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View Full Version : Future AC Games should be like Mass Effect?



whereisantonio
03-17-2014, 07:45 AM
I was wondering if future AC games should try to be more like Mass Effect.

I had loved the concept of choosing what dialogues to say and the vast customisations.
But the main thing that Mass Effect stood out the most was that many of your actions and choices lead to change the story, so you can have a variation of endings, rather than all of us just doing different things to get to one plain of-course-that's-gonna-happen ending.

Any thoughts?

Templar_Az
03-17-2014, 07:51 AM
I would like there to be one main canon ending but alternate endings which are non-canon would be fun.

Consus_E
03-17-2014, 09:11 AM
Animus=no

Dome500
03-17-2014, 02:36 PM
I'm kinda undecided.

On the one hand having dialogue options and giving your own input and having different endings is cool.

But if you have a game like Assassins Creed that lets you "relive history" then those choices are very limited to your own character and are not supposed to effect any real historical events.
Also, we all need the same ending for the lore to be correct.

I just don't think it works. Every game has it's own story to tell, it's own moral code and it's own set of characters including the protagonist. Wouldn't we rob the series of one of it's elements by making the protagonists personality dependent on what the player wants to say and do?

After all every of those games should have it's own story and tell it's own messages. If you adjust the protagonists behavior to the character and choices of the player you basically unify all protagonists to one, because they all have a similar character (the one which is most similar to the players character).

I think it does just not work.

A game like Assassins Creed should best strive to be like the new Metal Gear Solid IMO (MGSV). MGSV is said to have an open world with lots of main and side missions. But the most important thing, and the thing I think is (are) important for the future AC titles is the following:

Create a game where freedom of approach in all missions is a requirement. Let the player choose how to deal with situations. Give him a vast array of tools and abilities and less restrictions then in the previous games and let him do what he can do best. Plan, Execute, Improvise (if necessary).

More Freedom, not only in Assassinations (though those are most important) but also in other main and side missions. Distance yourself from the concept of desynchronization if restrictions are not absolutely met and find another way to do it.

In MGSV the design idea is that if 100 players play the same mission that there are 100 ways to do that mission and every experience is unique. If Assassins Creed can even achieve only 1/16 of that in most main and side missions I would be happy.

Another thing they should take from MGSV (and Splinter Cell) is better Stealth mechanics and more tools to distract, stun, K.O. and Kill. The more tools and abilities you have (far ranged silent weapons, close ranged silent weapons, silent traps, Assassins to help you (not too many), distraction tools (like fire crackers or cherry bombs), whistling from hiding places or bushes, social stealth abilities, hiding behind corner, hiding in closet, manual crouching (as an example for a good addition), mid-distance silent weapons (like throwing knifes), etc, etc), the more ways there are to do a mission (if the A.I. and mechanics allow it and if the restrictions are not too strict), the more fun you will have in the end. (my opinion).

Build and improve on the stealth mechanics, the A.I. intelligence, the A.I. investigation phase, the A.I. reaction time (1 - 2 seconds of "shock" before they attack you and go in combat mode (example: Splinter Cell Blacklist)) and on the abilities and tools to use.

dxsxhxcx
03-17-2014, 03:06 PM
it's not gonna happen in the historical times because of how the animus work (but I wouldn't be surprised if they create an excuse in the future allowing that just for the sake of adding something new) and it's not gonna happen in the modern days because if they aren't capable of work with a linear story, imagine one with different outcomes based on the choices we make..

Sushiglutton
03-17-2014, 03:33 PM
This is obviously a matter of preferences, but personally I'm against adding RPG elements to AC. Dialogue options I find to be a quite contrived mechanic. More customization is not something I'm really interested in either. To me the core difference between an Action-Adventure game and an RPG is that the former focuses on what you can do and the latter focuses on who you can be. I find what you can do far more interesting, which is why I will always prefer the action-adventure genre.

