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View Full Version : "A delayed game is eventually good, but a rushed game is forever bad."



bruise2010
11-26-2012, 02:25 AM
- Shigeru Miyamoto.

Wether or not Nintendo follow this motto lately is another discussion. But it definitely applies to AC3, at least to a degree.

I respect how hard it is to work on a game, so I don't blame the devs, I imagine this was a corporate management decision to push the game out.

The game is not bad, but it is forever tainted by the fact it feels horribly rushed and thus, the potential that has been lost should and will damage Ubisofts next game until they prove us all wrong by making a game that isn't buggy, cut content, broken promises etc.

I was reading today from another poster that content was cut like wearing furs and canoeing.

Then you factor in the obscene level of bugs - and you begin to realize that this game was not released as originally intended.

It's a shame.

Gonna get your next games on sale Ubisoft (talking to the company here, not the devs). - You can redeem yourselves though :) Make AC4 over a longer period and don't rush it! The developers are clearly talented guys just give em more time :)

I did love a lot about AC3, just wanted moar :)

http://forums.ubi.com/image.php?u=1341747&type=sigpic&dateline=1359432244

ZephyrStrife
11-26-2012, 02:27 AM
They worked on AC3 for three years.

TrueAssassin77
11-26-2012, 02:30 AM
they cut it in favor of a long prolouge... haythams part

ZephyrStrife
11-26-2012, 02:42 AM
they cut it in favor of a long prolouge... haythams part

Haytham's backstory is part AC3's story. It doesn't make sense without it. There's a lot more going on in AC3 then just Connor's story.

TrueAssassin77
11-26-2012, 02:45 AM
make a movie... that what they did with ezio's dad... they are giving haytham nearly half the game and a book... to much resources went into the prolouge of this game. and the main story suffered because of it

Kaschra
11-26-2012, 02:48 AM
make a movie... that what they did with ezio's dad... they are giving haytham nearly half the game and a book... to much resources went into the prolouge of this game. and the main story suffered because of it
Stop. Just stop.
It's getting REALLY annoying by now.

Assassin_M
11-26-2012, 02:51 AM
make a movie... that what they did with ezio's dad... they are giving haytham nearly half the game and a book... to much resources went into the prolouge of this game. and the main story suffered because of it
I respect your point of view, but you do not have to spam it in every single thread I see your name on...

Alright we get it..You hated Haytham, but just stop...please

zhengyingli
11-26-2012, 02:51 AM
make a movie... that what they did with ezio's dad... they are giving haytham nearly half the game and a book... to much resources went into the prolouge of this game. and the main story suffered because of it
Spam, dude.

ZephyrStrife
11-26-2012, 02:55 AM
make a movie... that what they did with ezio's dad... they are giving haytham nearly half the game and a book... to much resources went into the prolouge of this game. and the main story suffered because of it

Haytham took up three sequences.....there are twelve in total, that's not half. Haytham is important because he sets up the entire plot of the game...Giovanni wasn't important nor did that movie add anything to the overall plot of AC2. I knew Giovanni was an assassin already. Anyone with eyes could have figured that out. Furthermore, making a movie would have taken just as much resources away from the game....not everyone would see it and then the game would be confusing, making the story suffer even more. People already complain about Ubisoft implementing story elements from DLC into the next installment because if you chose not to play it, it makes the story confusing. -___-

FYI, a lot of people actually like Haytham. Many like him more than Connor.

bruise2010
12-12-2012, 12:02 PM
^ I like hatthams bit, its not that, its the bugs and the lack of time given to the QA team :)

The devs work hard, you can't fault them, but you can ask the publishers to give them more time.


http://forums.ubi.com/image.php?u=1341747&type=sigpic&dateline=1359432244

ProdiGurl
12-12-2012, 12:12 PM
Haytham's backstory is part AC3's story. It doesn't make sense without it. There's a lot more going on in AC3 then just Connor's story.


Haytham took up three sequences.....there are twelve in total, that's not half. Haytham is important because he sets up the entire plot of the game...Giovanni wasn't important nor did that movie add anything to the overall plot of AC2. I knew Giovanni was an assassin already. Anyone with eyes could have figured that out. Furthermore, making a movie would have taken just as much resources away from the game....not everyone would see it and then the game would be confusing, making the story suffer even more. People already complain about Ubisoft implementing story elements from DLC into the next installment because if you chose not to play it, it makes the story confusing. -___-

FYI, a lot of people actually like Haytham. Many like him more than Connor.

