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View Full Version : Sequel and the HVT - My Desperate Plea to Ubisoft



Charity Diary
03-08-2013, 08:56 AM
(Isn't "Sequel and the HVT" a great name for a band!?)



Ubisoft:

I thoroughly enjoyed - and still enjoy - Ghost Recon: Future Soldier. It is my favorite adversarial multi-player game, hands down. I have almost no beefs with the game, apart from the connection issues. However, there is one aspect of the game I'd really like to see changed, if you guys are planning on making a sequel.

Please rethink the HVT objectives in the Conflict gametype. I'd prefer it if they were completely absent in the sequel, but if you guys find a way to make them more balanced or something, I'd be okay with that.

Let me explain it like this. I will attribute different numerical values to the different types of Conflict objectives. A 1 signifies minimal difficulty,and higher numbers signify increased difficulty.

Enemy HVT Objective at your spawn: 0
Neutral Objective at your spawn: 1
Defense Objective at your spawn: 2
Neutral Objective in the middle of the map: 3
Defense Objective at enemy's spawn: 4
Neutral Objective at enemy's spawn: 5
HVT Objective at enemy's spawn: 7

(These values disregard the potential ordering of objectives, where an HVT objective at the start of the match would actually add difficulty points to the base value.)

HVT's are the hardest objectives in this gametype because (1) they are directly at the enemy team's spawn, (2) if your HVT dies, you lose, and (3) you could potentially become HVT at any time, even right before being meleed in the back. I've even became HVT while incapacitated. This makes this objective really unbalanced.

Another huge problem with this is that the objectives are random. For example, I played a match recently where my team got three HVT objectives in a row, and the other three objectives were a neutral objective in the enemy spawn, a defense objective in the enemy spawn, and a neutral objective in the center of the map.

This means that my team had a difficulty of 7+7+7+5+4+3= 36 while the enemy team had a difficulty of 0+0+0+1+2+3= 6

This shows how, in a random environment, objective difficulty for each time will hardly ever be equal. This issue is blown WAY out of proportion by the HVT objectives.

Please consider removing these objectives from the sequel, if you haven't done so already. I would also appreciate further objective balancing, such as the removal of the possibility of a team having a defense objective at their spawn as the first objective of the match, or the removal of the possibility of one team having multiple defense objectives in a row. Of course, these things must not take precedence over the HVT issue, as the HVT objective is perhaps the factor that unbalances the game the most, and the most often.

It is my opinion that game balance should always take precedence over realism, and although HVT objectives are realistic, they simply are not balanced.

So please consider these factors when working on the sequel. Thanks!

A GR Fan
~Charity Diary

Sturnz0r
03-08-2013, 07:15 PM
No doubt they've already got a new algorithm to the random generator, or they've weighted them similar to what you have

they could also make hvt objectives a little less random; obiously they should have the hvtbe in a safe place... maybe have the goal be in a place closer to spawn, but have a freeze time before teh hvt can interract.. i just think the suspense of being hvt is too much to be left out of some of all of the gametypes

EvilPixieGrrr
03-08-2013, 11:18 PM
I'll be sure your suggestions are passed along. :) Thanks for all your feedback!

Charity Diary
03-09-2013, 12:16 AM
No doubt they've already got a new algorithm to the random generator, or they've weighted them similar to what you have

they could also make hvt objectives a little less random; obiously they should have the hvtbe in a safe place... maybe have the goal be in a place closer to spawn, but have a freeze time before teh hvt can interract.. i just think the suspense of being hvt is too much to be left out of some of all of the gametypes

Eh, guess I just don't feel the "suspense". Honestly, whenever I become HVT (which is every match), I just grenade myself to save my team the time we would have wasted trying to get that objective.

I guess I just hate being the HVT because I'm an LMG Rifleman, and I love laying beside the objective and suppressing an entire direction while my team interacts with it. Me being the HVT usually just ends up with me killing four or five people, then trying to take the objective, but since no one's suppressing the enemies, they just kill me. I'm simply not spec'd to be HVT.

tr3ntmc89
03-09-2013, 02:14 AM
So long as the HVT isnt the first objective and both teams get one HVT objective each, then im happy.
First objective should always be a neutral objective in the very middle, then that allows a strong HVT to be selected the following objective.

