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View Full Version : Clearing wrecks from the flight deck? How????



-HH-Dubbo
06-22-2004, 12:59 AM
Playing on-line, it has occured to me that if you limp back to base ahead of your squad and belly-in on landing (or if you don't limp back but just prang because of pilot error), if you are on the runway, your fellow pilots have to land around you. Not so much a problem in FB because you can usually work around that.

PF will be a different story. The unique challenges of landing on a carrier deck will result in a lot more prangs. I cannot imagine that all of them will result in the aircraft exploding so how does one clear the deck of wreckage??

I thought that perhaps, after a certain short period of time, your wrecked aircraft will be shoved overboard. In the interem, the pilot should bail and lose some points (but not as many as he/she would bailing away from base)
If he/she doesn't bail....well over the side with them as well.

In addition to this, pilots bailing on deck shouldn't run randomly overboard....or should they? It seems to me that in FB, you can never guess which way the pilot will run from his wreck. This would be dangerous on a flight deck.

Ideas anyone? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.angelfire.com/falcon/nightschpanker/crashoz.jpg
Kermit the Frog is actually a south paw.

[This message was edited by HH Dubbo on Thu June 24 2004 at 11:58 PM.]

-HH-Dubbo
06-22-2004, 12:59 AM
Playing on-line, it has occured to me that if you limp back to base ahead of your squad and belly-in on landing (or if you don't limp back but just prang because of pilot error), if you are on the runway, your fellow pilots have to land around you. Not so much a problem in FB because you can usually work around that.

PF will be a different story. The unique challenges of landing on a carrier deck will result in a lot more prangs. I cannot imagine that all of them will result in the aircraft exploding so how does one clear the deck of wreckage??

I thought that perhaps, after a certain short period of time, your wrecked aircraft will be shoved overboard. In the interem, the pilot should bail and lose some points (but not as many as he/she would bailing away from base)
If he/she doesn't bail....well over the side with them as well.

In addition to this, pilots bailing on deck shouldn't run randomly overboard....or should they? It seems to me that in FB, you can never guess which way the pilot will run from his wreck. This would be dangerous on a flight deck.

Ideas anyone? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.angelfire.com/falcon/nightschpanker/crashoz.jpg
Kermit the Frog is actually a south paw.

[This message was edited by HH Dubbo on Thu June 24 2004 at 11:58 PM.]

Yellonet
06-22-2004, 04:28 AM
Havn't heard something of this. But probably the plane just dissapears once you press re-fly http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Would be cool if:

Firefighters rushed forward and put out the flames of a crashed plane.

Some little veichle came and towed the remains of the plane to an elevator and down under the deck.

Choose if you're going to jump or just walk out of your plane. And possibly control the pilot in some way, direction and speed perhaps.


- Yellonet

AWL_Spinner
06-22-2004, 04:28 AM
The bail out hadn't been "fixed" yet as far as I could tell at the show - someone bailed whilst on deck and ended up in the water. Something still to be worked on.

Excellent question about the wreckage though, should have thought to ask at the time!

Cheers, Spinner

http://www.alliedwingedlegion.com/members/signatures/spinner_sig.jpg

-HH-Dubbo
06-22-2004, 09:09 AM
Pressing refly will work offline or on dogfight servers but not with a co-op. You're stuck where you end up until everyone has landed, otherwise no points for you.

And of course, I don't think they dumped every pranged aircraft overboard. I'm sure if they weren't under attack or under the gun to land other aircraft, they would recycle the crashed aircraft. Maybe there can be 2 options
"Quick Deck-clear" which would involve over the side, &
"Regular Deck-clear" which would involve taking the wreck below decks.

I dunno if any are do-able, I'm just throwing out ideas here. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.angelfire.com/falcon/nightschpanker/crashoz.jpg
Kermit the Frog is actually a south paw.

IV_JG51_Razor
06-22-2004, 11:34 AM
"You're stuck where you end up until everyone has landed, otherwise no points for you."

I would imagine that would be the price you pay for pranging it on the deck http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Razor
IV/JG51 Intelligence Officer
www.jg51.net (http://www.jg51.net)

"Good judgement comes from experience, and experience comes from poor judgement"

ShadowHawk__
06-22-2004, 02:13 PM
Good luck to everyone else trying to land on the deck though... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif

__________________________________________________ ________
Death From Above
http://www.geocities.com/tk_shadow_hawk/shadowhawk_sig2.txt

-HH-Dubbo
06-22-2004, 02:47 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by ShadowHawk__:
Good luck to everyone else trying to land on the deck though... http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif

__________________________________________________ ________
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's my point http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

http://www.angelfire.com/falcon/nightschpanker/crashoz.jpg
Kermit the Frog is actually a south paw.