^ ^ ^
I personally appreciate that we played Haytham once I got to Sequence 9 - it totally amped up the story due to relating more to Haytham bcuz I had played his backstory.
Pretty brilliant. I see both sides of this but once you know that you don't need to do so much w/ Haytham in your first playthru (ie. use him to open viewpoints in Boston, look for treasure, buy much at he stores, etc.), it's pretty short in comparison to time w/ Connor.

Deadlysyns666
12-12-2012, 12:15 PM
Obviously you didn't play Darksiders 2 it was delayed but still sucked

ProdiGurl
12-12-2012, 12:24 PM
I think the key here is that Ubi spent up to 3 years on this & still felt the rush towards the end - and this was a huge endeavor for them.
It's not so much about time, it's about content, resources, talent/discernment w/ decision making in game direction, organization and time management. I think a game company can put a good game out yearly, but it doesn't always happen due to alot of variables.
I know a guy that owns his own business & it doesn't matter how much time he has, he's NEVER on time or ready & always scrambling around at the last minute.

Deadlysyns666
12-12-2012, 12:25 PM
I think the key here is that Ubi spent up to 3 years on this & still felt the rush towards the end - and this was a huge endeavor for them.
It's not so much about time, it's about content, resources, talent/discernment w/ decision making in game direction, organization and time management. I think a game company can put a good game out yearly, but it doesn't always happen due to alot of variables.
I know a guy that owns his own business & it doesn't matter how much time he has, he's NEVER on time or ready & always scrambling around at the last minute.
i actually thought it was a good game. infact an awesome game the ending was amazing

TinyTemplar
12-12-2012, 02:44 PM
make a movie... that what they did with ezio's dad... they are giving haytham nearly half the game and a book... to much resources went into the prolouge of this game. and the main story suffered because of it

That's a great idea, they definitely should have shown Haytham's story that way, like Embers.

p.s. sorry guys, I've just read ))

ProdiGurl
12-12-2012, 03:02 PM
i actually thought it was a good game. infact an awesome game the ending was amazing

Oh I LOVE it!! I'm just replying to the topic & acknowledge a few valid issues (bugs etc.)

pirate1802
12-12-2012, 03:09 PM
TrueAssassin your crusade against Haytham is getting a little irritating now -_-

pirate1802
12-12-2012, 03:11 PM
FYI, a lot of people actually like Haytham. Many like him more than Connor.

I like him, more than Connor. he is now my favourite playable character in the AC universe. I believe playing as a "that guy" was important both for AC3 with its grey tone and for the future direction of the series.

Overtkill21
12-12-2012, 04:50 PM
AC3, and to a lesser extent Darksiders 2, have made me rethink ever preordering a game again.

Why should we as gamers rush to get a game at launch for full price?

Preorder bonuses? They’ve become more laughable and irritating than can’t miss incentives to buy a game full price.

It seems to me that if anything we have huge incentive to purchase a game 6 months to 1 year after its release; when bugs, game crashes, etc. have been fixed by numerous patches.

I get that bugs happen, but AC3 is inexcusable. There were points during the story where I was honestly unsure if the game had cut out or if there really were just horrid transitions for the narrative. (I think it’s actually both.) The glitches and flaws in this game completely break my immersion. I am truly saddened by this – I love a lot of aspects of AC3 – but in the end that’s all they are – gameplay aspects. I love tree-running, I love hunting, I love the weather changes…I just find that I don’t love AC3.

Maybe if I had waited for a year I would.

TrueAssassin77
12-12-2012, 04:57 PM
TrueAssassin your crusade against Haytham is getting a little irritating now -_-

My crusade against haytham is valid. His story was overall better written than even Desmond. and many people like it more than Connors. Haytham didn't need that long a prologue. period. i may be the most vocal about it, but i am by no means the only one who got sick of haytham after the 5th time heading back into the bar. THEY SHOULD HAVE MADE A MOVIE, LIKE WITH EZIO'S DAD. In the end the villains don't matter in the big scheme of things, its the protagonist(2 in this case) that matter. you sure as hell got a different feeling than that while playing AC3. Would i rather learn more about the temporary villains... or the character i bought the game for?

TinyTemplar
12-12-2012, 05:02 PM
even Desmond.