I personally enjoy the HVT objective, it encourages interaction, teamwork and some tactics.
I had a friendly random frag me off the objective once while i was HVT and capping it. All because we were team killing each other and he couldnt wait a minute.

If your by yourself with randoms then the HVT can be near impossible sometimes, however it should still kept, just make it even.

Charity Diary
03-09-2013, 02:33 AM
So long as the HVT isnt the first objective and both teams get one HVT objective each, then im happy.
First objective should always be a neutral objective in the very middle, then that allows a strong HVT to be selected the following objective.

I personally enjoy the HVT objective, it encourages interaction, teamwork and some tactics.
I had a friendly random frag me off the objective once while i was HVT and capping it. All because we were team killing each other and he couldnt wait a minute.

If your by yourself with randoms then the HVT can be near impossible sometimes, however it should still kept, just make it even.

It can never be even because of objective ordering. If the second objective is Bodark HVT, and the final objective is Ghost HVT, the Bodark HVT objective will be moderately difficult, while the Ghost HVT objective will be either easy or impossible, because the team that's winning will have set up shop in good areas around the map, and the team that's losing will be getting somewhat spawn-trapped.

The only way to make it even is to change the reward and punishment system for the HVT objective. If a team successfully completes the HVT objective, they get 200 points instead of the normal 100. However, if they fail, no one gets any points. This way, if a team tries for the impossibly unbalanced HVT objective that was randomly handed to them, the only penalty they will incur is a loss of time they could have used to capture other objectives. As of now, whenever the opposing team gets an HVT objective, the game basically hands your team 100 points, free of charge.

Charity Diary
03-09-2013, 03:46 AM
I've thought about it, and I think my idea above, about the HVT objective giving a 200-point reward if successful, and NO point reward for the opposing team if failed, is an excellent idea.

If a team is winning, and they get an HVT objective, they can simply try to wait it out to avoid having another objective the enemy could capture, or they could try for it to get 200 extra points.

If a team is losing, and they get an HVT objective, they can try for the 200 extra points if they want, or they can just die quickly to get another objective that's less impossible for them to complete.

Of course, the HVT should not be allowed to enter their own spawn boundaries, so that they can't just camp in their own spawn and wait it out...

mzkina
03-09-2013, 12:03 PM
Eh, guess I just don't feel the "suspense". Honestly, whenever I become HVT (which is every match), I just grenade myself to save my team the time we would have wasted trying to get that objective.


No, don't do that.
Killing yourself instantly when you are HVT give more advantage to your enemy.

Charity Diary
03-09-2013, 12:12 PM
No, don't do that.
Killing yourself instantly when you are HVT give more advantage to your enemy.

If Ubisoft would simply pull some statistics, they would see that the HVT objective is failed about 95 out of 100 tries, excluding games where one team is being spawn-trapped the entire game. If you actually have to work for your objectives, if there is actually some competition in the game, you have about a 5% chance of succeeding.

I would much rather get the HVT objective over with so that my team can use that extra time to maybe capture another objective that we otherwise could not have captured. If I DON'T kill myself, I'll just die 2 minutes later, and we will have lost those 2 minutes. If I kill myself as soon as I become HVT, then we can use those 2 extra minutes to catch up in points.

Kodie Collings
03-09-2013, 12:54 PM
I personally love the HVT objective. It requires full teamwork, tactics and brings out the importance of survival.
Yes there are moments of unluckiness when someone becomes the HVT then dies or if a base is being spawn trapped. But if a base is being spawn trapped there are many places to hide in the base, waiting until you push the enemy back out.

I think the HVT objective should happen for one team and the start and for the other team near the end of the game.
But when the HVT objective is coming there should be a warning 10 seconds before he is chosen for players to prepare.

Charity Diary
03-09-2013, 01:03 PM
I personally love the HVT objective. It requires full teamwork, tactics and brings out the importance of survival.
Yes there are moments of unluckiness when someone becomes the HVT then dies or if a base is being spawn trapped. But if a base is being spawn trapped there are many places to hide in the base, waiting until you push the enemy back out.

I think the HVT objective should happen for one team and the start and for the other team near the end of the game.
But when the HVT objective is coming there should be a warning 10 seconds before he is chosen for players to prepare.

Giving one team an HVT at the beginning of the match would essentially just give the opposing team 100 free points.

