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waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 11:14 AM
the simple good old days


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugmZQIDC-mk

this was and still is a great game.Who still loves and plays it, and why?

Assassin_M
03-16-2013, 11:16 AM
*Raises hand*

pirate1802
03-16-2013, 11:30 AM
*Raises both hands*

waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 11:31 AM
why? what brings you back to this 6 year old beast?

Assassin_M
03-16-2013, 11:33 AM
why? what brings you back to this 6 year old beast?
FREEDOM !!

Seriously...

kuled2012
03-16-2013, 11:35 AM
<cries uncontrollably>
WHY UBISOFT!! WHY!?

roostersrule2
03-16-2013, 11:36 AM
I remember the first time I played it, instant love.

pirate1802
03-16-2013, 11:38 AM
I remember the first time I played it, instant love.

I remember the first time I looked over the hill and saw the great walls of Damascus rise in the distance. Love at first sight.. :D

waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 11:42 AM
I had more fun in that 20 min vid *above* then the first 20 mins of the last 2 main AC titles

I can't fully put my finger on it? because it was the first? the passion and love Desilets put into it? Freedom?
Still trying to figure it out

Assassin_M
03-16-2013, 11:44 AM
I had more fun in that 20 mins *above* then the first 20 mins of the last 2 major AC titles

I can't fully put my finger on it? because it was the first? the passion and love Desilets put into it? Freedom?
Still trying to figure it out
Back then, the games weren't trying to pander to millions of fans at the same time...

waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 11:47 AM
Back then, the games weren't trying to pander to millions of fans at the same time...
yet they havent realised there is no need to pander anyone

waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 11:51 AM
Now Désilets is back with Ubisoft, i hope he returns to AC and right the wrongs

kuled2012
03-16-2013, 11:53 AM
Now Désilets is back with Ubisoft, i hope he returns to AC and right the wrongs

He's working on another game 1666. Maybe when he finishes that one.

Assassin_M
03-16-2013, 11:54 AM
Now Désilets is back with Ubisoft, i hope he returns to AC and right the wrongs
I don't think he`ll return to AC anytime soon....or ever actually..For Patrice to have returned to work, he most likely asked for greater creative freedom with his new games and I`m certain Ubisoft agreed to this. Patrice has become a famous name now, I`m pretty sure he was not desperate for work at Ubisoft, who wouldn't want to have the creator of AC on board ? Lots of people...he could`v gone anywhere else, that said, I doubt they`ll let Patrice anywhere near their, as of now, golden goose with the new creative freedom he was given...

waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 11:56 AM
He's working on another game 1666. Maybe when he finishes that one.
and another called Underdog, but still i cant see why he wouldbn't come back to AC in the future, as a producer if anything

saydrix12
03-16-2013, 11:57 AM
am i the only one that thinks the blood when counter killing enemies was the best looking blood in ac game ?

waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 12:01 PM
am i the only one that thinks the blood when counter killing enemies was the best looking blood in ac game ?
i'll agree with that :)
i think most of the counter kills over all were better, the brutal bone breaking sounds. oh god remember breaking the arm with a sword? :P

ACfan443
03-16-2013, 12:02 PM
Watching this was painful with your commentary, I'd tone it down a bit.
However it really does bring back a lot of memories, the music, the combat, the gritty and dark atmosphere. When I think 'Assassin's Creed' I think AC1.


am i the only one that thinks the blood when counter killing enemies was the best looking blood in ac game ?

I totally agree. I've said this numerous times, there's something about AC1's combat that felt truly satisfying and rewarding. It's those awesome counter kills and gory slashes, the sound effects added so much.

waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 12:04 PM
I'd tone it down a bit.

? Elaborate. Tone down volume? attitude? pain from ear infaction? :P

ACfan443
03-16-2013, 12:07 PM
? Elaborate. Tone down volume? attitude? pain from ear infaction? :P

I think you were a little too excited, and spoke a bit too much at times, unnecessarily too. But overall I enjoyed the video. (I'm not trying to offend, just providing feedback)

waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 12:12 PM
I think you were a little too excited, and spoke a bit too much at times, unnecessarily too. But overall I enjoyed the video. (I'm not trying to offend, just providing feedback)
i get what you mean, but that was my legit reaction to playing it after 5 years, it felt just so good lol :D

ACfan443
03-16-2013, 12:17 PM
i get what you mean, but that was my legit reaction to playing it after 5 years, it felt just so good lol :D

I could tell you were enjoying it. Even though I've replayed AC1 quite a few times, each playthrough still feels nostalgic, and brings me back to the day I picked up my PS3 for the first time with this game. It was my first 'next gen' game and so has a special place in my heart :D

waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 12:23 PM
I could tell you were enjoying it. Even though I've replayed AC1 quite a few times, each playthrough still feels nostalgic, and brings me back to the day I picked up my PS3 for the first time with this game. It was my first 'next gen' game and so has a special place in my heart :D

its the game that sold me the idea of getting a PS3 and that wait from getting a PS3 on day 1 release till AC came out was painful lol

lothario-da-be
03-16-2013, 12:48 PM
This vid reminded me why i love ac so much, thanks. And great video btw.

AjinkyaParuleka
03-16-2013, 01:04 PM
That 1 game was soooooooooooooo cool,it instantly climbed the list as the best game,below which was Prince of Persia.

IWGCJoeCool
03-16-2013, 01:11 PM
yep, a simple but sensible Controller scheme, and to be a little sarcastic...wouldnt all those potion & poison bottles, extra weapons, and animal hides & meat, weigh him down? ...not to mention the rattling of all those vials.

the only thing i would wish for is the ability to arial assassinate. other than that, Ubisoft would have needed to do nothing else to keep me coming back. but i guess the market pushes to add more stuff, more complexity, and they have erred to that side of things. they would be afraid that we would see the same thing as stale. it's a fine line to do it right.

