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mike_espo
02-25-2004, 09:31 PM
I was wondering if gravity drop is modelled in the weapon characteristics. I notice the 50 cals are like lasers. Also, I fly the bf-109e alot and noticed that the MG FF cannons historically were low muzzle velocity weapons and had a poor trajectory. Also, the IJN used this weapon as the type 99 cannon on the zero 21, 32, and 22. I noticed when I fly the zero and bf-109Es that I get great results from this weapon. I would think the rate of fire should be slower and the trajectory should show more drop unless very close to the target. I hope when the Zero 21 comes out in Aces expansion pack, that this will be modelled correctly.

thanks

mike_espo
02-25-2004, 09:31 PM
I was wondering if gravity drop is modelled in the weapon characteristics. I notice the 50 cals are like lasers. Also, I fly the bf-109e alot and noticed that the MG FF cannons historically were low muzzle velocity weapons and had a poor trajectory. Also, the IJN used this weapon as the type 99 cannon on the zero 21, 32, and 22. I noticed when I fly the zero and bf-109Es that I get great results from this weapon. I would think the rate of fire should be slower and the trajectory should show more drop unless very close to the target. I hope when the Zero 21 comes out in Aces expansion pack, that this will be modelled correctly.

thanks

boohaa
02-25-2004, 10:11 PM
Mike you must have unchecked realistic gunnery.this sim is very real in regards to balistics and the arc bullets take.Go into gunsight view and turn cockpit off to realy see the bullets fallhttp://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

mike_espo
02-25-2004, 10:19 PM
No. I know that. The 20mm cannons on the zero 52 are awesome. In reality, it was not a great weapon. Its rate of fire was slow; 550 rounds per minute and its muzzle velocity was only 600 meters per second. I can routinely get kills from 300m using this weapon where it would be hard pressed to do so in reality. Sakai said: "it was like shooting dragon flies with a rifle" when referring to the type 99 cannon. True, he was speaking of the Mk1 but the Mk 2 used on the zero 52 was only a slight improvement.

Awake74
02-26-2004, 02:26 AM
mike_espo;

I agree your opinion about Type52 20mm shoot rate but I'm a japanese.
The real film of 20mm attack of type52 from attacked B29 I had been seen before, it's shoot rate was pa_pa_pa_pa..x2wing.

Have you ever seen Picture"provate ryan"; there was street fighting. 20mm which German soldiers shooting was nearly to type52 20mm rate I feel.

Generally in FB, I feel 20mm to 37mmMG shoot rate is fast then real.
someone how do you feel about this?

I don't know about Type52 bullet fall rate improved then Type21 20mm.

blabla0001
02-26-2004, 03:25 AM
9.1 rounds per second is a slow rate of fire for a 20mm cannon in WWII?

Since when?

Awake74
02-26-2004, 04:22 AM
After Type52 20mm is Type99-2-4 belt feed capacity is 470bullets/1Min = 7.8bullets/1sec.

I felt diffrence RealFilm and SPEC.

mike_espo
02-26-2004, 06:27 AM
the type 99 rof is slow compared to the 50 cal which is something like 750 rpm. The MG 151 20mm cannon used by the bf-109f, g has a rof of 740 rpm. Check out this site for ww2 aircraft weapons info: http://www.ww2guide.com/guns.shtml


Target Rabaul faithfully recreates the type 99 cannon perfectly in sound, rof, and muzzle velocity.

www.targetware.net (http://www.targetware.net)

VW-IceFire
02-26-2004, 07:10 AM
I get some of my sources for this stuff on this website:

http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hangar/8217/fgun/fgun-pe.html

The MG-FF has a rate of fire of 530rpm, the ShVAK (on most VVS fighters) has one of 800rpm, the Hispano Mark II (Typhoon, Hurricane C) does 600rpm, the Mark V (on the Tempest) does 750rpm, the MG151/20 does 700rpm and the Type 99-1 does 520 rpm. Overall the MG-FF and the Type 99-1 (which are based on the Oelirkon cannon) are the slowest firing of the 20mm cannons.

Ballistics drop on the MG-FF and Type 99 in game are excellently modeled in my rough approximation. I don't see anything wrong with these guys...yes you can hit stuff at 300 meters or more but its harder to do (the muzzle velocity is also low) and the spread on the guns is such that maybe only a single cannon is hitting the target while the other is not. I consider the MG151/20 a far superior weapon to the FF Oerlikon designs.

The .50 cal has quite a dropoff as well. It takes longer for it to happen but killing targets at 700 meters or more is difficult at best and a waste of ammunition. Nobody online using limited ammo will open fire at that range (unless they don't have much experience with the .50cal).

http://home.cogeco.ca/~cczerneda/sigs/temp_sig1.jpg
RCAF 412 Falcon Squadron - "Swift to Avenge"

mike_espo
02-26-2004, 07:32 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by VW-IceFire:

Ballistics drop on the MG-FF and Type 99 in game are excellently modeled in my rough approximation. I don't see anything wrong with these guys...yes you can hit stuff at 300 meters or more but its harder to do (the muzzle velocity is also low) and the spread on the guns is such that maybe only a single cannon is hitting the target while the other is not. I consider the MG151/20 a far superior weapon to the FF Oerlikon designs.

The .50 cal has quite a dropoff as well. It takes longer for it to happen but killing targets at 700 meters or more is difficult at best and a waste of ammunition. Nobody online using limited ammo will open fire at that range (unless they don't have much experience with the .50cal).

Hmmm. Did'nt notice the drop with the 50 cal. I got killed with a mustang on my 6 from half a kilometer. I guess Im used to the TR type 99 cannons. They are really a challenge to use correctly. I wish they were modelled like that in this sim. Especially with the zero 21 coming out!! Can't wait!

p1ngu666
02-26-2004, 10:09 AM
ive read the cannons wherent converged, hence they where inacurate to a close fighter

http://www.pingu666.modded.me.uk/mysig3.jpg