This is why I think that the HVT objective should either be removed, or be completely optional. It is simply too unbalanced to be present in a randomized objective system without screwing one team over in most matches.

mzkina
03-09-2013, 01:22 PM
If Ubisoft would simply pull some statistics, they would see that the HVT objective is failed about 95 out of 100 tries, excluding games where one team is being spawn-trapped the entire game. If you actually have to work for your objectives, if there is actually some competition in the game, you have about a 5% chance of succeeding.

I would much rather get the HVT objective over with so that my team can use that extra time to maybe capture another objective that we otherwise could not have captured. If I DON'T kill myself, I'll just die 2 minutes later, and we will have lost those 2 minutes. If I kill myself as soon as I become HVT, then we can use those 2 extra minutes to catch up in points.
That's why I say don't do that.

I will try to explain this but don't know you understand or not, English is not my mother tongue.

Every game we got 15 minutes, each objective will take 2 minutes and 30 seconds.

Each map(I don't know the DLC) will have 7 objective locations, Underground is special having 8 objective locations (2 inside the bridge office).

Objective location will separate like near spawn and middle of map, all of them can be sensor or supply objective, those near spawn some can be HVT and some can be EMP.

Some map only have 2 objective location for EMP and HVT like Cargo, some have 3 like Pipeline. One special map is Harbor, Bodark only have 2 HVT and EMP objective location but Ghost will have 3, I am not so sure but I never see HVT and EMP objective at the train station.

Last thing, objective location won't reuse until all of them have been used.

So basically we will have at least 6 objective in a game, that means if we use up all 2:30 of each objective, we won't getting the 7th objective.

As I said above, HVT only will be on some locations, when you used it, the remain time won't have any more HVT for the remain time unless all objective locations are used.

Like Cargo, you won't get more than 2 HVT within 7 objectives cycle, because the middle line location won't be HVT or EMP, so if you have HVT at start and kill yourself instantly, you get 1/18 chance having one more escort HVT objective at the remain time which I guess still OK, but if you kill yourself instantly twice when having HVT, the chance that having more escort HVT objective is 1/11 (total having 22 objectives can be final and 2 of them are escort HVT) of the remaining match. Killing yourself help nothing, it brings more chance to having another HVT objective at the end of the game.

If you waste up both HVT objective time, you only get 10 minutes remain for 5 objective point, which almost guaranteeing you will not get anymore more escort HVT for the remain time unless enemy have 2 escort HVT and dead quickly. You only need to take 3 and hold 1 down, it having big chance that 2 of them are near your spawn, and may be EMP or HVT.
If you play the 8th objective, you still need capture at least 2 and hold down 3 at the first 7 objective cycle, and get the 8th objective, I don't see this will be more easier to do...

If you lose the HVT objective anyway why not try to get some advantage even losing.
Think how will affect the match before do something, it seems not a big deal but sometime it decides who win the match.

Charity Diary
03-09-2013, 01:34 PM
My point is that the odds of succeeding at an HVT objective are so low, that it actually gives my team an INCREASED probability of winning if I just kill myself as HVT immediately.

I've been in numerous games (too many to count) where my team won because I did kill myself as soon as I got HVT. We managed to catch up, and we got one more objective at the very end that put us ahead of the other team. Without the extra time I gave my team by killing myself, we would have lost.

Simply put, in games where the teams are somewhat even in skill, you are NOT going to complete an HVT objective. It's easier to just kill yourself and move on to the next objective, and hope to catch up that way.

mzkina
03-09-2013, 02:05 PM
Maybe using a real match to explain, I was playing with some random against maybe a full party.


They are really good so I tell those random player do exactly what I say, and thank god they are not deaf.


The first objective I said just hold it down, don't take it because you will die and enemy will break the line, just hold it.
So both of us can't take it, and the second objective is HVT, I am the HVT so I hide inside the spawn, the match remain is less than 10 minutes.


The next one is kill HVT, he is just out side of our spawn so I give him a bullet and got the objective very quickly.


Then we take the following objective at the last second, we winning one objective now, remain time is about 7 minutes, than next objective, we still able to take it.


We winning two objective now, only about 5 minutes and 2 locations remaining, they want to win they need to capture both of them, but we only need take 1 objective or just hold down 1 objective to 100% winning this game. Or we can go back to the spawn and resupply each other to win by teamwork point.


