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View Full Version : How do the Assassins and the Templars view the First Civilization?



Radman500
03-25-2014, 01:27 AM
do the Assassins have a favorable opinion on the First Civilization/TWCB or do they have contempt for them


same with the Templars how do you think they view the TWCB?

Assassin_M
03-25-2014, 01:35 AM
Assassins: Frustration, wonder, wariness, possibly contempt from some members..
Templars: History, contempt, unwanted wardens, holders of valuable knowledge..

The Templars hold contempt for TWCB for holding them away from their full potential. (see ACR Dossier TWCB)

Calvarok
03-25-2014, 01:57 AM
The Templars desire their technology for the edge it gives them. they don't care for anything about them beyond what they can use to understand and exploit their tech.

The Assassins are more interested in understanding WHY they left things behind than stealing said things, and who they really were. Information that the Templars think is useless, but led to the world being saved, and is going to be necessary in understanding and fighting Juno.

Radman500
03-27-2014, 03:12 AM
why would the templars hate the first civ?

Assassin_M
03-27-2014, 03:31 AM
why would the templars hate the first civ?
Because just because both want control does not mean they both love each other. like i said, read the ACR dossiers..

http://i.gyazo.com/8319884021d9250d03f8b775c90d012c.png

Calvarok
03-27-2014, 05:07 AM
Because just because both want control does not mean they both love each other. like i said, read the ACR dossiers..

http://i.gyazo.com/8319884021d9250d03f8b775c90d012c.png
Yeah, the only people who are unequivocally positive about the TWCB and all they did are the Instruments of the First Will. And that order probably won't ever be as big as either the Assassins or Templars, since becoming vessels of and slaves for a malevolent entity's mind isn't exactly going to sell most people on a secret society.

Assassin_M
03-27-2014, 05:33 AM
Yeah, the only people who are unequivocally positive about the TWCB and all they did are the Instruments of the First Will. And that order probably won't ever be as big as either the Assassins or Templars, since becoming vessels of and slaves for a malevolent entity's mind isn't exactly going to sell most people on a secret society.
Indeed, it can still be a pretty interesting cult..

Calvarok
03-27-2014, 06:12 AM
Indeed, it can still be a pretty interesting cult..
Indeed. I wonder how many members are Sages.

Radman500
03-27-2014, 06:17 AM
well like it was said earlier...I think the Assassins don't have contempt for the first civ....but probably want to understand their history... and why they did what they did

Assassin_M
03-27-2014, 06:20 AM
Indeed. I wonder how many members are Sages.
It'd be interesting to see different sages at the same time with their own distinct personalities. I think Darby talked about it once...how every sage's personality views Aita's imprinted memories...he said Thom was intrigued by it, Black Bart embraced it and it made John a fanatic...


well like it was said earlier...I think the Assassins don't have contempt for the first civ....but probably want to understand their history... and why they did what they did
William views them as frustrating and considering that Juno killed his son, i'd say he holds some contempt for at least Juno..

Radman500
03-27-2014, 06:35 AM
It'd be interesting to see different sages at the same time with their own distinct personalities. I think Darby talked about it once...how every sage's personality views Aita's imprinted memories...he said Thom was intrigued by it, Black Bart embraced it and it made John a fanatic...


William views them as frustrating and considering that Juno killed his son, i'd say he holds some contempt for at least Juno..

true...i assume the Assassins have more interest and curiosity about the First Civ..then the Templras, like you said, they couldn't care less about the First civ...

actually wait a second, wouldn't the Templars admire the First Civ..

1. the TWCB created the Human Race....

2. The TWCB initiated order and law at the humans for a perfect world...something the templars would like?

Calvarok
03-27-2014, 06:45 AM
It'd be interesting to see different sages at the same time with their own distinct personalities. I think Darby talked about it once...how every sage's personality views Aita's imprinted memories...he said Thom was intrigued by it, Black Bart embraced it and it made John a fanatic...

Yeah. It would be interesting to see if any of them would reject Juno. Surely Aita must have had some part of him that would disapprove of her actions. Maybe one of them will latch onto that part and bring it to the surface.

I wonder though, if Abstergo will begin rounding them up. They have cameras and facial recognition technology and they all look the same...

(apparently their facial recognition tech is so good that it makes the Observatory beneath their notice. I wonder if that's actually true or simply Templar overconfidence speaking)


actually wait a second, wouldn't the Templars admire the First Civ..

1. the TWCB created the Human Race....

2. The TWCB initiated order and law at the humans for a perfect world...something the templars would like?
EDIT: M said it better.

Assassin_M
03-27-2014, 06:47 AM
actually wait a second, wouldn't the Templars admire the First Civ..

1. the TWCB created the Human Race....

2. The TWCB initiated order and law at the humans for a perfect world...something the templars would like?
You're forgetting the details, like I said and fell into the same logic of "oh they both want control, they'll be allies" The Templars work for the betterment of Humanity through control. The Templars' goal of control has a reason...the ultimate benefit for humanity. a direction. a set course for the entirety of the human race to take.

The first civ couldn't care less about humanity. they controlled them to be their slaves, nothing more...the humans were machines for the first civ. The first civ didn't care about humans. They made them to be animals...a docile workforce...how can you admire someone who made you a slave with no purpose nor direction?? no thought of making you better??

What most people seem to be confused about is that, the goal came first for the Templars THEN the method. their goal was peace...their ultimate goal was the betterment of humanity. That's when the dissent happened...'we can only ensure the betterment of humanity, peace by control'...by giving people direction...purpose. They don't want control for the hell of it (although it has proven as a valuable ramp for selfish and greedy individuals such as Rodrigo and Cesare) They want control because they're convinced that it's the only way to achieve peace and a better future for all..


EDIT: M said it better.
Thank you, I think you summarized what I wanted to say in your unedited post..


Yeah. It would be interesting to see if any of them would reject Juno. Surely Aita must have had some part of him that would disapprove of her actions. Maybe one of them will latch onto that part and bring it to the surface.

I wonder though, if Abstergo will begin rounding them up. They have cameras and facial recognition technology and they all look the same...

(apparently their facial recognition tech is so good that it makes the Observatory beneath their notice. I wonder if that's actually true or simply Templar overconfidence speaking)
Or maybe not Aita, just some part of the other personality of the sage. it'd come to reject being a slave again.

I'm curious to see how that'd work on a female...Aita's facial features are not exactly soft xD

(It can be a bit of both, since hey their satellite, which they were so confident about, was going to fail)

Calvarok
03-27-2014, 07:04 AM
You're forgetting the details, like I said and fell into the same logic of "oh they both want control, they'll be allies" The Templars work for the betterment of Humanity through control. The Templars' goal of control has a reason...the ultimate benefit for humanity. a direction. a set course for the entirety of the human race to take.

The first civ couldn't care less about humanity. they controlled them to be their slaves, nothing more...the humans were machines for the first civ. The first civ didn't care about humans. They made them to be animals...a docile workforce...how can you admire someone who made you a slave with no purpose nor direction?? no thought of making you better??