For this reason the most important things to improve in AC imo are the gameplay mechanics.

Philliesfan377
03-17-2014, 03:39 PM
I'd rather the characters tell the story. Like Dome500 said, we would rob the series by making the character personality dependent on what the player chooses. Each Assassin has their story to tell and messages.

Fatal-Feit
03-17-2014, 05:12 PM
A modern day like Mass Effect, IMO. The protagonist can be us for all I care. All I wanted in AC:IV was some interaction and development with the world.

EVA Spartan 317
03-17-2014, 05:22 PM
NO, just NO!!!
NOOO!!! NOOOOO!!! No! Pls, no!

SixKeys
03-17-2014, 07:11 PM
If I wanted to play Mass Effect, I would play Mass Effect.

One of the biggest reasons I could never get into those games was the amount of dialogue. AC is more about atmosphere, immersing yourself in a historical world rather than creating your own character.

Plus, as someone pointed out, the Animus pretty much dictates this could never happen. You're not in control of your choices, you're watching the memories of an ancestor whose actions are set in stone.

STDlyMcStudpants
03-17-2014, 07:33 PM
NO
This is why no one is ever satisfied with a game.
They want it to be more like something else.
WHY oh WHYYY do gamers want clones out there and then cry when it happens?!
Assassins Creed has its own unique formula and shouldnt try to be anything but a better Assassins Creed.

GunnerGalactico
03-17-2014, 07:43 PM
NO
This is why no one is ever satisfied with a game.
They want it to be more like something else.
WHY oh WHYYY do gamers want clones out there and then cry when it happens?!
Assassins Creed has its own unique formula and shouldnt try to be anything but a better Assassins Creed.

Absolutely 100% agreed... why the hell would anyone suggest that... just NO! :nonchalance:


If I wanted to play Mass Effect, I would play Mass Effect.

One of the biggest reasons I could never get into those games was the amount of dialogue. AC is more about atmosphere, immersing yourself in a historical world rather than creating your own character.

Plus, as someone pointed out, the Animus pretty much dictates this could never happen. You're not in control of your choices, you're watching the memories of an ancestor whose actions are set in stone.

I wouldn't want the core elements of AC changed, that's what makes it a unique from other games.

Hans684
03-17-2014, 07:51 PM
http://cdn.grumpycats.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/Grumpy-Cat-01.jpg

Edit:

http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/822572-The-Substitute-for-The-Animus

http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/822574-Alternate-Possibilities

Both these threads sums how it can be possible, if you read everything.

Fatal-Feit
03-18-2014, 01:49 AM
NO
This is why no one is ever satisfied with a game.
They want it to be more like something else.
WHY oh WHYYY do gamers want clones out there and then cry when it happens?!
Assassins Creed has its own unique formula and shouldnt try to be anything but a better Assassins Creed.

Innovation is sometimes a step in the right direction for a franchise. Like how they turned AC into an RPG, action adventure, open world game through the Ezio Trilogy, lol. IMO, a Mass Effect iteration would work well in modern day.

TheHumanTowel
03-18-2014, 03:00 AM
Innovation is sometimes a step in the right direction for a franchise. Like how they turned AC into an RPG, action adventure, open world game through the Ezio Trilogy, lol. IMO, a Mass Effect iteration would work well in modern day.
The Ezio games aren't rpgs in like any way? Action adventure is a meaningless tag that can be applied to nearly every game, including AC1. And AC1 is already an open world game. Assassin's Creed has never been about choices and decisions affecting the story and it shouldn't start now. Especially when the modern day plot is still ongoing. You can't decide in the middle of a story player choice is suddenly going to become a thing.

STDlyMcStudpants
03-18-2014, 04:24 AM
Innovation is sometimes a step in the right direction for a franchise. Like how they turned AC into an RPG, action adventure, open world game through the Ezio Trilogy, lol. IMO, a Mass Effect iteration would work well in modern day.