"even Desmond" - LOL

p.s. sorry again

CalgaryJay
12-12-2012, 05:09 PM
I just started my second playthrough this week, I forgot how much I liked the Haytham parts. I don't get the argument.

...actually now playing it again with lowered expectations (after all that Inside AC stuff, they were sky high the first time around), I'm remembering how much I like this game in general.

pirate1802
12-12-2012, 05:11 PM
My crusade against haytham is valid. His story was overall better written than even Desmond. and many people like it more than Connors. Haytham didn't need that long a prologue. period. i may be the most vocal about it, but i am by no means the only one who got sick of haytham after the 5th time heading back into the bar. THEY SHOULD HAVE MADE A MOVIE, LIKE WITH EZIO'S DAD. In the end the villains don't matter in the big scheme of things, its the protagonist(2 in this case) that matter. you sure as hell got a different feeling than that while playing AC3. Would i rather learn more about the temporary villains... or the character i bought the game for?

Ezio's dad is different from Connor's dad. Without spoiling, you know what I'm talking about, and the effect wouldn't be same as actually playing it. Would you rather play as Connor or watch an AC movie with Connor? Anyhow, I believe it is important for the future of the franchise. You'll see when that happens. It was already hinted in AC3.

And yes, in AC the villains matter as much as the good guys, atleast to me. Maybe not to you, but please don't assume everyone else thinks the same as you. Brotherhood's villains were a big fail (to me) and that took away a lot fro the story.

So in the end, you didn't like Haytham because you had different expectations of the story, I liked it because mine were different. And anyone who surfs these forums for a resonable amount of time knows of your opinion very well, you don't have to repeat it everywhere. Which is why it gets irritating. Every bad thing in AC3 is not Haytham's fault, believe it or not.

TrueAssassin77
12-12-2012, 05:29 PM
So in the end, you didn't like Haytham because you had different expectations of the story, I liked it because mine were different. And anyone who surfs these forums for a resonable amount of time knows of your opinion very well, you don't have to repeat it everywhere. Which is why it gets irritating. Every bad thing in AC3 is not Haytham's fault, believe it or not.

Everything bad about AC3 isn't all haythams fault. true.

but there is a majority of things that are bad, that can be speculated as haythams fault.
i still believe they should have been spending more time on Connor rather than giving us life stories of Templar....
sorry if i prefer to play more with the character i bought the game for







this is what my friend said once:

"So... we get 2 light-skinned guys that get full games or more... and the minority guy gets a little bit more than half of his?"
yes i tried to explain to him i believe Altair could be considered a minority but he said " with that voice actor?"
i also said that Altair had only one game. he said " an look how many ezio had...?

This is not what i feel is the issue... but that doesn't mean i don't see where he is coming from. simply put, it does actually rub some people the wrong way. its also a **** shame that haytham's story is more cohesive than connors.

pirate1802
12-12-2012, 05:40 PM
but there is a majority of things that are bad, that can be speculated as haythams fault.
I can speculate every major problem in AC is brotherhood's fault. You can speculate anything basically.


i still believe they should have been spending more time on Connor rather than giving us life stories of Templar....
sorry if i prefer to play more with the character i bought the game for.
Yeah, you prefer to play Connor's story, I prefer to play the story Connor is a part of. Different goals. Like I said, its a matter of opinion. You didn't get what you were looking for, so you're angry. I got what I was looking for and I'm happy.


"So... we get 2 light-skinned guys that get full games or more... and the minority guy gets a little bit more than half of his?"
yes i tried to explain to him i believe Altair could be considered a minority but he said " with that voice actor?"
i also said that Altair had only one game. he said " an look how many ezio had...?
This bit more than half bit is pure and unadulterated BS. Since when is 9/12 considered "bit more than half"? And yes, your friend probably thinks getting more games is a good think. He should come over here and see how much love Ezio was getting after Revelations. I'd rather have less games than that. And it has nothing to do with minority, its stupid to even bring that into equation.


its also a **** shame that haytham's story is more cohesive than connors.
I didn't feel any lack of cohesiveness in Connor's story. Again, matters of opinion.

TrueAssassin77
12-12-2012, 05:47 PM
I can speculate every major problem in AC is brotherhood's fault. You can speculate anything basically.

i meant speculate intelligently while bringing up valid and non-subjective points


Yeah, you prefer to play Connor's story, I prefer to play the story Connor is a part of. Different goals. Like I said, its a matter of opinion. You didn't get what you were looking for, so you're angry. I got what I was looking for and I'm happy.