What most people seem to be confused about is that, the goal came first for the Templars THEN the method. their goal was peace...their ultimate goal was the betterment of humanity. That's when the dissent happened...'we can only ensure the betterment of humanity, peace by control'...by giving people direction...purpose. They don't want control for the hell of it (although it has proven as a valuable ramp for selfish and greedy individuals such as Rodrigo and Cesare) They want control because they're convinced that it's the only way to achieve peace and a better future for all..
I think you could also make a case for why the Assassin's aren't super buddy-buddy with the Assassin-like TWCB faction because they similarly go against their ideals. The reason why Minerva would rather Desmond had denied Juno and begun the cycle again is because she didn't truly believe in humanity either. Assassins aren't about not ever compromising or allowing any threats to remain, they're about fighting whenever it can lead to any amount of hope for the future.

She observed them throughout history. That she couldn't understand why they fight reveals how insignificant she believes they are. How simple and childish she considers their convictions. I don't think any assassins should or will truly consider that faction of TWCB their allies.

Assassin_M
03-27-2014, 07:17 AM
I think you could also make a case for why the Assassin's aren't super buddy-buddy with the Assassin-like TWCB faction because they similarly go against their ideals. The reason why Minerva would rather Desmond had denied Juno and begun the cycle again is because she didn't truly believe in humanity either. Assassins aren't about not ever compromising or allowing any threats to remain, they're about fighting whenever it can lead to any amount of hope for the future.

She observed them throughout history. That she couldn't understand why they fight reveals how insignificant she believes they are. How simple and childish she considers their convictions. I don't think any assassins should or will truly consider that faction of TWCB their allies.
Excellent point, I never really thought about it, but yes indeed. People keep talking about how "ohmagodz Minerva is za Assassin choice and Juno is za Templar choice, Dezmon chose ze Templarz ending" when it's not really that black and white. Both Minerva AND Juno go against the Assassins' ideals. both Minerva AND Juno go against the Templar ideals. It's baffling that people think that just because Juno wants control, then the Templars will ally with her and because Minerva mentioned "fighting for freedom" then she is with the Assassins..

Calvarok
03-27-2014, 11:30 AM
Excellent point, I never really thought about it, but yes indeed. People keep talking about how "ohmagodz Minerva is za Assassin choice and Juno is za Templar choice, Dezmon chose ze Templarz ending" when it's not really that black and white. Both Minerva AND Juno go against the Assassins' ideals. both Minerva AND Juno go against the Templar ideals. It's baffling that people think that just because Juno wants control, then the Templars will ally with her and because Minerva mentioned "fighting for freedom" then she is with the Assassins..
I mean, I understand why people think that. It's an easy parallel to make, and I do think the similarities are mostly intentional. I do hope they more directly explore the flawed aspects of those who came before, there's a lot of interesting things that could be done with that. I'd like to know more about what it's actually like for them to communicate with humans, and how it differs from how they themselves communicated. Also, here's hoping for an ancient history game where we get to see a living twcb without them being all hologrammy.

Radman500
06-24-2014, 12:34 PM
so the Assassins dont hate the First Civ

you think the assassins would be logical and have a unbias opinion on the first civ

its a shame the asssassins arn't tolerant of fc

Radman500
07-12-2014, 04:13 AM
im talking the modern day/initaties ..do they realize the Juno threat..

i have a feeling that they will find out during initaties right before the game comes out...so i think modern day

i assume we will be finding out how to combat her...

roostersrule2
07-12-2014, 04:14 AM
When will Radman find out about the AC's discussion thread?

Radman500
07-12-2014, 04:16 AM
When will Radman find out about the AC's discussion thread?
thats gameplay discussion...not story discussion

JustPlainQuirky
07-12-2014, 04:16 AM
Im sorry can you make it clearer what you're saying? I actually like the topic :o

@rooster

IKR? :rolleyes:

edit

@radman

it's an ALL discussion actually :o

roostersrule2
07-12-2014, 04:17 AM
thats gameplay discussion...not story discussionNo it's for semi-important AC threads.

rickprog
07-12-2014, 04:19 AM
I don't get your point. The modern day Assassins are with Bill, Shaun and Rebecca, and all of them witnessed what was told to Desmond and what later happened to him. They have also read messages coming from Juno and have links with the ACIV MD protagonist, so they know about the incident of John from IT and so on.

Calvarok
07-12-2014, 05:05 AM
They know about it, they just don't know what to do about it. The Instruments of The First Will are who knows where and likely small in number. they encountered an assassin HQ that Juno had been attempting to use to return through the animus, and they shut it down, but they have no leads as to where she might strike next, if she's started already, or if she's already succeeded long ago.

Galina is an obvious candidate for someone who's already been taken over by her. too obvious, as if the writers are trying to misdirect, but don't count anything out.

naumaan
07-12-2014, 05:16 AM
Galina is an obvious candidate for someone who's already been taken over by her. too obvious, as if the writers are trying to misdirect, but don't count anything out.

I am sorry for being not updated, although I am keeping track of everything ac . who is GALINA?

Sekuiya.
07-12-2014, 05:23 AM
You're totally not keeping tracks of everything AC, since you don't seem to be tracking Initiates.
Galina (http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Galina_Voronina) is a Russian assassin that recently join the crew of the Altair II.

naumaan
07-12-2014, 05:30 AM
You're totally not keeping tracks of everything AC, since you don't seem to be tracking Initiates.
Galina (http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Galina_Voronina) is a Russian assassin that recently join the crew of the Altair II.

oh i know about her ... but when was she possessed by juno ?

Ureh
07-12-2014, 05:36 AM
oh i know about her ... but when was she possessed by juno ?

That's just speculation (for now).

naumaan
07-12-2014, 05:44 AM
I think juno needs a vessel just like the sage and john of IT ... and for that, juno needs to take help from an ancestor as she did from desmond's ancestors, and if they are going to involve ac initiates updates with juno, then they will introduce the new characters in the modern day era ..

Sekuiya.
07-12-2014, 05:48 AM
Erm... she wasn't, not that I recall. And saying that anyone in that room on that day was controlled by Juno it's still a little far-fetched in my opinion.
We have no idea what exactly means to be possessed by Juno so...

Calvarok
07-12-2014, 05:55 AM
Erm... she wasn't, not that I recall. And saying that anyone in that room on that day was controlled by Juno it's still a little far-fetched in my opinion.
We have no idea what exactly means to be possessed by Juno so...
it's true that juno might not immediately gain control, but the implication is that she would eventually.

though we may not have any hard evidence on juno having done anything yet, I think it was made pretty explicit what was at least meant to happen in that room.

Sekuiya.
07-12-2014, 05:59 AM
There was? I dunno, how can you tell? Woman that was insane from the start, strapped to an Animus and saying random stuff. Somehow remind me more of Daniel Cross after returning to Abstergo than an actual possession, whatever that exactly is.

naumaan
07-12-2014, 06:00 AM
Erm... she wasn't, not that I recall. And saying that anyone in that room on that day was controlled by Juno it's still a little far-fetched in my opinion.
We have no idea what exactly means to be possessed by Juno so...

the ending of ac brotherhood was a fair example of juno's possession ..

