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AssassinHMS
10-26-2013, 02:51 PM
Am I the only one bugged by the fact you canít remove weapons in AC games?
I wouldnít be so pissed off if the games didnít force the player to buy or equip weapons and armor at some point but, unfortunately, they do.
And apparently AC 4 BF is no exception.
I do know that the player is forced to equip the blowpipe at some point in the game.
I do not own AC4 but, so far, people who have played the game, told me there is no way to remove weapons.
This means that once the player gets the blowpipe he wonít be able to remove it.

The way I see it, the option to remove gear shouldíve been available since AC2 and no game should ever force players to buy armor or weapons.
I personally donít like the blowpipe. I donít like it visually and it doesnít fit my play style since I prefer up-close assassinations with the hidden blade which offers more tension and challenge.

Besides, choosing what weapons the assassin carries should matter. Taking a crossbow and a sword at the same time should make the assassin too heavy to sprint and a lot noisier when attempting to sneak. This would encourage the player to think like an assassin as he would have to think carefully which gear he should take before an assassination mission. Not only that, but different weapons fit different play styles, for example:
. Those who would rather assassinate from a distance but donít want to be vulnerable in a combat situation would take a crossbow or a bow and a knife plus a few smoke bombs;
. Those who prefer more personal assassinations but want to kick *** in battles could take a heavy weapon in addition to the hidden blade and throwing knives;

Anyway, what I want to know is if you donít mind that the game forces you to carry certain weapons, in this case every weapon available, or if you want future AC games to give you the choice to only equip the gear that fits your play style.
I would also like to know if you like the idea I gave (weight limit and improved sound detection system).

Sushiglutton
10-26-2013, 03:16 PM
I am not bothered by the blowpipe in AC4. I was bothered by Ezio's crossbow and I didn't like the look when I accidently picked up swords/axes as Connor, so I can relate. I think the ability to easily enquip tools/weapons for aesthetic reasons would be neat.

I'm no fan of having to choose equipment a priori as there is no way to really know how missions will play out (which is a good thing). If you have to choose a subset of gadgets you will frequently get into situations like "oh this would be perfect for X, I wish I had it with me" which is not fun imo. Having access to everything all the time gives the most potential for creativity and to vary your approach.

I'm also not a fan of punishing the player for having a lot of equipment. This would basically not affect you at all, but only the weaker players. It's ok in a game like Dark Souls, but for AC I think it's too much.

roostersrule2
10-26-2013, 03:30 PM
I only care if it affects the way we look etc. like how Ezio's crossbow would clip through is cape, that was annoying as ****. Other then that I see no need to unequip weapons, especially when you don't know what type of mission is ahead of you and you can't really prepare for something that you don't know about.

AssassinHMS
10-26-2013, 03:30 PM
I am not bothered by the blowpipe in AC4. I was bothered by Ezio's crossbow and I didn't like the look when I accidently picked up swords/axes as Connor, so I can relate. I think the ability to easily enquip tools/weapons for aesthetic reasons would be neat.

I for one would like to be able to play an AC game with nothing but a hidden blade, 10 throwing knives and my skill.


I'm no fan of having to choose equipment a priori as there is no way to really know how missions will play out (which is a good thing). If you have to choose a subset of gadgets you will frequently get into situations like "oh this would be perfect for X, I wish I had it with me" which is not fun imo. Having access to everything all the time gives the most potential for creativity and to vary your approach.

Now, now. What do you do before an assassination mission? You investigate. You listen to rumurs in the streets, you stalk people that work for the target and beat them up for information and so on...
Besides, that is the point of replaying missions. If you didn't get everything right or if you want to approach a mission in a different way you replay it. If anything, my idea would add replayability.


I'm also not a fan of punishing the player for having a lot of equipment. This would basically not affect you at all, but only the weaker players. It's ok in a game like Dark Souls, but for AC I think it's too much.

You can see it as punishing the player or you can see it as a way to make choice matter and to spice things up. You can't have both. However "weaker" players shouldn't have any problem with this since they have their own play style too. Seriously, who needs all those weapons?
Actually this affects me a lot. This adds realism, improves immersion, makes me feel like my choices matter and shows that thinking like an assassin pays off.

AssassinHMS
10-26-2013, 03:33 PM
I only care if it affects the way we look etc. like how Ezio's crossbow would clip through is cape, that was annoying as ****. Other then that I see no need to unequip weapons, especially when you don't know what type of mission is ahead of you and you can't really prepare for something that you don't know about.

That is why investigation exists. Don't you want to feel like your choices matter?

roostersrule2
10-26-2013, 03:36 PM
That is why investigation exists. Don't you want to feel like your choices matter?I usually investigate with my eyes though, weapons don't really play a part.

pacmanate
10-26-2013, 03:46 PM
Well Ezios crossbow took up half his back so it was sometimes annoying and sometimes I wanted to unequip. The blowpipe takes up considerably less back space so it shouldnt be a problem.

However, I dont know why removing back weapons isnt in the game still. It shouldnt force us to carry it. Hell we should be able to go out completely weapon naked (minus Hidden Blades) if we want too.

AssassinHMS
10-26-2013, 03:47 PM
I usually investigate with my eyes though, weapons don't really play a part.

I'm talking about something like this: While investigating you hear a conversation between two guards where they say that, during their patrols, they usually spot, from a certain tower, the target meditating in a room. This means it should be easy to kill the target with a bow from that same tower.

dxsxhxcx
10-26-2013, 03:49 PM
IMO there's no reason to complicate something like this, I think a weight system would be kinda pointless in AC and wouldn't add much in terms of challenge or fun factor, I just want to be able to unequip weapons for an aesthetic purpose, IMO someone that doesn't look like a walking armory blends a lot better with the common citizens than someone with dozens of weapons on his belt screaming for attention, we are supposed to hide in plain sight but the way things are now the Assassin just stand out too much because of his weapons and basically being the only person in the city with a hood (that's why I also want the option to remove the hood whenever I want), just give us the option to equip/unequip our weapons in our hideout and I'll be happy...

thekyle0
10-26-2013, 04:19 PM
You're not alone.
http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/801706-Picking-up-weapons
http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/799676-Investigations-2-0

roostersrule2
10-26-2013, 04:20 PM
I'm talking about something like this: While investigating you hear a conversation between two guards where they say that, during their patrols, they usually spot, from a certain tower, the target meditating in a room. This means it should be easy to kill the target with a bow from that same tower.And what if you planned not to have a bow, instead you took two swords and your hidden blade? Like I said you can't prepare for something you don't know about.

AssassinHMS
10-26-2013, 04:27 PM
IMO there's no reason to complicate something like this, I think a weight system would be kinda pointless in AC and wouldn't add much in terms of challenge or fun factor,

Sure it isn't something too challenging but it would make people think twice before equiping every weapon available. Then again it would add challenge: if you where hidden in shadows and trying to pass by undetected fuilled with armor and weapons, you would need to walk very slowly. On the other hand, if you only carried essencial gear, then sneaking would only depend on your stealth skills.
How can this be pointless when it helps to achieve one of the main purposes of Assassin's Creed: to make the player feel and think like an assassin. Besides, it is a very simple feature.
I think it would be fun since, by restricting your equipment you would have to organize your gear and use any resource available in the mission to avoid wasting arrows, bullets, throwing knives or to simply craft equipment. It's like in zombie post apocalyptic games where you have to make every bullet count and manage your gear the best way you can. How is that not fun or challenging?


