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Redwine
05-25-2004, 01:31 PM
We need a more real method to take ranges on the sim.

I has not enought technical information about those WW2 german periscopes, but they ues as american a Stadimeter to measure vertical angles.

Here you can se how it works..........

German Stadimeter (http://personales.ciudad.com.ar/pietraroja/SH2/GermStadimeter/German%20Stadimeter.jpg)

Pictures from Eaj13, thanks Eaj !!


Later, i read they uses a more advanced double image telemeter. I have no info about it.



I do not know about Telemeter, but a Stadimeter is an easy to do.............

It is present in SH2, in the right grip of the periscope, the right hadle.........

The problem is it is so imprecise, because it go from -20 to + 80 degrees.........

Its sacle is 100 degrees wide................



But if can have the same feature you can see in the right handle of the SH2 periscope, but measuring only from -1 down, up to +3 degrees up, (4degrees).........with about 200 pixels by degree............ ( 800 pixels ) into a vertical strip of 1024 pixels.............


We can have a well precise stadimeter when move the periscope view up and down, without the complex feature of the double image...........


( I was not able to reduce this range from 100 deg. to 4 deg. in SH2, may be it is into the program code)


I am sure it is not complex, it is done in SH2, and may be a step up in reality simulation...............


Stadimeter, Telemeter, and a big Bearing chart is needed (I made a 2048x32 Bearing chart for SH2)

Regards, Red.

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[This message was edited by Redwine on Thu August 05 2004 at 06:45 AM.]

Redwine
05-25-2004, 01:31 PM
We need a more real method to take ranges on the sim.

I has not enought technical information about those WW2 german periscopes, but they ues as american a Stadimeter to measure vertical angles.

Here you can se how it works..........

German Stadimeter (http://personales.ciudad.com.ar/pietraroja/SH2/GermStadimeter/German%20Stadimeter.jpg)

Pictures from Eaj13, thanks Eaj !!


Later, i read they uses a more advanced double image telemeter. I have no info about it.



I do not know about Telemeter, but a Stadimeter is an easy to do.............

It is present in SH2, in the right grip of the periscope, the right hadle.........

The problem is it is so imprecise, because it go from -20 to + 80 degrees.........

Its sacle is 100 degrees wide................



But if can have the same feature you can see in the right handle of the SH2 periscope, but measuring only from -1 down, up to +3 degrees up, (4degrees).........with about 200 pixels by degree............ ( 800 pixels ) into a vertical strip of 1024 pixels.............


We can have a well precise stadimeter when move the periscope view up and down, without the complex feature of the double image...........


( I was not able to reduce this range from 100 deg. to 4 deg. in SH2, may be it is into the program code)


I am sure it is not complex, it is done in SH2, and may be a step up in reality simulation...............


Stadimeter, Telemeter, and a big Bearing chart is needed (I made a 2048x32 Bearing chart for SH2)

Regards, Red.

______________________________
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http://personales.ciudad.com.ar/pietraroja/imagenes/firmas/EscudoU552b.jpg
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The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
"HTDC Tutorial" (http://www.iespana.es/rotteufel/htdc_tutorial/a_start.htm)
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[This message was edited by Redwine on Thu August 05 2004 at 06:45 AM.]

HeibgesU999
05-25-2004, 01:47 PM
i wonder how effective they were at diffentiating between 100m range increments.

realistically you need to be able to estimate ranges between 300m and 2000m. but more likely 300m and 1000m.

Redwine
05-25-2004, 07:37 PM
I read in real life U-Boote Kapitans attempt to make shots as near as posible, but more long range shot was managed too.....

If you input the TDC with accurate dat, you can make shots at more range.........

Look at the Manual TDC Tutorial at my signature.

To input accurate data into the TDC, we need accurate periscope and range measurements.......

______________________________
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The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
"HTDC Tutorial" (http://www.iespana.es/rotteufel/htdc_tutorial/a_start.htm)
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RHYLASS
05-26-2004, 07:24 AM
Good post Redwine.

