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View Full Version : If being a Jedi can be an official religion, why cant being an Assassin?



J0N1X303
05-20-2014, 05:51 PM
https://www.facebook.com/AssassinIdeology

marvelfannumber
05-20-2014, 05:52 PM
Because the Assassin ideology contradicts religion, making it like a sicko thing.

Assassin_M
05-20-2014, 05:54 PM
Because being Religious does not negate logic and reason. The Assassins said time and time that the Creed is not a replacement for Religion.

You can be an Atheist AND a democrat, a Muslim AND a right winger, a Christian AND a tea partyer...etc, same with the Creed, you can be of a specific religious affiliation AND follow the Creed.

J0N1X303
05-20-2014, 05:56 PM
The question is more can we not make it official, like Jedi, to be something recognised by masses & applicable to be completed on a census?

marvelfannumber
05-20-2014, 05:57 PM
Because being Religious does not negate logic and reason.
Yeah you're right about that one I suppose, maybe I should just commit suicide for the day. I don't even know what I am saying anymore.

Assassin_M
05-20-2014, 05:58 PM
The question is more can we not make it official, like Jedi, to be something recognised by masses & applicable to be completed on a census?
Oh....you want to make it a real life religion? for people to follow?

Assassin_M
05-20-2014, 05:59 PM
Yeah you're right about that one I suppose, maybe I should just commit suicide for the day. I don't even know what I am saying anymore.
Oh pish posh, you're doing fine, i'v had worse days

Locopells
05-20-2014, 06:02 PM
Probably, if you really wanted. Then again, given the central purpose of an Assassin is assassinating people, which is illegal if you're not James Bond, maybe not...

J0N1X303
05-20-2014, 06:02 PM
Oh....you want to make it a real life religion? for people to follow?

Why can it not be a choice, what is a religion but a community of individuals sharing similar beliefs. Religion does not dictate whom follows it, nor offer any opinions. Why not have the choice?

Shahkulu101
05-20-2014, 06:04 PM
"If being a Jedi can be an official religion, why can't being an Assassin?":


http://youtu.be/qLKhxjfG03A

J0N1X303
05-20-2014, 06:06 PM
"If being a Jedi can be an official religion, why can't being an Assassin?":


http://youtu.be/qLKhxjfG03A

Just taking 5 minutes to pose the simple question...

Assassin_M
05-20-2014, 06:07 PM
Why can it not be a choice, what is a religion but a community of individuals sharing similar beliefs. Religion does not dictate whom follows it, nor offer any opinions. Why not have the choice?
Well, given that, like Loco said, the Creed revolves around assassination and it's illegal, i don't see how you can go around doing it..

J0N1X303
05-20-2014, 06:10 PM
Well, given that, like Loco said, the Creed revolves around assassination and it's illegal, i don't see how you can go around doing it..

On the contrary, the creed only seeks to create control and order within the environment in which one lives. In the games, sure, through violence although in practice the search for knowledge, logic, control and order can easily be achieved through non-violent means.

Assassin_M
05-20-2014, 06:15 PM
On the contrary, the creed only seeks to create control and order within the environment in which one lives. In the games, sure, through violence although in practice the search for knowledge, logic, control and order can easily be achieved through non-violent means.
I think you're confusing the Creed with the Templar vision...

marvelfannumber
05-20-2014, 06:25 PM
Oh pish posh, you're doing fine, i'v had worse days
Don't worry, I've eaten alot of green mushrooms today. I should be fi........oh...

I don't think that worked.

Anyways back to the topic, I don't see why it matters that being an Assassin involves illegal actions such as murder, it ain't stopped other religions. (this was a bad joke, don't take it too seriously, oh no why did someone create this thread, arguments iminent!)

Hans684
05-20-2014, 06:36 PM
Anyways back to the topic, I don't see why it matters that being an Assassin involves illegal actions such as murder, it ain't stopped other religions. (this was a bad joke, don't take it too seriously, oh no why did someone create this thread, arguments iminent!)

*takes joke seriously and creates arguments while cursing and mention Ezio as best example of an Assassin. Leading to why AC3 and Connor sucks*

J0N1X303
05-20-2014, 06:39 PM
Don't worry, I've eaten alot of green mushrooms today. I should be fi........oh...

I don't think that worked.

Anyways back to the topic, I don't see why it matters that being an Assassin involves illegal actions such as murder, it ain't stopped other religions. (this was a bad joke, don't take it too seriously, oh no why did someone create this thread, arguments iminent!)