I just want to be able to unequip weapons for an aesthetic purpose, IMO someone that doesn't look like a walking armory blends a lot better with the common citizens than someone with dozens of weapons on his belt screaming for attention, we are supposed to hide in plain sight but the way things are now the Assassin just stand out too much because of his weapons and basically being the only person in the city with a hood (that's why I also want the option to remove the hood whenever I want), just give us the option to equip/unequip our weapons in our hideout and I'll be happy...

Exactly! Because it is unrealistic, because it breaks immersion. Do you think Ubisoft will hear us if we don't complain about this? People have spoken against these mandatory weapons and armor for a long time and so far we have been ignored. And guess what. If we don't complain loud enough Ubisoft will keep doing this for the next AC games.
So what do you think we will be forced to equip in AC5? A weapon? Armor?

AssassinHMS
10-26-2013, 04:31 PM
And what if you planned not to have a bow, instead you took two swords and your hidden blade? Like I said you can't prepare for something you don't know about.

You don't investigate and go straight to assassinate your target unless you choose to. You can allways go to your hideout change your weapons or simply ditch the ones you have in the middle of the street and buy new ones.
Besides I'm not saying that you can't complete those missions without specific weapons. Any mission can be completed using the hidden blade and nothing else. However certain missions are easier to complete if you take a bow with you. Anyway you can allways replay them and approach them in a different way.

Rugterwyper32
10-26-2013, 04:34 PM
I do agree about being able to unequip stuff for aesthetic purposes, but unless we get something similar to hardcore mode from New Vegas for the series (in this case, making weight limits an option and whatnot) I would prefer to keep things as they are and being able to carry everything at once if you want. You want to play calmly, go ahead and do it, you have normal mode, but you want an extra challenge you can go for hardcore mode. See, that'd work.

roostersrule2
10-26-2013, 04:36 PM
You don't investigate and go straight to assassinate your target unless you choose to. You can allways go to your hideout change your weapons or simply ditch the ones you have in the middle of the street and buy new ones.But how would I know what to assassinate my target with?

If it's better to use my bow to kill him and I didn't bring it I can't just go to a store and buy a bow.

AssassinHMS
10-26-2013, 04:53 PM
But how would I know what to assassinate my target with?

If it's better to use my bow to kill him and I didn't bring it I can't just go to a store and buy a bow.

So you didn't understand the example I gave you? If you read the post were I gave a specific situation in which you hear 2 guards talking to each other while you're investigating (you're not in the main assassination mission), you can understand from what they're saying that they can spot the target (inside a room through a window) from a certain tower. You also learn that the room where the target is, is used for meditation. This means that, if you can get to that tower, you should be able to spot the target (if it is meditating time). So, if you were to have a long range weapon you could probably kill the target from the tower instead of having to go all the way to that room (where the target is meditating) for a hidden blade kill.

Why can't you buy a bow? In other AC games you can buy armor that you already own or a crossbow even if you already have one.

AssassinHMS
10-26-2013, 04:57 PM
You're not alone.
http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/801706-Picking-up-weapons
http://forums.ubi.com/showthread.php/799676-Investigations-2-0

You are right, there are other people who want, more or less, the same thing. However, we are cleary not enough or else we would be able to remove weapons by now and AC games would focus on making the player feel like an assassin.

roostersrule2
10-26-2013, 05:20 PM
So you didn't understand the example I gave you? If you read the post were I gave a specific situation in which you hear 2 guards talking to each other while you're investigating (you're not in the main assassination mission), you can understand from what they're saying that they can spot the target (inside a room through a window) from a certain tower. You also learn that the room where the target is, is used for meditation. This means that, if you can get to that tower, you should be able to spot the target (if it is meditating time). So, if you were to have a long range weapon you could probably kill the target from the tower instead of having to go all the way to that room (where the target is meditating) for a hidden blade kill.

Why can't you buy a bow? In other AC games you can buy armor that you already own or a crossbow even if you already have one.So there's a specific mission just to tell you what weapons to use?

It'd be easier just to let us use every weapon.

AssassinHMS
10-26-2013, 05:36 PM
So there's a specific mission just to tell you what weapons to use?

It'd be easier just to let us use every weapon.

It doesn't need to be a specific mission. In AC1 you had to investigate in order to prepare yourself for the assassination missions. This is simply information that helps you complete the mission in the easiest way possible. The information could be as well about a broken window that you can use to slip inside.
It could also be a random event. Just by listening to random conversations between NPCs during free roam, the player can learn about the location of a templar which would unlock an assassination mission previously locked. Then you can decide to go strait to that location to complete the assassination mission or you can continue to gather information from the streets that may give you hints on easier ways to kill the target, alternate routes so that you can bypass guards, secret passages and so on.
Like I said before you would be able to complete any assassination mission using only the hidden blade and if, for some reason, you wish to try a different approach or to use different weapons you can always replay the mission. This adds replayability, immersion and encourages the player to think like an assassin.

roostersrule2
10-26-2013, 05:39 PM
It doesn't need to be a specific mission. In AC1 you had to investigate in order to prepare yourself for the assassination missions. This is simply information that helps you complete the mission in the easiest way possible. The information could be as well about a broken window that you can use to slip inside.
It could also be a random event. Just by listening to random conversations between NPCs during free roam, the player can learn about the location of a templar which would unlock an assassination mission previously locked. Then you can decide to go strait to that location to complete the assassination mission or you can continue to gather information from the streets that may give you hints on easier ways to kill the target, alternate routes so that you can bypass guards, secret passages and so on.
Like I said before you would be able to complete any assassination mission using only the hidden blade and if, for some reason, you wish to try a different approach or to use different weapons you can always replay the mission. This adds replayability, immersion and encourages the player to think like an assassin.I never used the info from the AC1 investigations, I didn't need too.

What if you didn't encounter that random event though what would you do then?

Now it just sound like mission constraints that aren't optional and if people hate them when they are optional they'll loathe them when they aren't.

Sturnz0r
10-26-2013, 06:03 PM
you have the choice and Freedom to use or not use whichever weapon you desire.

thekyle0
10-26-2013, 06:12 PM
You are right, there are other people who want, more or less, the same thing. However, we are cleary not enough or else we would be able to remove weapons by now and AC games would focus on making the player feel like an assassin.
It's never been about numbers. Ubisoft just doesn't listen. How many people complained about the game being too easy since AC1? Until now they've done nothing to address these complaints. Worse yet, initial impressions seem to be that the steps they've taken are still inadequate.

Even when they try to use player feedback it takes 2-3 years to manifest itself in the game in any meaningful way due to the staggered production model they run with.

Sturnz0r
10-26-2013, 06:49 PM
It's never been about numbers. Ubisoft just doesn't listen. How many people complained about the game being too easy since AC1? Until now they've done nothing to address these complaints. Worse yet, initial impressions seem to be that the steps they've taken are still inadequate.