Regards
Dietger

Redwine
05-26-2004, 08:49 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Dietger:
Good post Redwine.

Regards
Dietger<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Tanks a lot for comment Dietger.

I made many attempts to incorporte it in SH2, but unsucessful........

I was not able to find how to put limits of degees at the vertical strip..........

It always moves from -20 up to + 80 degrees........ and this fact makes we need a really giant monster vertical strip, with a size wich can not be managed for any actual video card...........

In example at 200 pixel by degree, (-20 to + 80)...100 degrees needs 20,000 pixels..........

If I can be able to limit it to (-1 to +3) 4 degees....... 800 pixels..... managed well by all actual video cards..........

To put limit between -1 to + 3 degrees may be hardcoded in the program..........

This is a very easy way to give us a simple STADIMETER in SH3......... teh Team can do it with no problem....... If we request it and if they listen to us............

And this feature, just simple and sure included in the game, if is limited in movement to -1 up to +3 degrees in example, can be a step foward....... more ...... a jump foward in hardcore simulation of reality ....and real Range measurement methods............

______________________________
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The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
"HTDC Tutorial" (http://www.iespana.es/rotteufel/htdc_tutorial/a_start.htm)
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Redwine
06-03-2004, 01:02 PM
And...what ? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Still with no screens about periscope, bearing charts, and range measurement......

Put some screen please......... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/11.gif

______________________________
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http://personales.ciudad.com.ar/pietraroja/imagenes/firmas/EscudoU552b.jpg
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The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
"HTDC Tutorial" (http://www.iespana.es/rotteufel/htdc_tutorial/a_start.htm)
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Drebbel
06-08-2004, 09:02 AM
Yep manual TDC support is crucial for all hardcore subsimmers. Although auto TDC is nice to use as well. Good way to loose some agresion :-)

Lets hope your manual TDC modding skills are not needed in SHIII ;-)

Drebbel

The Submarines of the Royal Netherlands Navy 1906 - 2004
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Drebbel
06-08-2004, 11:45 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Redwine:
And...what ? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

Still with no screens about periscope, bearing charts, and range measurement......

Put some screen please......... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/11.gif<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Regarding the scope:
Rock & Roll (http://207.44.164.159/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=24203)


Drebbel

The Submarines of the Royal Netherlands Navy 1906 - 2004
http://www.DutchSubmarines.com/
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Redwine
06-08-2004, 01:50 PM
Thanks a lot Drebbel..........!

Bearing charts looks enough precise.......I am not sure, that is a screen shot but may be about 10 pixels by degree, the same of HTDC Mod......

No Stadimeter at any place...... bad, it is simple feature present in SH2 in the periscope grip.......

We will be enforced to use the reticle to measure "mast head angles" another time.........

Looks so good, with some little more marks in the reticle, we will manage a good manual shooting........


Now we need to see some TDC INPUT INSTRUMENTS, to watch how much precise they are.........

Thanks a lot Drebbel..........

______________________________
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The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
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Redwine
06-08-2004, 03:07 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Me:

Thanks a lot Drebbel..........!

Bearing charts looks enough precise.......I am not sure, that is a screen shot but may be about 10 pixels by degree, the same of HTDC Mod......

No Stadimeter at any place...... bad, it is simple feature present in SH2 in the periscope grip.......

We will be enforced to use the reticle to measure "mast head angles" another time.........

Looks so good, with some little more marks in the reticle, we will manage a good manual shooting........


Now we need to see some TDC INPUT INSTRUMENTS, to watch how much precise they are.........

Thanks a lot Drebbel..........

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>



Wrong...... wrong...... wrong......... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-sad.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

I my entusiasm, I read bad............

The bearing chart do not have 10 pixels by degree, may be 1 pixel by degree only.......

Is 10 times more imprecise than the chart in HTDC Mod......

Based in that screen shot, error in measurement will be half degree.......

Stadimeter is not at view.........