JC

x___Luffy___x
03-16-2013, 01:22 PM
the whole atmosphere and feel of the game was awesome.. every city was special in its own way. my favourite was damascus and then acre..
i feel that no other AC game,s cities were as good as the first ac. totally loved the game when i first saw it... and still do.

waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 01:25 PM
yep, a simple but sensible Controller scheme, and to be a little sarcastic...wouldnt all those potion & poison bottles, extra weapons, and animal hides & meat, weigh him down? ...not to mention the rattling of all those vials.

the only thing i would wish for is the ability to arial assassinate. other than that, Ubisoft would have needed to do nothing else to keep me coming back. but i guess the market pushes to add more stuff, more complexity, and they have erred to that side of things. they would be afraid that we would see the same thing as stale. it's a fine line to do it right.

JC

You can arial assassinate in AC1. I do it at 17:00 in the vid at the start of the thread

LightRey
03-16-2013, 02:00 PM
You can arial assassinate in AC1. I do it at 17:00 in the vid at the start of the thread
Still can't believe there are people out there that never figured that out.

roostersrule2
03-16-2013, 02:07 PM
Still can't believe there are people out there that never figured that out.It's funny how people want Ubi to stop holding there hands during games yet something like this is still widely unknown.

TheHumanTowel
03-16-2013, 02:11 PM
Still can't believe there are people out there that never figured that out.
Well it's not like the game told you you could do it or how to. You literally just had to stumble upon it.

pacmanate
03-16-2013, 02:12 PM
*raises both hand and raises his :O*

Megas_Doux
03-16-2013, 02:15 PM
Ac1's atmosphere, freedom + AC3' gameplay mechanics such freerunning, weather, season and stealth = Best AC game ever!!!!!!
My two favorite ones and in which I enjoy freeroaming the most.

waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 02:20 PM
Well it's not like the game told you you could do it or how to. You literally just had to stumble upon it.

think there was hint the popped up very rarely, but i love the idea of not being told about some moves, you just find and hone them over time. rather then "there's a mission decicated to learning 1 skill"

TheHumanTowel
03-16-2013, 02:28 PM
think there was hint the popped up very rarely, but i love the idea of not being told about some moves, you just find and hone them over time. rather then "there's a mission decicated to learning 1 skill"
Ah maybe for skills that aren't as important as air assassination. I love AC1 but not telling the player they could air assassinate isn't a positive point for me.

waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 02:38 PM
Ah maybe for skills that aren't as important as air assassination. I love AC1 but not telling the player they could air assassinate isn't a positive point for me.

its not that imprortant, its not like it's none existance would be a game breaker. Think of it like the classic arcade mortal kombat where therewere no hints or guides in-game. When you learn a new combo, how epic you felt discovering it, like its your little secret lol

serialkeyler
03-16-2013, 02:39 PM
A great depiction of what the Middle Ages looked like. Solemnity, ritualism and darkness... The game was just very attractive in its own way...

SixKeys
03-16-2013, 02:57 PM
Still can't believe there are people out there that never figured that out.

Not that strange. In the sequels you could air-assassinate from any height, in AC1 you could only be a few feet above the ground. It's pretty much like the fact that there's vaulting over objects in the game, only it looks more like a glitch than an actual feature due to the stiff animation.

AC1 will always have a special place in my heart. It's not even the nostalgia factor so much since I only started playing these games 3 years ago.

Sushiglutton
03-16-2013, 03:32 PM
Playing devils advocate here for a moment. There is in principal nothing in that vid that you can't do in AC3 (except for the silly monk-blend). You can ride around, run around and engage enemies in AC3 just as in AC1. I will admit though that there are a lot of fun structures/guard posts in the Kingdom that you can play around with without any mission structure, which is nice.

Now about the combat system. You seem a bit confused about it. If you listen to the vid at 17+ one can hear how you are spamming the attack button. Then after you are able to kill a guard by tapping the counter button at the right moment you cry out: "So simple and basic (...) it requires you #¤"% brain, not beating the buttons". This is nostalgia at its finest. What you have just done doesn't require the use of your brain at all, it's all about reflexes. The only reason why AC1 feels harder is tighter counter windows. But that isn't an example of a complex, deep and strategic combat system. It's an example of a primitive, twitch based system.

waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 05:11 PM
Playing devils advocate here for a moment. There is in principal nothing in that vid that you can't do in AC3 (except for the silly monk-blend). You can ride around, run around and engage enemies in AC3 just as in AC1. I will admit though that there are a lot of fun structures/guard posts in the Kingdom that you can play around with without any mission structure, which is nice.

Now about the combat system. You seem a bit confused about it. If you listen to the vid at 17+ one can hear how you are spamming the attack button. Then after you are able to kill a guard by tapping the counter button at the right moment you cry out: "So simple and basic (...) it requires you #¤"% brain, not beating the buttons". This is nostalgia at its finest. What you have just done doesn't require the use of your brain at all, it's all about reflexes. The only reason why AC1 feels harder is tighter counter windows. But that isn't an example of a complex, deep and strategic combat system. It's an example of a primitive, twitch based system.


your reflexes are controled, by your brain. this so called primitive, twitch based system is more strategic the later AC's. It does been more brains because there is no attack indicator and no 360 degree easy auto block and of course i'm button bashing, thats what I and you have been condistioned to do over the last 3 AC games

SixKeys
03-16-2013, 05:21 PM
Now about the combat system. You seem a bit confused about it. If you listen to the vid at 17+ one can hear how you are spamming the attack button. Then after you are able to kill a guard by tapping the counter button at the right moment you cry out: "So simple and basic (...) it requires you #¤"% brain, not beating the buttons". This is nostalgia at its finest. What you have just done doesn't require the use of your brain at all, it's all about reflexes. The only reason why AC1 feels harder is tighter counter windows. But that isn't an example of a complex, deep and strategic combat system. It's an example of a primitive, twitch based system.