Even when they try to use player feedback it takes 2-3 years to manifest itself in the game in any meaningful way due to the staggered production model they run with.

Combat is the same, he just takes more damage from musket and brute-axe.. but if you are like most of us and you hardly get hit, it is irrelevant.

And then they complained in AC3 the guard AI was too difficult (more of the assassinated ragdoll problem, but I thought it was challenging), and now you can pretty much ghost levels by going from stalk zone to stalk zone in plain site, and evade them in chase a lot more easily.

pretty much; this community complains that it is too easy, then they finally fix it; then this fine community decides they overcompensated. The stealth and fighting have flip-flopped in that regard

bottom line could be that: this game is a no-lose easy-difficulty game and probably always will be; it sells better that way. The beauty is how you play the game. That's where the optional objectives come in, to easily make the game more difficult without creating difficulty modes. maybe difficulty modes come next game (recruit / Assassin / Master Assassin)

Landruner
10-26-2013, 07:34 PM
Am I the only one bugged by the fact you can’t remove weapons in AC games?
I wouldn’t be so pissed off if the games didn’t force the player to buy or equip weapons and armor at some point but, unfortunately, they do.
And apparently AC 4 BF is no exception.
I do know that the player is forced to equip the blowpipe at some point in the game.
I do not own AC4 but, so far, people who have played the game, told me there is no way to remove weapons.
This means that once the player gets the blowpipe he won’t be able to remove it.

The way I see it, the option to remove gear should’ve been available since AC2 and no game should ever force players to buy armor or weapons.
I personally don’t like the blowpipe. I don’t like it visually and it doesn’t fit my play style since I prefer up-close assassinations with the hidden blade which offers more tension and challenge.

Besides, choosing what weapons the assassin carries should matter. Taking a crossbow and a sword at the same time should make the assassin too heavy to sprint and a lot noisier when attempting to sneak. This would encourage the player to think like an assassin as he would have to think carefully which gear he should take before an assassination mission. Not only that, but different weapons fit different play styles, for example:
. Those who would rather assassinate from a distance but don’t want to be vulnerable in a combat situation would take a crossbow or a bow and a knife plus a few smoke bombs;
. Those who prefer more personal assassinations but want to kick *** in battles could take a heavy weapon in addition to the hidden blade and throwing knives;

Anyway, what I want to know is if you don’t mind that the game forces you to carry certain weapons, in this case every weapon available, or if you want future AC games to give you the choice to only equip the gear that fits your play style.
I would also like to know if you like the idea I gave (weight limit and improved sound detection system).

Here we are again - It is what I wrong in my thread & poll 4 days ago & I agree with you - I don not understand after all the requests we made since AC2 that the player CAN'T chooses his/her OWN weapon by switching the slot in its menu inventory?

Same question you mention there:

Why instead of removing weapons they don't improve them for some Assassin weapons corresponding to the character and period (Take the medieval crossbow turn it as pistol/crossbow for instance, but why removing it?) and let the player to use it IF he/she CHOOSES TO) - Let the Choice of Gear & Outfits pieces/ Weapons.... I don't get it.

A lot of friends that play the game, thought that the Blow-pipe was cool but ridiculous and annoying because of his location on the character, and wished to have it on another location of their character and having another weapon such a Sword, Bow, musket, crossbow or Nothing at all instead of having the blow-pipe there.

PS: I like your suggestion about the balance in picking weapons, but I believe with AC4 configuration of the gameplay mechanics, it will difficult to implant without some heavy re-script...

x___Luffy___x
10-26-2013, 07:42 PM
i would love to have an option to choose the weapons you want to equip or unequip. there should be an option for this. there is so much customization in game so why not this.

in ezio games the one thing i hated was the armor. they forced us to wear an armor part otherwise you can't continue the story. it was stupid.

pacmanate
10-26-2013, 07:43 PM
Choice and Freedom = NO 100% sync objectives. Its obvious to us, but to the devs? How else will they flesh out the "It will take *insert hours* time to 100% the game".?

AssassinHMS
10-26-2013, 09:17 PM
Thank you for all your replies. So far I can see that most want the freedom to choose what weapons and equipment we want to carry. This really matters a lot to me as I’m very picky about this. All I wanted from the start was to be a blade in a crowd and never a tank in a crowd.
I don’t know how to reach out to Ubisoft so, if you have any idea and are willing to help I would really appreciate it.



What if you didn't encounter that random event though what would you do then?
The whole assassination is a side mission that is triggered/unlocked by a random event. Let’s say you have 50 locked assassination missions in a certain city (London for example). If you want to unlock those assassination missions you need to search the streets, listen to random conversations, tail people who appear to be misplaced (someone who wears expensive clothes; that has a strange look…). By doing any of these random events you will gain information and learn the location of your target unlocking an assassination mission but you will also learn the location of other investigation targets that can be viewed on the map. Then you can continue to investigate by doing the investigation missions or go straight to the assassination mission.


Now it just sound like mission constraints that aren't optional and if people hate them when they are optional they'll loathe them when they aren't.
No these aren’t optional objectives. They are other ways to complete the mission, easier ways that can only be learned by investigating. It is, more or less, the same thing as in Dishonored where you have multiple paths and ways to kill a target. This adds replay value and allows you to complete the mission according to your play style.



It's never been about numbers. Ubisoft just doesn't listen. How many people complained about the game being too easy since AC1? Until now they've done nothing to address these complaints. Worse yet, initial impressions seem to be that the steps they've taken are still inadequate.
Even when they try to use player feedback it takes 2-3 years to manifest itself in the game in any meaningful way due to the staggered production model they run with.
I rightfully don’t understand Ubisoft. Any company should know that the key to success is listening to fans, especially to older fans, otherwise they won’t last very long. This is why I hate games with big budgets and big audience.



Here we are again - It is what I wrong in my thread & poll 4 days ago & I agree with you - I don not understand after all the requests we made since AC2 that the player CAN'T chooses his/her OWN weapon by switching the slot in its menu inventory?
I liked your thread. I just made this one to focus on some other points and to show my discontent with the game forcing players to use a blowpipe.



Same question you mention there:
Why instead of removing weapons they don't improve them for some Assassin weapons corresponding to the character and period (Take the medieval crossbow turn it as pistol/crossbow for instance, but why removing it?) and let the player to use it IF he/she CHOOSES TO) - Let the Choice of Gear & Outfits pieces/ Weapons.... I don't get it.

A lot of friends that play the game, thought that the Blow-pipe was cool but ridiculous and annoying because of his location on the character, and wished to have it on another location of their character and having another weapon such a Sword, Bow, musket, crossbow or Nothing at all instead of having the blow-pipe there.

PS: I like your suggestion about the balance in picking weapons, but I believe with AC4 configuration of the gameplay mechanics, it will difficult to implant without some heavy re-script...
I completely agree. Ubisoft should work on these details before adding anything else because this is what the franchise needs, not some underwater or naval gameplay (leave that until you get the rest right Ubibisoft)


i would love to have an option to choose the weapons you want to equip or unequip. there should be an option for this. there is so much customization in game so why not this.

in ezio games the one thing i hated was the armor. they forced us to wear an armor part otherwise you can't continue the story. it was stupid.
1000 times this! I hated the Roman spaulders. I really felt like Ubisoft was mocking me: “so you want this awesome outfit we display everywhere, even in the game’s cover? Then take these Roman Spaulders instead and forget all about the twin hidden blades. And by the way you also get this annoying cape that Ezio is constantly shoving over the shoulder for some reason.”