If I kill myself while the HVT objective, we will have 3 more objective to go, and the final one can be anything, we still need 1 objective to win the game or need to hold down at least 2 of them, but the last objective can be escort HVT or destroy EMP or can be near their spawn, then we will lose the match, I won't bet on it.



Losing 1 objective you need 2 more objectives to take back the score, but a sensor and supply objective will use up all the time you earned from killing yourself, if you not having EMP or kill HVT objective, your suicide is meaningless.


Suicide only works when you have one or two minutes left and the score is fifty fifty, then you can bet on having a kill HVT or destroy EMP on the next objective, otherwise you need teamwork point to win even you take the extra objective.

lll zeke lll
03-11-2013, 11:48 PM
A couple of nights ago I was in a game of Conflict on Pipeline with ITK5 and we had 5-6 HVT objectives back to back. That is to say, one of us was HVT then one of the enemy was HVT and so on. It was crazy, I've never seen that before. We won with a final score of like 945 - 24. I like the HVT objective as it is... It's meant to be hard. It generally takes excellent teamwork and communication to cap that objective. An interesting stat to see is how many times you've been designated a High Value Target vs how many times you've capped it successfully.

Charity Diary
03-12-2013, 12:51 AM
I like the HVT objective as it is... It's meant to be hard. It generally takes excellent teamwork and communication to cap that objective.

This is exactly my point. You guys just don't understand....

This game is supposed to be BALANCED and COMPETITIVE. An objective that's 10x as hard as the other objectives has no place in a game where the objectives are RANDOM. I don't care if it's tactical or whatever BS you puke out of your face to justify it to yourself; it simply is not balanced. In fact, in most matches I play that aren't completely one-sided, the team that loses only loses because they got 2 HVT objectives while the other team got none, or something similar.

If you want to put the HVT objective in it's own gametype, where it's the only objective, that's fine. But in Conflict, when my team is essentially playing tug-of-war with the other team, and the game's like, "Okay team, the next objective is in their spawn, only this time, if you die, you lose. Oh, and I know you're incapacitated right now, but you just became HVT."... That just doesn't belong in the game. If you're not going to have every objective be balanced and even, then why have multiplayer in the first place? It just screws people over.

BubonicBeast
03-12-2013, 11:42 AM
I would simply give HVT to a team getting battered, no penalty for not completing the objective, no extra points given to the HVT for kills so it isn't abused. If the winning team don't drop back to the objective the losing team will get easy points; which will also help (a bit) with stopping the winning team spawn camp.

Charity Diary
03-12-2013, 12:21 PM
I would simply give HVT to a team getting battered, no penalty for not completing the objective, no extra points given to the HVT for kills so it isn't abused. If the winning team don't drop back to the objective the losing team will get easy points; which will also help (a bit) with stopping the winning team spawn camp.

Well, what if the HVT objective and the alternate deployment mechanic were combined?

I'm just gonna make this scenario up, so forgive me if it's not perfect:

Ghost team is winning by 400 points, and Bodark team is being spawn-trapped. The objective is at Bodark spawn, and Ghost team is protecting it pretty well. On Bodark's second or third alternate deployment, they get an HVT objective. Everyone that dies is deployed at the alternate spawn somewhere on the map, and an HVT objective is added at a random location with the first Bodark player to take alternate deployment becoming the HVT.

So now there are two objectives on the map. The first one at Bodark spawn, and the secondary HVT objective at a random location. Ghost team must protect the primary objective, but if the HVT captures the secondary HVT objective, Bodark team gets 100 points. However, if the HVT dies, Ghost team does not get 100 points. So the HVT objective is simply an optional way for Bodark to get some extra points, or at least an incentive for Ghost team to have to back off of Bodark's spawn in order to protect both objectives.

Sounds like a pretty good idea to me!

meathead_79
03-12-2013, 05:07 PM
I still think my idea is easiest. I want to have dual HVTs, each team gets it at the same time. Not only that, the team to capture it first wins, and the other teams HVT becomes a regular guy again. This way you have to decide if you wna tot have 3 people defend, and 3 people protect your HVT, ro go all out on one of them.

Charity Diary
03-12-2013, 06:03 PM
I still think my idea is easiest. I want to have dual HVTs, each team gets it at the same time. Not only that, the team to capture it first wins, and the other teams HVT becomes a regular guy again. This way you have to decide if you wna tot have 3 people defend, and 3 people protect your HVT, ro go all out on one of them.