Sekuiya.
07-12-2014, 06:03 AM
the ending of ac brotherhood was a fair example of juno's possession ..
Not exactly, Juno just guided Desmond actions, she was not controlling him. In ACIII, Desmond admits that if he wanted, he could have stopped.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7EO52BjHdqU#t=349

masterfenix2009
07-12-2014, 06:04 AM
Hmm.. interesting. Looks like I missed a lot of stuff about initiates while I was gone. Is there anyway anywhere I can learn all the new information that Initiates gave? Any information post Black Flag launch date I mean. I would go to initiates, but it is down right now.

Sekuiya.
07-12-2014, 06:09 AM
Hmm.. interesting. Looks like I missed a lot of stuff about initiates while I was gone. Is there anyway anywhere I can learn all the new information that Initiates gave? Any information post Black Flag launch date I mean. I would go to initiates, but it is down right now.
The information is kinda scattered through out the wiki, but reading everything here (http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Assassin's_Creed:_Initiates#January_2014) beginning in January 2014 can give you a clear picture of the situation, I guess.

Ureh
07-12-2014, 06:10 AM
Yeah, I don't think she was capable of possessing anyone in Brohood (i.e. using their body as a vessel). Cause she was still stuck inside that globe or eye or whatever you want to call it (in AC3).

naumaan
07-12-2014, 06:12 AM
Hmm.. interesting. Looks like I missed a lot of stuff about initiates while I was gone. Is there anyway anywhere I can learn all the new information that Initiates gave? Any information post Black Flag launch date I mean. I would go to initiates, but it is down right now.

you can find initiate updates from here

http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Assassin's_Creed:_Initiates

naumaan
07-12-2014, 06:16 AM
personally i categorize this philosophy of juno trying to find a vessel for herself in humans and her husband finding a vessel in humans as sage and john of IT ... juno hated humans ... she will never accept humans as her vessel .. and according to first civilizations philosophy ... humans are lower than them ... so its out of question .. but as I am ac fan I am very interested in what is going to happen next

Calvarok
07-12-2014, 06:25 AM
There was? I dunno, how can you tell? Woman that was insane from the start, strapped to an Animus and saying random stuff. Somehow remind me more of Daniel Cross after returning to Abstergo than an actual possession, whatever that exactly is.
Um... did you forget about the part where Galina's mother was screaming about Aita dying, then she stabbed her, then Juno's face on the animus monitors in the room screamed and disappeared?

Juno IS strong enough to possess someone now, or at least to begin the process of possessing them. And she would likely have succeeded if she were not stopped. But of course there's the possibility that she may not have been entirely stopped and Galina might have been imprinted with a fragment of Juno's consciousness or something. Which is a long shot, it's more likely that things happened exactly as they seemed.

summary here at the end: http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Juno#Life_in_the_Grey

naumaan
07-12-2014, 06:46 AM
Um... did you forget about the part where Galina's mother was screaming about Aita dying, then she stabbed her, then Juno's face on the animus monitors in the room screamed and disappeared?

Juno IS strong enough to possess someone now, or at least to begin the process of possessing them. And she would likely have succeeded if she were not stopped. But of course there's the possibility that she may not have been entirely stopped and Galina might have been imprinted with a fragment of Juno's consciousness or something. Which is a long shot, it's more likely that things happened exactly as they seemed.

summary here at the end: http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Juno#Life_in_the_Grey

so you are saying that gaina's mother was experiencing the first civilization time period in animus ?

Ureh
07-12-2014, 06:59 AM
so you are saying that gaina's mother was experiencing the first civilization time period in animus ?

Well I think it was Galina that claimed that her mom was talking to Eve in the animus. Like an actual 1-on-1 conversation. So yep.

Calvarok
07-12-2014, 07:06 AM
No, I'm not saying that. She was talking to Eve before, she was being possessed then. Why else would juno scream when she was killed?

why would she be screaming for Aita if she was talking to eve at that very moment?

Ureh
07-12-2014, 08:05 AM
@Calvarok
I thought naumann was asking if Galina's mom was exploring the FirstCiv time period in the Animus. I said that is a possible case because she was apparently talking to Eve at one point (cause Eve lived during that era right? we'll just assume that Eve is still dead.). Maybe I misunderstood naumann's question, and he's actually asking if her mother was exploring the FirstCiv era at the time that she was shrieking and got stabbed. In which case, probably not.

I don't think she was screaming about Aita and talking to Eve at the same time. Although that scenario might be a possibility since she was still strapped to the Animus at the time.

Moultonborough
07-12-2014, 10:19 AM
She does have the ability to possess humans she is currently too weak. Thus why John was having us hack into computers so we could get access. And why he was ****ing pissed when she didn't/couldn't...... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ZjlIoVbX-0 7:34-end

Sekuiya.
07-12-2014, 02:53 PM
No one denies that Juno may be able to possess humans. Yet, what we question, is if it already happened. That video strongly suggests that it's still not the time for that, meaning, a couple of months shouldn't be sufficient for she to be able to actually possess someone. She looks to want something specific to happen, some artifact to resurges, before coming back to the flesh world.

jayjay275
07-12-2014, 06:33 PM
When will Radman find out about the AC's discussion thread?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QkjD3D5FgmE

Layytez
07-12-2014, 07:16 PM
I feel Juno was only capable of taking over the mother due to her brittle mind. With her being too weak to resist, Juno had a easy trip. With her talking about her dead husband and "the grey" made it kinda clear Juno had a foot in basically rewriting her brain.

Jexx21
07-13-2014, 01:48 AM
Calvarok had an interesting idea on handling Juno.

What if we could somehow force her into an simulated Animus environment, and kill her there? Our character would be like a virus, Juno is a program protected by a firewall, and we would somehow get past her firewalls and delete her, or severely cripple her.

JustPlainQuirky
07-13-2014, 01:56 AM
Calvarok had an interesting idea on handling Juno.

What if we could somehow force her into an simulated Animus environment, and kill her there? Our character would be like a virus, Juno is a program protected by a firewall, and we would somehow get past her firewalls and delete her, or severely cripple her.

hnghhhhhh

I guessssssssss

I mean i guess we cant exactly beat up her innocent vessel...

but only if I have fists to beat her to a bloody pulp with.

I want to punish her.

She indirectly killed Desmond. She screwed over Connor and Haytham. She deserves to be puniiiiiished *foams at the mouth*

Jexx21
07-13-2014, 02:07 AM
Uh.. yes.. Animus simulated environemnt.. You may as well be stabbing her

hell, if we're using the Assassin animus where Clay may have or may not have tried to back up Desmond's memories as an AI, for all we know Desmond might try to join our conciousness and we would get what you want in a sense, where Altair, Ezio, Connor, Edward, etc. all "team up" to kill Juno, except in reality it's just our player character flickering between personas.

JustPlainQuirky
07-13-2014, 02:23 AM
Uh.. yes.. Animus simulated environemnt.. You may as well be stabbing her

hell, if we're using the Assassin animus where Clay may have or may not have tried to back up Desmond's memories as an AI, for all we know Desmond might try to join our conciousness and we would get what you want in a sense, where Altair, Ezio, Connor, Edward, etc. all "team up" to kill Juno, except in reality it's just our player character flickering between personas.

http://derpy.ponychan.net/chan/files/src/140331891289.gif

Not quite as meaningful since the Assassin's minds arent actually there, but is pretty dang close!