Choice and Freedom = NO 100% sync objectives. Its obvious to us, but to the devs? How else will they flesh out the "It will take *insert hours* time to 100% the game".?
They could make optional objectives that weren’t so specific. For example: “Remain undetected for the majority of the mission.” or “Don’t kill anyone other than the main target.”

pacmanate
10-26-2013, 09:24 PM
They could make optional objectives that weren’t so specific. For example: “Remain undetected for the majority of the mission.” or “Don’t kill anyone other than the main target.”

That would just be repetitive though

AssassinHMS
10-26-2013, 09:32 PM
That would just be repetitive though

Or don't make optional objectives at all? They could be more varied. Certain missions could have traps that can be used to incapacitate or elude guards and the optional objectives could be about them.
But personaly I don't like optional objectives.

Landruner
10-26-2013, 09:33 PM
@AssassinHMS : I am with you, but that had been since E3 2011, interviews & pieces of advices, twitter discussions, reviews, letter requests that some of us tried to convince the each creative director of each AC franchise to do include that, and nothing had been done, so...?

PS: You have to consider also that such changes like that are going to be hard to re-script for the gameplay of AC4 like it is set, and some of what we mention above could involve of lot of Data and involve them to have re-script part of the gameplay + the new Character's animation, and so on - So, we cannot ask then to request that by a patch or updates, but however: perhaps for a DLC?

Here is a link bellow of a picture of what a crossbow could be in AC4 in using same mesh/texture/ animation script that the pistol animation for Edward
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1c/Crossbow_pistol_IMG_3841.jpg

also it could be a wrist Crossbow, but it is more complicated to render with the in game Edward animation.

AssassinHMS
10-26-2013, 09:37 PM
@AssassinHMS : I am with you, but that had been since E3 2011, interviews & pieces of advices, twitter discussions, reviews, letter requests that some of us tried to convince the each creative director of each AC franchise to do include that, and nothing had been done, so...?

But surely there must be something we can do. We have the right to demand Ubisoft to listen to us. After all we were the ones that allowed the start of the franchise.

Sushiglutton
10-26-2013, 09:43 PM
Now, now. What do you do before an assassination mission? You investigate. You listen to rumurs in the streets, you stalk people that work for the target and beat them up for information and so on...
Besides, that is the point of replaying missions. If you didn't get everything right or if you want to approach a mission in a different way you replay it. If anything, my idea would add replayability.

That would mean we found out everything during the preperation. I mean stuff like "a guard will walk under a tree so I can do a ropedart execution". There need to be some suprises in the missions even if they bring back the investigation system. I don't think you would add replayability by removing some of the possible strategies on the first run. Even if you have all the tools on every playthrough you can still go back and play a different style.



You can see it as punishing the player or you can see it as a way to make choice matter and to spice things up. You can't have both. However "weaker" players shouldn't have any problem with this since they have their own play style too. Seriously, who needs all those weapons?
Actually this affects me a lot. This adds realism, improves immersion, makes me feel like my choices matter and shows that thinking like an assassin pays off.

I just don't think that making the assassin clumsy depending on carrying some gear is a good idea. I agree they should not have too many weapon, but Edwards loadup seems fime to me. If he would get slower, noicier from carrying swords I think that would be disturbing.

thekyle0
10-26-2013, 09:53 PM
Combat is the same, he just takes more damage from musket and brute-axe.. but if you are like most of us and you hardly get hit, it is irrelevant.
That would be why I said the steps they've taken are inadequate.


And then they complained in AC3 the guard AI was too difficult (more of the assassinated ragdoll problem, but I thought it was challenging), and now you can pretty much ghost levels by going from stalk zone to stalk zone in plain site, and evade them in chase a lot more easily.

pretty much; this community complains that it is too easy, then they finally fix it; then this fine community decides they overcompensated. The stealth and fighting have flip-flopped in that regard.
The difficulty of using stealth in AC3 was not because the mechanics were hard to use, but that they were not often available. This is a problem of designing controlling levels. It was also an issue of detection not working intuitively. If you know how to manipulate the AI then stealth becomes easy, but the rules didn't always make sense, and the players had to put themselves in an altered state of reasoning than they would in any real situation.

AssassinHMS
10-26-2013, 10:05 PM
That would mean we found out everything during the preperation. I mean stuff like "a guard will walk under a tree so I can do a ropedart execution". There need to be some suprises in the missions even if they bring back the investigation system.

No. We only find out certain aspects of the mission as is the point of investigating but surprises can be anywhere. Who knows if you won't find the target's secret diary in his bedroom or if there are dogs that may alert guards to your presence? These investigations are optional and exist to make certain aspects of the mission easier, not to spoil the fun.



I don't think you would add replayability by removing some of the possible strategies on the first run. Even if you have all the tools on every playthrough you can still go back and play a different style.


If you have all the gear with you then you can do everything available. However if there is a wall that can be scaled with a claw or a roof that is only accessible by using a rope arrow then you have to replay the mission to make sure you take that equipment the next time. Besides if you can use any weapon then you can use them according to each situation but if your equipment is confined then your options to approach each situation are confined as well requiring another play through with different weapons to approach them differently.




I just don't think that making the assassin clumsy depending on carrying some gear is a good idea. I agree they should not have too many weapon, but Edwards loadup seems fime to me. If he would get slower, noicier from carrying swords I think that would be disturbing.

No no. Carring swords alone wouldn't make much difference. But if the player carries a number of weapons that is above a certain weight, then there will be a noticeable difference (like a crossbow and a sword). A blowpipe is lighter than a bow so Edward's layout is only slightly above the limit (due to the four pistols plus all the rest) although he wouldn't make much noise but he would be a little slower and not so light on his feet.

Landruner
10-26-2013, 10:20 PM
But surely there must be something we can do. We have the right to demand Ubisoft to listen to us. After all we were the ones that allowed the start of the franchise.

Yes technically...you are right, but my point was since they got reviewers telling them that and they don't care...I donno?
BTW: Go back to my previous reply before that one, I put you a link with a picture of a pistol/crossbow that can't be easy to tweek in using the same in game data for Edward.

Landruner
10-26-2013, 10:25 PM
But surely there must be something we can do. We have the right to demand Ubisoft to listen to us. After all we were the ones that allowed the start of the franchise.
Technically you are right, but they have been a lot of request including reviewers so I dono?

Here is a link bellow of what I meant by New crossbow that could be easy to tweek in using Edward script for his pistol(s).

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1c/Crossbow_pistol_IMG_3841.jpg

AssassinHMS
10-26-2013, 11:02 PM
PS: You have to consider also that such changes like that are going to be hard to re-script for the gameplay of AC4 like it is set, and some of what we mention above could involve of lot of Data and involve them to have re-script part of the gameplay + the new Character's animation, and so on - So, we cannot ask then to request that by a patch or updates, but however: perhaps for a DLC?
Yeah I don’t expect them to be able to patch something like that. However I will find unacceptable if AC5 still doesn’t let the player to remove weapons which I’m pretty sure it won’t unless we stand up and demand Ubisoft to hear us.


