouht you were talking to me :p

And I can't find the article.

#thereisstillhope

NondairyGold
07-10-2014, 12:17 AM
http://www.cinemablend.com/games/Assassin-Creed-Unity-Won-t-Return-Abstergo-Entertainment-64942.html


“So you played this third-person character in the present, and we wanted to go one step beyond that," Ubisoft Montreal senior producer Vincent Pontbriant told gamesTM. "We decided that you’re actually, you the player, are the pilot of the Animus. So you start the game and then at some point you get contacted by the Assassin order to explore the memories of Arno through the Animus, and basically figure stuff out for them in the present."

We've already been contacted by the Assassins to help, that's what the whole Shaun/Rebecca hacking the Initiates site is about. Mark my words, MD in AC Unity will be the MD we've all been wanting. It'll be 3rd person and we'll get to create a character "us". We'll be training to be an Assassin.

That's why there's Watch Dog style skill trees, in the Arno section of the game. We concentrate on what kind of Assassin we want to specialise as and learn it through the Animus. Those skills then transfer over to "us" and we'll get to go on some epic top secret mission at the end of the game.

Every new entry in the series will then expand upon this and we'll be able to become a Master Assassin, eventually facing off against Juno!!

JustPlainQuirky
07-10-2014, 12:20 AM
We've already been contacted by the Assassins to help, that's what the whole Shaun/Rebecca hacking the Initiates site is about. Mark my words, MD in AC Unity will be the MD we've all been wanting. It'll be 3rd person and we'll get to create a character "us". We'll be training to be an Assassin.

That's why there's Watch Dog style skill trees, in the Arno section of the game. We concentrate on what kind of Assassin we want to specialise as and learn it through the Animus. Those skills then transfer over to "us" and we'll get to go on some epic top secret mission at the end of the game.

Every new entry in the series will then expand upon this and we'll be able to become a Master Assassin, eventually facing off against Juno!!

If we get to create/customize a 3D version of us and get to run around in 3rd person I'd be totally down with that.

But I don't see anything that implies that in interviews...

LoyalACFan
07-10-2014, 12:23 AM
The last thing AC needs is for modern day to be completely removed.

Why, Jexx? What does it have to offer other than an annoyingly constrictive framing device (not being able to see memories past the child's conception is getting irritating)? Surely you don't actually have hope that they're going to salvage the ungodly mess they've made of the story?

Assassin_M
07-10-2014, 12:24 AM
Don't mind modern day too much, it's a nice little distraction...I liked the hacking in AC IV, though I would like more puzzles alongside the minigames.

Jexx21
07-10-2014, 12:25 AM
Why, Jexx? What does it have to offer other than an annoyingly constrictive framing device (not being able to see memories past the child's conception is getting irritating)? Surely you don't actually have hope that they're going to salvage the ungodly mess they've made of the story?

Have hope? I don't need hope because I don't believe that they have made a "ungodly mess" of the story. And so far, I don't think that it has constricted the stories much at all.

rickprog
07-10-2014, 12:28 AM
It's still beyond me how they're not taking advantage of the modern day story they've built with Initiates, having Gavin rebuild the brotherhood to a fair extent and Bill back with the Assassins. And by taking advantage I mean having Gavin, Bill or some other modern day Assassin be the protagonist.

dxsxhxcx
07-10-2014, 12:31 AM
It's still beyond me how they're not taking advantage of the modern day story they've built with Initiates, having Gavin rebuild the brotherhood to a fair extent and Bill back with the Assassins. And by taking advantage I mean having Gavin, Bill or some other modern day Assassin be the protagonist.

because they want to avoid that in the games, that's why we got what we got in AC4 and probably will do in ACU as well







“So you played this third-person character in the present, and we wanted to go one step beyond that," Ubisoft Montreal senior producer Vincent Pontbriant told gamesTM. "We decided that you’re actually, you the player, are the pilot of the Animus. So you start the game and then at some point you get contacted by the Assassin order to explore the memories of Arno through the Animus, and basically figure stuff out for them in the present."

this kinda implies that we might not be playing as Arno from the beginning, so what will we be doing until the Assassins contact us to tell us we need to explore Arno's memories?

JustPlainQuirky
07-10-2014, 12:32 AM
I say go the Mass Effect route and let the player customize their own character and have that character play a consistant role throughout the series in Modern Day.

Make the character transferrable from game to game.

And if Ubi wants a new setting in MD where that character wouldn't fit, let us create a new character.

Edit: also make a conversation tree for Modern day. I want to choose what I say to others.

dxsxhxcx
07-10-2014, 12:51 AM
I say go the Mass Effect route and let the player customize their own character and have that character play a consistant role throughout the series in Modern Day.