Reticle is not precise to replace the ausence of stadimeter...............

Bad news, based on that screen.......... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-sad.gif



______________________________
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The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
"HTDC Tutorial" (http://www.iespana.es/rotteufel/htdc_tutorial/a_start.htm)
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Leif...
06-09-2004, 01:13 AM
Redwine what exactly do you mean with ‚"Ěstadimeter‚"Ě? Do you mean the double image thing used by the U.S.? I have always been under the impression that the U-boats read the mast height simply using the stadia marks in the view finder.

Also why do you want to read the bearing with such a high resolution? I don‚'t see the problem, the bearing is electronically transferred to the TDC and the capten hardly need the 1/10 of a degree resolution personally.

A picture taken through the attack periscope of a type VII u-boat sure would answer a lot of questions, they seem to be very difficult to find though.


Leif‚...

Redwine
06-09-2004, 10:32 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Leif...:

Redwine what exactly do you mean with ‚"Ěstadimeter‚"Ě? Do you mean the double image thing used by the U.S.? I have always been under the impression that the U-boats read the mast height simply using the stadia marks in the view finder.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hi...... Leif, thank a lot for your words and opinion.........

Well, I supose Captain was free to use the marks or simply his estimate impression.......

But German Periscopes was fitted with a kind of "Stadimeter".

I read, later they fit a kind of "Telemeter" but about this last I am not sure, because I read about it but no technical info found, and the few info is sacanned pages of books in german.........

Up to the "Stadimeter" I found some little info you have a link above of how the system works......

And yes, it works as the American Stadimeters, you can generate a double image with the internal prisms, and when you put the floatation line of one image, just over the mast head line of the other, you can read in a lateral knob or into a viewfinder the "angle" to mast head............

Telemeters Wrks similar, they gives you a doble image and when you put both images coincident one over the second, you can read the range, another may be a broken image.......... as in actual reflex photo cameras, ......... just a photo camera nothing extrange.

But never can found technical info about Telemeter, but yes about Stadimeters.

Stadimeter is easy to do, just in SH2 it is present in the grip of the periscope....... but it is not enough precise.



<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Leif...:

Also why do you want to read the bearing with such a high resolution? I don‚'t see the problem, the bearing is electronically transferred to the TDC and the capten hardly need the 1/10 of a degree resolution personally.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You are not wrong............

The matter is you are in a sim, not in a real sub.........

Initially, the giro angle was introduced manually with a tool into the navigation system of the torp........

Later TDC do it..........

I really ear some times that you said, the bearing is introduced to the TDC electronically from the periscope......... may be with a kind of "Mark" button, but I never found information, technical information about this.

This behavior needs a kind of sincronicas motors........ I do not know if German had this kind of features in that age.........

The las I knows.......... Kapitan or shot Officer or somebody calculates the target relative course with a Calculator Ruler, wich solves this using the 3 Bearing Method, taking 3 measurements.......... and with 2 of them using the same calculator Ruler, they determine the Target Speed using the Cosin Theoreme method solved by the ruler........

Then, the operator wait for the oportune moment, and takes a range and bearing final data, to input tin the TDC, he gives these data to the TDc operator who input manually them into the TDC input instruments..........

And fire..........


The matter is why more precision.........

Just because you a re in a simulator, not in a real sim...........

What it means ?

You have no help of another crew, you have no crew at periscope, no crew using the rulers, no crew at TDC, no Stadimetr, or Telemeter......and........ you have no Calculator Rulers !!

What it means........? you needs more time than in real life to do all this job you alone........ no help of another persons.

What it means, you need to start up calculations and measurements at a longer range than in real life.........

Due to this you need more precise Reticle than inreal life...........

Yes...... I know, and you are right, it is not real a more precise reticle.........

But is the only way to compensate the ausence of another crew helping you with the calculations, masurements, and TDc operation, here you need to do all job you alone.........


With the Bearing Chart is the same situation.........

You need to start up the measurements early, because you have not crew helping you, and you have not Calculator Rulers...........