Here is a link bellow of a picture of what a crossbow could be in AC4 in using same mesh/texture/ animation script that the pistol animation for Edward
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1c/Crossbow_pistol_IMG_3841.jpg
also it could be a wrist Crossbow, but it is more complicated to render with the in game Edward animation.
Yeah but I doubt Ubisoft will include that in AC4. Although I agree with you, there should be more assassin weapons other than the hidden blade (though all of them should be removable).


Technically you are right, but they have been a lot of request including reviewers so I dono?
Maybe, but this forum exists for the developers to listen to their fans, right?

Sushiglutton
10-26-2013, 11:40 PM
No. We only find out certain aspects of the mission as is the point of investigating but surprises can be anywhere. Who knows if you won't find the target's secret diary in his bedroom or if there are dogs that may alert guards to your presence? These investigations are optional and exist to make certain aspects of the mission easier, not to spoil the fun.

My point is that IF we know exactly what gadgets we want to use in the mission, then we have to know so much about it that it spoils the fun. I understand that's not how you want the assassinations to be. But that means we will run into the "gosh I wish I had that tool now"-type situations frequently.



If you have all the gear with you then you can do everything available. However if there is a wall that can be scaled with a claw or a roof that is only accessible by using a rope arrow then you have to replay the mission to make sure you take that equipment the next time. Besides if you can use any weapon then you can use them according to each situation but if your equipment is confined then your options to approach each situation are confined as well requiring another play through with different weapons to approach them differently.

Well if you can enter a building either from the roof (with some gadget) or by the window (using something else) then you have to chose either one even if you have all gadgets. Similarily you can only kill your target with one weapon no matter how many you carry. Next time you can choose the opposite approach/weapon. I have absolutely nothing against multiple routes, on the contrary. I prefer if the options are open on the fly and not decided when you pick your equipment at the den however.

I also think it would be tedious in the sandbox gameplay to run back and forth to your hideout to switch gear.



No no. Carring swords alone wouldn't make much difference. But if the player carries a number of weapons that is above a certain weight, then there will be a noticeable difference (like a crossbow and a sword). A blowpipe is lighter than a bow so Edward's layout is only slightly above the limit (due to the four pistols plus all the rest) although he wouldn't make much noise but he would be a little slower and not so light on his feet.

I would prefer if they had one parkour system that they nailed over having several based on the weight of the character.


Like I've said before I respect your opinion. You are correct that your way would be more realistic and I can understand why you would find it more immersive. For me the price is too high though. It's annoying in missions and tedious in sandbox gameplay to not have all your gadgets with you. Gimping parkour depending on gear is also not something I want. I think the best solution is to give the assassin a reasonable amount of weapons and gear in the first place. I feel this is what the devs have done for AC4.

AssassinHMS
10-27-2013, 12:15 AM
My point is that IF we know exactly what gadgets we want to use in the mission, then we have to know so much about it that it spoils the fun. I understand that's not how you want the assassinations to be.

I never said we knew excatly what gadgets we want to use in the mission. That was an assumption you made. That doesn't mean however that some information you pick up from investigation can't be about that.


But that means we will run into the "gosh I wish I had that tool now"-type situations frequently.

Far from that. Like I said you can choose your equipment. A melee weapon (swords, axes, knives...), a ranged weapon (trowing knives, crossbow, bow, blowpipe, guns...) and gear (claw, arrows, bombs, darts, bullets...) so the player can always have a tool of every kind. The only situations where I could see that happening would be when the target is at a long distance that throwing knives can't cover so the player would be froced to get closer. Then again that has to do with the play style. If you like to kill targets from a distance then you should take a bow but if you prefer up-close assassinations then you might save that space for something else. Taking a bow means that the player won't have to worry if he finds a perfect place to eliminate the target from a distance, however all he can take for combat is a knife without surpassing the weight limit. This means there are allways ups and downs that the player should choose according to his/her playstyle.



Well if you can enter a building either from the roof (with some gadget) or by the window (using something else) then you have to chose either one even if you have all gadgets. Similarily you can only kill your target with one weapon no matter how many you carry. Next time you can choose the opposite approach/weapon. I have absolutely nothing against multiple routes, on the contrary. I prefer if the options are open on the fly and not decided when you pick your equipment at the den however.

Yeah I agree. I think to correct that, the gear you need to perform those operations should be very light and a must own if you want to make sure you can take any route. I would also like to say that, in Thief, there are specific tools, that unlock different routes, which need to be bought or else the player won't be able to take full advantage of the world.


I also think it would be tedious in the sandbox gameplay to run back and forth to your hideout to switch gear.

You can buy and choose your gear in stores, so no need to run back and forth.

Landruner
10-27-2013, 11:20 AM
@AssassinHMS - Why don't you make another threat with a pole with right question is order to see, if some people could be interested on that Forum? Just to get a feeling about it - I messed up with that point with my pole 4 days ago, and I am not sure I pass the message I wanted to.

AssassinHMS
10-27-2013, 11:40 AM
@AssassinHMS - Why don't you make another threat with a pole with right question is order to see, if some people could be interested on that Forum? Just to get a feeling about it - I messed up with that point with my pole 4 days ago, and I am not sure I pass the message I wanted to.

Ok. But what do you want me to make the poll about? Is it the ability to choose what weapons and gear the assassin caries?
Perhaps there is a way to edit this thread and turn it into a poll so that we don't have to make a new one...though I'm not sure how.

Edit: I already found out how to add a poll. Could you give me an example of the options you would like to see?

Crazy_Vantage
10-27-2013, 12:52 PM
I agree with OP on this but I also don't think it's a huge issue unless there are sequences which really do require the use of certain items. Sometimes that's okay, like when introducing you to it, or when you need to nonlethally take down someone, that makes sense. And in the more open missions you can just choose to not use certain weapons, even if it annoys you a little that you can still see them.

AssassinHMS
10-27-2013, 02:17 PM
So I thought this thread could use a poll. Feel free to share your opinions.

AssassinHMS
10-27-2013, 02:55 PM
I agree with OP on this but I also don't think it's a huge issue unless there are sequences which really do require the use of certain items. Sometimes that's okay, like when introducing you to it, or when you need to nonlethally take down someone, that makes sense. And in the more open missions you can just choose to not use certain weapons, even if it annoys you a little that you can still see them.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I understand your point but I just want to say that, to me, it's not simply a matter of seeing certain, visually undesirable, weapons. Edward, for example, has swords, guns and a blowpipe in addition to the hidden blades and I think it is just too much. I would like to remove the blowpipe and the swords, not only because I don't like them visually, but due to the fact that it should be impossible for him to blend with citizens which breaks immersion for me. Also, it feels like I'm in the shoes of a walking tank and not of a nimble, skillful assassin. Finally I don't need swords or a blowpipe due to my play style. My weapons of choice are the hidden blade, a knife, a bow (not Connor's though), throwing knives and smoke bombs. These are the weapons I use the most, that fit the way I play and yet I don't want to carry them all at the same time. I don't want to take two weapons of each kind (like a bow and throwing knives) because I only take what I need. If you played Resident Evil 4, you know we had to choose our equipment wisely or else we would fill our inventory with unnecessary gear. This is what I want: resource management and feel like my choices matter (that by taking only what I need my assassin will be lighter making less noise and moving faster).