WANT WANT WANT

Jexx21
07-13-2014, 02:30 AM
Actually if it's Desmond's consciousness the minds could technically be there.

It was always one of my theories that the TWCB could essentially be immortal beings because with their full sixth sense they may be able to freely access the memories of their ancestors like those memories were their own. Of course, they wouldn't truly be their ancestors, but they could completely mimic them. It's like, what if you were able to take all your memories and personality and psyche and put it in a computer to build an AI. There would be you, and there would be the AI that is basically you, but it isn't really you.

One of my theories for AC3 would be that Desmond would actually fully unlock the sixth sense and all of his ancestors memories would unlock to him.

JustPlainQuirky
07-13-2014, 02:33 AM
Yeah thats a cool theory, and AC has the means for cloning.

But you're right it wouldn't REALLY be the assassins.

Unless Ubi introduces a way to transfer souls or life essence or whatever identifies an individual in the AC universe.

Jexx21
07-13-2014, 02:34 AM
Souls may not exist in the AC universe.

JustPlainQuirky
07-13-2014, 02:42 AM
Jex is banned

noooooooooooooooo


jexx. Twitter. Steam. Nao

edit:

lol my post count was affected too for some reason. Dunno why that happens. Maybe your threads are pulled down I guess?

Xstantin
07-13-2014, 02:50 AM
Yes they're. I was going to post in the iconography thread and it wouldn't let me.

JustPlainQuirky
07-13-2014, 03:00 AM
@jexx

thats another problem

If souls dont exist in the AC universe, then that means we'll NEVER see the TRUE original assassins *cough* and Haytham *cough* in MD Q-Q


Oh well. The dream was something that would be found in fanfiction anyway

edit:


WAIT NVM THERES STILL THE ABKH PIECE OF EDEN THAT REVIVES THE DEAD HNGHH

goob0t
07-14-2014, 01:43 AM
I always thought that in the last AC our main character would be having bleed through issues with all the assassins we have played through while fighting off someone like Juno, he picks up an apple and you know how the apple can make clones? Well each clone will absorb a different assassin memory, effectively making it so each assassin is actually there side by side.

JustPlainQuirky
07-14-2014, 01:46 AM
I always thought that in the last AC our main character would be having bleed through issues with all the assassins we have played through while fighting off someone like Juno, he picks up an apple and you know how the apple can make clones? Well each clone will absorb a different assassin memory, effectively making it so each assassin is actually there side by side.

I'll take this too.

Anything for nostalgia.

http://www.elle.com/cm/elle/images/3r/Cryinggifs_01_1.gif

But I still prefer the real deal.

HDinHB
07-14-2014, 05:12 AM
Calvarok had an interesting idea on handling Juno.

What if we could somehow force her into an simulated Animus environment, and kill her there? Our character would be like a virus, Juno is a program protected by a firewall, and we would somehow get past her firewalls and delete her, or severely cripple her.

AC: Tron?


Uh.. yes.. Animus simulated environemnt.. You may as well be stabbing her

hell, if we're using the Assassin animus where Clay may have or may not have tried to back up Desmond's memories as an AI, for all we know Desmond might try to join our conciousness and we would get what you want in a sense, where Altair, Ezio, Connor, Edward, etc. all "team up" to kill Juno, except in reality it's just our player character flickering between personas.

Like when Al Mualim used the apple to create the illusion of the nine Templars Altar killed? Except this time it would be computer recreations of Desmond's ancestors to fight Juno. And they could each fight her in their own time period, and only when she is beaten in all time periods is she truly defeated. That could be a grand finale. But we'll need moar games about moar Assassin's from moar time periods.

wvstolzing
07-14-2014, 01:57 PM
And they could each fight her in their own time period, and only when she is beaten in all time periods is she truly defeated. That could be a grand finale.

That kinda reminds me of the finale for ST - The Next Generation. (All Good Things...)
Sounds plausible, actually.

MasterAssasin84
07-14-2014, 05:48 PM
You may need to structure the question a bit differently ?

Are you asking if the Assassins are aware of Juno's intentions ?

Then yes they do ! this was all explained at the end of AC3 ( spoiler ) before Desmond's death as minerva warned the Assassins what the consequences would be if Desmond released Juno from the Grand Temple .

If your asking was the Assassins aware of Juno's existence then yes !

That was made very clear when both Ezio and Connor encountered her not forgetting Shaun Bill and Rebecca all witnessed Desmond's final conversation with Juno and Minerva


Altair discovered the existence of TWCB through the apple and recorded this information gleaned from the artefacts in the codex .

You should know this being an Assassins Creed Fan

Radman500
08-09-2014, 06:50 PM
thats the only way i can see the Assassins and Templars ever uniting...

marvelfannumber
08-09-2014, 06:56 PM
*cough*Elise*cough*

Anyways, the name having a triple meaning? Naaahh, sounds unlikely.

Acrimonious_Nin
08-10-2014, 01:26 AM
I believe that Unity has to either mean Arno and Elise form an alliance, which is foreshadowed in the newest trailer...or It's about Juno being part of the gray and have her "instruments" actually fight or fend from both sides of this ongoing war...or a bit of both...

They cast Juno so shortly in the last game as if they were saving the best for later...soooo...maybe we will hear more about Juno during Arno's time...Even Aita makes mention to the fact that Juno would have used Edward, but chose not too for some reason...she seems to favor helping the assassins...And being that the Initiates seem to be allying themselves with the Assassins...could mean that Arno is going to be used by Juno...maybe ? somehow ?!

AherasSTRG
08-10-2014, 01:36 AM
No, it doesn't.

S0ckPuppet
08-12-2014, 05:26 AM
I think Elise could be the Eve descendant.

Radman500
08-29-2014, 07:41 PM
do they have a unfavorable opinion of them, similar to the Templars, they like First civ technology but don't really care about them?

Radman500
09-06-2014, 04:05 AM
what do you guys think....

JustPlainQuirky
09-06-2014, 04:09 AM
Pretty sure you made this exact thread before.

AdamPearce
09-06-2014, 04:11 AM
Thanks, haven't laughed like that since Rogue's gameplay/

HiddenKiller612
09-06-2014, 04:16 AM
will your threads ever have any substance?

Namikaze_17
09-06-2014, 04:16 AM
Nope, we're more likely to see Jupiter if anything...

I just feel it...

Juno's still stuck in the Limbo tea party with Connor, MD, and Initiates. :)

HiddenKiller612
09-06-2014, 04:18 AM
nah, we have a higher chance of seeing Uranus.

Namikaze_17
09-06-2014, 04:22 AM
Or Pt.2 to "The Truth" :rolleyes:

Xstantin
09-06-2014, 04:49 AM
Wasn't there one this week? I think it got moves but really

SpiritOfNevaeh
09-06-2014, 04:55 AM
Didn't we have a thread like this already?


nah, we have a higher chance of seeing Uranus.