In real life, with crew helping you, and Stadimetr, or Telemeter, and with Calculator Rulers, you needs seconds...........

But in the sim you nneds lot of minutes.......

Due to that you need a more precise Bearing Chart.......... you really can not see the magnitude of the problem until you try the first tiema complete manual shooting.......

But here a Flame topic...........

A more precise Bearing Chart is UNREAL ?

mmmmmhhhhh.......

Looking at some periscope pictures, I see they has a big bearing chart at top..........

It is not posible to measure it but may be they have a 2 feet diameter........ big chart.......

With 2 feet diameter, the long of the chart is

Long = 3.14 x 2 feet = 6.28 feet !!

It is near to 192 centimeters.

This long may be enough to give you a minimal apreciation (eror) of 0.15 degrees...........

Then remember you need a more precise one than in ral life, for the exposed above, you have no crew help, no stadimetr, no calculator rulers....... for those you need to start up to take target dat early and need a more precise one........

If in real life you has a precision of 0.15 degrees, the bearing chart I had done with a precision of 0.10 degrees is not exagerated.......



<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Leif...:

A picture taken through the attack periscope of a type VII u-boat sure would answer a lot of questions, they seem to be very difficult to find though.


Leif‚...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


I soupose that we can see in that screen shot will be the attack periscope.........

I only request, please Team, let the files open to be able to made the mods we need to a good level in manual shooting, we have reached a very high hardcore levle abailable ( if you want ) in SH2...............


Of course, you canhave a diferent opinion, or another person, somebody can not like those long calculations to shoot a torp......... well, they always will have the red triangle or some thing similar to enjoy the game as a game..........

But let the others, who enjoy that, to have the another way............

Beleve me, when you sink a only ship and can sacpe making all you, not the program, you feel better than when you sink a complete convoy using the red triangle............

Best Regards, and tahks for your interest, I remain waiting for your opinions........

And any info about German Periscopes. Stadimeter, Telemeter, Sincronic Motors Bearing Trasmisions from Periscope to TDC........ Calculator Rulers......... all you can share will be welcome..........

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The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
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Leif...
06-09-2004, 02:29 PM
&gt;But German Periscopes was fitted with a kind of "Stadimeter".


The information I have about the attack periscope in the type VII does not mention anything about a stadimeter. Also the eyepiece of the scope doesn‚'t have this gadget. So the question is, did all u-boats have this?

I‚'m thinking perhaps it was a tool that could be quickly attached to the scope whenever the capten wanted to use it. Possible?

I looked at the link above and it seems to me the text about the stadimeter continues on the next page in the book, do you have that page scanned too? ( And which book is it by the way?)



&gt;I really ear some times that you said, the bearing is introduced to the TDC &gt;electronically from the periscope......... may be with a kind of "Mark" button, but I &gt;never found information, technical information about this.


It was electronically transferred, there is no doubt about that. It is described in the book ‚"die torpedo der deutschen u-boote‚"Ě for instance. (I‚'ve seen it elsewhere too.) There was a switch located in the control room that selected the source of the signal, either the attack scope, the night scope or the UZO. From that switch the signal was feed into the TDC. Don‚'t know what kind of repeater technique they used though.
Of course the bearing could be set manually too, the dials for the bearing is marked in 1/10 of degree.

Leif‚...

Redwine
06-09-2004, 03:12 PM
About those book pages, I have only some ones, I downloaded them from the web, I have not the book, and that kind of books sadly are not abailable here, and German language is a barrier for me. ( english too... as you can see http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif )

I read web pages in german using web traslators.........

I have somo more pages, if you want i can send them by email............

About if they are fitted or not ...... and in wich subs, I soupose, level of equipment vary along the years of war.............