Another example of this could be the Assassin recruits in ACR. Each had a specialty. I think all of them had a hidden blade but some specialized themselves in long/small range kills (crossbow or throwing knives), others were specialized in combat (swords, axes…) and I think all of them had stealth tools (smoke bombs, poison darts…).
My specialty is close or distant assassinations which means I take one of these two sets:
- A bow/crossbow for long distance kills along with the hidden blade for up-close kills and smoke bombs in case I find myself in a bind;
- The hidden blade for up-close kills, a knife in case I’m forced to fight and throwing knives to quickly eliminate archers or multiple enemies at once.
This is my play style and I do know other people have theirs (like taking a sword and a blowpipe or a heavy weapon and pistols) and this feature would let the player customize their experience and be whatever type of assassin they want. A weight limit and an improved noise detection system would also reward those who take their time to choose their gear while making the player feel that his/her choices matter.

Landruner
10-27-2013, 02:57 PM
So I thought this thread could use a poll. Feel free to share your opinions.

I saw you edited your thread that is perfect - Good questions. :D , feel free to PM anytime you want to.

Rugterwyper32
10-27-2013, 03:09 PM
Here are two ways I see of going about it: An optional mode like New Vegas hardcore mode which adds the weapon management element among other things (not sure which so far, but I'd make a "if you have too much gear you can't swim" parameter or something), OR

You mentioned RE4. Well, in RE4, if you played with the small case throughout the game, you could just stick to the basic pistol, shotgun and rifle and limited ammo. It was possible to go around with it all the way to the end with good management. However, if you had gotten enough money, later during the game you could get the XL case which could basically allow you to be a walking tank anyway. I tended to carry my main 4 weapons (Blacktail, Riot Gun, Semi-Auto Sniper and Broken Butterfly) plus a mine thrower (that ammo gives you good money and it can be useful), lots of grenades, ammo and healing items and the infrared scope. So if you added that, I think that could be a possible solution for both ends. Players who like being armed to the teeth could do that, but they'd have to earn it. Make it upgrades that you need to put effort on getting.

Now, I didn't agree with you on clunkier freerunning, I'd prefer just one system that works well (unless, again, this was a "hardcore mode" case), but management of your stuff can work. A player who wants challenge can keep the basic setup and not get upgrades for it, but if you want to get the upgrades, you have to put effort into it.

Landruner
10-27-2013, 03:39 PM
Here are two ways I see of going about it: An optional mode like New Vegas hardcore mode which adds the weapon management element among other things (not sure which so far, but I'd make a "if you have too much gear you can't swim" parameter or something), OR

You mentioned RE4. Well, in RE4, if you played with the small case throughout the game, you could just stick to the basic pistol, shotgun and rifle and limited ammo. It was possible to go around with it all the way to the end with good management. However, if you had gotten enough money, later during the game you could get the XL case which could basically allow you to be a walking tank anyway. I tended to carry my main 4 weapons (Blacktail, Riot Gun, Semi-Auto Sniper and Broken Butterfly) plus a mine thrower (that ammo gives you good money and it can be useful), lots of grenades, ammo and healing items and the infrared scope. So if you added that, I think that could be a possible solution for both ends. Players who like being armed to the teeth could do that, but they'd have to earn it. Make it upgrades that you need to put effort on getting.

Now, I didn't agree with you on clunkier freerunning, I'd prefer just one system that works well (unless, again, this was a "hardcore mode" case), but management of your stuff can work. A player who wants challenge can keep the basic setup and not get upgrades for it, but if you want to get the upgrades, you have to put effort into it.

Cool ideas but that it only can be use for another AC since those idea will imply to re-work on the script, the physics and a lot of different stuff. For AC4 so far, if they can make that inventory system with optional ability to remove weapon and gear that would be cool. But you may suggest those idea for one of the next AC

Rugterwyper32
10-27-2013, 03:51 PM
Cool ideas but that it only can be use for another AC since those idea will imply to re-work on the script, the physics and a lot of different stuff. For AC4 so far, if they can make that inventory system with optional ability to remove weapon and gear that would be cool. But you may suggest those idea for one of the next AC

This is more thinking about the future of the series, admittedly. I know nothing about that can be done for AC4, but I agree it's possible for future games. So we'll see how that goes.

AssassinHMS
10-27-2013, 04:01 PM
I saw you edited your thread that is perfect - Good questions. :D , feel free to PM anytime you want to.
Ok. Thanks! I’m glad you like the questions.




Here are two ways I see of going about it: An optional mode like New Vegas hardcore mode which adds the weapon management element among other things (not sure which so far, but I'd make a "if you have too much gear you can't swim" parameter or something), OR
You mentioned RE4. Well, in RE4, if you played with the small case throughout the game, you could just stick to the basic pistol, shotgun and rifle and limited ammo. It was possible to go around with it all the way to the end with good management. However, if you had gotten enough money, later during the game you could get the XL case which could basically allow you to be a walking tank anyway. I tended to carry my main 4 weapons (Blacktail, Riot Gun, Semi-Auto Sniper and Broken Butterfly) plus a mine thrower (that ammo gives you good money and it can be useful), lots of grenades, ammo and healing items and the infrared scope. So if you added that, I think that could be a possible solution for both ends. Players who like being armed to the teeth could do that, but they'd have to earn it. Make it upgrades that you need to put effort on getting.
I like the second a lot. Yes, in RE4, once you had enough money you could buy a larger case but to get to that point you would still have to face most of the game with low ammunition and a ton of decisions to make about equipment management. But I like your idea. If players want to take every weapon and be a walking tank then they have to earn it (Just realized that I, inadvertently, copied your sentence). However I don’t think this feature is so hardcore that it needs a separate mode. It is meant to be enjoyable and not hard.


Now, I didn't agree with you on clunkier freerunning, I'd prefer just one system that works well (unless, again, this was a "hardcore mode" case), but management of your stuff can work. A player who wants challenge can keep the basic setup and not get upgrades for it, but if you want to get the upgrades, you have to put effort into it.
It’s not really chunkier. Do you remember the jogging ability, from Ac games previous to AC3, which was triggered simply by pressing R1 (PS3 controls). If a player carries swords, pistols and a bow, then the assassin, while able to jog, won’t be able to sprint (holding R1 and x simultaneously). But if the player is only slightly above the weight limit then the assassin will be able to sprint but not at full speed. So there is no need to change the freerunning as it is simply a matter of depriving players, under those conditions, from certain freerunning speed levels and making it louder.

x___Luffy___x
10-27-2013, 04:16 PM
there should be just an option for removing too. whether someone wants to use it or not it should be completely up to them. they should give us this much freedom at least.

everybody has different playstyle, not everyone wants to carry all the arsenal into every fight. those who fear that if they don't know what type of next mission would be and what weapons they should equip, then they shouldn't remove weapons but if someone wants to use this option why not let them. it will challenge us how to do the missions with the weapons we have equipped.