In addition to the smaller counter windows, I would argue that another feature that makes the combat (somewhat) challenging is that it doesn't flow as smoothly as in later games. I'm replaying AC2 at the moment and the combat system is similar to AC1, just easier. After getting used to AC3's combat, going back I'm noticing how much longer each battle takes in the older games. Starting with ACB you had chain kills which made combat a lot more flowing. In AC1 and AC2 it's all about wailing on your enemy with a sword until there's an opening, just like in RL. The enemies are blocking a lot more and in AC1 they could also counter. If there's one thing I miss from AC1's combat it's that the enemies were able to kick you, rendering you helpless for a while. Not even the AC3 archetypes can do that.

Honestly, while AC3 has more archetypes, it still comes down to button-mashing. I don't remember any individual strategies for each enemy type, I just get through each battle by spamming E (counter). So in essence AC3's combat is not any more advanced than AC1, you can still button-mash your way through.

ProletariatPleb
03-16-2013, 05:25 PM
Nobody called me for this thread ._. AC1 is the love of my life.

Sushiglutton
03-16-2013, 05:41 PM
your reflexes are controled, by your brain. this so called primitive, twitch based system is more strategic the later AC's. It does been more brains because there is no attack indicator and no 360 degree easy auto block and of course i'm button bashing, thats what I and you have been condistioned to do over the last 3 AC games

I thought that by "brain" you mean the concious part. How is tapping a button when an enemy attack in any way strategic? Could you please elaborate on this point!

AC3 punishes button mashing. If you button mash the block button you will throw enemies around, since B+B = throw. Instead you need to tap B once and then follow up with another tap of say X (depending on enemy). That is the opposite to button mashing as you have to adjsust to what is happening and calmly tap buttons one at the time. (If you button-mash the attack button, enemies will also punish you.)

The attack indicator is easy to turn off in the HUD menu. I always play without indicators in AC3.

Megas_Doux
03-16-2013, 05:57 PM
To me, combat during Ezio's trilogy = boooooring and easy. At least in AC3 you can actually die....

nitres15
03-16-2013, 06:02 PM
im re-playing right now. I really like it, though is has some obvious flaws. Some of which you refuse to accept

TheHumanTowel
03-16-2013, 06:04 PM
To me, combat during Ezio's trilogy = boooooring and easy. At least in AC3 you can actually die....
I remember actually trying to die in Brotherhood. I just stood there and let the guards hit me. I honestly couldn't die. They'd get me down to no health and then that period would happen when the screen flashes red but it took so long for any guard to try and hit me by the time they did my health had already come back. That was pretty awful.

Sushiglutton
03-16-2013, 06:15 PM
In addition to the smaller counter windows, I would argue that another feature that makes the combat (somewhat) challenging is that it doesn't flow as smoothly as in later games. I'm replaying AC2 at the moment and the combat system is similar to AC1, just easier. After getting used to AC3's combat, going back I'm noticing how much longer each battle takes in the older games. Starting with ACB you had chain kills which made combat a lot more flowing. In AC1 and AC2 it's all about wailing on your enemy with a sword until there's an opening, just like in RL. The enemies are blocking a lot more and in AC1 they could also counter. If there's one thing I miss from AC1's combat it's that the enemies were able to kick you, rendering you helpless for a while. Not even the AC3 archetypes can do that.

Honestly, while AC3 has more archetypes, it still comes down to button-mashing. I don't remember any individual strategies for each enemy type, I just get through each battle by spamming E (counter). So in essence AC3's combat is not any more advanced than AC1, you can still button-mash your way through.


This is a matter of taste ofc. I think maintaining a flow is something a lot of people finds satisyfing. It's also a good measure of how well you completed the entire fight, namely if you were able to do it in one streak.

Another of the basic ideas behind the Arkham system (AC3 uses a variation of it, but the same ideas applies) is that it's easy to survive, but somewhat challenging to perfect. That is a great idea for a massive AAA franchise as it allows the weaker players to progress while at the same time give the better players something to strive for (aka maintaining the flow while fighting as varied as possible). Some old-school gamers do not get this idea. They are used to survival being the only acceptable type of challenge. Their natural reflex is to find a strategy that is as simple as possible and then keep spamming that until they win. That is not the way to approach an Arkham type system, because it's not designed to be hard to survive. The challenge and fun is to perfect (flow+variation)! No offense :).

About waiting for enemies to attack. To me that is one of the greatest weaknesses of AC1. Your defensive move (counter kill) is so much better and safer than your offensive alternatives. This encourages people to "turtle" (aka just hold block and tap counter when an enemy attack). It's not a well balanced system in that sense. I think it's better if you are encouraged to use a mix of the two, such as for example in AC3. I personally prefer a system that favours aggresion somewhat as I feel that is more empowering. Another waty to say this is that AC3 encourages initiative, while AC1 encourages waiting for someone else to take the initiative.

All this being said the combat system in AC3 is by no means perfect. To me it's much better and more technically advanced (from a design pov) than AC1 though.

Sushiglutton
03-16-2013, 06:17 PM
I remember actually trying to die in Brotherhood. I just stood there and let the guards hit me. I honestly couldn't die. They'd get me down to no health and then that period would happen when the screen flashes red but it took so long for any guard to try and hit me by the time they did my health had already come back. That was pretty awful.

Have done the same thing, it's broken. One hilarious thing is that the guards armed with spears can't attack you on the ground. So after they do their leg-sweep they just keep stabbing into thin air :D.

AjinkyaParuleka
03-16-2013, 06:20 PM
IF..if AC4 has the freedom of AC1,small counter window(the time pause idea of ac3 wasn't good,made combat easier),guards kicking you,Social Stealth,freerunning of ac3,combat system,graphics,character development overtime.Hell it would be the best game ever.

Megas_Doux
03-16-2013, 06:32 PM
Combat in ACB = MEHHH

ProletariatPleb
03-16-2013, 06:34 PM
Except AC3's combat system is like a broken Arkham combat system. I don't hate it, but I don't like it too much either.