Make the character transferrable from game to game.

And if Ubi wants a new setting in MD where that character wouldn't fit, let us create a new character.

Edit: also make a conversation tree for Modern day. I want to choose what I say to others.

this would be more complicated than what we got with Desmond which is exactly what they want to avoid...

Calvarok
07-10-2014, 08:29 PM
this would be more complicated than what we got with Desmond which is exactly what they want to avoid...
Exactly. the trouble with modern day is it's not what the majority of people buy AC games for, and it's not a huge part of the marketing push or main creative focus of the brand. we don't use the animus to see things that the modern story dictates, the modern story adapts to fit the historical setting that's chosen.

Because of that, there just cannot under any circumstances have a part at the beginning of the game where an in-depth customization menu pops up for a character that you will not play as for the majority of the game. that just can't be how they introduce you to it. I don't think the player should even be taken out of the animus at any point in the game. It would be far preferable to have Shawn comment on your research and what you've found during between-sequence loading screens, at the very most with a little window popping up showing his face as he talks. And possibly some stuff like that for completing side mission chains, and especially for 100% sync. Like what happens after you finish the Captain Kidd questline in AC3.

I don't even know if players should ever leave the animus, even for the side-content/puzzles, which could exist in some more abstract part of the animus. And none of those puzzles should ever be required in the main path. The amount of modern story in the critical non-optional path of the game should only be enough for the player to know why they're reliving Arno's life, and then what happens in the modern day as a result of them completing their objective. And that part at the end should be the most elaborate and overt the main modern storytelling gets in the critical path.

It's kinda sad to have to say this... maybe if AC were pitched with more of the sci-fi angle, they wouldn't have to minimize it so much.

UniteUnderPower
07-10-2014, 09:15 PM
The sci-fi and conspiracy story is the thing that keeps a lot of people coming back to the franchise year after year. If they ever made it where there is no modern-day gameplay, I and many other people I know would drop the series quicker than a rock. The thing is that we normally have the OPTION to exit the animus at any time. That increases the immersiveness for me. It makes me feel like I'm the one studying these memories and I can exit and do what I like outside of that as well. I don't see any reason not to allow a customizable character in the modern day. We can still play as ourselves, but we can actually make the character LOOK like ourselves. The dialogue tree is also a great idea and would increase the immersiveness even further. What the modern-day needs is CONTENT. AC4 went towards this a bit, but they should build upon what that game started.

Jexx21
07-10-2014, 09:16 PM
sci-fi and conspiracy is still possible without third person or first person gameplay....

you can have all of AC4's content without actually leaving the animus in the modern day in the sense that everything you got out of the animus for could have been delivered through video and sound feeds.

UniteUnderPower
07-10-2014, 09:23 PM
sci-fi and conspiracy is still possible without third person or first person gameplay....

you can have all of AC4's content without actually leaving the animus in the modern day in the sense that everything you got out of the animus for could have been delivered through video and sound feeds.

**** that. No. That would completely ruin the immersiveness for me with no option to exit the animus(and don't say exiting the game).

Jexx21
07-10-2014, 09:24 PM
I dunno, what if you can control drones through the animus and explore modern-day paris using drones and spying into abstergo offices and ****

UniteUnderPower
07-10-2014, 09:27 PM
I dunno, what if you can control drones through the animus and explore modern-day paris using drones and spying into abstergo offices and ****

I wish it were possible to parkour through modern-day Paris as our own customized character.

Calvarok
07-10-2014, 11:39 PM
the sci fi angle is a big draw for some, but while I'm sure most of the majority like it, they're really there for the historical side. How could they not be, since that's how the advertisements that led them to it presented it.

I'd be perfectly happy with being represented as a hazy data-stream person with no identifiable gender or features and parkouring around abstract representations of animus architecture to find secrets and hack into real-world cameras/drones and find out more about the modern story through that lens. All optional besides the introduction and conclusion of your research.

But in the future... I dunno. I wonder how the movie will affect things? I wonder if the more unified nature that the story will need to take in a film will lead to the series focusing more on what people learn from their ancestors by reliving their memories, and how it affects their lives. visiting a new modern character each time.

Jexx21
07-10-2014, 11:41 PM
Yea, control a drone, fly into a Temple, steal a PoE, avoid traps and detection and get yo *** out of there

Calvarok
07-10-2014, 11:45 PM
It seems doubtful something that ambitious would be justified for optional content in a game that already has so much of it in the Animus...

Jexx21
07-10-2014, 11:48 PM
I wasn't thinking of it being an optional thing.