For discussion mostly

marvelfannumber
05-20-2014, 06:45 PM
For discussion mostly

But it's the internet, any mention or passive reference of religion will cause a massive flame war to start, which may last for months. I am so calling it, you have doomed us all!

Locopells
05-20-2014, 06:49 PM
Well keep it civil, and we ain't got a problem...

J0N1X303
05-20-2014, 06:56 PM
But it's the internet, any mention or passive reference of religion will cause a massive flame war to start, which may last for months. I am so calling it, you have doomed us all!

I certainly hope not, the question is not intended to be derogatory to anyone or anything, or create a war. Just simply to discuss.
The irony of it all of course is that no one can tell you what to believe or follow, it's personal choice.

J0N1X303
05-20-2014, 06:57 PM
Well keep it civil, and we ain't got a problem...

Indeed, thank you.

RinoTheBouncer
05-20-2014, 07:14 PM
Because our governments are of Templar ideologies, rather than Assassin ones.

J0N1X303
05-20-2014, 07:21 PM
Because our governments are of Templar ideologies, rather than Assassin ones.

Touché

Jexx21
05-20-2014, 07:58 PM
if Jedi's an actual religion: What the hell.

Shahkulu101
05-20-2014, 08:02 PM
I follow The Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, personally.

Assassin_M
05-20-2014, 08:05 PM
I follow The Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, personally.
You should stop watching repetitive, YT celebrity atheist videos

Hans684
05-20-2014, 08:06 PM
I follow The Church of the Flying Spaghetti Monster, personally.

It must be a good church.

Jexx21
05-20-2014, 08:06 PM
I'm a Christ

Shahkulu101
05-20-2014, 08:08 PM
You should stop watching repetitive, YT celebrity atheist videos

It's from South Park, and the episode ****ged off both radical atheists and radical religious ideals.

Assassin_M
05-20-2014, 08:10 PM
It's from South Park, and the episode ****ged off both radical atheists and radical religious ideals.
lol, I know...it's just that the phrase gets repeated on every celebrity atheist video...

South Park unloads on everybody

Sushiglutton
05-20-2014, 08:24 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sxk3NJWngm0&list=RDSxk3NJWngm0#t=168

jk I'm an atheist :p

Ureh
05-20-2014, 08:44 PM
Why can it not be a choice, what is a religion but a community of individuals sharing similar beliefs. Religion does not dictate whom follows it, nor offer any opinions. Why not have the choice?

I could be wrong but aren't potential apprentices determined and revealed by the Force? Nothing in Star Wars universe is by chance right? And they had that prophecy that actually blinded them and nearly caused the downfall of the entire Jedi order, I guess.

Shahkulu101
05-20-2014, 08:48 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sxk3NJWngm0&list=RDSxk3NJWngm0#t=168

jk I'm an atheist :p

Same here, but that song is still awesome lol

Sushiglutton
05-20-2014, 08:59 PM
Same here, but that song is still awesome lol

Haha agree, plenty of great religious songs/hymns etc!

AssassinHMS
05-21-2014, 03:28 AM
It's from South Park, and the episode ****ged off both radical atheists and radical religious ideals.

Makes sense, they are fundamentally the same thing. They're all about believing in something (either in its existence or in its non-existence).



Personally, I think it's better to think about things instead of believing in them.

Shahkulu101
05-21-2014, 03:41 AM
Makes sense, they are fundamentally the same thing. They're all about believing in something (either in its existence or in its non-existence).



Personally, I think it's better to think about things instead of believing in them.

Yes, the episode mainly blasted radicalism on both sides which is a sentiment I wholly agree with.

I can agree with that, I suppose. I'd rather come to my own conclusions, that are always going to adapt, than be limited by age old beliefs written by God Knows Who. I guess I just try to be a good human.

AdamPearce
05-21-2014, 03:43 AM
Yes, the episode mainly blasted radicalism on both sides which is a sentiment I wholly agree with.

I can agree with that, I suppose. I'd rather come to my own conclusions, that are always going to adapt, than be limited by age old beliefs written by God Knows Who. I guess I just try to be a good human.

What if Hitler thought the same.

Shahkulu101
05-21-2014, 03:45 AM
What if Hitler thought the same.

What? Not sure I understand?

Do you mean Hitler thought he was being a good human? I'm sure he did, but the guy didn't exactly have his head screwed on.

AssassinHMS
05-21-2014, 03:58 AM
Yes, the episode mainly blasted radicalism on both sides which is a sentiment I wholly agree with.

I can agree with that, I suppose. I'd rather come to my own conclusions, that are always going to adapt, than be limited by age old beliefs written by God Knows Who. I guess I just try to be a good human.


