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View Full Version : A Slight Grievance, otherwise a great game.....



Rogue Agent 035
12-28-2012, 04:31 AM
I'm currently on my 2nd full run through an am on sequence 9, actually yet to start. Anyway...., I'm tryin fer the Original Gamer Achievement an fer the love that's all that's holy..., ubi, please, next time..., make the AI a bit believable. As in Fanarona, I've been up as many as 5 chips to Achilies 2, an everytime..., no matter what move I make that's well within the rules an obviously should lead to a winning game on my behalf..., miraculously turns out disasterous an I end up loosing everytime. I'm not sayin that you should dump down the AI so it's too easy, just give us some wiggle room fer god sakes I'm mean I've went through $100 just tryin ta beat him an have yet to accomplish that feat, as well as the innkeeper which I dread mercifly. Outside of that...., great game, well put together, an plenty to do, love it.



Thanks fer yer time.......



Rogue Agent 035

TheSpong
12-28-2012, 07:25 AM
I despise the games in AC3, but that's partly to do with the setting/time period. I hate all the games in Red Dead Redemption too. Poker, Fanorona, Liar's Dice, Nine Man Morris, that ridiculous bowling game that makes no sense - they're all mind-numbing crap. I particularly despise that bowling game in AC3 because it was forced on me during a Homestead mission and there was absolutely NO ****ING EXPLANATION AT ALL as to how it was supposed to be played or how I was supposed to win.

So, if the next patch could remove the games entirely, that would be awesome IMO.

LoyalACFan
12-28-2012, 08:01 AM
Yeah, Fanorona is a stupid game regardless of the AI. It's almost impossible to approach an enemy piece if you're more than 1 spot away, because they can just move toward you and then you're screwed. It's like a caveman version of Checkers. But part of the problem is that the game is programmed to a point where it's literally impossible for the opponent to miss an opportunity to score. Since there's a built-in requirement that EVERY move must be a scoring move if possible, the computer analyzes every possible square that would let the opponent score, and they always go for the right one. Which makes the game kind of boring, since the computer hinders you in the same way by highlighting your only available moves. It essentially plays itself.

Assassin_M
12-28-2012, 08:31 AM
What about this guy ??

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=64ar37WY2Uc

Or him ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mGAd2wbfIg

Or this one ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DqKQ5uFkxKg

Do they all manage some kind of Alien telepathy ??? "OH NOEZZZ ISS SO BORINGZ BECAUSE I CANT WIN THESE GAMES ARE SUCKING CHICKEN YAAA SO ESTUPID"

For ****`s sake, guys...Not targeted at OP

Sushiglutton
12-28-2012, 10:35 AM
Since I'm a intelligent chap I very much appreciate that Ubi made the boardgames for real. It's pretty much the only part of the game that requires some thought. But as soon as something in this franchise challenge the player even remotely, people come here to whine about it and it is removed from the sequel. That's why AC has become the "go to green marker, press button to interact"-kind of game that it is today. It's sad :(.

LoyalACFan
12-28-2012, 11:12 AM
What about this guy ??

(bunch of videos)

Do they all manage some kind of Alien telepathy ??? "OH NOEZZZ ISS SO BORINGZ BECAUSE I CANT WIN THESE GAMES ARE SUCKING CHICKEN YAAA SO ESTUPID"

For ****`s sake, guys...Not targeted at OP

I never said it was impossible... Just hard, stupid, and not very fun. I've beaten it a few times myself for the Original Gamer trophy and the gambling challenge for the thieves, without the use of a guide, but I'll never go back to it because it's not enjoyable in the slightest. And none of you who enjoyed it should be claiming it required strategic thought... All your moves are highlighted and essentially dictated by the computer.

Sushiglutton
12-28-2012, 01:02 PM
I never said it was impossible... Just hard, stupid, and not very fun. I've beaten it a few times myself for the Original Gamer trophy and the gambling challenge for the thieves, without the use of a guide, but I'll never go back to it because it's not enjoyable in the slightest. And none of you who enjoyed it should be claiming it required strategic thought... All your moves are highlighted and essentially dictated by the computer.

That the computer highlights possible moves doesn't really affect the challenge level. And yes it requires strategic thought. Why did you beat it "a few times" if you didn't enjoy it? You need to beat it once for the trophy that's it. No other challenge requires it.

Rogue Agent 035
12-28-2012, 07:51 PM
Since I'm a intelligent chap I very much appreciate that Ubi made the boardgames for real. It's pretty much the only part of the game that requires some thought. But as soon as something in this franchise challenge the player even remotely, people come here to whine about it and it is removed from the sequel. That's why AC has become the "go to green marker, press button to interact"-kind of game that it is today. It's sad :(.


