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GreySkellig
05-14-2013, 07:28 PM
Ubisoft's discussion of the seamless naval-to-land gameplay has been intriguing, but one thing that has jumped out to me is the repeated description of jumping off the Jackdaw and swimming to land.

Swimming in AC games has always been dull and boring. Granted, AC:BF promises some more swimming flexibility, but even so, it strikes me that it wouldn't be that hard to have a longboat or even a dinghy Edward could use for boat=>shore=>boat transitions. Previous AC games had such skiffs (AC2, AC:B, AC:R) and there were some early screenshots of Connor in birchbark canoes, but that feature was evidently ditched. That was irritating enough in AC3 (I got reeeeally tired of swimming rivers on the frontier. It would have been easier and more immersive to paddle up and down rivers) But in AC:BF's game world spread out as an archipelago, I think I might lose my mind if I have to spend 20-40 seconds swimming to and from my ship every time I want to explore/leave an island.

It does occur to me that the emphasis on swimming could just be because a) It's going to be expanded, and b) It seems to hammer home better the seamless world. Even so, having to swim every time I want to visit an island would be a bit lame. I mean, what captain forgets to bring a ship's boat?

True_Assassin92
05-14-2013, 07:37 PM
Or let your crew row for you and you stand at the end as a reaaal captain :p

lothario-da-be
05-14-2013, 07:43 PM
I hope we won't have too swim too much in ac4, as you said it got boring fast in ac3.

ProletariatPleb
05-14-2013, 07:47 PM
Or let your crew row for you and you stand at the end as a reaaal captain :p
This please...

STDlyMcStudpants
05-14-2013, 08:28 PM
I'm 99% sure the swimming mechanics will be improved including speed at which we swim...but ill personally spend as much time as possible under the water when im swimming..so i wont mind :D

rob.davies2014
05-14-2013, 08:29 PM
It's not just the speed. Any self respecting pirate captain would have his crew and longboat at the ready to row him ashore. Or row himself, it would look much cooler.

ze_topazio
05-14-2013, 08:38 PM
Suddenly i had a vision of a trophy/ achievement that requires you to swim from one corner to the other of the "ocean area".

GreySkellig
05-14-2013, 09:28 PM
It's not just the speed. Any self respecting pirate captain would have his crew and longboat at the ready to row him ashore. Or row himself, it would look much cooler.

Exactly. It's not so much my impatience as a player as it is the fact that it's just weird for the supposedly-fearsome pirate captain to crawl ashore like a half-drowned rat every time he wants to visit an island.

pacmanate
05-14-2013, 10:09 PM
They keep going on about it because its new.

I don't see the fascination in holding the left stick up for like a minute with R1 pressed to swim from the boat to an island...

But yes, its new so they will bang on about it like it is something amazing, don't fall for it. Its just swimming...

EarthlyStudio1
05-14-2013, 11:36 PM
It adds to immersion to the game. You have the option to jump off your ship at any time and just swim seamlessly to an island. Oh my gosh...this game sounds sooo amazing!!!!

So hard to keep my hopes low. =(

x___Luffy___x
05-15-2013, 12:05 AM
Or let your crew row for you and you stand at the end as a reaaal captain :p

this would really be awesome

GreySkellig
05-15-2013, 12:16 AM
It adds to immersion to the game. You have the option to jump off your ship at any time and just swim seamlessly to an island. Oh my gosh...this game sounds sooo amazing!!!!

Not sure why it's more immersive to seamlessly swim to the island rather than to seamlessly row there. In fact, I'd far rather row, since I'll feel like a moron if I have to swim to an island when literally any ship of the times would have had a row boat.

I mean, I get that Ubi is probably pounding this to emphasize the seamlessness (which I mentioned in my OP). And obviously it's working, since it seems to have you excited. But it will irk me every time I play the game if swimming is our only option.

AdamPearce
05-15-2013, 12:35 AM
I just imagine the worst scene ever: Doing this for every Viewpoints...