I'll have to watch that episode then.

Yes, "Nothing is True" and "Everything is Permitted". As for me, I just want to be a good Jedi.

Assassin_M
05-21-2014, 04:17 AM
Yes, the episode mainly blasted radicalism on both sides which is a sentiment I wholly agree with.

I can agree with that, I suppose. I'd rather come to my own conclusions, that are always going to adapt, than be limited by age old beliefs written by God Knows Who. I guess I just try to be a good human.
There's a contradiction in this post. if someone's thoughts and conclusions led them to believe in 'age old beliefs', would they be limited? I always pondered about the phrase "free thinker" and how many Atheists monopolized that term, so to speak simply because they broke away from a parentage that induced religion.

I could say that i'm a Muslim by choice, not due to how I was raised...before i came here, I was in my comfort zone...it's a majority of muslims so i was never challenged..I never gave my beliefs much thought...I wasn't a practicing muslim by any means of the word, I was a muslim in the birth certificate and that was it.
Ever since I came to the US, I felt that I was challenged more and more....I watched many videos about Islam by people of other religions, I heard people talking about my religion, I watched CNN berate it to the floor...that pushed me to actually study and learn more about other Religions and my own Religion. I guess you could say it was a rediscovery and I found my answers...I didn't read anybody's opinion about anything...I didn't read articles or researches, although those made me WANT to learn, they did not influence my thought of choice.

I learned a lot about my religion and other beliefs and I decided that Islam is for me. sure, you could say that it was convenient but perhaps not so much, since everyone i'v talked to says that coming here actually influences people the other way around, away from Religion in general.

I'm now a practicing Muslim more than I ever was back home.

Not sure if that makes me limited to you but I know one thing: if thought and ponder is what constitutes a free thinker, then I am one to myself. I could say right now that if I hadnt thought deeply and got pushed out of my comfort zone, i'd have most likely become irreligious.

(see?? Religious discussion can be nice, Shade)

AssassinHMS
05-21-2014, 05:15 AM
Answers do not limit us by themselves. We aren't limited as long as we accept that there are no real answers. We can accept an answer for a practical or logical reason but we aren't limited by it as long as we doubt it (at least to a minimum).
Religion, like science, isn't much else other than answers with the difference that it doesn't offer a "real" source.


Assassin_M, if you accept Islam's answers without any doubt or if you consider them true without also considering them wrong at the same time, then I’d say you are more limited than someone who accepts every possibility.
If it isn't too personal, I would be interested in knowing what led you to believe in Muslim.




I think the ultimate free thinker is someone who can provide no answers, only questions plus an array of possibilities.

Assassin_M
05-21-2014, 05:30 AM
Answers do not limit us by themselves. We aren't limited as long as we accept that there are no answers. We can accept an answer for a practical or logical reason but we aren't limited by it as long as we doubt it (at least to a minimum).

Religion, like science, isn't much else other than answers with the difference that it doesn't offer a "real" source.


Assassin_M, if you accept Islam's answers without any doubt or if you consider them true without also considering them wrong at the same time, then I’d say you are more limited than someone who accepts every possibility.
If it isn't too personal, I would be interested in knowing what led you to believe in Muslim.

I think the ultimate free thinker is someone who can provide no answers, only questions plus an array of possibilities.
Islam has provided me with answers ABOUT Islam and about my beliefs, to doubt certain elements in Islam, like the existence of a God, would be Agnosticism akin to Atheism, proposing possibilities would be plain agnosticism; however, I can still have doubt and be open to various possibilities in other elements. I'd say the solutions that Islam gave to the blockades i'v faced were satisfying, it's not of course the absolute knowledge or answer to everything. It's just like being in a class room for example...there are certain things one must acknowledge with certainty...the authority of the tutor, for one. now I know this'll bring up the argument of "but the existence of the teacher can be proven, you can't prove god" sure thing but i'm simply stating WHY i need to have a certainties and why I don't really think it's limiting.

I can't really believe in something AND consider it wrong at the same time, sure there's of course the lingering doubt that occurs within everyone but i'm fairly certain in my beliefs and like I said, it's not an absolute knowledge or answer to everything...learning about Islam made me so much more open to questions, possibilities, explanations...always thinking, always learning. I accept that I may be wrong but I don't think I am...I accept that everything I have learned may be wrong but i don't think I am...I'm embracing two possibilities and two views...the fact that I may be wrong and the fact that I don't think so.