I'm just asking for the option to remove weapons. it doesn't mean everyone should use them.

Rugterwyper32
10-27-2013, 04:33 PM
I like the second a lot. Yes, in RE4, once you had enough money you could buy a larger case but to get to that point you would still have to face most of the game with low ammunition and a ton of decisions to make about equipment management. But I like your idea. If players want to take every weapon and be a walking tank then they have to earn it (Just realized that I, inadvertently, copied your sentence). However I don’t think this feature is so hardcore that it needs a separate mode. It is meant to be enjoyable and not hard.

The thing with RE4 is this: Early on the game, you can get the Medium case to carry more stuff, but it's expensive enough at that point to make you think about going for either that or the rifle, unless you've explored the area and gotten all the treasure possible up to that point and if you've done enough killing and collecting. For example, it's easy to get it if you killed both Dr. Salvadors in the Village in the first chapter, but that takes some skill and not just pointlessly wasting ammo. But if you haven't played that well, it's a choice between that and the other options, so you can have the space for later or the other weapon that fits right now but likely no space to carry more ammo.
Same with the large one. If you've looked around, done some good hunting for treasures and dared to do riskier stuff (taking the two paths and clearing them in chapter 2-3, for instance), then getting it and other weapons is no problem. But if you haven't, you probably either can't get it outright or you might get the money if you replace your current equipment but then you'll be getting the new weapons rather than the suitcase. And same case for the XL one.

So the way I see it is, maybe make upgrades for your carrying capacity gradually accessible but make it something really hard to get at the point you are of the game. Either make you do a side-mission line, or make it something that you can purchase but feels way off-limits unless you wait for it or do sidequests that earn you good money but are difficult at the same time. If you want the extra capacity earlier, you can try it right then and there, but if you feel at that point your skill level's not good enough, you can either get the money through the main quest and get the upgrades late during it or wait some time for either better equipment or having more skill at the game to go ahead with it. What do you think?

As for the hardcore part of it, I mentioned this more as the non-hardcore mode option.


It’s not really chunkier. Do you remember the jogging ability, from Ac games previous to AC3, which was triggered simply by pressing R1 (PS3 controls). If a player carries swords, pistols and a bow, then the assassin, while able to jog, won’t be able to sprint (holding R1 and x simultaneously). But if the player is only slightly above the weight limit then the assassin will be able to sprint but not at full speed. So there is no need to change the freerunning as it is simply a matter of depriving players, under those conditions, from certain freerunning speed levels and making it louder.

AC3 did have jogging, not sure how for the PS3 version but on Xbox360 just slightly holding the trigger would make you jog rather than go full speed. And admittedly, I don't think the weight of such things alone would merit such slowdown, though ACR Ezio levels of weaponry and armor I think would. Though that would definitely make it louder. But I think I can see what you mean. Make freerunning still possible yet slower according to how much stuff you have. I'm personally not the biggest fan of the idea, but I can see where you're coming from. This is something, I feel, that could be added with difficulty levels. A difficulty that added this and limited your carrying capacity to the basic level according to the previous part of the post, maybe? And some other elements that added to the challenge.

AssassinHMS
10-27-2013, 05:00 PM
So the way I see it is, maybe make upgrades for your carrying capacity gradually accessible but make it something really hard to get at the point you are of the game. Either make you do a side-mission line, or make it something that you can purchase but feels way off-limits unless you wait for it or do sidequests that earn you good money but are difficult at the same time. If you want the extra capacity earlier, you can try it right then and there, but if you feel at that point your skill level's not good enough, you can either get the money through the main quest and get the upgrades late during it or wait some time for either better equipment or having more skill at the game to go ahead with it. What do you think?

Awesome! Like when you go to a tailor and buy pouches to increase crossbow darts or smoke bombs capacity but only now it would be to increase the capacity for all the gear. I still wouldn't buy it but, since it provides choice and freedom and I wouldn't want to alienate those who want to be armed to their teeth, I wouldn't mind it at all. So yeah, that upgrade idea sounds good but those upgrades shouldn't be too easy to get.



AC3 did have jogging, not sure how for the PS3 version but on Xbox360 just slightly holding the trigger would make you jog rather than go full speed. And admittedly, I don't think the weight of such things alone would merit such slowdown, though ACR Ezio levels of weaponry and armor I think would. Though that would definitely make it louder. But I think I can see what you mean. Make freerunning still possible yet slower according to how much stuff you have. I'm personally not the biggest fan of the idea, but I can see where you're coming from. This is something, I feel, that could be added with difficulty levels. A difficulty that added this and limited your carrying capacity to the basic level according to the previous part of the post, maybe? And some other elements that added to the challenge.

Yeah, these features aren't there simply there for realism and surely not to punish players. The objective of these additions is to reward those who take their time to choose their resources and make the player feel that his choices matter. They would also encourage the player to think like an assassin.
Still, I don’t think this is a hardcore feature, I mean, it really feels natural and fun.

Landruner
10-27-2013, 05:46 PM
@AssassinHMS

I agree with you:
The thing like I see it in trying to use the game mechanics: (I did not play the game yet, so I try to guess the following bellow from the few pieces of footage I saw so far.

For instance you (Whatever how/ side mission or hidden conquistador treasure...?) the crossbow, you can keep it the way it is or transform it into a pistol crossbow by combining the two weapon together - You can switch that crossbow for the blow-pipe in your inventory wheel - Then you have to buy the pouch (Upgrade 1) is equal to 3 bolds, You may find the ingredient (2 iguana skins, or anything else) you need to it to a grafter / tailor - and you get it - For pouch Upgrade 2 is equal to 5 bolds (2 iguana skins, and 1 jaguar skin) and so on - or keep the same in game process than the dart for the blow-pipe in game for its dart (poison/sleeping...ect )- The same thing with the bow and arrows... or anything else that you can carry on the back?


Tell me if it is what you suggested in your reply to Rugterwyper32

Note:I usually do not like comparison among games, but I have a game I know that got it right on this matter it is Far Cry 3 - I never felt so much in any game to really upgrade my gear the faster the better - I do not if you played that game and if yes if you have the same feeling

AssassinHMS
10-27-2013, 07:02 PM
@AssassinHMS

I agree with you:
The thing like I see it in trying to use the game mechanics: (I did not play the game yet, so I try to guess the following bellow from the few pieces of footage I saw so far.

For instance you (Whatever how/ side mission or hidden conquistador treasure...?) the crossbow, you can keep it the way it is or transform it into a pistol crossbow by combining the two weapon together - You can switch that crossbow for the blow-pipe in your inventory wheel - Then you have to buy the pouch (Upgrade 1) is equal to 3 bolds, You may find the ingredient (2 iguana skins, or anything else) you need to it to a grafter / tailor - and you get it - For pouch Upgrade 2 is equal to 5 bolds (2 iguana skins, and 1 jaguar skin) and so on - or keep the same in game process than the dart for the blow-pipe in game for its dart (poison/sleeping...ect )- The same thing with the bow and arrows... or anything else that you can carry on the back?