But really I hope we are going to be able to row just like in AC2-B but of course with a way bette system and the capacity to go faster than the gondola. But even then, it would be boring after a time anyway, so I think the best thing to do is to give different choices, as always

1 > Swim like an idiot
2 > Row
3 > Let your members row.
4 > Skippable cutscene.

dxsxhxcx
05-15-2013, 12:55 AM
IF we are able to anchor our ship anywhere (I don't remember if in AC3 we had anchors), they could make new options available during this state like:

1. you jump out of your ship and swim
2. you go to a certain spot of your ship and when you click the required button you'll be teleported to a row boat with some of your crew on the side of your ship and then be able to go anywhere from there

Sushiglutton
05-15-2013, 01:42 AM
Haven't really thought of that. I'd guess they are rebuilding the entire swim system. Hopefully you get a leg kick so you can gain some momentum after diving. You can also take a lift to the top of the mast to reach high cliffs you may be sailing by. Not sure if rowing would be faster. First you would have to get to the extra boat, then row then julp off that boat etc. Ofc the longer the distance the greater the gain, but I assume we can get fairly close to shore. Besides rowing is really not an elegant and cool activity for badass playboys.

Assassin_M
05-15-2013, 01:45 AM
how about rowing OR swimming?? whichever you wish?? you know.....options?

Sushiglutton
05-15-2013, 01:57 AM
how about rowing OR swimming?? whichever you wish?? you know.....options?

Do fewer things, but do them great! That's my AC4 motto! Swimming is a must for several reasons. Having a boat so you can row to shore is not, so skip it imo.

Assassin_M
05-15-2013, 01:58 AM
Do fewer things, but do them great! That's my AC4 motto! Swimming is a must for several reasons. Having a boat so you can row to shore is not, so skip it imo.
But but.......options D:

swimming is already there

ProletariatPleb
05-15-2013, 02:01 AM
Do fewer things, but do them great! That's my AC4 motto! Swimming is a must for several reasons. Having a boat so you can row to shore is not, so skip it imo.
But we can already swim ffs.

Sushiglutton
05-15-2013, 02:04 AM
But but.......options D:

swimming is already there

It's there, but it's meh. Watch how pro swimmers dive into the water. They use their legs to kick themselves forward under water. The actual swimming should be a bit faster (even if it's unreslistic) and smoother with options for diving below the surface. Rowing is for old people, there's nothing cool about it. It's like knitting.

Assassin_M
05-15-2013, 02:07 AM
It's there, but it's meh. Watch how pro swimmers dive into the water. They use their legs to kick themselves forward under water. The actual swimming should be a bit faster (even if it's unreslistic) and smoother with options for diving below the surface. Rowing is for old people, there's nothing cool about it. It's like knitting.
Then the option to row :D right along with the option to swim..hah ? hah ??

GreySkellig
05-15-2013, 02:19 AM
Exactly, the thing to me is not rowing instead of swimming, but rowing as a second option. It shouldn't be hard to implement, and it would make island exploration feel better, imo.

Along the lines of having your crew row the boat for you, I'm hoping we'll be able to set a course for the Jackdaw, turn the tiller over to our helmsman, and roam the ship while under way.

EarthlyStudio1
05-15-2013, 02:50 AM
Not sure why it's more immersive to seamlessly swim to the island rather than to seamlessly row there. In fact, I'd far rather row, since I'll feel like a moron if I have to swim to an island when literally any ship of the times would have had a row boat.

I mean, I get that Ubi is probably pounding this to emphasize the seamlessness (which I mentioned in my OP). And obviously it's working, since it seems to have you excited. But it will irk me every time I play the game if swimming is our only option.

I think I misunderstood you. I'm sorry. Anyways, yes I would love the option to bring out a row boat to bring myself over to an island on. That would be an extremely cool feature.

projectpat06
05-15-2013, 03:26 AM
If they have a row boat, they will prob just allow you to walk up to it while on the jackdaw and press a button to initiate a small cut scene of it being lowered with you on it. We should prob also consider the size of the Jackdaw. If it's going to be as small as the aquila, there may not have room for a row boat. I don't remember the aquila having one. (edit: actually duh it did. just don't remember seeing it on the boat) I doubt it will be as large as the boat haytham sails to the US of A on but possibly something in between.

The Aquila was small enough to navigate through shallower waters so If the jackdaw is the same size we may not be that far from shore to need a row boat.


I just hope we get to ride sea turtles.....

EarthlyStudio1
05-15-2013, 03:31 AM
If they have a row boat, they will prob just allow you to walk up to it while on the jackdaw and press a button to initiate a small cut scene of it being lowered with you on it. We should prob also consider the size of the Jackdaw. If it's going to be as small as the aquila, there may not have room for a row boat. I don't remember the aquila having one. I doubt it will be as large as the boat haytham sails to the US of A on but possibly something in between.

