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View Full Version : Poor, poor checking of history in AC3



kizza545
03-30-2013, 02:23 PM
At the end of sequence 8, there is a cutscene with the signing of the Declaration of Independence. But, the date is given is as June 16th 1775. Now, I'm no expert on American history, but was the declaration not signed on July 4th 1776?

What makes this even more ridiculous is that the Battle of Bunker Hill, which took place in the previous sequence, was on June 17th 1775 (the day after the cutscene!) I know AC3 has been criticised for its lack of polish, but for a game that prides on itself on its historical basis, this is ridiculous.

(I would post a screenshot, but I do not know how - here is a link though: http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=kj1hWnaiGms#t=1688s)

Assassin_M
03-30-2013, 02:29 PM
Actually the declaration was not signed on the 4th of July. On July 1, 1776, the Second Continental Congress met in Philadelphia, and on the following day, 12 of the 13 colonies voted in favor of Richard Henry Lee’s motion for independence. The delegates then spent the next two days debating and revising the language of a statement drafted by Thomas Jefferson. On July 4, Congress officially adopted the Declaration of Independence, and as a result the date is celebrated as Independence Day. Nearly a month would go by, however, before the actual signing of the document took place.

First, New York’s delegates didn't officially give their support until July 9 because their home assembly hadn't yet authorized them to vote in favor of independence. Next, it took two weeks for the Declaration to be “engrossed". Most of the delegates signed on August 2, but Elbridge Gerry, Oliver Wolcott, Lewis Morris, Thomas McKean and Matthew Thornton signed on a later date and 2 others, John ****inson and Robert R. Livingston, never signed at all.

So, you`re wrong and the game`s wrong:p

can be seen as an oversight, though...this and the other games have various date errors too

kizza545
03-30-2013, 02:33 PM
So, you`re wrong and the game`s wrong:p

can be seen as an oversight, though...this and the other games have various date errors too

but is this not quite a BIG error - especially for a game that has historians on staff?

also, i didn't say it was signed on the 4th July - i asked if it was, so, as pedantic as it makes me, i can't be "wrong"

Assassin_M
03-30-2013, 02:39 PM
but is this not quite a BIG error - especially for a game that has historians on staff?

also, i didn't say it was signed on the 4th July - i asked if it was, so, as pedantic as it makes me, i can't be "wrong"
Well, you asked, true, based on what you HEARD or SEEN here and there, so it counts to what you KNOW, but no matter...

Each game had historians on staff and there were still errors there as well..

It`d mostly be a BIG "OMG WTF" ERROR to an american. to me, this is simply another independence document...

pacmanate
03-30-2013, 02:40 PM
LOL so they advertise it as Pro American in America yet mess up important dates.

dxsxhxcx
03-30-2013, 02:49 PM
that's because in the game they show how history REALLY happened and not how we were lead to believe it happened, didn't they use this excuse for other dates or events that happened one way in the game and a different one in the real world?

Assassin_M
03-30-2013, 02:52 PM
that's because in the game they show how history REALLY happened and not how we were lead to believe it happened, didn't they use this excuse for other dates or events that happened one way in the game and a different one in the real world?
I forgot :O

kizza545
03-30-2013, 03:05 PM
that's because in the game they show how history REALLY happened and not how we were lead to believe it happened, didn't they use this excuse for other dates or events that happened one way in the game and a different one in the real world?

right, and when sequence 8 opens up on the homestead in 1776, i suppose that was an illusion as well was it?

sequence 8 opened up in 1776 and ended in 1775 according to the game's cutscenese - to me, that is VERY poor quality checking by the team

Lass4r
03-30-2013, 03:07 PM
I refuse to believe they got the date of the signing of the bloody declaration of independence wrong in a game about the American revolution...

Say it ain't so... is Esco or Shade around? We need an official statement on this, because that would be ridiculous...

dxsxhxcx
03-30-2013, 03:10 PM
right, and when sequence 8 opens up on the homestead in 1776, i suppose that was an illusion as well was it?

sequence 8 opened up in 1776 and ended in 1775 according to the game's cutscenese - to me, that is VERY poor quality checking by the team

that's a different situation (and I didn't notice it in the game.. lol)...

pacmanate
03-30-2013, 03:12 PM
I refuse to believe they got the date of the signing of the bloody declaration of dependence wrong in a game about the American revolution...