Megas_Doux
03-16-2013, 06:38 PM
I remember actually trying to die in Brotherhood. I just stood there and let the guards hit me. I honestly couldn't die. They'd get me down to no health and then that period would happen when the screen flashes red but it took so long for any guard to try and hit me by the time they did my health had already come back. That was pretty awful.

Even with the armor removing glitch I had a lot trouble trying to die haha. However in AC3, if you are surrounded by jagers and just because you miss a counter, you might end up dead.



This is a matter of taste ofc. I think maintaining a flow is something a lot of people finds satisyfing. It's also a good measure of how well you completed the entire fight, namely if you were able to do it in one streak.


All this being said the combat system in AC3 is by no means perfect. To me it's much better and more technically advanced (from a design pov) than AC1 though.
LOL at the nick!!! I guess it is a matter of perspective, but I think combat in AC3 is a HUGE step forward


Have done the same thing, it's broken. One hilarious thing is that the guards armed with spears can't attack you on the ground. So after they do their leg-sweep they just keep stabbing into thin air :D.

That was sad, No comments!


IF..if AC4 has the freedom of AC1,small counter window(the time pause idea of ac3 wasn't good,made combat easier),guards kicking you,Social Stealth,freerunning of ac3,combat system,graphics,character development overtime.Hell it would be the best game ever.

THIS!!!

If Ubisoft manages to combine the best from AC1 and the best from AC3, then we mean business....



PD I know that is something regarding their own personal tastes, but I just dont see how can ACB be the best in the series.

waynedavies89
03-16-2013, 07:05 PM
Lets move onto the story.
I loved Altair's story, with the balancing of heavy social commentery, philosophy and violence of the time. AC3 tried to do this, but didnt reach the level of intrigue in AC1, maybe thats because the american revolution didnt appeal to me as much as the crusades

what are your likes and dilikes of the AC1 story?

ProletariatPleb
03-16-2013, 07:07 PM
what are your likes and dilikes of the AC1 story?
Likes - Everything.
Dislikes - The storytelling was somewhat "fragmented" could've used better storytelling.

Frank9182011
03-16-2013, 07:09 PM
im re-playing right now. I really like it, though is has some obvious flaws. Some of which you refuse to accept

This.

Caveat: I love AC1.

However, among other issues, the "freedom" you all speak of is marred by questionable game design decisions.

Take, for instance, roaming the Kingdom looking for flags. The process often goes like this: do everything in your power to be as stealthy as possible, guards still notice you for whatever reason, either run away or stick around to fight them, spending the next 10-15 minutes holding R1 and hitting square occasionally until all guards are gone, collect flag, rinse, repeat.

As much as I adore the game, this takes a process that is more fun in future games (gathering collectables) and renders it repetitive, frustrating, and, ultimately, boring, due to some structural game design flaws.

ProletariatPleb
03-16-2013, 07:10 PM
This.

Caveat: I love AC1.

However, among other issues, the "freedom" you all speak of is marred by questionable game design decisions.

Take, for instance, roaming the Kingdom looking for flags. The process often goes like this: do everything in your power to be as stealthy as possible, guards still notice you for whatever reason, either run away or stick around to fight them, spending the next 10-15 minutes holding R1 and hitting square occasionally until all guards are gone, collect flag, rinse, repeat.

As much as I adore the game, this takes a process that is more fun in future games (gathering collectables) and renders it repetitive, frustrating, and, ultimately, boring, due to some structural game design flaws.
But why would you collect flags? They were put there as a joke.

Frank9182011
03-16-2013, 07:17 PM
But why would you collect flags? They were put there as a joke.

For the same reason you gather collectables in other games: to spend more time with the game in the game's world.

However, the process in my first post applies to other, more "core" aspects of the game as well. I arbitrarily chose collectable gathering as an example.

Soulid_Snake
03-17-2013, 02:47 AM
When Patrice made AC, it was about creating a experience. Now it's about making money! :(

Assassin_M
03-17-2013, 02:58 AM
For the same reason you gather collectables in other games: to spend more time with the game in the game's world.

However, the process in my first post applies to other, more "core" aspects of the game as well. I arbitrarily chose collectable gathering as an example.
If you thought AC i`s combat was JUST holding R1 and pressing square occasionally then your argument is moot..

cstrike105
03-17-2013, 03:59 AM
What are your likes and dislikes of the AC1 story?

Basically, this. It's all about the philosophy within the game itself that made me realize, "holy s**t, this gon' be an awesome franchise."


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_sEyky7NlY

SixKeys
03-17-2013, 05:13 AM
This is a matter of taste ofc. I think maintaining a flow is something a lot of people finds satisyfing. It's also a good measure of how well you completed the entire fight, namely if you were able to do it in one streak.

Another of the basic ideas behind the Arkham system (AC3 uses a variation of it, but the same ideas applies) is that it's easy to survive, but somewhat challenging to perfect. That is a great idea for a massive AAA franchise as it allows the weaker players to progress while at the same time give the better players something to strive for (aka maintaining the flow while fighting as varied as possible). Some old-school gamers do not get this idea. They are used to survival being the only acceptable type of challenge. Their natural reflex is to find a strategy that is as simple as possible and then keep spamming that until they win. That is not the way to approach an Arkham type system, because it's not designed to be hard to survive. The challenge and fun is to perfect (flow+variation)! No offense :).

About waiting for enemies to attack. To me that is one of the greatest weaknesses of AC1. Your defensive move (counter kill) is so much better and safer than your offensive alternatives. This encourages people to "turtle" (aka just hold block and tap counter when an enemy attack). It's not a well balanced system in that sense. I think it's better if you are encouraged to use a mix of the two, such as for example in AC3. I personally prefer a system that favours aggresion somewhat as I feel that is more empowering. Another waty to say this is that AC3 encourages initiative, while AC1 encourages waiting for someone else to take the initiative.

All this being said the combat system in AC3 is by no means perfect. To me it's much better and more technically advanced (from a design pov) than AC1 though.