HH Quazi
06-22-2004, 02:57 PM
Something will definately have to done to ensure the ability of the rest of your flight to be able to land on the deck if you are playing coop. I believe leaving it up to the player to initiate a quick clean option of the deck after a crash landing would be a viable option, especially in a coop. Probably neccessary. But, if there is no hurry to clean it up, and for the imersion factor, the ideas above concerning the approach of firemen with hose putting out any fires and/or watching as your aircraft is pushed overboard would be great for imersiveness. Great topic and concerns Lt. Dubbo. S!

http://www.angelfire.com/falcon/nightschpanker/QuasiPOWsmall.jpg

|CoB|_Spectre
06-23-2004, 04:07 AM
The decision to push the damaged aircraft over the side or move it to the hangar deck lies with the airboss. I'm reasonably sure that assessment would depend on the outward condition of the damage and made in short order. If it looked like it was "beyond economical repair" (an official term still used by the USN), the aircraft would probably be struck (scrapped). As another poster mentioned, other mitigating factors are conditions at time of recovery ops. If they were not under attack and there were not significant numbers of other aircraft in the landing evolution with low fuel states, time might allow for the wreck to be moved to the hangar deck and usable parts cannibalized. If the aforementioned conditions precluded a more leisurely course of action, they might have to push it over the side. Of course a catastrophic crash may be accompanied by fire which would have priority over everything and the aircraft awaiting recovery would have to be diverted to other carriers if within range if they could not orbit until the deck was cleared. The tempo of launch and recovery carrier ops has always been a high energy affair frought with dangers to aircrew and deckcrew alike. It would be cool if a crash party could be animated to run out on the deck and clear the wreckage.

-HH-Dubbo
06-23-2004, 05:03 AM
Very informative post Spectre. Thank you.

I figured the pilot would not be making the decision as to whether to scrap the aircraft or not, but your post outlines the process really well.

The problem remains however. If there is not some way to clear the decks, co-op missions will have real playability issues.

2 other options
(which would really suck, to be honest)

a/ to have player aircraft disappear after the player bails http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

b/ to not have any carrier landings during co-op play http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

Trying to land around this
http://www.angelfire.com/falcon/nightschpanker/carrierwildcat.jpg

or this
http://www.angelfire.com/falcon/nightschpanker/Avengerbroken.jpg
(obviously there was no rush to clear this Avenger)

or this
http://www.angelfire.com/falcon/nightschpanker/Corsaircrash.jpg

would not be easy, regardless of whether the aircraft was declared beyond economical repair or not.

See I learnt something today http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

[This message was edited by HH Dubbo on Wed June 23 2004 at 11:19 AM.]

I_Jg3_BARKHORN
06-24-2004, 02:01 PM
perhaps if u are heavily damaged you could ditch near the fleet and get picked up. That happened a bunch. Also there are usually more than 1 carrier in a task force. Divert to another boat, a smaller one and tear that deck up. Leave the big boat for everyone else.
S!

-HH-Dubbo
06-24-2004, 03:38 PM
I agree Barkhorn and making the decision of where to land will add to the game.

But there will be prangs on the deck just from pilot error, more so than in FB just because of the challenge of aircraft carrier landings.

I can see a lot of aircraft choking up the deck that were not damaged in battle at all.

http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

http://www.angelfire.com/falcon/nightschpanker/crashoz.jpg
Kermit the Frog is actually a south paw.

stansdds
06-25-2004, 05:06 AM
Before the advent of armored and paved decks, damage to the planking would have also been a factor. Take a look at some flight deck accidents during WW II and you will see the wood planks are torn to pieces. I expect minor damage would not have interrupted recovery, but major damage would have made the deck unusable.

IV_JG51_Razor
06-25-2004, 08:46 AM
A little known factoid: the Essex class CVs were able to rig arresting gear on the forward deck, and recover aircraft while backing down!! My dad was the Flight Deck Officer on the new Yorktown, and saw them actually do this during their shake down cruise.

Razor
IV/JG51 Intelligence Officer
www.jg51.net (http://www.jg51.net)

"Good judgement comes from experience, and experience comes from poor judgement"

Zeus-cat
06-25-2004, 05:02 PM
"Essex class CVs were able to rig arresting gear on the forward deck, and recover aircraft while backing "

Sorry, don't understand what you are saying. I was an Air Force man, not a swabbie. Please explain.

Zeus-cat

Sakai9745
06-25-2004, 07:38 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Zeus-cat:
"Essex class CVs were able to rig arresting gear on the forward deck, and recover aircraft while backing "

Sorry, don't understand what you are saying. I was an Air Force man, not a swabbie. Please explain.

Zeus-cat<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Typically, an aircraft carrier steams (heads) into the wind and lands aircraft on the aft (rear) portion of the deck. In the previously mentioned case, an Essex Class carrier had the ability to steam backwards (up to 20 knots if I remember right), and recover aircraft on the forward portion of the flightdeck.

Hope this clarifies. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Al - SF, Calif

"Defense Dept regrets to inform you that your sons are dead cause they were stupid."

IV_JG51_Razor
06-25-2004, 07:49 PM
BINGO Sakai!! That's absolutely correct!!

If any here have ever seen that WWII classic, "Wing and a Prayer", there's a shot or two of the Yorktown 'backing down' with a bone in her A$$! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Razor
IV/JG51 Intelligence Officer
www.jg51.net (http://www.jg51.net)

"Good judgement comes from experience, and experience comes from poor judgement"

olaleier
06-26-2004, 01:16 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by HH Dubbo:
2 other options
(which would really suck, to be honest)

a/ to have player aircraft disappear after the player bails http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

b/ to not have any carrier landings during co-op play http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_mad.gif

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

You forgot:

c/ Nail those landings like a true Navy ace. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/mockface.gif


Anyway, I don't think animated deck crew recovering the wreck is an option, so a wreck-timeout seems more likely.

Perhaps a conf.ini parameter, so those that don't want it can keep the wrecks.

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