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View Full Version : How in god's name does he know him? (Spoilers)



Tekwarthewolf
11-05-2012, 12:28 PM
Ok, so I just reached the part of Sequence 9 where Connar and his dad talk for the first time face to face on screen. Was there a scene cut or something? In the game him and his father NEVER meet, yet his father knows his name, doesn't show any surprise at meeting his son for the first time...the entire scene just feels...weird. Can someone please explain HOW this happened, or was it just a flub on the writing team's part.

Rithrius
11-05-2012, 12:55 PM
During the time you play as a 15 year old Connor, they cross paths in Boston, but they only look at eachother from a distance and don't even talk, so... yeah, i'm clueless.

Apirka
11-05-2012, 01:14 PM
I guess while investigating that pesky Assassin he found out or something. I wish he hadn't, and I certainly wish there had been more development for that relationship. So much potential, and then nearly nothing is done with it...

NumberSix1967
11-05-2012, 02:58 PM
I wonder how by the time Connor is old enough to go roaming around Assassin-style, all of Haytham's band of merry men turned into pantomime villains. They were perfectly fine pre-story plot twist and when we see them again they're laundering cash and all sorts. Very odd. Haytham actually seems a good guy, well, until they made him condone things that surely he wouldn't have based upon what we knew of him from playing as him. All very odd.

Grandmaster_Z
11-05-2012, 03:26 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MacGuffin

Apirka
11-05-2012, 03:28 PM
I wonder how by the time Connor is old enough to go roaming around Assassin-style, all of Haytham's band of merry men turned into pantomime villains. They were perfectly fine pre-story plot twist and when we see them again they're laundering cash and all sorts. Very odd. Haytham actually seems a good guy, well, until they made him condone things that surely he wouldn't have based upon what we knew of him from playing as him. All very odd.

*snort* I thought that as well. Charles Lee during the Haytham missions: sincere, friendly enough, vaguely adorable. Charles Lee when he meets mini!Connor: Hurr hurr, listen to my evil speech that will leave you utterly convinced that I burned down your village! My reaction to that: ...All right. And here I thought we were finally getting grey and gray morality back.

And then we're supposed to think that the others wanted well... but never get any evidence for that before we kill them. Haytham I could actually understand since he displayed some of his darker side in the prologue, but it would have been nice if he had shown more of his good side during the team up missions.

NumberSix1967
11-05-2012, 04:21 PM
Even when it's made clear that Washington was the casue of Connor's village burning, he [Connor] carried on working for his cause. How did any of this slip by the editors!? Haytham's darker side I can understand. I mean, we're dealing with murderers and social engineers here, on both sides, so that's actually fair enough but "thou shalt burn, young savage" [I made that up] Charles Lee was perfectly likeable up until he, for some reason, was hanging around in the forest. In fact, why was he there again?

Apirka
11-05-2012, 04:41 PM
Only reason I can think of for them being there was that Haytham wanted them to warn the natives... In which case, Charles' behaviour hardly helped (and why didn't they end up doing anything apart from strangling Connor a bit? And why was Charles such a ******bag when he knows his beloved Haytham was with a native woman? Hell, how did Haytham not know when Connor confronts him, despite his men having been there not too long before the attack?) Seriously, as much as I love AC as a series and its story, AC3 wasn't really an example of good story telling.

Mega8BitPanda
11-05-2012, 05:14 PM
I think it is a combination of the fact that Charles Lee was a changed man after learning the Templar's "secrets" once initiated by the end of Haytham's sequences. I believe he was sent by Haytham to Connor's village to establish relations with them yet Lee's impatience with Connor lead to him never really knowing where to go to find the village, he wouldn't ask Connor to begin with if he knew, right?

Achilles had also informed Connor of the entire Templar and Assassin war right from Altiair to Ezio before training. Although Connor was more focused on the protection of his village, he also knew the stakes of should the Templars be allowed to live, Juno had also stirred this fear within him that the village would be in danger so long as they lived when he interacts with the crystal ball. Juno was a God figure to him, what she says must be true to him.