You wrote :

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
It was electronically transferred, there is no doubt about that. It is described in the book ‚"die torpedo der deutschen u-boote‚"Ě for instance. (I‚'ve seen it elsewhere too.) There was a switch located in the control room that selected the source of the signal, either the attack scope, the night scope or the UZO. From that switch the signal was feed into the TDC. Don‚'t know what kind of repeater technique they used though.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


Very interesting....... as I wrote, I only ear or read about this feature but never found any technical info about it.........

Transmision sure was with a sincronic motor.........

If you can have some adta please share it here..........

Would be great to learn about the real technics of manual shooting used by an U-Boote Kapitan......

The mod I made, I called Hardcore TDC Mod, is for use in two ways.......

One assuming you are in the WW1, with no help of any kind, no stadimeters, no rulers nothing......... you are alone........

The second is based in the WW2 method, where you take target data and input them into the TDC..............

To take range, I was not able to increase the precision of the vertical strip un periscope handle, it is hardcoded, for that I made a precision reticle, but it add a one more step in each measurement............

Finally results are very good....... really good.



<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>
Of course the bearing could be set manually too, the dials for the bearing is marked in 1/10 of degree.

Leif‚...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Are you refering to the TDC input dials or are refering to the Periscope Bearing Chart........

I wll give thousand of thanks if you have a close up picture of the periscope bearing chart.......... showing that level of precision of 1/10 of degree..........

Thanks for info, and interest............

______________________________
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The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
"HTDC Tutorial" (http://www.iespana.es/rotteufel/htdc_tutorial/a_start.htm)
.

Leif...
06-10-2004, 01:33 AM
&gt;Are you refering to the TDC input dials or are refering to the Periscope Bearing &gt;Chart........

I was referring to the TDC input dials, unfortunately I don‚'t have a close up picture of the bearing chart from the attack periscope. The resolution of the bearing on the night scope though seems to be 1 degree as can be seen here:
http://hanshansa.piranho.de/laboe/u995zentrale/pages/DSC00271.htm


My German is also weak but from the site: http://home.t-online.de/home/stm.meister/Sehrohre_u__Zubehor/Stand-Sehrohr_10_A/stand-sehrohr_10_a.html I understand there was a tool that could be quickly attached to the periscope and with which you could measure the distance and also the Angle on bow. The Angle on bow where solved by rotating the device 90 degrees. Then the distance and the length of the ship where set on the device and the double picture where adjusted so that the end of the ship touched the bow of the ship. After this was done the angle on bow could be read.

If you could send me the other pages I would appreciate it. please send it to *edit* andersson.leif@eudoramail.com *end edit*

Thanks.
Leif‚...

[This message was edited by Leif... on Thu June 10 2004 at 08:25 AM.]

[This message was edited by Leif... on Fri June 11 2004 at 02:02 AM.]

Redwine
06-10-2004, 08:42 AM
Lot of thanks for the links, the first do not works.........

I will read them this night with a german traslator.......

But in a first look..........

Just look this the image of the periscope....... there is a Wizard Whell monted around the ocular eyepiece !!

http://home.t-online.de/home/stm.meister/Sehrohre_u__Zubehor/Doppelbild-Entfernungs-_und_Zi/doppelbild-entfernungs-_und_zi.html

______________________________
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http://personales.ciudad.com.ar/pietraroja/imagenes/firmas/EscudoU552b.jpg
.
The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
"HTDC Tutorial" (http://www.iespana.es/rotteufel/htdc_tutorial/a_start.htm)
.

Leif...
06-10-2004, 09:31 AM
Oops, link corrected now. Or try http://hanshansa.piranho.de/laboe/u995.htm for the main entry, there is more then 800 pictures of U995 on this site.

Leif‚...

Redwine
06-10-2004, 10:09 AM
Many tahnks Leif...........

About your commnents, about if it is posible stadimeters was an added feature, I soupose, early periscopes was not fitted with them, may be an added one could benn developed, but in most modern periscopes, I supose this feature was a "build in" device.........I am not sure.


Looking the site you put the link.........