I know what ya mean, I'm an avid chess player myself have been since college. Though what I was making refference to was the obvious blatened illegal moves the AI seems to be pulling in order to win. I beat Achilies numerous times since posting this with my own method. An given the devs said that this was a jump on point for new ppl to the series, I just wanted to drop my two cents on what they should consider in the next installment if they continue with a similar type setting.\

Sushiglutton
12-28-2012, 08:15 PM
I know what ya mean, I'm an avid chess player myself have been since college. Though what I was making refference to was the obvious blatened illegal moves the AI seems to be pulling in order to win. I beat Achilies numerous times since posting this with my own method. An given the devs said that this was a jump on point for new ppl to the series, I just wanted to drop my two cents on what they should consider in the next installment if they continue with a similar type setting.\

I have never seen any illegal moves, but the rules are a bit tricky so it may seem like that at first (I know I was pretty suprised a couple of times before I got it).

Maybe they should have removed the achievement attached to it. People are obsessive about these virtual rewards and if there was no achivement I bet we would see no complaints (doing stuff in games because they are fun is a less common approach).

It was nothing personal, it's just that I've been a fan of this franchise a long time (not a member on these boards as long as you though ;) ) and it's depressing how stupid the games still are. As a chessplayer you probably no what I mean.

TheSpong
12-28-2012, 08:15 PM
I know what ya mean, I'm an avid chess player myself have been since college. Though what I was making refference to was the obvious blatened illegal moves the AI seems to be pulling in order to win.

I kind of had the same thing when I was playing Six Man Morris for the thief challenges. The scenario would arise where I was absolutely guaranteed to win, and my opponent would just start making pointless moves purely to force me into a move in the hope I'd screw up. It would get to the point where the same two pieces were being moved back & forth in a tedious stalemate as my opponent would try and avoid the inevitable. Then, after several repetitions, they'd try and call it a draw, as if I was the one struggling. Poor is a word I'd use to describe it, and annoying seeing as I dislike these sorts of games anyway.

Sushiglutton
12-28-2012, 08:20 PM
I kind of had the same thing when I was playing Six Man Morris for the thief challenges. The scenario would arise where I was absolutely guaranteed to win, and my opponent would just start making pointless moves purely to force me into a move in the hope I'd screw up. It would get to the point where the same two pieces were being moved back & forth in a tedious stalemate as my opponent would try and avoid the inevitable. Then, after several repetitions, they'd try and call it a draw, as if I was the one struggling. Poor is a word I'd use to describe it, and annoying seeing as I dislike these sorts of games anyway.

Eh if you have the advantage it's your job to leverage it and end the game. Of course your opponent will avoid suicide moves just to help you finish it. If none of you has a winning move the game is a draw. That's how it works in pretty much all board games.

TheSpong
12-28-2012, 08:31 PM
Eh if you have the advantage it's your job to leverage it and end the game. Of course your opponent will avoid suicide moves just to help you finish it. If none of you has a winning move the game is a draw. That's how it works in pretty much all board games.

By that point, I'd have done all the leverage I could to get to the position of being the undeniable winner in waiting in the first place. Yet it always came down to my opponent having the option of the same two moves; a move that would snowball into my victory, or a pointless move that would change nothing and was completely wasteful. It's not like the opponent would move their piece to make me move one of mine so they could then go on the attack, they'd ALWAYS just move their piece back again. It was just a cheap AI tactic to bring about a draw. I'm glad I was only forced into playing the game once for the thief challenge, I can't see myself ever getting the achievement associated with playing the games in the Homestead.

EDIT
100 posts! Yay me! :D

Rogue Agent 035
12-28-2012, 10:39 PM
I have never seen any illegal moves, but the rules are a bit tricky so it may seem like that at first (I know I was pretty suprised a couple of times before I got it).

Maybe they should have removed the achievement attached to it. People are obsessive about these virtual rewards and if there was no achivement I bet we would see no complaints (doing stuff in games because they are fun is a less common approach).

It was nothing personal, it's just that I've been a fan of this franchise a long time (not a member on these boards as long as you though ;) ) and it's depressing how stupid the games still are. As a chessplayer you probably no what I mean. I agree 100%, an I too love the franchise an have been with it since my PC gamin days, An I love how they've represented the history of America as accurately as possible, just hope these mini games were bit more straightforward to a degree.

LoyalACFan
12-29-2012, 12:07 AM
That the computer highlights possible moves doesn't really affect the challenge level.

-_- Do you even realize how absurd that sounds? The computer is TELLING YOU WHERE TO MOVE. Kind of counter-intuitive if you're trying to make the player think strategically. Yet it remains difficult, not because of any real need for tactical input from the player, but because the game of Fanorona itself is boring, primitive, and clunky. And it's impossible for the AI to make a wrong move.


Why did you beat it "a few times" if you didn't enjoy it? You need to beat it once for the trophy that's it. No other challenge requires it.

The thief challenges require you to get a certain sum of money from gambling, and I misunderstood the challenge and thought you had to make it all in one specific game type. So I opted for Fanorona, since I had already won a decent portion of money in it.