Connor knew about Haytham being his father due to not only his mother but he also read from Haytham's journal in the village as a boy, so I recall. As for Haytham knowing, it wouldn't be a stretch to think he connected the dots as Connor strongly resembles him with certain traits as Achilles points out. Adding that with Connor's mother's descent and the fact he is even an assassin as Haytham once was would make it a logical choice. That, or Haytham would undoubtedly have enough intelligence to gather that information as Connor and Achilles both openly acknowledge it to have ever asks when there is a meeting concerning the Templars. Haytham was a smart man, he probably expected the day to come for quite some time, too.

As for them working together, Haytham had the upper hand when they first met in both skill and circumstance so if I were Connor I wouldn't exactly be willing to try anything for sometime myself, especially with a truce such as theirs. The smart thing to do would be to bide his time and learn more about his father, potentially weaknesses and habits as well as the hope that he may be swayed from his ways given how naive Connor can be about it all. That'd be my take on it, anyway.

NumberSix1967
11-05-2012, 11:41 PM
I think it is a combination of the fact that Charles Lee was a changed man after learning the Templar's "secrets" once initiated by the end of Haytham's sequences. I believe he was sent by Haytham to Connor's village to establish relations with them yet Lee's impatience with Connor lead to him never really knowing where to go to find the village, he wouldn't ask Connor to begin with if he knew, right?

Achilles had also informed Connor of the entire Templar and Assassin war right from Altiair to Ezio before training. Although Connor was more focused on the protection of his village, he also knew the stakes of should the Templars be allowed to live, Juno had also stirred this fear within him that the village would be in danger so long as they lived when he interacts with the crystal ball. Juno was a God figure to him, what she says must be true to him.

Connor knew about Haytham being his father due to not only his mother but he also read from Haytham's journal in the village as a boy, so I recall. As for Haytham knowing, it wouldn't be a stretch to think he connected the dots as Connor strongly resembles him with certain traits as Achilles points out. Adding that with Connor's mother's descent and the fact he is even an assassin as Haytham once was would make it a logical choice. That, or Haytham would undoubtedly have enough intelligence to gather that information as Connor and Achilles both openly acknowledge it to have ever asks when there is a meeting concerning the Templars. Haytham was a smart man, he probably expected the day to come for quite some time, too.

As for them working together, Haytham had the upper hand when they first met in both skill and circumstance so if I were Connor I wouldn't exactly be willing to try anything for sometime myself, especially with a truce such as theirs. The smart thing to do would be to bide his time and learn more about his father, potentially weaknesses and habits as well as the hope that he may be swayed from his ways given how naive Connor can be about it all. That'd be my take on it, anyway.

All exactly as considered when playing through. I wasn't too fussed with finding out how Haytham and Connor knew of each other because, as you say, the gaps were filled in off-screen by circumstance. If you really think about it, the game itself had all the elements there (story, play, mechanics etc) but it was just handled a bit badly, almost as if it wasn't allowed enough time to develop during development. Maybe 6 months or a year extra could have seen ACIII bring about the real next step in the series.

Rob1610
11-06-2012, 12:26 AM
It's all part of the game's ambience. I'd always thought Charles Lee, while following Haytham, was a little too rough. So to see that roughness years later and on the other side of the fight makes it seems like he's even rougher than before. As for Haytham, between the time he sees Connor from a distance to the time he actually meets him and talks to him, doesn't anyone think that Haytham did his research? Charles Lee figured out before then that Connor was "the little boy from the native village". He told Haytham and Haytham put 2 and 2 together. The village his love is from has an Assassin in it? Most Assassins keep it in the family. He could've even seen the resemblance and put 2 and 2 together.

UtilityTortoise
11-06-2012, 12:40 AM
Even when it's made clear that Washington was the casue of Connor's village burning, he [Connor] carried on working for his cause. How did any of this slip by the editors!?

My interpretation on this is that at that point, Connor had realized that he was being used as a pawn/tool regardless of sides, and decided to just act for himself and his people and get rid of all the templars as well as avenge himself by killing Charles Lee. Hence that's why he says to Washington that that is the last time he should call on him again (or something to that effect, I paraphrased).

I think Connor's story kind of parallels the modern day story, in that Washington may not have been the best choice, but it's too late, there needs to be a leader for the new country (similar to how Juno might not have been the best choice, but again it's too late and there needs to be someone to save the world from the solar flare).