In this page is clear visible a kind of Calculator Ruler attached to the periscope ocular eyepiece......

http://home.t-online.de/home/stm.meister/Sehrohre_u__Zubehor/Doppelbild-Entfernungs-_und_Zi/doppelbild-entfernungs-_und_zi.html



In this page is visible the periscope bearing chart, it has 1 degree marks in the photo, but......... is not a simple scale there is another scale visible over the main scale.........


http://home.t-online.de/home/stm.meister/Sehrohre_u__Zubehor/Teilkreis/teilkreis.html

In the graphic is clear visible they are 3 scales.......

I soupose the bottom one and the middle one works together, as in "caliber", "nonius" or "vernier"...........

Did you had used a micrometer some time ?

You have a manin scale, in example reading milimeters, but you have another second scale, with oposit marks...........

The oposit marks are made so 10 of them are in the same size than 9 of the main scale............ to able you to read 1/10.....

In Example.........

When a determined mark in the main scale, in example 10, is just coincident with the "zero" mark of the secondary scale, you are reading 10 mm..........

When the zero mark of the secondary scale is beyond 10, and you have the coincidence in the first mark of the secondary scale, 1 with 11 in the main............ you read 10.1 mm

When the zero mark of the secondary scale is beyond 10, and you have the coincidence in the second mark of the secondary scale, 2 with 12 in the main............ you read 10.2 mm

Definitivelly....... that bearing chart is capable to read small parts of a degree............

I can not to download pictures of the site to enlarge them....... right mouse is disabled in that web page, so bad..........



My dude now is.............

What is the third scale for ?

That under the two upper turn knobs, and with 4 little round view ports ........

I will read the site if traslators works, and put comments of any news.........

Thanks to share this info, and if you have more, please put it here..........

I wll send the email with the pericope info i have............

______________________________
.
http://personales.ciudad.com.ar/pietraroja/imagenes/firmas/EscudoU552b.jpg
.
The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
"HTDC Tutorial" (http://www.iespana.es/rotteufel/htdc_tutorial/a_start.htm)
.

[This message was edited by Redwine on Thu June 10 2004 at 09:26 AM.]

Redwine
06-10-2004, 03:41 PM
Hi...Leif.

Files send........check email box.

Iam so sorry about your links, imposble to traslate that good link, traslator only traslate the left page frame, (the index), imposible to traslate the content......those multiple frame pages are a headache to traslators..........

______________________________
.
http://personales.ciudad.com.ar/pietraroja/imagenes/firmas/EscudoU552b.jpg
.
The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
"HTDC Tutorial" (http://www.iespana.es/rotteufel/htdc_tutorial/a_start.htm)
.

mog_tr
06-10-2004, 04:04 PM
Redwine (and other manual gurus),

After seeing the E3 ingame footage, does it look to you like the periscope recticule has all the things it needs for manual firing?

Redwine
06-10-2004, 10:42 PM
Hi...Mog.

I soupose it is so early to speak.........for many reasons, This Team hade made an amazing job, it is early to speak about a sim I have not in my hands........

Periscope Bearing Chart is more precise than in SH2 from the box........ Reticle too, it is a step forward.

But I think so they was not enough precise, in that condition I think so they are for use a more closer ranges......

Real bearing charts was more precise......... pictures in the site posted by Leif shows it clearlly.

Reticle is real, but in real life they have some device to stablish range, If we will have not it, we need to increase this precision a little bit..........

And in real life captain has officers helping with data and calculations, in a sim you are alone and make all it alone takes more time, for that you need to start up calculations at more larger ranges.....for this those people who will shoot manually will enjoy better a more precise reticle and bearing chart.

If the DEV. TEAM let the files open, as in SH2 with the .dsf files, we will be able to adapt reticle and chart as manual shooters needs.

Video shows a kind of Auto TDC, target data appears in the piece of paper when you put the reticle cross over the target, an easy mode I soupose, and I soupose will be a usable TDC, and a manual firing mode......but not at view in the video.

Best regards, Red.

