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shadowlord4001
12-26-2012, 07:18 AM
What did Minerva want desmond to do (Spoilers)

GoldyTart
12-26-2012, 07:48 AM
You mean in the ending of AC3? SPOILERS AHOY

Minerva's original intention was to create a device that could stop the solar flare scheduled for 2012. She sent messages to Ezio so that it could reach Desmond through the Animus. Juno blamed the humans for the deaths of her people (TWCB) and she wanted revenge. To stop this, Minerva left Juno for dead and was hopeful that her plan would work and the people of 2012 could be saved. She decided to look one last time to see if her plans worked and was surprised to see the result. Juno actually manipulated Minerva's device so that Juno could rise and take over the world when Desmond activates it. So in one last desperate attempt Minerva went to Desmond and pleaded him to not to activate the device. Juno must not be released else the people will be in trouble. So Minerva requested Desmond to let the Solar flare do its thing and let the world burn because that is better than letting Juno free. The problem with that theory is that if Desmond doesn't activate the device, 90% of the people will die and Desmond will be herald as a Saint to guide the remaining people living. He will be considered very important and when he dies people will think he is like Jesus and the survivors will preserve his words. Soon people who have different opinions over Desmond's words will start a conflict eventually leading to the war between Templars and Assassins. This will be a self-repeating cycle and there will never be a way out of the loop. So Desmond believed that he must activate the device because he believed in his brotherhood and knew that they will defeat Juno when the time comes. Because he was against Minerva, Minerva told him that the consequences of Desmond's actions will kill him. So Desmond sacrificed himself to save humanity from the flare.

I think Desmond, although a disappointment to some, made the right and honorable choice.

shadowlord4001
12-26-2012, 07:52 AM
But Minervas device was behind the gate and it was juno who showed desmon how to get the key if juno hadnt interfered desmond would never have found the key

GoldyTart
12-26-2012, 07:58 AM
But Minervas device was behind the gate and it was juno who showed desmon how to get the key if juno hadnt interfered desmond would never have found the key

Good point. I never thought of that. I believe that before Juno revealed her intention to rule the world, Minerva and Juno worked together to allow Desmond to reach the temple and use the key obtained from Connor. Behind the scene Juno also modified the device without Minerva finding out before its too late so that it could help her get revived in 2012.

shadowlord4001
12-26-2012, 08:42 AM
But in the game guide it says that Juno was manipulating conner when she was in the grand temple(When her body was destroyed

Assassin_M
12-26-2012, 09:12 AM
But in the game guide it says that Juno was manipulating conner when she was in the grand temple(When her body was destroyed
At first, Juno was playing along with Minerva and Jupiter. they were on the same team, until very close to the end of their plan which is Contacting Desmond. Minerva made the Eye, called out on Desmond, Juno continues guiding Desmond (Still on Minerva`s team), Minerva and Jupiter think everything is jolly, Juno tampers with the Eye, Minerva discovers this (At that time they`v already put Desmond on his way to the Grand Temple through the Sync Nexus at the end of ACR) Minerva Banishes Juno, Minerva abandons Eye, Juno calls out to Connor to finish what Minerva started..

shadowlord4001
12-26-2012, 09:30 AM
But juno says Minerva destroyed the eye thats why she was so shocked so what was the ting that freed juno

Assassin_M
12-26-2012, 09:35 AM
But juno says Minerva destroyed the eye thats why she was so shocked so what was the ting that freed juno
No...Juno thought Minerva destroyed the Device that allowed them to see the future, that Device is not the eye...The Eye freed Juno. The Eye was originally built to ONLY save the world, but Juno tampered with it to give HER that power and after seeing What Juno did, Minerva banished Juno and abandoned the eye, after that Juno again manipulated the eye to instead free HER and tie THAT with saving the world..

shadowlord4001
12-26-2012, 09:37 AM
do you have evidence of your theory or is this a speculation because in the game it dosent say the eye was the device that saved the world

Assassin_M
12-26-2012, 09:41 AM
do you have evidence of your theory or is this a speculation because in the game it dosent say the eye was the device that saved the world
It does.... Doesn't look like you payed much attention to the end scene..