I see what you did there :rolleyes:

naumaan
09-06-2014, 05:33 AM
no .. but i guess we will find out about juno's family and how she was a total ***** with the them ..

HiddenKiller612
09-06-2014, 10:50 AM
Didn't we have a thread like this already?



I see what you did there :rolleyes:
;)

Radman500
10-18-2014, 09:52 PM
seeing as the First Civilization created humanity and ruled them with order, like the templars would want


the assassins would defintelly be against the First Civilization, or would they?

SixKeys
10-18-2014, 10:03 PM
The First Civ created humans as slaves. Templars want order, but they want that order to rise from humanity itself, not from TWCB.

EmbodyingSeven5
10-18-2014, 10:43 PM
........ if a Templar was given the same opportunity desmond was in three there is a possibility that they would take it IMO

Radman500
10-18-2014, 10:45 PM
The First Civ created humans as slaves. Templars want order, but they want that order to rise from humanity itself, not from TWCB.
so both Templars and Assassins have negative views on the First Civilization

MakimotoJin
10-19-2014, 03:47 AM
The First Civ created humans as slaves. Templars want order, but they want that order to rise from humanity itself, not from TWCB.

Well they also want to protect and secure them.But yeah,the templars have some differences from the First Civilization.The templars want peace,while they don't care about it at all.

VestigialLlama4
10-19-2014, 04:28 AM
The Templars want to BE the First Civilization. Vidic and the Satellite all talk about unleashing the potential of the Human DNA and unlock mankind's true potential, the Templars want to replace the First Civilization by recreating the same order, hierarchy and coveting the same powers and abilities. They state repeatedly, like Haytham does in his final duel with Connor, that mankind was bred to be slaves and will never be more than that, and they need the order of superior beings. At the end of Black Flag, they are making progress trying to seek the blood vials of First Civilization blood.

The Assassins feel humanity should never aspire for the power and society created by the First Civilization while the Templars want to return mankind, in the name of progress, to the same backward technocratically imposed servitude.

pirate1802
10-19-2014, 05:09 AM
What SIxKeys said. They actually explicitly answer this question in an ACR MP dossier. They was control, but they want THEIR control, not TWCB's. Come to think of it, its common sense really. Would Stalin be okay with it if Hitler came in and took his country over? I mean..... both want control right? Right?

Radman500
10-19-2014, 06:16 PM
so the templars want to replicate First Civ society and Assassins don't

Hans684
10-19-2014, 06:20 PM
I have no idea what the end goal of the First Civ was. So it's not easy to say. But I doubt their pro-Firs Civ.

As for Assassins, they've been harassed by the First Civ.

RinoTheBouncer
10-19-2014, 10:05 PM
To be quite honest, I don’t condemn the First Civ. I like how they evolved and how they built the world. I can’t blame them for treating humans like pets or like their own property, because in reality, we are their property, they made us and they intended for us to serve them and they even mated with us to pass down the good genetic features to us, so I don’t really think they’re bad people. Juno wants to rule the world because in her opinion, she’s the most worthy of doing so, she comes from the superior race, the race of the Gods.

She managed to survive and now she’s taking back what’s hers. So I can’t really blame her even though her actions do not appeal to us, humans. The only reason we thought Minerva and Jupiter to be good is because their decisions and actions benefit our race, that’s all. It’s not because they’re good or bad people, just that they’re good to us.

Back on topic, I wonder if the Assassins would rather be ruled by the Templars, a part of the human race who thinks they know what’s good for mankind, or the First Civ., the superior race?

I know the Assassins want freedom and wisdom, but I’m not sure which side is on their priority list to defeat. Would they rather team up with the Templars and defeat Juno? join Juno to destroy the Templars since Juno herself said “The cross darkens the horizon” implying the she’s against them? or they’ll just fight alone against both?

Radman500
10-19-2014, 10:51 PM
To be quite honest, I don’t condemn the First Civ. I like how they evolved and how they built the world. I can’t blame them for treating humans like pets or like their own property, because in reality, we are their property, they made us and they intended for us to serve them and they even mated with us to pass down the good genetic features to us, so I don’t really think they’re bad people. Juno wants to rule the world because in her opinion, she’s the most worthy of doing so, she comes from the superior race, the race of the Gods.

She managed to survive and now she’s taking back what’s hers. So I can’t really blame her even though her actions do not appeal to us, humans. The only reason we thought Minerva and Jupiter to be good is because their decisions and actions benefit our race, that’s all. It’s not because they’re good or bad people, just that they’re good to us.

Back on topic, I wonder if the Assassins would rather be ruled by the Templars, a part of the human race who thinks they know what’s good for mankind, or the First Civ., the superior race?

I know the Assassins want freedom and wisdom, but I’m not sure which side is on their priority list to defeat. Would they rather team up with the Templars and defeat Juno? join Juno to destroy the Templars since Juno herself said “The cross darkens the horizon” implying the she’s against them? or they’ll just fight alone against both?


I would assume the Assassins would unite with the Templars before they would ever unite with First Civ...but thats an interesting question


the templars just want order, though....not slavery, in fact templars abhorred slavery.......... juno/first civ CREATED us to be slaves and want us to be slaves again as that is our "natural state" in First Civ eyes

Radman500
10-21-2014, 10:46 PM
the Assassins or Templars who is more ignorant of the fact that Juno is out there and planning/scheming

Radman500
10-21-2014, 11:04 PM
everyday i hear people argue about the first civ/animus/present day aspect of AC...

well the fact is, Ubisoft has spent so much time building up the first civ aspects, lore etc....that they just can't "Get rid of it/scrap it"

its here to stay and the only possibility is a reboot


which i doubt Ubisoft will ever reboot Assassins Creed until it starts declining alot in sales..

Radman500
10-21-2014, 11:07 PM
same with the juno plot

m4r-k7
10-21-2014, 11:07 PM
Do you create a thread whenever a thought comes into your head?

Don't wanna sound mean, but damn you make tons and tons of threads

Radman500
10-21-2014, 11:08 PM
besides there are many people that like the sci-fi aspect of ac just as much as the people that hate it

RinoTheBouncer
10-21-2014, 11:09 PM
I really wish that the First Civ. story and modern day stay forever. I’m really not interested in a mere simulator of past times with massive shoehorning of historical events. I know history, I can read about history or watch movies about it. But nobody can tell me about First Civ. or the Assassins and their origins other than AC games themselves.

Radman500
10-21-2014, 11:10 PM
Do you create a thread whenever a thought comes into your head?

Don't wanna sound mean, but damn you make tons and tons of threads
sorry, i dont try to...but this idea that ubisoft is just going to drop the first civ, animus, juno plot thats already been so much established in ac lore....is laughable....

and they will NEVER reboot the series for a long, long, long time, probably never


I really wish that the First Civ. story and modern day stay forever. Im really not interested in a mere simulator of past times with massive shoehorning of historical events. I know history, I can read about history or watch movies about it. But nobody can tell me about First Civ. or the Assassins and their origins other than AC games themselves.
their never going to drop first civ...its already too established in the lore of ac,

Xstantin
10-21-2014, 11:12 PM
what is this even

Megas_Doux
10-21-2014, 11:33 PM
Two threads about the SAME thing within minutes.....