Still, that would have some unfair elements to it, such as objective ordering and the actual 'crowning' of the HVTs. One HVT could be in combat and die as soon as he's crowned, or the HVT objectives could be given right after an EMP Defense objective at one team's spawn, making it unfair for one team.

The only way to make it balanced is to remove it. That, or just make it an optional objective occasionally paired with an alternate deployment, as I described above.

Charity Diary
03-12-2013, 06:04 PM
I get accused of being a "f*ggot"...

Their words, not mine.

mattshotcha
03-12-2013, 06:41 PM
I think the HVT is a great objective like Kodie said. Relies on teamwork. I would love to see an HVT only game mode in the future like Team Leader from Rainbow Six.

But on topic, I think in regards to Conflict maybe have all the objectives random as they are now, except HVT. Have the HVT only come up as an equalizer. If one team is winning 300+ to Less than 100 have an HVT objective just as it is now come up to give the losing team a boost at getting back into the fight. Everytime a team leads by 2 objectives or more, pop em with an HVT. A good team would then be able to plan for it solving the surprise issue and the struggling team would get a chance to level the board and keep it a closer fight.

Charity Diary
03-12-2013, 06:51 PM
I think the HVT is a great objective like Kodie said. Relies on teamwork. I would love to see an HVT only game mode in the future like Team Leader from Rainbow Six.

But on topic, I think in regards to Conflict maybe have all the objectives random as they are now, except HVT. Have the HVT only come up as an equalizer. If one team is winning 300+ to Less than 100 have an HVT objective just as it is now come up to give the losing team a boost at getting back into the fight. Everytime a team leads by 2 objectives or more, pop em with an HVT. A good team would then be able to plan for it solving the surprise issue and the struggling team would get a chance to level the board and keep it a closer fight.

I guess. It's an alright concept, it's just executed in an unbalanced way.

reaper1032
03-12-2013, 09:40 PM
I agree. The HVT objectives are really a slap in the face. Very, very unbalanced. 9/10 the HVT will get killed by

1. Random head-shot.

2. Claymores/stun mines

3. Siega 12 with dragons breath.

Very pointless. It gets to a point where the entire match is based around who gets the HVT. It can turn the match around VERY quickly and I've seen it much too often. Especially since I am the HVT every time. Punished for doing good. Unfair. The HVT objective should be in the middle of the map. Not the enemy spawn, force teamates to spread out and clear a way. Also, maybe give the HVT some kind of new class that has access to heavier armor. One the can withstand a few head-shots, And take more damage.

Charity Diary
03-12-2013, 09:44 PM
Also, maybe give the HVT some kind of new class that has access to heavier armor. One the can withstand a few head-shots, And take more damage.

Yeah, maybe like a Commando class or something. The announcer would say, "We're inserting a Commando into your unit. Protect him while he uploads the data," or something like that.

meathead_79
03-12-2013, 09:47 PM
Yeah, maybe like a Commando class or something. The announcer would say, "We're inserting a Commando into your unit. Protect him while he uploads the data," or something like that.

At first I loved this idea, but ever try playing with AI? He would probably walk right through a fire fight, or get stuck on a rock LOL.

reaper1032
03-12-2013, 09:47 PM
Yeah, maybe like a Commando class or something. The announcer would say, "We're inserting a Commando into your unit. Protect him while he uploads the data," or something like that.

Sounds reasonable. Not exactly sure how it would give you the option to switch classes mid battle. But it sounds somewhat balanced. Maybe down on the D-pad to respawn or something.

Charity Diary
03-12-2013, 09:54 PM
At first I loved this idea, but ever try playing with AI? He would probably walk right through a fire fight, or get stuck on a rock LOL.

Well, a human player would be the Commando (HVT). Whoever was respawning at the time, I guess.

Charity Diary
03-15-2013, 01:52 AM
Just ran into a stun mine, and while I was being hacked, I became the HVT -_-

Sighhhhhhhh

Maybe I hate this objective so much because I typically always get HVT, but I constantly get stuck on teams where no one can do anything. For example, I just played a round where the rest of my team kept getting trapped in our spawn while I was running around, killing people. I got HVT like 3 times that match, but I didn't even care, because I knew we weren't going to get any of the objectives. The game ended, and I had 35 kills, while the other people on my team had 2, 2, 1, 0, and 0, with a combined like 100 deaths.