I've never cared much for the combat in AC, I prefer to just get it out of the way as quickly as possible. So I agree, it's a matter of taste and AC3's system is probably good for those who care about perfecting their attacks. I'm not one of them, so I just mash ALL the buttons. ;) ACB's combat system is my fave because while it's ridiculously easy, it has the best flow and makes me feel like a badass with little effort. Every fight in ACB can be over in seconds once you get a chain kill going, allowing me to get back to more enjoyable things like exploring. I understand people who complain about it though because it is super easy and if you enjoy combat, it offers no challenge at all.

ACfan443
03-17-2013, 12:04 PM
Basically, this. It's all about the philosophy within the game itself that made me realize, "holy s**t, this gon' be an awesome franchise."


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y_sEyky7NlY

That music.
It just elevates the atmosphere and makes the dialogue even more badass. I loved the exchanges between Altair and Al Mualim.

DTfunjumper
03-17-2013, 04:28 PM
When the clothing made sense.... Sure!

kriegerdesgottes
03-17-2013, 04:37 PM
AC1 was a fantastic game. It emphasized freedom and being able to play however you want to play and not how Ubisoft wanted you to play. It was revolutionary for its time.

Frank9182011
03-17-2013, 05:19 PM
If you thought AC i`s combat was JUST holding R1 and pressing square occasionally then your argument is moot..

What?

That is literally all that is required of you in virtually any AC1 battle.

Assassin_M
03-17-2013, 05:23 PM
What?

That is literally all that is required of you in virtually any AC1 battle.
Nope..more like an Option, but not what`s required......the combat has more layers than that..

is that how you played AC I ?

pacmanate
03-17-2013, 05:30 PM
Nope..more like an Option, but not what`s required......the combat has more layers than that..

is that how you played AC I ?

Hardly, just press attack 3 times in succession to get a kill animation or counter. There are not more layers, there is 1.

Assassin_M
03-17-2013, 05:39 PM
Hardly, just press attack 3 times in succession to get a kill animation or counter. There are not more layers, there is 1.
go play AC I again...

Combo kills are more than just "attack 3 times in succession"

You`re confusing AC I with ACBrainless

TheHumanTowel
03-17-2013, 05:43 PM
go play AC I again...

Combo kills are more than just "attack 3 times in succession"

You`re confusing AC I with ACBrainless
Press attack 3 times but time it with your sword strike. Come on guys. AC1 combat was good but let's not pretend it was some deep and complex experience.

Assassin_M
03-17-2013, 05:46 PM
Press attack 3 times but time it with your sword strike. Come on guys. AC1 combat was good but let's not pretend it was some deep and complex experience.
Never said it was this deep complex thing..

just more than just hold R1 and press square and 3 successive strikes

TheHumanTowel
03-17-2013, 05:49 PM
Never said it was this deep complex thing..

just more than just hold R1 and press square and 3 successive strikes
You would seem to imply that talking about how the combat has "layers".

Assassin_M
03-17-2013, 05:51 PM
You would seem to imply that talking about how the combat has "layers".
It does...

having multiple layers does not mean depth or complexity...

ACB had lots of layers...complex and deep ? Heck no

Farlander1991
03-17-2013, 05:56 PM
Let's face it, counter-attack breaks the AC1 combat system. It's not a bad system per se (battles with Templars without counter-attack are particularly fun), but if there's a dominant strategy that is 'press the same buttons over and over again', it doesn't matter how deep, layered, or complex the system is. It's broken. And yeah, we can always say 'it is just an option' or 'if you do not like it, then do not use it', but these arguments don't really cut it. If the player has to force himself to not use the dominant strategy which counter-attack is, then it's a broken system.

EDIT: And, actually, ACB combat system has quite a few things going for it, but it's not like anybody knows or cares about them, because... well, counter-attack and kill streak break the system completely.

Megas_Doux
03-17-2013, 05:59 PM
I feel that, despite the fact that combat is not - and probably will never be- hard in this series, both AC1 and AC3 are two steps forward from what we had during Ezio´s trilogy.....
Mostly on ACB!

D.I.D.
03-17-2013, 06:37 PM
I feel that, despite the fact that combat is not - and probably will never be- hard in this series, both AC1 and AC3 are two steps forward from what we had during Ezio´s trilogy.....
Mostly on ACB!

All they really need to do is change the opponent AI. If the enemies were allowed to behave like guards (i.e. actually try to kill you) then they would attack at the same time. You'd be wary of two enemies and very reticent about attacking three or more. A good player would be able to disengage, move, and attack when they'd shifted the alignment of enemies to his/her advantage, and a button-masher would have a pretty difficult time. I think it would make both offensive and stealth play much more fun if the combat provided more stress; you'd feel more on edge creeping past enemies, and if you decided to take them on then it would be much more tense.

Assassin_M
03-17-2013, 06:40 PM
All they really need to do is change the opponent AI. If the enemies were allowed to behave like guards (i.e. actually try to kill you) then they would attack at the same time. You'd be wary of two enemies and very reticent about attacking three or more. A good player would be able to disengage, move, and attack when they'd shifted the alignment of enemies to his/her advantage, and a button-masher would have a pretty difficult time. I think it would make both offensive and stealth play much more fun if the combat provided more stress; you'd feel more on edge creeping past enemies, and if you decided to take them on then it would be much more tense.
And have Kotaku complain about how it took poor ol` them 28 times to pass a certain combat level..

Due to people like Kotaku, we`ll never have challenging anything..

ajl992008
03-17-2013, 06:46 PM
the main thing I miss from ac1 is the freedom and open mission design, otherwise I like all the changes in more recent assassins creed games, If they deliver on their promise on bringing back the open ended assassination missions in ac4 then I will be satisfied as in my opinion that's the only thing missing. had ac3 did this it would have been perfect in my opinion, the only thing I thought was lacking in ac3 was that some of the assassinations were too scripted.