Say it ain't so... is Esco or Shade around? We need an official statement on this, because that would be ridiculous...

What would they do about this? Both M and the OP have checked.

dxsxhxcx
03-30-2013, 03:16 PM
What would they do about this? Both M and the OP have checked.

IMO the game has far worse problems than this, of course a wrong date sometimes can break the immersion a little and it's good to point it out for the devs don't make the same mistake again, but I don't see a reason to make a fuss about it...

Assassin_M
03-30-2013, 03:25 PM
right, and when sequence 8 opens up on the homestead in 1776, i suppose that was an illusion as well was it?

sequence 8 opened up in 1776 and ended in 1775 according to the game's cutscenese - to me, that is VERY poor quality checking by the team
Like I said, oversight...

Just so we`re clear, I`m not excusing any of this nor defending anyone

kizza545
03-30-2013, 03:29 PM
Like I said, oversight...

Just so we`re clear, I`m not excusing any of this nor defending anyone

I didn't say you were, and I agree it is oversight - problem is that it wasn't checked, and it's quite a big mistake to go unchecked

Assassin_M
03-30-2013, 03:31 PM
I didn't say you were, and I agree it is oversight - problem is that it wasn't checked, and it's quite a big mistake to go unchecked
No no, I wasn't telling that last bit to you xD some people here just like to think i`m defending everything Ubisoft does..

I agree with you and this just shows how longer development time can benefit such small details; I don't find it a big deal, though, but you`re right to bring this up, so they can avoid it in the future..

kizza545
03-30-2013, 03:36 PM
No no, I wasn't telling that last bit to you xD some people here just like to think i`m defending everything Ubisoft does..

I agree with you and this just shows how longer development time can benefit such small details; I don't find it a big deal, though, but you`re right to bring this up, so they can avoid it in the future..

ah, it's just we have come into conflict in the past, so I wanted to clarify that I wasn't arguing!

the game itself is fantastic, and after AC2, it's my favourite in the series, but for a AAA game that is so heavily based on history, poor quality checking like this is very disappointing

pirate1802
03-30-2013, 03:40 PM
http://memeorama.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/now-kiss-meme-face.jpg

Assassin_M
03-30-2013, 03:42 PM
ah, it's just we have come into conflict in the past, so I wanted to clarify that I wasn't arguing!

the game itself is fantastic, and after AC2, it's my favourite in the series, but for a AAA game that is so heavily based on history, poor quality checking like this is very disappointing
We had a conflict before ?? Oh wow I can`t remember xD

I bet I was a ****, though....so if I was.......sorry :P

kizza545
03-30-2013, 03:43 PM
We had a conflict before ?? Oh wow I can`t remember xD

I bet I was a ****, though....so if I was.......sorry :P

a while ago, but that's because I don't post much on these forums - anyways, back on topic!

ghostdance69
03-30-2013, 03:44 PM
I just started playing AC3, (yes I know a late comer but got a great price on a new copy), and the first thing I read when the game was booting up is that the game is a Fiction based game by a multicultural team with different religious beliefs. Based on that I don't expect everything to be 100% historically accurate, am I wrong? There is a historical accurate environment with historical characters and such but I don't think everything is 100% accurate as the whole story is fiction to begin with.

Aside from that it's a great open world game but the gameplay is very linear which is a bummer, looking forward to Black Flag. Not to mention I get very frustrated with the stealh parts and not getting noticed, aggravating to say the least. I'm stuck on one part for quite a while now that I just had to turn the game off so I didn't go into overload of head exploding.

nunosilva13
03-30-2013, 04:19 PM
All this discussion isn't anything but bollocks. Sorry for saying it.... What are we based on to say this battle happened on this or that date? Papers? Books? Can't everyone writte a book?

If no1 remembers, i do....Most of our targets on Ac1 didn't die exactly on 1191.... Yes, they died arround that date (1187 for some 1193 for others blablabla) but it's as simple that ubisoft said Templars "changed" history but that what animus shows us, is the truth, and only the truth.