Not angry, simply determine to voice that it should never happened again


This bit more than half bit is pure and unadulterated BS. Since when is 9/12 considered "bit more than half"? And yes, your friend probably thinks getting more games is a good think. He should come over here and see how much love Ezio was getting after Revelations. I'd rather have less games than that. And it has nothing to do with minority, its stupid to even bring that into equation.

trust me bro. It is not as far-fetched as it sounds. if you think stuff like this doesn't happen in media, you might not be looking closely enough.


I didn't feel any lack of cohesiveness in Connor's story. Again, matters of opinion.

Fact: " 6 months later" loading screens do not equal cohesive



in red

pirate1802
12-12-2012, 06:00 PM
Fact: 99% what we both say and indeed what anyone says is personal opinion. So please let's not pretend anything else, this is an exercise in futility because we are basically fighting opinion with opinion, but still I'll persevere:

1. Yes, it can be argued intelligently and non-subjectively that Brotherhood is the root of all evil in AC.

2. No arguments there. I hope you understand why I want "that" to happen again.

3. I know but I'm talking about this particular instance. If it was so why would they make a minority character in the first place? And spend resources to hire native experts to get his character right? Your friend probably doesn't know all this so he assumes it is a bias, but you know all this, surely you don't believe the same?

4. "6 months later" automatically doesn't translate to lost cohesiveness. It is regularly done in many media to skip over non-important parts. Note: here the subjectivity comes in. What may be important to you may be non-important to me. AC2 had "years later" many times yet it is held as a pinnacle of storytelling in AC.

CalgaryJay
12-12-2012, 06:02 PM
Thank you for burning my retinas with that bright red choice

TrueAssassin77
12-12-2012, 06:09 PM
Fact: 99% what we both say and indeed what anyone says is personal opinion. So please let's not pretend anything else, this is an exercise in futility because we are basically fighting opinion with opinion, but still I'll persevere:

1. Yes, it can be argued intelligently and non-subjectively that Brotherhood is the root of all evil in AC.

actually interested in your belief of this. please elaborate

2. No arguments there. I hope you understand why I want "that" to happen again.

are you saying you want connor's sequel to feature playable bad guys...

3. I know but I'm talking about this particular instance. If it was so why would they make a minority character in the first place? And spend resources to hire native experts to get his character right? Your friend probably doesn't know all this so he assumes it is a bias, but you know all this, surely you don't believe the same?

nope. doesn't mean it doesn't have merit

4. "6 months later" automatically doesn't translate to lost cohesiveness. It is regularly done in many media to skip over non-important parts. Note: here the subjectivity comes in. What may be important to you may be non-important to me. AC2 had "years later" many times yet it is held as a pinnacle of storytelling in AC.

subjective. AC2 is not a great story to me

pirate1802
12-12-2012, 06:10 PM
Lol.. I had to highlight them to read properly xD

Lightpex
12-12-2012, 06:18 PM
It's is NOT a matter of opinion whether Haytham was a good character or not. It is fact. Haytham had a good development for 3 sequences, he was strikingly keen, he caught everyone's attention whether you will admit it or not, and he always had an air about that made you wonder who he was, and why you didn't seem to get to now him fully.

Connor on the other hand, while cool calm and collected as he may be, lacked the sudden interest that Haytham had. While he developed nicely, from idiot kid to mature adult, he did NOT captivate you as a character. This reason being as he is an indian. I get that. He was more of the quiet confidence guy. I understand and agree. But, it no-the-less makes him less interesting as an actually character.

pirate1802
12-12-2012, 06:21 PM
actually interested in your belief of this. please elaborate

Didn't say i necessarily believe in it. But It has some merit, just like your friend's argument.

are you saying you want connor's sequel to feature playable bad guys...

Yes why not? I don't consider the Templars the bad guys anyway. The traditional good guy-bad guy characterization doesn't do justice to a game like AC. Not especially after AC3.

subjective. AC2 is not a great story to me

Subjective: AC2 and AC3 both have a great story imo. Brotherhood's story is poor, again, just my opinion. It didn't have a "6 months later" caption either, yet it didn't do it for me. Revelation's story was good.

I can't figure out how to use colored texts properly so I'll just use your ccolor.