I don't really think that free thinker exists...every thinker must have a complete certainty towards something, no matter how insignificant, otherwise it'll be meaningless philosophy sugar coated with complex phrases...

It's not too personal, I just don't think Shade and the others would allow this kind of discussion to go on.

EDIT: actually, scratch that...no, I wouldn't really want to discuss what led me to believe in Islam. My original point was to address what Shahkulu said and I did that.

Shahkulu101
05-21-2014, 05:41 AM
There's a contradiction in this post. if someone's thoughts and conclusions led them to believe in 'age old beliefs', would they be limited? I always pondered about the phrase "free thinker" and how many Atheists monopolized that term, so to speak simply because they broke away from a parentage that induced religion.

I could say that i'm a Muslim by choice, not due to how I was raised...before i came here, I was in my comfort zone...it's a majority of muslims so i was never challenged..I never gave my beliefs much thought...I wasn't a practicing muslim by any means of the word, I was a muslim in the birth certificate and that was it.
Ever since I came to the US, I felt that I was challenged more and more....I watched many videos about Islam by people of other religions, I heard people talking about my religion, I watched CNN berate it to the floor...that pushed me to actually study and learn more about other Religions and my own Religion. I guess you could say it was a rediscovery and I found my answers...I didn't read anybody's opinion about anything...I didn't read articles or researches, although those made me WANT to learn, they did not influence my thought of choice.

I learned a lot about my religion and other beliefs and I decided that Islam is for me. sure, you could say that it was convenient but perhaps not so much, since everyone i'v talked to says that coming here actually influences people the other way around, away from Religion in general.

I'm now a practicing Muslim more than I ever was back home.

Not sure if that makes me limited to you but I know one thing: if thought and ponder is what constitutes a free thinker, then I am one to myself. I could say right now that if I hadnt thought deeply and got pushed out of my comfort zone, i'd have most likely become irreligious.

(see?? Religious discussion can be nice, Shade)

Well that's nice to hear, believe whatever you wish. I just want people to be happy.

Half of my family's actually Muslim, however I live on my agnostic Mothers side - religion just isn't something that's talked about in our house and it's never appealed to me to be honest. The concept of God, punishment for our sins etc. is too far-fetched a concept for me to believe in. I actually quite liked hearing the bible stories as a child in school - they were fun - but that's all they ever were to me, stories. Maybe their true, but I choose not to believe.

Assassin_M
05-21-2014, 05:44 AM
Well that's nice to hear, believe whatever you wish. I just want people to be happy.

Half of my family's actually Muslim, however I live on my agnostic Mothers side - religion just isn't something that's talked about in our house and it's never appealed to me to be honest. The concept of God, punishment for our sins etc. is too far-fetched a concept for me to believe in. I actually quite liked hearing the bible stories as a child in school - they were fun - but that's all they ever were to me, stories. Maybe their true, but I choose not to believe.
That's nice to hear.

Shahkulu101
05-21-2014, 05:51 AM
Civil religious discussion on the internet...

World...imploding...

Assassin_M
05-21-2014, 05:52 AM
Civil religious discussion on the internet...

World...imploding...
I can feeeeeel eeeeeeeeet

Shahkulu101
05-21-2014, 05:53 AM
Probably The Lord himself

JustPlainQuirky
05-21-2014, 06:15 AM
Because it's more like a philosophy than a religion.

Locopells
05-21-2014, 09:16 AM
I just don't think Shade and the others would allow this kind of discussion to go on.


Civil religious discussion on the internet...

World...imploding...

As ever, as long as it stays so. The second it ain't...

Jexx21
05-21-2014, 03:28 PM
Well that's nice to hear, believe whatever you wish. I just want people to be happy.

Half of my family's actually Muslim, however I live on my agnostic Mothers side - religion just isn't something that's talked about in our house and it's never appealed to me to be honest. The concept of God, punishment for our sins etc. is too far-fetched a concept for me to believe in. I actually quite liked hearing the bible stories as a child in school - they were fun - but that's all they ever were to me, stories. Maybe their true, but I choose not to believe.

Depends on what you mean by "punishment for our sins." You could interpret the Bible in a way that hell isn't actually this place where you go to burn for eternity, but rather, it's "eternal destruction." Pretty much it means what people who don't believe in an afterlife believe. When you die, you die. No life after death. Because the Bible tells us that if we believe in God or Jesus or whatever, we would have eternal life. A life eternally being burned away at is still an eternal life...

Anyway, while I personally identify as a Christian, my beliefs are more akin to: We can't have all the answers, religions are all just different interpretations of this world, and you can't say for certain which one is the utmost correct one.