D.I.D.
03-17-2013, 06:52 PM
And have Kotaku complain about how it took poor ol` them 28 times to pass a certain combat level..

Due to people like Kotaku, we`ll never have challenging anything..

One writer. There is no person.

Also, I wouldn't call that level challenging in any interesting way. It's poorly designed.

Yes, the guy took a baffling number of tries to do it, mainly because he was apparently trying to jump through a hole that was actually an invisible wall, but his beef was to do with it being the final level of a game with an awful design. I have no idea how anyone can contest that. Everything was building up to this moment, and it was weak. The cut scene afterwards was quite good*, but I don't play games for their cut scenes.

*Mine was spoiled a little bit because as Connor walked up to the door, a horse and cart was coming around the corner and the horses decided they wanted to come into the pub too. Kind of ruined the moment!

Assassin_M
03-17-2013, 07:06 PM
One writer. There is no person.

Also, I wouldn't call that level challenging in any interesting way. It's poorly designed.

Yes, the guy took a baffling number of tries to do it, mainly because he was apparently trying to jump through a hole that was actually an invisible wall, but his beef was to do with it being the final level of a game with an awful design. I have no idea how anyone can contest that. Everything was building up to this moment, and it was weak. The cut scene afterwards was quite good*, but I don't play games for their cut scenes.

*Mine was spoiled a little bit because as Connor walked up to the door, a horse and cart was coming around the corner and the horses decided they wanted to come into the pub too. Kind of ruined the moment!
No idea how it was poorly designed...if poorly designed refer to what comes after in your post, then that`s not poor design..that`s poor narrative...there was nothing wrong with the design of this level...It was annoying maybe, but design flaws ? Not really..

And anyone who calls it difficult is a 3 year old...

Jexx21
03-17-2013, 07:37 PM
The good old days? The days are still good.

They just need to have more time in between releases + better QA.

Just extend the time between games from a year to a year and 1-3 quarters.

So say Black Flag comes out October 31/November 1st 2013, and the next AC comes out March/April 2015.

ajl992008
03-17-2013, 07:42 PM
The good old days? The days are still good.

They just need to have more time in between releases + better QA.

I agree except for more time between releases, the games have been amazing and I want ac to stay yearly if they keep up with the quality they have been so far, the minute I see a drop in quality then they should take a break but so far, nah they are doing fine. I don't think i can wait 2/3 years for an ac game, too long.

waynedavies89
03-17-2013, 08:11 PM
If you want to talk about combat, I completely forgot that AC1 has light and heavy attacks (tap the button or hold it down)

Jexx21
03-17-2013, 08:23 PM
i didn't

D.I.D.
03-17-2013, 08:51 PM
No idea how it was poorly designed...if poorly designed refer to what comes after in your post, then that`s not poor design..that`s poor narrative...there was nothing wrong with the design of this level...It was annoying maybe, but design flaws ? Not really..

And anyone who calls it difficult is a 3 year old...

This is the thing: rather than take on board the criticisms, people did what they so often do: find a small thing to pick at, in order to derail the real meaning of the article. "Oh I did it first time". "This guy's a noob". "He's just bad at games, therefore his opinion is bad". "This guy hates AC, he's just a hater".

The level was so flawed, you could flip it the other way; what was good about the Lee chase? The graphics were pretty, sort of? The construction and the paths were godawful, and that's the problem here - there was nothing satisfying about chasing Charles Lee, and in fact you weren't even chasing Charles Lee. And he was right to say that this particular sync requirement was stupid. If this was a level you'd enjoy playing again, then it would make sense to have a tricky sync assignment, but this like so many other AC3 missions was not enjoyable the first time. He said it feels thrown together, and it really does. You spend the whole game watching Connor ask "Where is Charles Lee?", and it ended up being a build-up to nothing, in gameplay terms.

(And no, that was just an AI flaw before the final Lee cutscene, where Connor got pushed through the door of the pub by a pair of thirsty horses. So instead of seeing the moody walk from behind Connor's back, I had horses' ears either side of him as they shunted him through the door. At least it was funny.)

emperior
03-18-2013, 12:36 AM
I'm replaying it and it's very good.
A little too repetitive but still very good.
And combat is really challenging... it's easier to escape then fighting, and stealth approach is the best to kill the templars, but isn't easy to do.

Assassin_M
03-18-2013, 12:43 AM
This is the thing: rather than take on board the criticisms, people did what they so often do: find a small thing to pick at, in order to derail the real meaning of the article. "Oh I did it first time". "This guy's a noob". "He's just bad at games, therefore his opinion is bad". "This guy hates AC, he's just a hater".

The level was so flawed, you could flip it the other way; what was good about the Lee chase? The graphics were pretty, sort of? The construction and the paths were godawful, and that's the problem here - there was nothing satisfying about chasing Charles Lee, and in fact you weren't even chasing Charles Lee. And he was right to say that this particular sync requirement was stupid. If this was a level you'd enjoy play again, then it makes sense to have a tricky sync assignment, but this like so many other AC3 missions was not enjoyable the first time. He said it feels thrown together, and it really does. You spend the whole game watching Connor ask "Where is Charles Lee?", and it ended up being a build-up to nothing, in gameplay terms.

(And no, that was just an AI flaw before the final Lee cutscene, where Connor got pushed through the door of the pub by a pair of thirsty horses. So instead of seeing the moody walk from behind Connor's back, I had horses' ears either side of him as they shunted him through the door. At least it was funny.)
I never said it was a mission made in heaven. There was nothing inherently bad with the design of the level itself and no it was not difficult. saying it`s difficult is not criticism, but egos being too big to admit that maybe one DOES suck at it.

There`s more than one route towards lee that`ll get you 100% and they`re all pretty fair..please how explain how the construction of the paths was godawful..

monster_rambo
03-18-2013, 02:16 AM
ah..I remember the first trailer for Assassin's Creed and the playthrough in Jerusalem. The good old days.