This is why HVT is unbalanced. You can't always play on a decent squad, and it's unfair to put a 100-point burden on ONE GUY for ONE LIFE, especially when his teammates could get better scores by simply killing themselves all game.

Phoenixmgs
03-15-2013, 11:32 AM
I don't see the problem with the HVT objective except for how someone just becomes the HVT no matter what's is going on. Maybe the next person that spawns should be HVT (like someone mentioned) or at least give like a 5 second warning to the person that's about to be HVT (if you die in that time, it goes to someone else obviously). The worst objectives in the game are the supply and sensor objectives right near the enemy's spawn because not only do you have to capture the objective, but then you have to defend it. That's much harder than the HVT objective especially when teams are evenly matched.

Charity Diary
03-15-2013, 12:57 PM
I don't see the problem with the HVT objective except for how someone just becomes the HVT no matter what's is going on. Maybe the next person that spawns should be HVT (like someone mentioned) or at least give like a 5 second warning to the person that's about to be HVT (if you die in that time, it goes to someone else obviously). The worst objectives in the game are the supply and sensor objectives right near the enemy's spawn because not only do you have to capture the objective, but then you have to defend it. That's much harder than the HVT objective especially when teams are evenly matched.

Consider how much death is involved in capturing one objective. With evenly matched teams, one team might die three or four times per person in order to capture a heavily contested objective. To just say, "Okay, you can't die now, or you lose. Oh, and it's in their spawn," is just a slap in the face to that team.

Phoenixmgs
03-15-2013, 07:51 PM
Consider how much death is involved in capturing one objective. With evenly matched teams, one team might die three or four times per person in order to capture a heavily contested objective. To just say, "Okay, you can't die now, or you lose. Oh, and it's in their spawn," is just a slap in the face to that team.

But the HVT doesn't have to be involved in all that death. The HVT goes in last, just like the player with the bomb in any standard bomb mode. And having the HVT in the middle of the map would be broken too, one-shot defend objectives (whether EMPs or HVTs) should be on your side of the map. How cheap would it be if there was just a EMP objective to defend in your spawn and your team just barely held them off, now you get an HVT defend objective that's in the middle of the map while the other team has pushed up onto your side of map due to that last EMP objective and now that HVT objective is pretty much a freebie for them?

Charity Diary
03-15-2013, 08:10 PM
But the HVT doesn't have to be involved in all that death. The HVT goes in last, just like the player with the bomb in any standard bomb mode.

That's stupid, then. Why take the best player on the team and make him stay back, while his teammates have to try to overtake the enemy's spawn while simultaneously protecting him? That's even more unbalanced than I previously thought.

Phoenixmgs
03-15-2013, 08:24 PM
That's stupid, then. Why take the best player on the team and make him stay back, while his teammates have to try to overtake the enemy's spawn while simultaneously protecting him? That's even more unbalanced than I previously thought.

I said in my previous post that the HVT selection should be changed, but the concept of the objective itself is fine. HVT is basically the same objective as any bomb mode like GRFS's own Saboteur, it's a tried and true mode that has been around for over a decade.

Charity Diary
03-15-2013, 08:27 PM
I said in my previous post that the HVT selection should be changed, but the concept of the objective itself is fine. HVT is basically the same objective as any bomb mode like GRFS's own Saboteur, it's a tried and true mode that has been around for over a decade.

But it shouldn't be mixed in with the normal objectives, especially not if the objectives are random, because it screws over the team that gets more HVT objectives.

I still think the idea I suggested a page or two ago would be best... just make the HVT an optional secondary objective that a team gets when it uses an alternate deployment, with no punishment for failing.

Charity Diary
03-15-2013, 09:29 PM
The main problem with the mode is who is picked and the points.

Perhaps the score should only be given to the defending team if they actually kill the HVT. That way the attacking team can decide to push for the points or hold. Chuck in meatheads suggestion that both teams get HVT at the same time and add that if the HVT enters their own spawn the barriers come down and the other team can get in.

I'd go for that.

Machofish
04-03-2013, 03:31 PM
Let's just take a step back and look at this:
This is an escort mission. IN A MULTIPLAYER GAME.

Escort missions are never fun. It doesn't work in single player. It sure as hell doesn't work in multiplayer. Why don't any gaming studios understand that?