Minerva: So I built the eye to aid us (Pointing at the Orb) but she turned it towards her own ends (Still pointing at the Orb)

Evidence enough ?

shadowlord4001
12-26-2012, 10:16 AM
So why in the game guide does it say that Juno used the four towers to save the world and tinia also said that NONE of the soloutions worked

shadowlord4001
12-26-2012, 10:17 AM
But in the game guide it says that Juno used the four towers to save the world and tinia also says None of the SIX soulotions worked

Assassin_M
12-26-2012, 10:21 AM
But in the game guide it says that Juno used the four towers to save the world and tinia also says None of the SIX soulotions worked
Game Guide is wrong. game is right..Which would you go with game or guide ?? The Guide is not made by Ubisoft

Yes, the six solutions failed. The 4 towers, Sending Apples to space, Containing Bodies in Vessels, Using the Shard of Eden, Changing their bodies to be stronger and finally travelling back in time.

So what what`s your problem ??

shadowlord4001
12-26-2012, 10:34 AM
problems
1.if minerva wanted desmond to use the eye why was juno the one to show him the key when she was bad and why not tell him about the seven soulotion (the eye ) when tinia spoke to desmond which was after juno betrayed them
2.why would juno say that others set machines to finish the towers she said that they didnt have enough time for the first solar flare but in the tousands of years inbetween im pretty sure they would be finished by now
3. Minera said that To comprehend the calculations was to tame time so she built the eye to aid them but how could the numbers have saved them when they were to do with time

Assassin_M
12-26-2012, 10:44 AM
problems



1.if minerva wanted desmond to use the eye why was juno the one to show him the key when she was bad and why not tell him about the seven soulotion (the eye ) when tinia spoke to desmond which was after juno betrayed them
Minerva made a step by step plan to warn Desmond. First step was introduction, second step was Initiation, third Step was the Revelation. which was the Sync nexus. That Door was not there at the start of Minerva`s plan, it would not make sense for Minerva to build something, guide Desmond to it and then "SURPRISE !! You have another door to go through" Minerva built that door to seal Juno and the Eye, because Juno tampered with it and so even though the pattern to save the world was still there, Juno`s tampering was beyond repair *WHAT FOLLOWS IS SPECULATION* Minerva probably hid the key for that door somewhere and Juno found out it`s place and thus worked her own plan for Desmond to find that key.



2.why would juno say that others set machines to finish the towers she said that they didnt have enough time for the first solar flare but in the tousands of years inbetween im pretty sure they would be finished by now
The Towers were abandoned. the first tower was never Completed, because at that time they did not know about Desmond yet, So they abandoned the project and the Sun probably destroyed it anyway during the first solar flare so either way even if you`re right, the towers would be gone..



3. Minera said that To comprehend the calculations was to tame time so she built the eye to aid them but how could the numbers have saved them when they were to do with time
Minerva made a calculation. She found the pattern of existence. Divination through numbers which has something to do with Desmond`s DNA. The Carefully planned calculation patterns in the eye combined with Desmond`s DNA would create an Aura that would shield the earth and only cause it to suffer minor effects from the Solar flare

GoldyTart
12-26-2012, 10:49 AM
problems
1.if minerva wanted desmond to use the eye why was juno the one to show him the key when she was bad and why not tell him about the seven soulotion (the eye ) when tinia spoke to desmond which was after juno betrayed them
2.why would juno say that others set machines to finish the towers she said that they didnt have enough time for the first solar flare but in the tousands of years inbetween im pretty sure they would be finished by now
3. Minera said that To comprehend the calculations was to tame time so she built the eye to aid them but how could the numbers have saved them when they were to do with time

1. Minerva wanted to save the world, Juno and Tinia were united to help her accomplish that. They sent messages to Desmond through Nexuses and so during the present day Desmond had the key and was at the temple ready to save the world (without releasing Juno at the time the messages were sent). That's why nobody warned Desmond about Juno because the messages were sent before Juno's real motive was revealed and that's why Desmond never found out until there was literally no time.
2. Because they didn't have thousands of years themselves to see if the tower worked or not. They were at the brink of extinction and they needed to get a solution that they tested and that was confirmed to work. So they abandoned this slow solution.
3. The eye was not built to calculate probabilities. It is designed to prevent the solar flare.

shadowlord4001
12-26-2012, 10:51 AM
Most of what you just said makes sense but how did minerva intend for desmond to originally save the world when the eye was behind the gate

GoldyTart
12-26-2012, 10:52 AM
M,

All of our points don't agree with each other. I am suspicious of my answer for point 3 but for the other points...

Who is right?

GoldyTart
12-26-2012, 10:53 AM
Most of what you just said makes sense but how did minerva intend for desmond to originally save the world when the eye was behind the gate

In the ending of AC3 she clarified that she DID NOT want to save the world because she didn't want Juno to be released. She wanted the solar flare to occur. Hard to digest I know.