SillySaxon
02-07-2013, 02:46 AM
I consider it poor programming when I have 9 pieces and the computer has 3 and all the AI does is move 1 piece back and forth till you give it the opportunity to take all of your pices, or else it calls a draw.
Simple solution, give each AI a %chance to make a mistake which would cost it to lose a piece then it would be possible to #$&%^ win

Assassin_M
02-07-2013, 02:47 AM
I consider it poor programming when I have 9 pieces and the computer has 3 and all the AI does is move 1 piece back and forth till you give it the opportunity to take all of your pices, or else it calls a draw.
Simple solution, give each AI a %chance to make a mistake which would cost it to lose a piece then it would be possible to #$&%^ win

Has it ever occured that you were the one with 3 pieces ?? Guess what ?? You can move wherever you want too...

SillySaxon
02-07-2013, 03:08 AM
And then either choose to suicide a piece, or end in a draw

Assassin_M
02-07-2013, 03:11 AM
And then either choose to suicide a piece, or end in a draw

You have to plan ahead then.....make sure you are in the win BEFORE you bring him down to 3....bringing him down to 3 BEFORE making the situation impossible for HIM will result in what you just mentioned....If this does not help, Youtube,....many guides there

Rogue Agent 035
02-15-2013, 07:53 PM
OK, I've resurrected this thread from the ashes of 2 months ago to ask about 9MM. I've beat Achilies (finally) before we buried him in sequence 12, an I've beat Terry with no issues. HOWEVER, that smug Innkeeper is killin me every...single...time!!! an this achievement is the final one I'm chasin till next weeks DLC. I've tried the corner strategy, everything an still nyet. So what I was wonderin..., could someone kindly guide me to where I could find a set-by-step walkthrough to beatin this bastardo so I can get the final standard achievement before the DLC's arrival.

J7hnny
02-15-2013, 09:02 PM
Is it just me who sees Fanorona and Nine Men's Morris, for the Original Gamer trophy/achievement, as the only challenge in Assassin's Creed III? Without it, any player with a copy of Assassin's Creed III would earn The Conqueror trophy/achievement. What would be the point of adding a trophy set, when no challenge is required to earn it?

Sushiglutton
02-15-2013, 10:00 PM
-_- Do you even realize how absurd that sounds? The computer is TELLING YOU WHERE TO MOVE. Kind of counter-intuitive if you're trying to make the player think strategically. Yet it remains difficult, not because of any real need for tactical input from the player, but because the game of Fanorona itself is boring, primitive, and clunky. And it's impossible for the AI to make a wrong move.

The computer tells you the legal moves. That is something entirely different than "telling you were to move". The challenge in any board game is to choose the best of the legal moves, not to understand the rules lol.




Is it just me who sees Fanorona and Nine Men's Morris, for the Original Gamer trophy/achievement, as the only challenge in Assassin's Creed III? Without it, any player with a copy of Assassin's Creed III would earn The Conqueror trophy/achievement. What would be the point of adding a trophy set, when no challenge is required to earn it?

I agree. Only time I had to use my brains a little, the rest is just a grind. It was like waking up from a mental coma lol. But the board games have received a lot of complaints on the forum and I suppose elsewhere. My guess is Ubi will replace them with roulette (or some other chance-based game) in the next game to not upset people. That way we can sleep through the entire next game ;)

J7hnny
02-15-2013, 10:07 PM
I agree. Only time I had to use my brains a little, the rest is just a grind. It was like waking up from a mental coma lol. But the board games have received a lot of complaints on the forum and I suppose elsewhere. My guess is Ubi will replace them with roulette (or some other chance-based game) in the next game to not upset people. That way we can sleep through the entire next game ;)
But I enjoy using me brains!

Perk89
02-16-2013, 03:01 AM
lol I died laughing first time I played fanarama. I have no concept of it all, bit my aides were hurting I was laughing so hard at what was happening.

Every time I assumed that I was making progress, the dude I was playing would just keep taking turns until he won. I was rolling.

J7hnny
02-16-2013, 03:06 AM
lol I died laughing first time I played fanarama. I have no concept of it all, bit my aides were hurting I was laughing so hard at what was happening.

Every time I assumed that I was making progress, the dude I was playing would just keep taking turns until he won. I was rolling.
Haha, try Nine Men's Morris and you'd laugh your ace out.

Perk89
02-16-2013, 04:18 AM
Haha, try Nine Men's Morris and you'd laugh your ace out.

I can actually figure that one out. I'm not good at it, and I'm absolutely positive there's no way some of the lame tricks the NPCs pull like just moving their pier back and forth can't possibly be legal and I'm absolutely sure it's some kind of developer oversight, but I do get the overall concept.

With Fanorama, the NPC just elects whenever he decides he doesn't feel like losing that he is gonna play until he wins.

J7hnny
02-16-2013, 04:35 AM
I can actually figure that one out. I'm not good at it, and I'm absolutely positive there's no way some of the lame tricks the NPCs pull like just moving their pier back and forth can't possibly be legal and I'm absolutely sure it's some kind of developer oversight, but I do get the overall concept.

With Fanorama, the NPC just elects whenever he decides he doesn't feel like losing that he is gonna play until he wins.
Ha, I didn't have any problem with Fanorona! Could playing against Achilles Davenport be harder than playing against the Priest?