Radman500
10-21-2014, 11:33 PM
TRANSMISSION BEGINS:22:13 “I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.....TRANSMISSION ENDS
https://twitter.com/acinitiates/status/508963004012953600
Initaites posted this back in september.. it is obviously Juno as she tries to come back to the world


so i think ubisoft is cooking something good for its modern day storyline for unity..

SHADOWGARVIN
10-21-2014, 11:35 PM
lol. You really like making threads, don't you?

Radman500
10-21-2014, 11:36 PM
lol. You really like making threads, don't you?
I don't see how this is a problem..if you don't feel like contributing, then don't


why does everyone have to be condescending all of a sudden..its not cute, nor funny

ACfan443
10-21-2014, 11:39 PM
Dude, ease your foot off the gas pedal. Making a thread and not actually contributing anything to the debate before quickly moving on to the next one is pointless and annoying.

Haven't you been infracted and banned several times for doing this?

SHADOWGARVIN
10-21-2014, 11:40 PM
I don't see how this is a problem..if you don't feel like contributing, then don't


why does everyone have to be condescending all of a sudden..its not cute, nor funny

I'm not being condescending. I just noticed that you made three separate threads in 5 minutes.

Radman500
10-21-2014, 11:40 PM
Dude, ease your foot off the gas pedal. Making a thread and not actually contributing anything to the debate before quickly moving on to the next one is pointless and annoying.

Haven't you been infracted and banned several times for doing this?
I think i am contributing to this thread.....

RinoTheBouncer
10-21-2014, 11:40 PM
TRANSMISSION BEGINS:22:13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.....TRANSMISSION ENDS
https://twitter.com/acinitiates/status/508963004012953600
Initaites posted this back in september.. it is obviously Juno as she tries to come back to the world


so i think ubisoft is cooking something good for its modern day storyline for unity..

I hope she does come back in physical form and actually controls the world and not just end up being deleted or something rushed and crappy like that.

Radman500
10-21-2014, 11:41 PM
I'm not being condescending. I just noticed that you made three separate threads in 5 minutes.
as far as I know, their isn't a limit on how many threads you are allowed to make in 5 minutes, so I don't really see the problem

ACfan443
10-21-2014, 11:42 PM
I think i am contributing to this thread.....

What about the other dozen that have slipped to the second and third pages?

Xstantin
10-21-2014, 11:42 PM
So are they ignorant or arrogant? Serious question /s

Radman500
10-21-2014, 11:43 PM
So are they ignorant or arrogant? Serious question /s
both?

Moultonborough
10-22-2014, 12:12 AM
Is Abstergo even aware of the Juno threat? If they are it would be them. The Assassin's are aware and (somewhat) dealing with it even if they don't notice it too much.

Eurostar7
10-22-2014, 12:23 AM
TRANSMISSION BEGINS:22:13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.....TRANSMISSION ENDS
https://twitter.com/acinitiates/status/508963004012953600
Initaites posted this back in september.. it is obviously Juno as she tries to come back to the world


so i think ubisoft is cooking something good for its modern day storyline for unity..

In AC1, when Desmond goes to Eagle Vision and sees the wall glowing with cryptic messages by Clay (Subject 16), one of the things was "22:13"

Its right next to the symbol that has re-appeared in Unity, some other member started a topic about it here a few days ago.

Ureh
10-22-2014, 12:37 AM
Yeah the Templars seemed slightly more in the dark this time.

In the conversation between Laeticia and an Unknown person (I'm guessing it's Rikkin), it almost sounds like she doesn't know the face in the screenshot is Juno. Or it could be that Laeticia simply refuses to call her by name. But she does know that it is a twcb and that it poses a serious threat. Erudito seemed to know more about Juno, so Abstergo might gain from their knowledge now that the two groups have joined together.

http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20140803231002/assassinscreed/images/d/d6/ScreenShot1.png

pacmanate
10-22-2014, 12:43 AM
Yeah the Templars seemed slightly more in the dark this time.

In the conversation between Laeticia and an Unknown person (I'm guessing it's Rikkin), it almost sounds like she doesn't know the face in the screenshot is Juno. Or it could be that Laeticia simply refuses to call her by name. But she does know that it is a twcb and that it poses a serious threat. Erudito seemed to know more about Juno, so Abstergo might gain from their knowledge now that the two groups have joined together.

http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20140803231002/assassinscreed/images/d/d6/ScreenShot1.png

@Johkr - Another thing that was put on Initiates. The secret group Erudito has now joined with Abstergo. Something that could have been mentioned in the game in an email or something

Ureh
10-22-2014, 12:44 AM
Actually that was exclusive to AC4 mp. :]

Radman500
10-22-2014, 02:09 AM
Actually that was exclusive to AC4 mp. :]
the biblical quote that initaites posted, the "i am alpha/omega" is defintelly juno

ERICATHERINE
10-22-2014, 01:45 PM
Yeah the Templars seemed slightly more in the dark this time.

In the conversation between Laeticia and an Unknown person (I'm guessing it's Rikkin), it almost sounds like she doesn't know the face in the screenshot is Juno. Or it could be that Laeticia simply refuses to call her by name. But she does know that it is a twcb and that it poses a serious threat. Erudito seemed to know more about Juno, so Abstergo might gain from their knowledge now that the two groups have joined together.

http://img1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20140803231002/assassinscreed/images/d/d6/ScreenShot1.png

Well, I read something like that on the internet it was these 2 person talking with each other and while thinking that Erudito might team up with abstergo, at a later date, we can read (also in ac 4 multiplayer) that membre of erudito have been arested because of them (it was after a "hoodini bank thief" had stolen the money of many people of many countries while not keeping it (surely to delete it). My opinions about this is that they weren't talking about Juno, but about the theft.

Eurostar7
10-22-2014, 06:48 PM
I always thought Erudito was good. Maybe they joined them to act as a mole for the Assassins.

I dont understand how the IT guy was the mole for the Assassins when he was the rebrith of Aita, Juno's lover. Wouldnt he naturally side with the Templars? I mean the Templars have similar ideologies to Juno after all, IF Minevera is telling the truth about Juno wanting the enslave humankind that is.

Ureh
10-22-2014, 07:25 PM
I always thought Erudito was good. Maybe they joined them to act as a mole for the Assassins.

I dont understand how the IT guy was the mole for the Assassins when he was the rebrith of Aita, Juno's lover. Wouldnt he naturally side with the Templars? I mean the Templars have similar ideologies to Juno after all, IF Minevera is telling the truth about Juno wanting the enslave humankind that is.

I don't think Juno and Aita would side with the Templars. Not unless it was part of their plan. In one of Juno's emails to Desmond, she said that the Templars are a perversion of her ideology.