Assassin_M
12-26-2012, 10:59 AM
Most of what you just said makes sense but how did minerva intend for desmond to originally save the world when the eye was behind the gate
Simple. Minerva sends message to Desmond, Builds Eye, Tells Juno to send second message, They all unite to deliver the final message (Sync Nexus. Juno still on their team) Now they put the Eye in the Grand Temple without a door waiting for Desmond to Open it, Juno Tampers, Minerva discovers, Abandons Eye, Builds door to seal Juno AND Eye, Juno contacts Connor and since Desmond is on his way to the Temple already, she manipulates Connor into hiding the Key for Desmond to find it...



M,

All of our points don't agree with each other. I am suspicious of my answer for point 3 but for the other points...

Who is right?
The Eye had a a carefully calculated pattern of Numbers that when combined with Desmond`s DNA, saves the world. As for the other 2 points. They`re not that far off...My points and yours can be seen as expansions to each other..

But i`m correct of course:p JK

Seriously, though I am pretty confident in my memory and Knowledge of the structure of the story..

Assassin_M
12-26-2012, 11:00 AM
In the ending of AC3 she clarified that she DID NOT want to save the world because she didn't want Juno to be released. She wanted the solar flare to occur. Hard to digest I know.
She originally wanted to save the world, but after finding out what Juno did, she decided to let it burn anyway

shadowlord4001
12-26-2012, 11:50 AM
so how come in the game it says that minerva called to desmond after they killed juno at the end

Assassin_M
12-26-2012, 11:57 AM
so how come in the game it says that minerva called to desmond after they killed juno
Then how was Juno present with Jupiter and Minerva in the Sync Nexus in Revelations ??

Minerva was either lying, structured her sentence wrongly or the Devs effed up big time, because Juno was present with Minerva and Tinia in the Sync Nexus at the end of Revelations and Tinia mentions her directly, how it was his, Minerva`s and Juno`s Job to gather and discuss the solutions...

dxsxhxcx
12-26-2012, 12:27 PM
Then how was Juno present with Jupiter and Minerva in the Sync Nexus in Revelations ??

Minerva was either lying, structured her sentence wrongly or the Devs effed up big time, because Juno was present with Minerva and Tinia in the Sync Nexus at the end of Revelations and Tinia mentions her directly, how it was his, Minerva`s and Juno`s Job to gather and discuss the solutions...


to me that looked like a recording showing us what they did together, the only TWCB present during the Sync Nexus was Jupiter who was showing Desmond what they did and what he should do.

Assassin_M
12-26-2012, 12:28 PM
to me that looked like a recording showing us what they did together, the only TWCB present during the Sync Nexus was Jupiter who was showing Desmond what they did.
And yet he mentions Juno by name as a helper with all of this ??

dxsxhxcx
12-26-2012, 12:33 PM
And yet he mentions Juno by name as a helper with all of this ??

because I believe that (the sync nexus) happened before they (TWCB) discover Juno's betrayal

Assassin_M
12-26-2012, 12:35 PM
because I believe that (the sync nexus) happened before they (TWCB) discover Juno's betrayal
And Yet Minerva says that they FIRST discover Juno`s Betrayal and THEN call on Desmond thinking it was safe with her gone. Calling on Desmond Obviously includes the nexus in ACR...So it`s either Minerva is lying or the Devs effed up

AjinkyaParuleka
12-26-2012, 12:41 PM
And yet AC never gets Story of the Year....

Assassin_M
12-26-2012, 12:56 PM
And yet AC never gets Story of the Year....
It never will.....too complex.

SixKeys
12-26-2012, 01:40 PM
I feel like all this overly complicated stuff could have been avoided if they had just stuck with the original plan to make AC a trilogy about Desmond. Then if they wanted to make more sequels, they could have started fresh with a new protagonist and wouldn't have all this baggage from five games weighing them down. The way AC3's ending played out makes it seem they really wanted to simplify the story by making Juno a clear villain (whereas before TWCB were all pretty ambiguous) so the next game will be a straightforward battle between good and evil. It's just a shame they left so much stuff from ACB and ACR open-ended that the overarching story still remains needlessly complicated.

kuled2012
12-26-2012, 02:05 PM
And yet AC never gets Story of the Year....

Annoying isn't it?

AjinkyaParuleka
12-26-2012, 03:36 PM
I bet the series won't finish until each of us are like..60?