______________________________
.
http://personales.ciudad.com.ar/pietraroja/imagenes/firmas/EscudoU552b.jpg
.
The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
"HTDC Tutorial" (http://www.iespana.es/rotteufel/htdc_tutorial/a_start.htm)
.

Leif...
06-11-2004, 03:00 AM
Yes that page is protected somehow making it really difficult to use translators, very annoying. Anyhow it is not a vernier scale according to the text, as far as I understand it. The first scale is meant to be read directly by looking up from the eyepiece. The second scale is rotated 180 degrees and is projected down into the periscope, I assume the optics for this is mounted on the backside of the scope, thus the 180 degrees offset.

The third scale though is still somewhat strange, it‚'s seems to be graded 0-60 left and 0-60 right. Perhaps it‚'s meant to give you a quick idea of how much the torpedo has to turn, that‚'s merely a guess though.

I haven‚'t received your mail unfortunately. And I just found out why, I wrote my mail address wrong, embarrassing. It should be andersson.leif@eudoramail.com
So could you please resend the mail?


Leif‚...

Redwine
06-11-2004, 08:27 AM
Hi......Leif.

Yes .... are very anoying those "protected" web pages, imposible to use a traslator...........is a good page but only focusing in german people, and the remains of the world....?


About the scale dials............

If you looks the middle one, it has a double file of marks, oposit marks....... they appears as to increase the precision of the minimun division of the scale.......

They are more than ten marks, but may be it is due a the draw is a simplified drw where only few marks was drawed, and this marks are presen all around the circular chart...........

In another way a precision bearing data can be obtained, puting a just entire bearing in the circular bearing chart, and reading decimal parts in the horizontal marks in the periscope reticle..........adding or sustracting them from the entire value in the circular chart.................

Knobs upper are sure to adjust reading field mark , a fine adjust of the "zero" bering to calibrate the periscope.


Files was resend to your correct email............. please confirm if you had received them.

______________________________
.
http://personales.ciudad.com.ar/pietraroja/imagenes/firmas/EscudoU552b.jpg
.
The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
"HTDC Tutorial" (http://www.iespana.es/rotteufel/htdc_tutorial/a_start.htm)
.

Redwine
06-11-2004, 06:02 PM
Hi......Leif.

Email is turn back, message saids it excedds your mail box capacity...........

File is 2.2 mb...........

Please let me to know wich is the limit of your mail box...........

______________________________
.
http://personales.ciudad.com.ar/pietraroja/imagenes/firmas/EscudoU552b.jpg
.
The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
"HTDC Tutorial" (http://www.iespana.es/rotteufel/htdc_tutorial/a_start.htm)
.

Leif...
06-12-2004, 02:03 AM
Ok, well it's my "Public" mail adress and it's quite small and full of spam,
but if you give me your adress I will send you my private "spam free" adress.

Sorry for the trouble.

Leif...

Redwine
06-12-2004, 07:09 AM
Write me to pietraroja@yahoo.com , my public too , to stablish contact.

No way in all attempts to traslate that link......

Very good periscope info..........

The problem is the most info about german periscopes is in german, and in german sites, and they do not apperas in search engines like google or yahoo.........

If you have any other technical site about german periscopes just share them.........

Thanks a lot for help.

______________________________
.
http://personales.ciudad.com.ar/pietraroja/imagenes/firmas/EscudoU552b.jpg
.
The Ancient History of the Submarine
"Subgenesis" (http://www.iespana.es/Subgenesis/subgenesis/sg00.htm)

Manual TDC
"HTDC Tutorial" (http://www.iespana.es/rotteufel/htdc_tutorial/a_start.htm)
.

TASKFORCE1x1
06-15-2004, 08:53 PM
I mostly make manual shots and only automatic if I need to evade in a hurry. This would come in handy. Back in the SHII days if you select a ship and it was zigzagging a very little bit(1 degree or so) it would make the torp go way off unless you manual zero. Nothing better than a dead on bow shot for me. I eye ball it best I can and works best with 45knot torps. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Keep on Smiling'