The Aquila was small enough to navigate through shallower waters so If the jackdaw is the same size we may not be that far from shore to need a row boat.


I just hope we get to ride sea turtles.....

I don't know. I definitely think there is a possibility of it being as big as the one Haytham sailed to the USA on. I expect it to at least have room for a cabin and some other stuff to be put in for aesthetic value.

projectpat06
05-15-2013, 03:40 AM
Actually just came across this photo used before. It's about the size of the aquila but if you look at the stern of the boat, you can see a small row boat held up by two levees so I can't imagine us not being able to use the boat. Now whether it will be a cut scene of us rowing to land or we get to control it is a different story.

You can also see the levee for what could be the diving bell or a net on the left or port side
https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc7/295522_342430339195148_860648338_n.jpg

pacmanate
05-15-2013, 12:39 PM
We can swim, we can sail a ship.

Who cares about rowing a little boat. FOCUS ON HOLSTERS FOR GUNS.

MasterAssasin84
05-15-2013, 01:49 PM
I am really excited about the seemless transition between sea and land, it makes perfect sense to include this granted that the swimming in previous AC games was not that great but being as this time around the ocean will play a huge part in the experience i am hoping that UBI get this right.

projectpat06
05-15-2013, 02:35 PM
I hope we have small boats like row boats to use anywhere like in port towns as well. Just have a few sitting at the docks that we can steal if we need them. I always thought it looked bad when Connor had to swim out a long distance to a ship. I'd rather edward row out to a ship that may be anchored in the bay and sneak on board.

GreySkellig
05-15-2013, 06:46 PM
Who cares about rowing a little boat. FOCUS ON HOLSTERS FOR GUNS.

Although they're both important to me, I will admit the no-holsters thing is going to make me grind my teeth every time I play.

arortiz73
08-21-2014, 03:22 AM
THIS IS A HUGE OVERSIGHT!!
Nobody jumped overboard to go ashore unless it was some special unforeseeable emergency (like "abandon ship!"), and/or the dinghy or longboat was somehow unavailable (most likely from damage in battle, or missing from a heavy storm, etc.).
This game (which is most definitely a high-seas pirate game) boasts the premise of being based on historical factors, but somehow missed the dinghy?!
WTF?! How stupid can you be?! I just bought the game a few days ago, and playing it beyond the first Havana quest is quickly driving me nuts! If this isn't included quickly in the next update or DLC, I am just going to sell the game and be done with it.

As a new sailor (in REALITY).
Every time I hear the crew members yell out how the stupid captain has gone overboard because clearly he fancies himself a swim, makes me cringe!

How could the NPCs know that it's a dumb idea to willy-nilly jump overboard, but somehow the game makers who wrote the dialogue for the NPCs don't know that?

Hey left hand, this is right hand. Now shake each other and cooperate.

HDinHB
08-21-2014, 05:50 AM
Nice necro :). They did have the little white boats on shore for fast travel back to the Jackdaw. They could have easily reversed the process. The wouldn't have even have needed to make a rowing cutscene.

To bring this to 2014, how will they handle this in Rogue, where swimming can literally kill you?

Jexx21
08-21-2014, 05:53 AM
In the River Valley swimming probably won't kill you.

And there's probably a coding reason for why they had to make you dive off the ship to go ashore.

Aphex_Tim
08-21-2014, 07:06 AM
We can swim, we can sail a ship.

Who cares about rowing a little boat. FOCUS ON HOLSTERS FOR GUNS.

Oh yeah, almost forgot that was a thing. :p

Sesheenku
08-21-2014, 07:43 AM
In the River Valley swimming probably won't kill you.

And there's probably a coding reason for why they had to make you dive off the ship to go ashore.

That doesn't make sense. If anything it's for seamlessness, they didn't want to have a little canoe appear every time you let go of the wheel most likely and definitely didn't want to interrupt the seamlessness with a cutscene.

In any case... you don't even have to swim, get your ship close enough and you can use the ropes to swing onto the island or just hop right onto it.

HDinHB
08-21-2014, 08:28 AM
That doesn't make sense. If anything it's for seamlessness, they didn't want to have a little canoe appear every time you let go of the wheel most likely and definitely didn't want to interrupt the seamlessness with a cutscene.

In any case... you don't even have to swim, get your ship close enough and you can use the ropes to swing onto the island or just hop right onto it.