Calvarok
07-10-2014, 11:50 PM
I wasn't thinking of it being an optional thing.
The second you have non-optional present day content with involved gameplay that has a failstate, you'll have people who complain. People complained about being forced to play Frogger once, and that's super basic in comparison.

Jexx21
07-10-2014, 11:52 PM
meh, flying a drone around sounds a lot more fun than frogger

Calvarok
07-11-2014, 12:17 AM
meh, flying a drone around sounds a lot more fun than frogger
maybe. if it controls extremely well, there's no way to fail, and it's not too long before you can choose to go back to the animus, it could work. but that's a lot of work on developing a new system that doesn't support the core of the game, or even feel connected to the main pillars of gameplay...

LoyalACFan
07-11-2014, 04:31 AM
I'm totally on board with ditching the modern day entirely, but I'm okay with it remaining if it's ALL optional. I HATE being ripped out of the Animus during emotionally heavy scenes and forced through an exposition dump in the present. When you start a new save file, you should get in the Animus and remain there throughout the entire game unless you choose to exit and partake in the modern content via the pause menu.

JustPlainQuirky
07-11-2014, 04:32 AM
I'm totally on board with ditching the modern day entirely, but I'm okay with it remaining if it's ALL optional. I HATE being ripped out of the Animus during emotionally heavy scenes and forced through an exposition dump in the present. When you start a new save file, you should get in the Animus and remain there throughout the entire game unless you choose to exit and partake in the modern content via the pause menu.

Yeah I know that feel of being ripped out the animus when super invested.

Making it optional could work.

But it could also mean Ubi might put less effort in modern day.

though not like it could get worse if the rumors are true...

Jexx21
07-11-2014, 04:54 AM
I'm totally on board with ditching the modern day entirely, but I'm okay with it remaining if it's ALL optional. I HATE being ripped out of the Animus during emotionally heavy scenes and forced through an exposition dump in the present. When you start a new save file, you should get in the Animus and remain there throughout the entire game unless you choose to exit and partake in the modern content via the pause menu.

actually that's there to put a break in between emotionally heavy scenes
I think it's a good idea in concept

GreySkellig
07-11-2014, 05:02 AM
I would dig it if MD became a more active element--as it seemed it was about to with ACB and AC3. Modern Day was at its best when it let us loose in a smaller open world as in ACB, or gave us a series of story-focused semi-scripted missions a la AC3. It seemed to be building to something, in both story and MD gameplay. But then AC3 totally trashed the long-term plot. So if we are going to be stuck sifting through boring sound-bites instead of actively advancing the modern story (I honestly cannot make myself care anymore, given that the story is all dead ends and failed promises, and the gameplay has been reduced to "office drone"), then I'd prefer to do it directly, where advancing the historical story unlocks data in the Animus, as in some of the Ezio games.

Calvarok
07-11-2014, 05:24 AM
AC4 told a better structured and more complete modern story than any previous AC game. You had more agency and influence on the story's progression in that game than you ever did in the first AC game, and since it was a start of a new story arc I thought it made sense that it resembled that.

And come on. AC3 built up to something. Things happened. Those things are over, and we started off slowly figuring out what would happen next. just like AC1, except way less vague and way more cool hints and glimpses into what's going on around the world and meta-humor and whatnot.

I understand trepidation about how the story can go forward without us being mostly passive characters, but I also don't think ONE game where not everything in the plot is turned up to 11 is total cause for alarm. I was getting tired of the whole "fate of the world saga" thing being dragged out, and it was interesting to have a story which was more self-contained and less frantic and complicated.

I'm not sure what the plans are going forward, and I would like to have a named protagonist even though it doesn't really bother me (wouldn't have minded if Desmond didn't have a name tbh) but it annoys me that some people want to just totally kill the story off simply because black flag wasn't a splinter cell + AC value pack.

JustPlainQuirky
07-11-2014, 05:27 AM
AC4 told a better structured and more complete modern story than any previous AC game. You had more agency and influence on the story's progression in that game than you ever did in the first AC game, and since it was a start of a new story arc I thought it made sense that it resembled that.

http://www.reactionface.info/sites/default/files/imagecache/Node_Page/images/1314029520391.jpg

Really?? I felt the opposite.

Pls expand. I'm curious on ur take.

Especially on the influence thing. I felt limited in that regard.

Calvarok
07-11-2014, 06:55 AM
http://www.reactionface.info/sites/default/files/imagecache/Node_Page/images/1314029520391.jpg

Really?? I felt the opposite.

Pls expand. I'm curious on ur take.

Especially on the influence thing. I felt limited in that regard.
Why did you stop bolding before the part where I explained I was speaking in relation to AC1?