Assassin_M
03-30-2013, 04:23 PM
All this discussion isn't anything but bollocks. Sorry for saying it.... What are we based on to say this battle happened on this or that date? Papers? Books? Can't everyone writte a book?

If no1 remembers, i do....Most of our targets on Ac1 didn't die exactly on 1191.... Yes, they died arround that date (1187 for some 1193 for others blablabla) but it's as simple that ubisoft said Templars "changed" history but that what animus shows us, is the truth, and only the truth.
wait wait, this is actually an error, the sequence opens up in 1776, but the in-game signing (which is chronologically after the opening) takes place in 1775...it`s definitely an error

nunosilva13
03-30-2013, 04:28 PM
wait wait, this is actually an error, the sequence opens up in 1776, but the in-game signing (which is chronologically after the opening) takes place in 1775...it`s definitely an error

Oh, right... I just read the first 4 replies. My mistake :$

pirate1802
03-30-2013, 04:29 PM
Obviously Connor can time travel..

OSantaClownO
03-30-2013, 07:32 PM
Well, you asked, true, based on what you HEARD or SEEN here and there, so it counts to what you KNOW, but no matter...

Each game had historians on staff and there were still errors there as well..

It`d mostly be a BIG "OMG WTF" ERROR to an american. to me, this is simply another independence document...

This is what I like about us Asians ;)


All this discussion isn't anything but bollocks. Sorry for saying it.... What are we based on to say this battle happened on this or that date? Papers? Books? Can't everyone writte a book?

If no1 remembers, i do....Most of our targets on Ac1 didn't die exactly on 1191.... Yes, they died arround that date (1187 for some 1193 for others blablabla) but it's as simple that ubisoft said Templars "changed" history but that what animus shows us, is the truth, and only the truth.

As long as we go back in time, the more inaccurate the dates are. In the 18 century, dates are most likely accurate in a matter of a week.

TRUKITTN
03-30-2013, 11:15 PM
As an American, I'll just go on record saying the date of the signing (in game or otherwise) isn't a huge deal to me. There's plenty of actual debate surrounding the real signing and truly no way to know for certain. As far as what I believe probably happened? It was a hectic time. Most of the representatives were also farmers. Not everyone was present, and it probably took place over several days or even months as some have suggested as the different reps dropped in to put their name down when they could. This is one of the more popular theories, and it makes more sense to me than everyone being there. (Heck, we can't even get all of our congressmen to show up to meetings NOW, why expect punctuality in a time of horse-drawn carriages and lousy, dangerous roads?) Regardless, the important thing isn't the date but the document itself. To be honest, I had a bigger wtf moment when Paul Revere took the ah... b-seat on his famous ride in this game. Hilarious. "Turn left up ahead." I fully expected him to say "Recalculating... TURN RIGHT NOW!!!" At some point.

I'll just chalk up the 1776-1775 thing in the sequence as yet another thing that shouldn't of gotten past QT, but did. :/

Black_Widow9
03-31-2013, 01:56 AM
Check this out-
Declaration History: http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/declaration_history.html

Declaration Facts: http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/treasure/declaration_facts.html

Sajuro
03-31-2013, 06:50 AM
My problem was the Connor was behind every patriot victory it seems. I'm surprised that Washington was able to cross the Delaware without Connor's help, or get in the boat for that matter.
Heck, I wouldn't have been surprised if Connor was the one who suggested the stars and stripes design for the flag

Assassin_M
03-31-2013, 06:54 AM
My problem was the Connor was behind every patriot victory it seems. I'm surprised that Washington was able to cross the Delaware without Connor's help, or get in the boat for that matter.
Heck, I wouldn't have been surprised if Connor was the one who suggested the stars and stripes design for the flag
MOST Patriot victories...and even the Patriots` victories without Connor, were due to Connor`s advices to GW :P LAWL

Anyways, Connor probably raised more American flags than any of the founders.....Connor basically found America...Yeah, he`s your savior

kizza545
03-31-2013, 12:24 PM
Check this out-
Declaration History: http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/declaration_history.html

Declaration Facts: http://www.archives.gov/exhibits/charters/treasure/declaration_facts.html

that just backs up the argument....