Yeah, seamlessness, intensifies. :p I did get pretty good at "parking" the Jackdaw so I wouldn't get my feet wet. The only problem them was I would try to start running before I had completely let go of the wheel, firing a broadside into the dock. I've long felt AC needs an "oops, sorry bout that" button.

Sesheenku
08-21-2014, 08:45 AM
Yeah, seamlessness, intensifies. :p I did get pretty good at "parking" the Jackdaw so I wouldn't get my feet wet. The only problem them was I would try to start running before I had completely let go of the wheel, firing a broadside into the dock. I've long felt AC needs an "oops, sorry bout that" button.

This is what happens when you try to stuff too many functions into one button. We're gonna need more buttons on a controller, or analog sticks on a keyboard or something to that effect.

Oh wait..

http://www.ftp-sgpartners.net/tdceu/uploads/uploaded/Bridge_remote.jpg

Make it standard please.

Why the hell hasn't this been done for consoles yet?

Remove some of the keys or make 'em smaller and push 'em to the middle, slap on another analog stick. No more oops.

Fatal-Feit
08-21-2014, 08:55 AM
I am saddened by the lack of innovation in the current-gen consoles. They should have added at least 4-8 more buttons.

Sesheenku
08-21-2014, 08:58 AM
I am saddened by the lack of innovation in the current-gen consoles. They should have added at least 4-8 more buttons.

You're damn right. Seriously though, AC needs more buttons, if they had more buttons, AC3 wouldn't have tried to smash everything together into the high profile button.

They started to have too many functions in Revelations and had to change eagle vision from the head button to the stick, AC3 just smashes more functions together.

Context sensitivity is nice but it ultimately ends up leading to problems, we're humans it's literally impossible we won't screw up with context sensitive controls.

Fatal-Feit
08-21-2014, 09:01 AM
AC is a game built on consoles, after all.

I remembered when the older titles would suffer from everything being used on the X button. Yikes.

I've been using an X1 controller a lot. It's an improvement on comfort and several button inputs, but it's still lacking so much innovation. What AC needs to do is allow players to map out their controls on the PC. That way I can take advantage of me Razer brand.

Sesheenku
08-21-2014, 09:06 AM
AC is a game built on consoles, after all.

I remembered when the older titles would suffer from everything being used on the X button. Yikes.

I've been using an X1 controller a lot. It's an improvement on comfort and several button inputs, but it's still lacking so much innovation. What AC needs to do is allow players to map out their controls on the PC. That way I can take advantage of me Razer brand.

I haven't used one yet, I've used PS4/360/PS3/PS2/Logitech Rumblepad2. I love when people get into controller wars.. They honestly don't feel any different to me and I have small hands and short fingers lol. The first time I picked any of them up it didn't require learning or uncomfortable adjustment. It's all basically the same layout and they all work.

You'd have to have hands much smaller than mine to feel uncomfortable with a 360 pad for example and if your hands are smaller than mine... Wow lol.

Fatal-Feit
08-21-2014, 09:22 AM
I haven't used one yet, I've used PS4/360/PS3/PS2/Logitech Rumblepad2. I love when people get into controller wars.. They honestly don't feel any different to me and I have small hands and short fingers lol. The first time I picked any of them up it didn't require learning or uncomfortable adjustment. It's all basically the same layout and they all work.

You'd have to have hands much smaller than mine to feel uncomfortable with a 360 pad for example and if your hands are smaller than mine... Wow lol.

I actually have some pretty small hands, no joke. We may be competing with that. lel

Have you gotten into competitive shooters or fighting games? Controllers makes all the difference for many players, such as myself. I can't ever play NUNS on a PS3 controller. The way the analog sticks are pointing out makes my fingers fall off, and the way they're close together makes it hard to pull good sidesteps without your fingers knocking each other out of place. Sometimes peripherals makes all the difference for me.

The wars, though, that makes no sense. Things like controllers and comfort are subjective.

Sesheenku
08-21-2014, 09:24 AM
I actually have some pretty small hands, no joke. We may be competing with that. lel

Have you gotten into competitive shooters or fighting games? Controllers makes all the difference for many players, such as myself. I can't ever play NUNS on a PS3 controller. The way the analog sticks are pointing out makes my fingers fall off, and the way they're close together makes it hard to pull good sidesteps without your fingers knocking each other out of place. Sometimes peripherals makes all the difference for me.