Ok, so influence-wise, in AC1 you wake up in a room, voluntarily go along with what you're asked to do, trigger some optional conversations, listen in on one private conversation, hear a bunch of non-optional conversations, both learn a door code from a closet and steal a pen from warren with a single button press, which allows you to open a few text-files to read for yourself.

Absolutely none of that stuff advances the story or even matters in the broad scheme of things. The only thing that matters is progressing through Altair's memories, you have no actual agency or way to move things forward other than literally just going to sleep.

in AC4, you are actively hacking things through interactive puzzle sequences, sneaking around, and delivering the information you gain to the Assassins. which means that the text, video, and audio files you find are actually being used for something, as compared to Desmond simply reading stuff and then it going to absolutely no use at all as he shuffles around in his cell waiting for powerful forces to force him to go back to the real game. In Black Flag, there's reason to explore your environment besides hacking, there's conversations to overhear and references and environmental storytelling to discover. it's structured like an immersive sim (Bioshock/System Shock without the combat) and allows you a lot of freedom and areas you can explore in the Abstergo Entertainment facility. It even has completely pointless bathrooms with no gameplay content inside, just because of course there should be bathrooms in a normal building, and it makes it feel like this is an actual place that people would be in, not just a "gameplay environment"

Now, as for why I actually think the story is well-done: the Abstergo Employee goes through a distinct arc.

== SKIP TO "Fin" if TL;DR

you begin their new job happy and unaware, then you're contacted by what seems to be a friendly co-worker, John from IT, but turns out to be some crazy guy who's blackmailing you to do weird **** that is clearly illegal. You continue with their work, occasionally interrupted by this madman, who seems more unstable every time. Management starts to take notice.

One day, You're drugged by management and stuck in a quarantine, one that looks dark and ominous compared to the cheery and modern upper levels. Now you understand why the madman didn't just do the work himself: clearly the bosses are dangerously crazy themselves and he wanted a patsy in case things went south. But then he contacts you again, and lets you out of your cell. he leads you to a strange room deep in the sublevel facility, explaining as you go that your employers are the descendants of the Templar order you've learned so much about these past few weeks, which explains their scary security measures. they hack the console, as you've done so many times, but this time an eerie and impossible face projects itself from the machine. as it talks you learn that this otherworldly being was stuck in the digital world and needed and your Co-worker had set you up to be the one who got possessed! (This is the point where I swore loudly at John from IT) It's become clear that not only is he a madman, but he's a madman in touch with some seriously evil ****. Shaken, you find solace in returning to your work and continue to document the life of Edward Kenway.

Your work begins to draw to a close, but you're rudely pulled from your console by the madman, John from IT... only it's the first time you've ever happened to get a good look at his face. And you see, that John is a Sage, just like Black Bart, and you understand what that implies about the strange things he's put you through, why he seemed to relish having you in his thrall, for over the course of your documentation you learned many things about an advanced Precursor race, who the Sages are mental reincarnations of. He drugs you much as your bosses did when bringing you down here, and prepares to spirit you away, as he vents to you about his disdain for Assassins, Templars, and humans alike. but it appears he overstepped his bounds this time, and he's cornered by security, who shoots him dead. After you wake up, you find that the blame for the illegal activity has conveniently fallen on John, and your top-level boss has mysteriously disappeared. You reflect that you handed over information about where said boss' schedule was taking him to some shady people, and wonder what they must be doing to them now. You're returned to your usual work floor.

The people you delivered information to earlier contact you via your datapad and explain that they had no idea John was crazy, and that you were being forced to do his work. They thank you for your assistance and explain that they're the modern incarnation of the Assassins. Well, that makes a lot of things clearer. They ask if you'll continue to help them snoop around Abstergo, be their person on the inside. You could accept, but you have nothing hanging over you now. You could just enjoy the cushy paycheck your psychopathic employers are paying you... or you could help this strange cult that seems to want them stopped. Before you decide, you head on over to your Animus and finish up documenting Edward's memories.

=== Fin

Now, why did I type all that out? Because I wanted to show how, if you look at it at the narrative all typed out, you can see that this is a substantial, complete and complex story arc.

Whether you liked the story of AC4 or not, it is a complete narrative, while every other game is one fifth of a single narrative. And that's not just due to it being a series, it's fine to have a series that has an overarching story, but each of them should be its own part of the puzzle, and only two of the games in the five-game Desmond Saga are actually their own contained story. (AC3 and Brotherhood, the others are mainly cryptic teasing) Moreover, those two just didn't execute as well on what they set out to, which BF does, they don't have as clear and coherent themes as BF, and they just don't stand as well as they should on their own, even as continuations of a previously started narrative arc.