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/EscortMission

There it is. The only way this would be made slightly less terrible was if the HVT objective could be captured at the rate of the objective in Siege. Other than that, it's better off being removed from the game.

Charity Diary
04-03-2013, 10:48 PM
Let's just take a step back and look at this:
This is an escort mission. IN A MULTIPLAYER GAME.

Escort missions are never fun. It doesn't work in single player. It sure as hell doesn't work in multiplayer. Why don't any gaming studios understand that?

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/EscortMission

There it is. The only way this would be made slightly less terrible was if the HVT objective could be captured at the rate of the objective in Siege. Other than that, it's better off being removed from the game.

Totally agree. I really enjoy your analogy comparing the HVT objective to babysitting, although since I'm the HVT most of the time, I often feel like I'm the one babysitting the other players. I'm like, "Come on, little fellas, let's all go to the objective and get some ice cream. I just killed everyone here, come on and get some free candy before they respawn and kill me. Or, you know, just stay on the other side of the map... You're getting a time-out!

Phoenixmgs
04-04-2013, 01:07 AM
Let's just take a step back and look at this:
This is an escort mission. IN A MULTIPLAYER GAME.

Escort missions are never fun. It doesn't work in single player. It sure as hell doesn't work in multiplayer. Why don't any gaming studios understand that?

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/EscortMission

There it is. The only way this would be made slightly less terrible was if the HVT objective could be captured at the rate of the objective in Siege. Other than that, it's better off being removed from the game.

Escort missions are hated mainly because of horrible friendly AI. One of the best games ever made, ICO, is just one big escort mission.

Escort missions in multiplayer games make up some of the most loved modes like Defuse from CounterStrike and Search & Destroy from COD. Saboteur is also basically an escort mission too.

The HVT objective filling up as fast as Siege would be broken.

subzero_214
04-04-2013, 12:01 PM
I like the HVT but it depends on the team you play with. I have been HVT twice a few times in one match, completed one, died on the other. You need a good team around you but I think it would have been better if the objective was in the middle of the maps, some were like in the market map, it's been next to the spawn area of the opposition.

PublicVermin
04-04-2013, 12:31 PM
I like the HVT but it depends on the team you play with. I have been HVT twice a few times in one match, completed one, died on the other. You need a good team around you but I think it would have been better if the objective was in the middle of the maps, some were like in the market map, it's been next to the spawn area of the opposition.

i couldn't care less how good my team is, it was a poorly thought out OBJ by ubisuck. It should have been done like the HVT type OBJ was done in Killzone 3. 30 second timer letting everyone know that an HVT will be selected, that way, if i'm in first place, i know to get my *** to cover. The worse is when i am at the respawn screen and it makes me HVT and we automatically lose, how stupid could the devs have been? Not to mentiomn i'm completly sick of getting them 2 or 3 times EVERY match like we have been all week, without the other team getting 1. And chew on this Sub, how good can your team be when the tubes start coming in when the HVT starts to take it?

Charity Diary
04-04-2013, 01:32 PM
i couldn't care less how good my team is, it was a poorly thought out OBJ by ubisuck. It should have been done like the HVT type OBJ was done in Killzone 3. 30 second timer letting everyone know that an HVT will be selected, that way, if i'm in first place, i know to get my *** to cover. The worse is when i am at the respawn screen and it makes me HVT and we automatically lose, how stupid could the devs have been? Not to mentiomn i'm completly sick of getting them 2 or 3 times EVERY match like we have been all week, without the other team getting 1. And chew on this Sub, how good can your team be when the tubes start coming in when the HVT starts to take it?

A bit aggressive for my tastes, but I agree with you nonetheless.

I'm sick of babysitting my teammates, and I'm even more sick of having to babysit them while I'm HVT 99% of the time. I don't care how "team-oriented" you are, or how much you love a challenge - the HVT objective is simply not fun or balanced in any way. We can't all play on stacked teams constantly, and I'm tired of being the HVT 3 times every game, only to make it to the objective and take out four or five enemies before I ultimately die because my team isn't entirely participating. If I wanted to babysit people who join Future Soldier matches only to set the controller down while they doodle in their coloring book, I'd babysit actual children.

PublicVermin
04-04-2013, 08:58 PM
A bit aggressive for my tastes, but I agree with you nonetheless.

Didn't mean to come off as aggressive (sorry if it seemed that way, Sub), just really aggravated with how the game handles it's most populated mode.