Ubisoft didnt TURN Ac into anything...they took an engine in one of the most satisfying platformers (Prince of Persia) and put it into an action adventure open world fighter.... AC has and never will be an rpg.. an RPG needs a growth/leveling system of some sort like a skill tree
Assassins Creed is its own thing
Assassins Creed 2 is Assassins Creed 1 with simpler combat, cutscenes, the ability to swim, and a larger variety of missions
Assassins Creed 3 is Assassins Creed 2 with more organic worlds and a larger variety of missions
Assassins Creed 4 is assassins creed 1 with ships hahahahhahahaha
Point is - it isnt being turned into or incorporating elements from other games..its doing its own thing
Its like saying 'Like how they turned call of duty into a platformer with the ability to jump'

Fatal-Feit
03-18-2014, 05:40 AM
Ubisoft didnt TURN Ac into anything...they took an engine in one of the most satisfying platformers (Prince of Persia) and put it into an action adventure open world fighter.... AC has and never will be an rpg.. an RPG needs a growth/leveling system of some sort like a skill tree
Assassins Creed is its own thing
Assassins Creed 2 is Assassins Creed 1 with simpler combat, cutscenes, the ability to swim, and a larger variety of missions
Assassins Creed 3 is Assassins Creed 2 with more organic worlds and a larger variety of missions
Assassins Creed 4 is assassins creed 1 with ships hahahahhahahaha
Point is - it isnt being turned into or incorporating elements from other games..its doing its own thing
Its like saying 'Like how they turned call of duty into a platformer with the ability to jump'

Are you on stuff? You just said it yourself. AC took the Prince of Persia elements and made a game of its own.

Anyway, every game, even the Assassin's Creed franchise, borrows stuff from other games. Even ''stealth'' wasn't an Assassin's Creed exclusive.


The Ezio games aren't rpgs in like any way? Action adventure is a meaningless tag that can be applied to nearly every game, including AC1. And AC1 is already an open world game. Assassin's Creed has never been about choices and decisions affecting the story and it shouldn't start now. Especially when the modern day plot is still ongoing. You can't decide in the middle of a story player choice is suddenly going to become a thing.

In like, too many ways. Shops, quests, exploration, chests, loot, armor, inventory-equipment, customization, guilds, dungeons, health bar, variety of weapons, stats, quivers-pouches upgrades, training, etc. Naming stuff from the top of my head. Of course, AC isn't an RPG but it borrows A LOT of elements from them. You're right though, stealth games are basically action adventures, but the Ezio Trilogy weren't stealth. I'm referring to the constant action pact aspects they introduced. It felt more like an platforming action-adventure than a action-adventure stealth game. Regarding modern day, that's my opinion. Everyone has an ideal version of modern day and they're free to share it since it's all jumbled up now. Since modern day is said to be based on different ''yous'' and in different areas, giving players the option to choose between different choices in conversations or other interactions couldn't hurt. You don't exactly have to have choices like ''Let Juno take over your body'' or whatever, lol. Something subtle like being rude to Melanie and stuff would be pretty intriguing for me.

STDlyMcStudpants
03-18-2014, 05:46 AM
Are you on stuff? You just said it yourself. AC took the Prince of Persia elements and made a game of its own.

Anyway, every game, even the Assassin's Creed franchise, borrows stuff from other games. Even ''stealth'' wasn't an Assassin's Creed exclusive.
.
No..you misunderstand..thats the point IM trying to make - games take ingredients to make a formula..you dont add salt if salt didnt work to begin with! ;)
Why all of a sudden make AC a decision based game when its at its core a game about SYNCRONIZATION - aka lining up perfectly
Sometimes its better to let a book tell you their story....

Fatal-Feit
03-18-2014, 05:56 AM
No..you misunderstand..thats the point IM trying to make - games take ingredients to make a formula..you dont add salt if salt didnt work to begin with! ;)
Why all of a sudden make AC a decision based game when its at its core a game about SYNCRONIZATION - aka lining up perfectly
Sometimes its better to let a book tell you their story....