Man, I typed way too much. I'm sorry, I tend to be too lengthy when trying to explain my opinions + am tired. I hope it made sense, I edited it down as best I could.

Jexx21
07-11-2014, 07:30 AM
Calv, when I told you on twitter I thought that AC3 and AC4 were the best in modern day, I meant in terms of what they actually let you do in the gameplay and also the quality of the individual pieces you can find, not necessarily the way the story flows. ...Just in case you were wondering about that.

masterfenix2009
07-11-2014, 09:12 AM
See, the thing that turns me off about the whole "Your console is the Animus" thing is that if all the modern day is just online chats with Shaun and such, it takes me even more out of the game. Why do I say that? Because it is a lot less tangible. My favorite form of Modern day was AC:Brotherhood. With AC4 close behind that. The world feels less tangible. Like, I could care less about the modern day if I am not actually there. It's the equivalent of finding out Shaun died in between games on an emotional connection level. If like Shaun was chatting with you, then half-way through he game, he died, and Rebeca replaced him and she told you he died, there would be no emotional impact. But if you were with him you can actually feel the emotion and tension because YOU were there.

I would rather them continue the AC4 way of doing things( I loved hacking the computers and exploring abstergo), but with a bit more action and more a world to explore then 4 levels. Also, give the protagonist a voice. I hate walking around like a mindless robot. It's part of the reason I prefer Bioshock : Infinite to the first two games.

Jexx21
07-11-2014, 04:07 PM
Fenix, what if you weren't there but you still saw Shaun died.

Like, through videos sent to you, or perhaps you're using the Animus to control a drone and you see Shaun died.

Calvarok
07-11-2014, 04:35 PM
Obviously if you're not actually there the story has to rely on different things to create an emotional connection than simply killing off a character. Though the whole de-emphasized vessel protagonist idea doesn't really preclude you from being around people who die... I mean, John died in front of you, and I had a distinct "emotional reaction" of "**** you, precursor jerk, tryna steal my body and ****"

Jexx, I understood that, but I think each Desmond AC game's modern segment has had big problems standing on its own as well as pacing problems. None of them really feel like a complete story, the closest being brotherhood followed by AC3.

masterfenix2009
07-12-2014, 10:11 PM
Jexx, to me it depends on how they perform said video. And it also depends on what kind of emotion they are going for. Example : If they wanted you to be more shocked then sad, or more angry then sad. If they want me to feel any emotion other then shocked,then the video would have to be pretty close, so I may see some facial expressions. Part of the advantages of cutscenes is the fact that you can get really personal. Like seeing the character in deep pain, regret and loss. It's hard to do that in a video format unless the camera is in odd places it shouldn't be like in bad found footage movies. Not saying it wouldn't be possible though.

Also , Calvarok, part of the advantage there was that you were still in that world that made it a bit more personal. That moment was supposed to give you the feeling of shock and anger. This "animus is your console thing," implies you won't be taken out of the animus. Unless people bust inside my house and try to kill me.

Though I'm not dissing the idea entirely though guys. I still support it as I think it is an interesting technique they could be doing. I was just saying the problems a player like me tends to explore in a context like that.

Though after reading the initiates wiki article, I was thrilled with the stories there. I actually found it for the most part emotionally satisfying. So, I may actually enjoy this a lot.

JustPlainQuirky
07-12-2014, 10:13 PM
I feel bad I asked for an elaboration but ended up tl;dr-ing

#mustforceselftoread #itwouldberudeofmeotherwise

Jexx21
07-12-2014, 10:17 PM
What if you were watching Shaun's death through a camera on Rebecca and then she runs up to him and tries to save him?

masterfenix2009
07-12-2014, 10:21 PM
That can work, but you also miss out on seeing Rebecca's reaction. Unless they do a Metal Gear Solid 4 type thing with multiple cameras. Though, if Rebecca's voice acting is great , we won't need to see her reactions.

Again, I'm not saying it couldn't work. It al depends on the execution.

Jexx21
07-12-2014, 10:24 PM
I think it has more meaning if we can't see Rebecca's face, and if we can only hear her and see her arms and hands while she's trying to save Shaun.

masterfenix2009
07-12-2014, 10:40 PM
True, which is why I said her voice acting and dialogue must be great for that part. If her lines consist of " Shaun No! Don't give up on me! Hold on!" it might not be done very well if her acting isn't top notch for that scene.

Shahkulu101
07-12-2014, 10:45 PM
I have a hunch we're going to be pleasantly surprised by how MD is handled.

It'd be cool if we were aboard the Altair II with the crew Initiates follows. Or do they even use that boat anymore?