XgasmloverX
03-18-2013, 03:05 AM
Look at dat postcount

jeebus

LoyalACFan
03-18-2013, 06:46 AM
Assassinating Sibrand was one of my favorite moments in the series. Hopped out there from boat to boat like a ninja, then cut his throat when nobody was looking...



Please, Black Flag, don't be lying about your epic non-linear assassinations... :nonchalance:

ArabianFrost
03-18-2013, 09:26 AM
Man, from Prince of Persia to Assassin's Creed. I really do admire Dèsolates' interest in Middle Eastern culture.

lothario-da-be
03-18-2013, 05:00 PM
Assassinating Sibrand was one of my favorite moments in the series. Hopped out there from boat to boat like a ninja, then cut his throat when nobody was looking...



Please, Black Flag, don't be lying about your epic non-linear assassinations... :nonchalance:
I wouldn't hope too much. There is an interview with Hutchingsen ( i know its spelled wrong) where he says ac3 will have a more open mission structure.

RinoTheBouncer
03-18-2013, 05:04 PM
I like it and still play and enjoy it.
On the other hand, I find Ezio's games more entertaining due to the lack of repetition, and the amazing protagonist, cutscenes and how there's a bigger role for modern day gameplay and so much interesting stuff like TWCB.

Bastiaen
03-18-2013, 05:18 PM
Just finished another replay. Still love it. Of course, I love all the AC games. I'm currently replaying AC2 and AC3 Liberation.

ACfan443
03-18-2013, 05:51 PM
Assassinating Sibrand was one of my favorite moments in the series. Hopped out there from boat to boat like a ninja, then cut his throat when nobody was looking...



Please, Black Flag, don't be lying about your epic non-linear assassinations... :nonchalance:

If they stay true to their promise, my faith in the series will be somewhat restored. I really want Black Flag to be good.

waynedavies89
03-18-2013, 05:59 PM
Remember how good the main assassinations were? The little character driven cutscenes, then simple told to get him? without silly sub orders like "do not get detected for 100% sync"


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3Ic0PM-UfU

pirate1802
03-18-2013, 06:14 PM
They need to get rid of the constraints, and make then like in Deus Ex: You get an extra something if you managed to pull it off without getting detected, or without causing unnecessary casualties. But it needs to be an EXTRA reward, whatever it is, maybe just an achievement, and not taking away from your existing rewards (like the full-sync conditions do.)

lothario-da-be
03-18-2013, 06:19 PM
They need to get rid of the constraints, and make then like in Deus Ex: You get an extra something if you managed to pull it off without getting detected, or without causing unnecessary casualties. But it needs to be an EXTRA reward, whatever it is, maybe just an achievement, and not taking away from your existing rewards (like the full-sync conditions do.)
Full sync shows too clearly YOU FAILED TO GET 100% SYNC

pirate1802
03-18-2013, 06:27 PM
Full sync shows too clearly YOU FAILED TO GET 100% SYNC

Which is what I don't like. I mean it should be like: you should be able to full sync if you rambo your way in, you should full sync if you stealth your way in. But you get an extra reward if you use stealth. Like extra money or a weapon or something else.

ACfan443
03-18-2013, 06:41 PM
Remember how good the main assassinations were? The little character driven cutscenes, then simple told to get him? without silly sub orders like "do not get detected for 100% sync"


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3Ic0PM-UfU

I just love AC1's assassinations. Cutscene, plan, kill, cutscene, run away. Simple but awesome. (Even though your particular assassination didn't go to plan :p)

yly3
03-18-2013, 06:56 PM
I still cannot believe how great the AC1 graphics are. It's the lighting or I don't know but everything FEELS real, since AC2 everything is cartoonish then added more polygons by the sequel that's all.
I still stand to my statement that AC1 has the best graphics period.

Locopells
03-18-2013, 07:11 PM
Assassinating Sibrand was one of my favorite moments in the series. Hopped out there from boat to boat like a ninja, then cut his throat when nobody was looking...

Me personal favourite as well. Once of the few you could pull of without actually being seen...

LoyalACFan
03-18-2013, 07:46 PM
I wouldn't hope too much. There is an interview with Hutchingsen ( i know its spelled wrong) where he says ac3 will have a more open mission structure.

Yeah, I know. Still, enough people have *****ed about the linearity in AC3 that I'm hoping they'll actually deliver this time. But I'm not holding my breath.

waynedavies89
03-18-2013, 07:51 PM
I just love AC1's assassinations. Cutscene, plan, kill, cutscene, run away. Simple but awesome. (Even though your particular assassination didn't go to plan :p)

True haha i trolled him a little to long, still killed him though so it still a victory haha. Next one i will do better

ACfan443
03-18-2013, 08:29 PM
Yeah, I know. Still, enough people have *****ed about the linearity in AC3 that I'm hoping they'll actually deliver this time. But I'm not holding my breath.

Considering they said development on BF began a year before AC3's release, how are they supposed to act on feedback? How do they know we want open ended assassinations? It baffles me.

hellomrdarcy
03-18-2013, 08:36 PM
AC1 is a piece of fantastic art.

LoyalACFan
03-18-2013, 08:50 PM
Considering they said development on BF began a year before AC3's release, how are they supposed to act on feedback? How do they know we want open ended assassinations? It baffles me.

They still had time for almost a full year of development after AC3 came out. Considering the entirety of Revelations was made from the ground up in about 9 months, it's reasonable to hope they could at least revise their assassination missions based on feedback they got from last fall.

And it's not like AC3 was the first time that the assassinations were criticized. Even in Brotherhood, and especially Revelations, people (rightfully) complained about the fairly restrictive mission structure in the assassination sequences, as well as the overall lack of major targets (we only got four in Brotherhood and three in Revelations). They've also said there will be MORE assassinations than in AC1, so we know for a fact that we'll have at least 10 targets. I don't think they'd tell us a boldfaced lie about that, even bearing in mind the canoes and frozen lakes...

lothario-da-be
03-18-2013, 08:51 PM
They still had time for almost a full year of development after AC3 came out. Considering the entirety of Revelations was made from the ground up in about 9 months, it's reasonable to hope they could at least revise their assassination missions based on feedback they got from last fall.