YazX_
12-31-2012, 07:07 PM
Simple. Minerva sends message to Desmond, Builds Eye, Tells Juno to send second message, They all unite to deliver the final message (Sync Nexus. Juno still on their team) Now they put the Eye in the Grand Temple without a door waiting for Desmond to Open it, Juno Tampers, Minerva discovers, Abandons Eye, Builds door to seal Juno AND Eye, Juno contacts Connor and since Desmond is on his way to the Temple already, she manipulates Connor into hiding the Key for Desmond to find it...
..

Ok this doesnt make any sense, Connor era was before desmond, so how come juno contacted connor while desmond is on his way to grand temple without juno being sealed?!?!

Juno was sealed way long before Desmond ever existed and found her way to connor to hide the key for desmond to pick it up, and also juno was surprised to see minirva poping out in the end to prevent desmond from touching the eye.

IMO, minirva never intended to give the eye for desmond as it has been tampered with by juno and there was no way to fix it. so all these clues were just to show desmond and his ancestors the way to build a new eye, but they wasted the time fighting with templares (As said in the ending of AC3) and there is no way out unless if he touched the eye and released juno and the rest you know.

so now the story moves on to how stop juno instead of how to create an eye to prevent the flare and they are gonna search for clues on how minirva locked down juno by going to other ancestors and following the leads there.

infamous_ezio
01-01-2013, 01:09 PM
I'm pretty sure the eye was the device used to look into the future..

twenty_glyphs
01-02-2013, 07:17 PM
I'm pretty sure the eye was the device used to look into the future..

This makes the most sense to me. Minerva's job was to look into the future through "divination". What better name to call a device that sees into the future than an "Eye"? She may have pointed and gestured while she was talking about the Eye to Desmond, but it may have just been gestures, and not her actually pointing at the device Desmond was about to touch. The guide suggests that the first method of salvation, the towers, were what stopped the solar flare. It presents as evidence the fact that Juno herself told Desmond that others returned later and sought to finish the process through automation (quoted from the wiki):


In the beginning, when we thought we could be saved, we sought to face the sun's wrath and contain it. Four towers would be built- to pull her fury into this place and dispel it. But even with all we knew... with all we had... It would take too long. A thousand years we could labor and still the work would not be done... The first tower was never completed, the project abandoned... We moved on. But while we labored on other endeavors, a few returned. They thought to automate the process... Metal might finish what flesh could not.


Then how was Juno present with Jupiter and Minerva in the Sync Nexus in Revelations ??

Minerva was either lying, structured her sentence wrongly or the Devs effed up big time, because Juno was present with Minerva and Tinia in the Sync Nexus at the end of Revelations and Tinia mentions her directly, how it was his, Minerva`s and Juno`s Job to gather and discuss the solutions...

It seems likely that when we see Minerva and Juno in the Sync Nexus in ACR, that's just a vision/recording that Tinia is showing Desmond of the three of them working together previously. Judging by the way it's all presented and the disappointment on Juno and Minerva's faces, I always interpreted that as the moment just before or after the solar flare arrived and the three of them were still culling through data about the methods of salvation. Minerva and the guide make it sound like they discovered Juno was a traitor in the Grand Temple, attacked her, then Tinia used the Eye to contact Desmond in the ACR Sync Nexus, then they destroyed the Eye in the Grand Temple. They seem to have not known that Juno survived yet, so they probably thought it was unnecessary to warn Desmond about her at that point in time.


And Yet Minerva says that they FIRST discover Juno`s Betrayal and THEN call on Desmond thinking it was safe with her gone. Calling on Desmond Obviously includes the nexus in ACR...So it`s either Minerva is lying or the Devs effed up

Based on the fact that the various story elements in the series don't line up very well and often ignore old story elements or outright contradict them, and that the fan community can't even come to an agreement on what happened in the story after five games and multiple "transmedia" story elements including Project Legacy and the comic books, I'm going to go with the "devs effed up" option. Seriously, we're struggling just to figure out what even happened and needing to pool multiple resources to even get that far, to say nothing of the meaning behind it all or the motivations of characters.

infamous_ezio
01-02-2013, 08:15 PM
From what i understand, the eye was the device that was used to look into the future. Minerva must have wanted desmond to go there and finish there work, however Juno had enough time to do that for desmond and make the final solution... What annoys me most though is that, it's really not explained at all what minerva wanted to desmond to do, it's sad that we're all trying to figure out something so simple..

shadowlord4001
01-03-2013, 02:37 AM
so what was the pedastal then at the end