Title: Improvements
Sent: Nov 13th, 2012; 18:21
To: D.Miles
"I have found a way to better control the impulses To formulate a thought and transmit it To add a sense of structure A sense of order You fear order Your kind The gentle hand tends the flock It is a kindess not a cruelty I wonder will you ever understand Your enemies do in their own way But they share your base heritage Their concept is flawed They are not worthy You have all proved unworthy of our gifts"


Well, I read something like that on the internet it was these 2 person talking with each other and while thinking that Erudito might team up with abstergo, at a later date, we can read (also in ac 4 multiplayer) that membre of erudito have been arested because of them (it was after a "hoodini bank thief" had stolen the money of many people of many countries while not keeping it (surely to delete it). My opinions about this is that they weren't talking about Juno, but about the theft.

You can read the conversations and news clippings here: http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Abstergo_Data
They're definitely talking about the face (ie Juno) and the bank thefts.

I guess we'll find out, in Rogue and/or Unity, what happened to Erudito. It's certainly possible that the Templars were offering a fake olive branch to draw Erudito out of hiding then.... BOOM arrest them and then interrogate them instead.

ERICATHERINE
10-22-2014, 08:06 PM
You can read the conversations and news clippings here: http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Abstergo_Data
They're definitely talking about the face (ie Juno) and the bank thefts.

I guess we'll find out, in Rogue and/or Unity, what happened to Erudito. It's certainly possible that the Templars were offering a fake olive branch to draw Erudito out of hiding then.... BOOM arrest them and then interrogate them instead.

Your link miss at least two thing :
#1 the conversation with Laeticia and the unknown person (that tell us that erudito might know something about de "ie Juno").
#2 the second Piece of the news (which says that erudito has been arrested for the houdini bank theft, doe to abstergo (and more precisely Laeticia)).

Ureh
10-22-2014, 08:12 PM
Those are there as well. Click on the tabs labeled "IM conversation" and "Phone transcript" and "Newspaper Cutting -11/29/13".

ERICATHERINE
10-22-2014, 08:23 PM
Those are there as well. Click on the tabs labeled "IM conversation" and "Phone transcript" and "Newspaper Cutting -11/29/13".

Ok sorry. I did not saw it the first time. ;-)

Radman500
10-22-2014, 09:58 PM
I don't think Juno and Aita would side with the Templars. Not unless it was part of their plan. In one of Juno's emails to Desmond, she said that the Templars are a perversion of her ideology.

Title: Improvements
Sent: Nov 13th, 2012; 18:21
To: D.Miles
"I have found a way to better control the impulses To formulate a thought and transmit it To add a sense of structure A sense of order You fear order Your kind The gentle hand tends the flock It is a kindess not a cruelty I wonder will you ever understand Your enemies do in their own way But they share your base heritage Their concept is flawed They are not worthy You have all proved unworthy of our gifts"



You can read the conversations and news clippings here: http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Abstergo_Data
They're definitely talking about the face (ie Juno) and the bank thefts.

I guess we'll find out, in Rogue and/or Unity, what happened to Erudito. It's certainly possible that the Templars were offering a fake olive branch to draw Erudito out of hiding then.... BOOM arrest them and then interrogate them instead.

im telling yall.....unity subtitle has something to do with the templars and assassins uniting to try and defeat juno...its only a coinicidence that the brahman novel mentions it at the end and then bam "assassins creed unity"

unity probably has a double meaning, the co-op but also juno

Radman500
10-23-2014, 04:52 AM
man i cant wait for this

hood3dassassin5
10-24-2014, 01:43 AM
Assassins: A bunch of ***holes that won't leave them alone
Templars: Godlike power they want for themselves

RA503
10-24-2014, 02:07 AM
I think that the ultimate objetive of the Templars are become First Civilization itself, like is said in abstergo files of revelations, but first they have to solve other things (control the rest of humankind,map the first civilization genome with the eve's blood).

Acrimonious_Nin
10-24-2014, 03:26 AM
The Assassins have all willingly obeyed the first civs regardless of what was asked of them. And the message was pretty up front.

1) Ezio was told to just sit their and listen to a message that could potentially influence the future. He only needed to put the apple down and still with his own curiosity and will obeyed and went on a killing spree to find the truth. To only find it when it was too late and everything had already been done.

2) Connor was told to fight off the Templars in order to protect the temple and the key. He obeyed only to be in a state of confusion of what had happened.

3) Clay was told the truth from Juno via bleeding effect. He told him the consequences and told him what needed to be done and convinced him with reason and truth, not force like the Templars. And he carried out Juno's request, with some retaliation, but still came to terms with the inevitable.

4) Desmond admitted, during his "possession from the apple" that, "there was a force their, but I didn't HAVE to, I CHOSE to." He consciously made the decision to follow through with a decision that would change the playing field, ever so slightly.

By the looks of it I would have to say that the Assassins are pretty ok with TWCB telling them what to do. Juno gives them the freedom to do as they please with no restrictions/force to make them do anything against their will. And in exchange for freedom they choose to productively carry out actions(killing Templars) that could change the "variables" that oppress the people from every truly actualizing their own purpose in their lives. The Assassins are ok with making the "choice to do what is right". Because in the end...It's just a choice, right? The Templars wish to stop people from ever being able to make choices that could endanger their own existence, but TWCB do not wish to destroy humanity out of their own intent unless needed...but then again they always have others to do the work like Assassins >_> just saying...

Radman500
10-24-2014, 04:08 AM
The Assassins have all willingly obeyed the first civs regardless of what was asked of them. And the message was pretty up front.

1) Ezio was told to just sit their and listen to a message that could potentially influence the future. He only needed to put the apple down and still with his own curiosity and will obeyed and went on a killing spree to find the truth. To only find it when it was too late and everything had already been done.

2) Connor was told to fight off the Templars in order to protect the temple and the key. He obeyed only to be in a state of confusion of what had happened.

3) Clay was told the truth from Juno via bleeding effect. He told him the consequences and told him what needed to be done and convinced him with reason and truth, not force like the Templars. And he carried out Juno's request, with some retaliation, but still came to terms with the inevitable.

4) Desmond admitted, during his "possession from the apple" that, "there was a force their, but I didn't HAVE to, I CHOSE to." He consciously made the decision to follow through with a decision that would change the playing field, ever so slightly.

By the looks of it I would have to say that the Assassins are pretty ok with TWCB telling them what to do. Juno gives them the freedom to do as they please with no restrictions/force to make them do anything against their will. And in exchange for freedom they choose to productively carry out actions(killing Templars) that could change the "variables" that oppress the people from every truly actualizing their own purpose in their lives. The Assassins are ok with making the "choice to do what is right". Because in the end...It's just a choice, right? The Templars wish to stop people from ever being able to make choices that could endanger their own existence, but TWCB do not wish to destroy humanity out of their own intent unless needed...but then again they always have others to do the work like Assassins >_> just saying...


are you saying that the TWCB would most likely ally with the Assassins over the Templars

but why, Templars want control and order,

Assassins want free will

TWCB wants humans to be slaves as they were originally created for by the TWCB...why would they choose the Assassins over the Templars

Acrimonious_Nin
10-24-2014, 06:34 AM
are you saying that the TWCB would most likely ally with the Assassins over the Templars

but why, Templars want control and order,

Assassins want free will

TWCB wants humans to be slaves as they were originally created for by the TWCB...why would they choose the Assassins over the Templars

TWCB will ally with no one but themselves. Would you ever ally with a tool in order to "defeat" anything ? No, because you use tools to achieve your ends. The Assassins have, for a time now, been the tools of TWCB to either

1) Deliver message like Ezio and Clay

2) Defend a zone or kill some people/Templars etc.