And it's not like AC3 was the first time that the assassinations were criticized. Even in Brotherhood, and especially Revelations, people (rightfully) complained about the fairly restrictive mission structure in the assassination sequences, as well as the overall lack of major targets (we only got four in Brotherhood and three in Revelations). They've also said there will be MORE assassinations than in AC1, so we know for a fact that we'll have at least 10 targets. I don't think they'd tell us a boldfaced lie about that, even bearing in mind the canoes and frozen lakes...
And in the first weeks they mostly do research and develop the story.

luckyto
03-18-2013, 08:58 PM
Loved that game. Love that game. There is still something magic about it.

One of my favorite features that is never mentioned about AC1 is that the time of day doesn't change. The sun stays still. Shadows don't constantly move in weird pixellated ways like it successors. As much as I enjoy the day/night; I also think it moves way too fast. There is something more real about having the sun not visibly moving... it just seems more believable.

And it still has the best combat system. Though I think AC3 is the best version of combat since AC1.

IronEagl3
03-18-2013, 09:46 PM
Loved that game. Love that game. There is still something magic about it.

One of my favorite features that is never mentioned about AC1 is that the time of day doesn't change. The sun stays still. Shadows don't constantly move in weird pixellated ways like it successors. As much as I enjoy the day/night; I also think it moves way too fast. There is something more real about having the sun not visibly moving... it just seems more believable.

And it still has the best combat system. Though I think AC3 is the best version of combat since AC1.

I believe that AC1 had a good atmosphere because it was constantly day. I would LOVE to see the cities at night, but during the day time, the holyness of the land really kicked in. Also, i agree with you on the combat, but I still think AC1 is the best combat system. It was so smooth, and when the swords clanged together it felt so real.

luckyto
03-18-2013, 10:35 PM
Right on! :)

Think about it, if you are outside during the summer, or anywhere near the equator... the sun doesn't just move constantly. It takes quite a long time for you to notice. And in that sense, AC1 just handled shadows and clouds much more believably. In every game since AC2, you can stand in one spot and literally watch the shadows move. Plus, the shadows in AC1 from clouds were much softer, more like real shadows. Put that with better graphics and nice ambient noise and it creates a much better atmosphere....

It just lacks the crowd AI that later games had.

abcdelm45084
03-18-2013, 11:15 PM
Played it in december to get the achievments. Fantastic game. IMO the best AC game. Especially the story altair is still my favorite assassin and the modern story was so mysterious at that time it was really fun to speculate what everything meant in the end and reading all thoose emails. Still enjoying the other games but still AC1 is in the top.

Locopells
03-19-2013, 10:41 PM
I personally like the unique feel that all the games have. That said, I generally like the original entries in any series the best.

tinrisky
03-19-2013, 11:04 PM
I can tell you with great sadness in my heart that maybe a little less than half the AC community don't know who Robert De Sable is or know the 3 tenets of the Creed. Which is strange because it's Assassin's CREED.

emperior
03-19-2013, 11:34 PM
By the way Assassin's Creed 1 was good but the best AC game has been AC2.

HeedfulMass4856
03-19-2013, 11:45 PM
AC1 is the best. Why? Because it stayed true to the roots of the franchise's topic: being an Assassin and only an Assassin.

emperior
03-19-2013, 11:50 PM
AC2 was way better than the first. Hands down.

Sushiglutton
03-20-2013, 12:05 AM
AC1 is the best. Why? Because it stayed true to the roots of the franchise's topic: being an Assassin and only an Assassin.

Staying true to the roots is kind of a given for the first entry in a franchiers ;)

HeedfulMass4856
03-20-2013, 12:08 AM
Staying true to the roots is kind of a given for the first entry in a franchiers ;)
franchiers? But yeah, I didn't quite think about that...*scratches head*

joey-4321_web
03-20-2013, 12:14 AM
AC1 is the best. Why? Because it stayed true to the roots of the franchise's topic: being an Assassin and only an Assassin.

yeah man in the newer games they're giving the assassins character. I don't ****ing play AC for character! I PLAY AC TO KILL PEOPLE WITH HIDDEN BLADES!!!! GOD D****T UBISOFT GET RID OF THE GOD**N PEOPLE!!!!! WAAAAAHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!

Megas_Doux
03-20-2013, 12:19 AM
AC2 was way better than the first. Hands down.

It is a matter of perspectives and personal tastes!

I prefer ACI and AC3 over AC2 because their story and combat! Although I admit AC2 beats them in terms of mission design,, mostly the third one...

Assassin_M
03-20-2013, 12:45 AM
AC2 was way better than the first. Hands down.
I disagree hands down...

For me, AC II does not hold a candle to AC I..

Assassin_M
03-20-2013, 12:46 AM
I can tell you with great sadness in my heart that maybe a little less than half the AC community don't know who Robert De Sable is or know the 3 tenets of the Creed. Which is strange because it's Assassin's CREED.
Why is it sadness ? less than half don't know Robert nor the Creed...that`s good actually

waynedavies89
03-20-2013, 05:33 AM
Why is it sadness ? less than half don't know Robert nor the Creed...that`s good actually

I agree, it just shows who the, "pure bloods" so to speak, really are. If you can from memory resite the 3 tennents from memory, your a real Assassin! :cool:
haha

Assassin_M
03-20-2013, 07:42 AM
I agree, it just shows who the, "pure bloods" so to speak, really are. If you can from memory resite the 3 tennents from memory, your a real Assassin! :cool:
haha
I can quote lines from all the games on the spot..

what about that ?

pirate1802
03-20-2013, 07:59 AM
I can quote lines from all the games on the spot..

what about that ?

AC nerd

Assassin_M
03-20-2013, 08:01 AM
AC nerd
Maybe I just have a better brain :|