Well, you're obviously stepping over some contradicting points but I'll let it slide. Although your analogy is definitely not worth noting. Did you know that AC:IV's gamplay concept was based off ''The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker''? Assassin's Creed and sailing a ship in an open sea world was never something people would thought to have mixed. But guess what? It worked wonders. So yes, you do add salt if it means experimenting. :p

STDlyMcStudpants
03-18-2014, 06:15 AM
Well, you're obviously stepping over some contradicting points but I'll let it slide. Although your analogy is definitely not worth noting. Did you know that AC:IV's gamplay concept was based off ''The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker''? Assassin's Creed and sailing a ship in an open sea world was never something people would thought to have mixed. But guess what? It worked wonders. So yes, you do add salt if it means experimenting. :p

Or maybe it was based out of people in the 1700s that sailed ships? lol

Fatal-Feit
03-18-2014, 06:35 AM
Or maybe it was based out of people in the 1700s that sailed ships? lol

Gameplay. not story. But speaking of, Pirates and Assassin's Creed. Must be some tasty salt.

pirate1802
03-18-2014, 08:51 AM
What would that achieve? Adding dialogs, choices and stuff? :confused:

TheHumanTowel
03-18-2014, 01:07 PM
In like, too many ways. Shops, quests, exploration, chests, loot, armor, inventory-equipment, customization, guilds, dungeons, health bar, variety of weapons, stats, quivers-pouches upgrades, training, etc. Naming stuff from the top of my head. Of course, AC isn't an RPG but it borrows A LOT of elements from them.
Dude none of those are solely rpg elements. Guilds? Dungeons? A health bar!? Really? TIL simply having a dungeon in your game is exclusively an rpg element. If your talking about the tombs as well they're hardly dungeons.

GunnerGalactico
03-18-2014, 01:07 PM
What would that achieve? Adding dialogs, choices and stuff? :confused:

I'm also not keen on adding dialogues and choices. The Animus simply allows the players to experience the ancestor's memories and witness key events that occured and it works for AC. It just wouldn't be feasible to add choices of what dialogue to choose and stuff.

RinoTheBouncer
03-18-2014, 02:19 PM
I wish they do that with the end of the franchise or story arc. I mean as long as the next game is gonna choose one ending, then the choice of the previous game would be pointless. I would’ve loved to see ACIII do that thing. Save the world, let it burn. And latter games would just be self contained stories in both possibilities like one game comes out about humans in a destroyed world and others in a saved world..etc.

STDlyMcStudpants
03-18-2014, 08:07 PM
I wish they do that with the end of the franchise or story arc. I mean as long as the next game is gonna choose one ending, then the choice of the previous game would be pointless. I would’ve loved to see ACIII do that thing. Save the world, let it burn. And latter games would just be self contained stories in both possibilities like one game comes out about humans in a destroyed world and others in a saved world..etc.

NOW THAT is something I could get behind..not necessarily the story arc..just the end of the franchise..give us incentive to play the final game again and see how differently things pan out..like first couple of sequences are all the same, but depending on the choices or our interests in the modern day, it effects the parts of our protagonists life we see when we go back into the animus..like every sequence after 3 or 4 has a sub sequence...like for example our modern day character would either be on the 'ins' or 'outs' of abstergo (of course we played on the 'outs' in ac iv) but lets pretend somehow we had choices that got us on the ins..our character would then be more aggressive about finding the secrets edward carries to his grave in ACIV (A power hungry mindset) rather than the outs version where the secrets are in the background and we get his growth as a man story (the 'make a movie' for the company im working for mindset), and our endng wouldve been much more brutal..., it wouldnt conclude with
SPOILER going back to england- And then based on what you see is your decisn for the modern day end...
But that wont work in an in between game because it would just be too complicated having an artificial intelligence carry on knowing what your character has and hasnt seen