The wars, though, that makes no sense. Things like controllers and comfort are subjective.

I used to play Quake 3 competitively back in 00-03 or so. I won't use a controller on an FPS. If you're playing on a PC with a game pad in those types of games you might as well give up, an analog stick isn't gonna do jack **** against 10,000 dpi mouses.

You know how the masses are with consoles these days, always trying to make ridiculous arguments on what's better. Blah blah blah ps3 controller is for sissy hands, blah blah blah 360 controller is for gorilla hands, blah blah blah 360 stick placement is more natural blah blah blah no it isn't.

Such people blow it out of proportion, I seriously find that none of the supposed issues are noticeable. This last generation has gotten out of hand though.

I don't mind support for your preferred console but at least make some valid objective arguments.

Fatal-Feit
08-21-2014, 09:41 AM
360 controllers are Windows, as well. Don't forget, it's not a console exclusive thing.

Sesheenku
08-21-2014, 12:18 PM
360 controllers are Windows, as well. Don't forget, it's not a console exclusive thing.

None of them are exclusive honestly. PS3 has third party tools to make it work just fine. PS2 had an adapter too if I recall correctly, not sure.

Fatal-Feit
08-21-2014, 12:24 PM
Ehhh, using third party programs aren't the same. But still viable, non the less.

RinoTheBouncer
08-21-2014, 12:44 PM
They keep going on about it because its new.

I don't see the fascination in holding the left stick up for like a minute with R1 pressed to swim from the boat to an island...

But yes, its new so they will bang on about it like it is something amazing, don't fall for it. Its just swimming...

I couldn’t agree more.

GreySkellig
08-21-2014, 02:47 PM
Oh yeah, almost forgot that was a thing. :p

Every time I see footage for Unity or Rogue I smirk a little. We got so riled up over Edward's lack of holsters that Arno and Shay have holsters right in the middle of their back staring at you all the time.

"You forum-dwellers wanted holsters? Here--we put them right in them middle of your view for the next 40-60 hours of gameplay. Now no more silly requests."

"But...scabbards?"

Also, wow, my thread got hella necro'd.

Jexx21
08-21-2014, 04:25 PM
Ehhh, using third party programs aren't the same. But still viable, non the less.

I disagree. I use a DS4 (PS4 controller) for my PC games and I use an input wrapper, and it feels just the same as using it on the PS4, except I have to translate A, B, X, and Y into X, O, square, and triangle in my brain. Actually I don't even have to do that because I'm rarely looking at the buttons. I just had to memorize the placement of A B X and Y.

Fatal-Feit
08-21-2014, 04:51 PM
I disagree. I use a DS4 (PS4 controller) for my PC games and I use an input wrapper, and it feels just the same as using it on the PS4, except I have to translate A, B, X, and Y into X, O, square, and triangle in my brain. Actually I don't even have to do that because I'm rarely looking at the buttons. I just had to memorize the placement of A B X and Y.

I'm referring to legal/official terms. The magic about PC is that you're not restricted, but that's not what I'm talking about.

Xbox controllers are officially for Windows, meaning that it's not a console exclusive product. You can plug it in and play with little to no problems.

HDinHB
08-22-2014, 04:24 AM
I disagree. I use a DS4 (PS4 controller) for my PC games and I use an input wrapper, and it feels just the same as using it on the PS4, except I have to translate A, B, X, and Y into X, O, square, and triangle in my brain. Actually I don't even have to do that because I'm rarely looking at the buttons. I just had to memorize the placement of A B X and Y.

Too hard for my brain...I'm out...

I'm sure you've all seen the Assassin's Creed Kinect?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NufHsmITjM

But have you seen the child-size version?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIWpY_tt7ME
(this just proves Xbox is for 5 year old)

Sesheenku
08-22-2014, 04:42 AM
Too hard for my brain...I'm out...

I'm sure you've all seen the Assassin's Creed Kinect?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7NufHsmITjM

But have you seen the child-size version?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIWpY_tt7ME
(this just proves Xbox is for 5 year old)

It's pretty easy once you get used to it. I use my logitech rumblepad 2 and when I play TR it shows in XBOX controllers. Then when I play Kingdom Hearts on my emulator it shows PS2 controls ;P

It's not any harder than memorizing where keys are on a keyboard.Even easier since there's a fraction of the buttons.

Locopells
08-22-2014, 10:57 AM
If we're done talking about the OT...