Tell me if it is what you suggested in your reply to Rugterwyper32


We were talking about Resident Evil where you have a case in which you can place anything you find (from ingredients to weapons). However this case is confined, forcing the player to make difficult choices (Should I give up on my grenade for this handgun I just found?). Given how limited the resources are and the number of enemies, you have to make every bullet count and make sure you don't fill your case with unnecessary equipment, or else you will run out of options and you will likely die. However, once you get enough money, you can buy a bigger case so that you can carry more gear. Rugterwyper32 proposed something similar for AC where, players that want to carry many weapons, can buy (once they acquire the money) an upgrade so that the weight limit increases. I didn't really suggest anything. However I'm starting to think those upgrades could be specific to each weapon. For example: if the player wants to take a bow but is afraid it will exceed the weight limit, he can buy a special upgrade for the bow that will make it lighter by changing its material.


Note:I usually do not like comparison among games, but I have a game I know that got it right on this matter it is Far Cry 3 - I never felt so much in any game to really upgrade my gear the faster the better - I do not if you played that game and if yes if you have the same feeling

No. Unfortunately I never played FC3.

Landruner
10-27-2013, 08:18 PM
We were talking about Resident Evil where you have a case in which you can place anything you find (from ingredients to weapons). However this case is confined, forcing the player to make difficult choices (Should I give up on my grenade for this handgun I just found?). Given how limited the resources are and the number of enemies, you have to make every bullet count and make sure you don't fill your case with unnecessary equipment, or else you will run out of options and you will likely die. However, once you get enough money, you can buy a bigger case so that you can carry more gear. Rugterwyper32 proposed something similar for AC where, players that want to carry many weapons, can buy (once they acquire the money) an upgrade so that the weight limit increases. I didn't really suggest anything. However I'm starting to think those upgrades could be specific to each weapon. For example: if the player wants to take a bow but is afraid it will exceed the weight limit, he can buy a special upgrade for the bow that will make it lighter by changing its material.



No. Unfortunately I never played FC3.

Yep I saw references about R6, but I did not play it - I gave up on that franchise after the 4th one. Okay I see what you mean. yes that could be interesting, however; that change considerably the gameplay in the AC franchise - I will personally be okay with something like that (like R/Evil) only for specific missions, but how many people will like it? - I mean with the conception of the Assassin hideout, people will have to come back more often if they want to keep the items just in case.
I will be okay like that if That some missions push you in those extreme situations where you have to choose between ( I am hurt, I can't carry much, so, I Keep my sword, or I keep the medicine, and try to hide for the rest of the mission in only using my HD?), why not, but I don't believe it could work in the all game.

Keep in mind that a lot of people are already happy with what they get, and they do not ask more than that - Like someone said earlier (I believe it was you) Players of that franchise have different paces for each game of that series, and no one really enjoy those games the same way that some other do... Some think that you don't need weapons because they never used them, some would day "real assassins" only use the HBs, some don't care, some will tell you that you can't win... and blalbla...:confused:

// - Far cry 3 has this compromise in its gameplay about the fact of being stealthy or not, depending of what the player wants to do with somewhat a different approach is the survival mode - However, after a while, when you start being out of stuff and you want to stay alive, well you try to keep it low and being more stealthy until you can buy gear in hoping you could have enough money in order to buy it. The same for the weapons you can upgrade them and upgrade your pouches with what you hunt in the jungle. except the Bioshocks, I do not like FPS shouters: but, I loved that game for its extreme situations it puts the player into.//

FOR AC4:

So, far, I try to keep to focus on what they could bring in additional gameplay for AC4/DLCs based upon the fact that the DLC team(s) has to use the AC4 script & assets in order to build something news or bring some improvement like THE OPTIONAL WEAPONS &/or GEAR with what could be possible to do - Perhaps, they can spawn a difficulty mod that could be like R6 (?) for some missions only as I described above

(They try to do that at the beginning of ACR, with the village infiltration - Ezio could not get hurt anymore, he was hurt could not jump without weapon except the HD, and reminding stealthy through the streets using his HB only until you find you meds on the other side of the village)

However; I am pretty sure that the DLC s are already planned / started/ and around the corner - On the other hand, I think that we should start a list or ideas like that we would like to see someday in that franchise for the next installment(s)

Sturnz0r
10-27-2013, 09:00 PM
@AssassinHMS

I agree with you:
The thing like I see it in trying to use the game mechanics: (I did not play the game yet, so I try to guess the following bellow from the few pieces of footage I saw so far.

For instance you (Whatever how/ side mission or hidden conquistador treasure...?) the crossbow, you can keep it the way it is or transform it into a pistol crossbow by combining the two weapon together - You can switch that crossbow for the blow-pipe in your inventory wheel - Then you have to buy the pouch (Upgrade 1) is equal to 3 bolds, You may find the ingredient (2 iguana skins, or anything else) you need to it to a grafter / tailor - and you get it - For pouch Upgrade 2 is equal to 5 bolds (2 iguana skins, and 1 jaguar skin) and so on - or keep the same in game process than the dart for the blow-pipe in game for its dart (poison/sleeping...ect )- The same thing with the bow and arrows... or anything else that you can carry on the back?


Tell me if it is what you suggested in your reply to Rugterwyper32

Note:I usually do not like comparison among games, but I have a game I know that got it right on this matter it is Far Cry 3 - I never felt so much in any game to really upgrade my gear the faster the better - I do not if you played that game and if yes if you have the same feeling

Sam Fisher keeps his compact multi-tool crossbow on the back of his hip with the Noisemaker/emp/ko-gas/sticky-shocker. I like how they configured that on the d-pad, as well. In that game he upgraded outfits which had more carrying capability with money, but obviously, there is no need to craft as he is a secret govt agent

I bet ubisoft can make a killing with a dlc that has this hybrid crossbow-pistol instead of the bulky blowdart, swords and four pistols for you true assassins. half-facetious.


On the other hand, I think that we should start a list or ideas like that we would like to see someday in that franchise for the next installment(s)

Yea. It's not plausible to make that big of a patch. Not even if it was still pre-production.

Landruner
10-27-2013, 11:16 PM
Sam Fisher keeps his compact multi-tool crossbow on the back of his hip with the Noisemaker/emp/ko-gas/sticky-shocker. I like how they configured that on the d-pad, as well. In that game he upgraded outfits which had more carrying capability with money, but obviously, there is no need to craft as he is a secret govt agent

I bet ubisoft can make a killing with a dlc that has this hybrid crossbow-pistol instead of the bulky blowdart, swords and four pistols for you true assassins. half-facetious.



Yea. It's not plausible to make that big of a patch. Not even if it was still pre-production.

Yep, it is what I am taking about and I hope they do - a Killer hybrid pistol crossbow ( I put a link yesterday of what it looks like) - That will be "badass" instead of that Tenchu's blow pipe that you can't even drop from your back & that makes Edward look like a troubadour that is going to play some flute for some money instead of doing his job. lol:rolleyes:

Seriously, they have been told over and over to put that stuff anywhere, but on the back, and/or to put back some improvement on the previous arsenal & surprise us with that... they did not listen - I honestly hope that they are going to listen and make some effort in order to tweaking the script and let you switch weapons "pour l'amour du ciel!".