3) Leave certain Artifacts behind for future reasons...

Jupiter and Juno have both been known to have used the term "Cipher" to refer to humans/assassins...Jupiter has referred to Desmond as 'Cipher' and Juno referred to "us" as 'Cipher'


DEF - Cipher : a way of changing a message to keep it secret
: a person who has no power or is not important - http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/cipher

This definition fits the description of what the Assassins have been used for, by TWCB. Hiding messages or tools or artifacts. And just like Clay, Desmond, and Lucy, they have been 'thrown away' when there worth has run out. 3 lives toiled and lost anyone ? :p

some first civs have united in order to combat each other. I do not think they would ally with their own tools. In Brahman there is a group that wants both Assassins and Templars to unite in order to defeat Juno. Once again they are not getting their hands dirty nor allying with anyone other than other first civs; they are "suggesting an idea to the humans" because human behavior is controlled by human "thoughts" or the human "mind". Humans, as tools of physical labor, have to be used via the mind first in order to get something physical done. Juno talks about this in one of the solutions to "save the world" and goes on about making humans "believe" in something that ends up creating/removing "stuff" in the physical realm, but not before getting their minds to work; in this case getting them to believe in something before doing it. Which also shows they did not fully understand what humans were entirely. Which I talked about their "probable flaw" that has been talked about in the sticky notes, in another thread.(There is a reason why the 'chaos theory' symbol has been overly used throughout the series)

...Continuing with the "other formed groups" Juno has her "Instruments of the First Will" thing going on...

And there could be a 3rd group that has been formed, that have allowed "Eve to lead them". As it has been shown in AC:L

But all in all they have used humans/hybrids/assassins to do most of their work...>_> They rarely do it themselves. TWCB ally with no one but other TWCB. Do CEO's of companies "ally" with another company's "labor force" or do they find connections and cooperate with other CEO's ? do you see what I am saying here...The Templars being "big business" people and also trying to be TWCB are acting like them. Making a seperation of "us vs them". TWCB ally with other TWCB while Templars ally with other Templars in higher places, thus keeping their power and rule "over" others.

to put it bluntly humans were made to serve them, not to think for themselves entirely. TWCB have a will and humans obey. It's very simple. I wonder how Eve did it though o.O don't tell me that the apple cast an illusion of freedom that led to the first civ's demise because that would be funny that freedom is created from illusions/knowledge...then again. Assassins do tend to "chase butterflies" don't they ?

BTW we all know that the apple can do 2 main functions and that is to contain knowledge and cast illusions. Which in the truth you will see that TWCB are clearly using an apple that is controlling humans minds to make them work...physical work...>_>

In AC3 we see Juno telling Desmond about the solutions...Realize that TWCB are always portrayed as "managers" or "thinkers" of how to find solutions or govern over humans. Never the ones doing the "dirty" work.

Sooo...TL;DR TWCB will not most likely ally with the assassins...they will do what they have been doing...like anybody with tools/instruments do...using the tools to get "the job done", whatever that might mean...because clearly TWCB do not see eye to eye with each other.

P.S I also forgot to include that Minerva and Juno are obviously not on the same page with each other. So, yes they probably have their own problems to worry about the Assassin and Templars feud is a minor issue for them. They will not be allying with such a small insignificant specie's minuscule problems...>_>


"We saw the Nephilim there. We seemed like grasshoppers in our own eyes, and we looked the same to them."

Acrimonious_Nin
10-24-2014, 06:52 AM
If you took the time to revisit every encounter the assassins have had with TWCB you will notice that they have always tried to use the assassins to do something. Minerva was trying to use Desmond and the assassins to "finish" their work...I mean...If you were to look at it that way then you would see that TWCB "use", they do not "ally" with assassins ever. And to be honest...we really have never seen TWCB communicate with Templars...now have we...Even Juno was inside talking to Galina's mother in the animus...but we almost never see her using nor spreading information to or for Templars...so I highly doubt it...The Templars are just having a power trip, but they are in the same situation as assassins/humans...>_> they just seem to have not figured it out yet...maybe AC:Unity has so many different meanings that will only make sense once seeing the lore that this new title has to offer :P...

P.S the most likely reason that TWCB don't talk to Templars is because the Templars know the truth and have closed they minds off to any "suggestion"...The Assassins being naive and innocent about things are very open to many suggestions leaving their minds almost easy to use >_> but that is just my take on why we may have never seen TWCB communicate with Templars :p

Hans684
10-24-2014, 07:31 PM
If you took the time to revisit every encounter the assassins have had with TWCB you will notice that they have always tried to use the assassins to do something. Minerva was trying to use Desmond and the assassins to "finish" their work...I mean...If you were to look at it that way then you would see that TWCB "use", they do not "ally" with assassins ever. And to be honest...we really have never seen TWCB communicate with Templars...now have we...Even Juno was inside talking to Galina's mother in the animus...but we almost never see her using nor spreading information to or for Templars...so I highly doubt it...The Templars are just having a power trip, but they are in the same situation as assassins/humans...>_> they just seem to have not figured it out yet...maybe AC:Unity has so many different meanings that will only make sense once seeing the lore that this new title has to offer :P...

P.S the most likely reason that TWCB don't talk to Templars is because the Templars know the truth and have closed they minds off to any "suggestion"...The Assassins being naive and innocent about things are very open to many suggestions leaving their minds almost easy to use >_> but that is just my take on why we may have never seen TWCB communicate with Templars :p

I've always wondered why you favor Juno of all the factions in AC, why?

Is she useing you? :rolleyes::p

Acrimonious_Nin
10-24-2014, 09:22 PM
I've always wondered why you favor Juno of all the factions in AC, why?

Is she useing you? :rolleyes::p

lmao, no :D She just is very honest :P

Hans684
10-24-2014, 09:40 PM
lmao, no :D

It defiantly seems like you favor her course, like the constant edit becouse Juno.


She just is very honest :P

So you're an Assassin. :p

RA503
10-24-2014, 10:53 PM
Hi people I created this topic on the forum with a interesting theory about the series universe http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/937214-The-concept-of-Cosmic-Man-in-AC-mythology, but nobody posted in it I invited this cool guys who love the series lore to read and say what you though about it . iis rare a tread without response this make me sad :(

Acrimonious_Nin
10-25-2014, 05:17 AM
It defiantly seems like you favor her course, like the constant edit becouse Juno.


?! I do not understand...




So you're an Assassin. :p


Never said that >_> lol

M4ke_Off
05-22-2017, 03:49 AM
This is a 3 year old thread, and many might wonder why the bump

I am interested if the Templars believe they can surpass the Isu in technology, I was always interested in the ideological differences between the Assassins and Templars

I was going to make a similar thread, but stumbled on this