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Metallicaner
06-02-2004, 03:56 AM
Hey all...

All this memorial stuff these days for the heroes of WWII really got me thinking

When WW1 ended, or atleast right before it ended, the Allied said it was the "war to end all wars"....

I say it's "The war that lead to even more wars"

One of the main reasons why WWII happened was because Hitler and the rest of the population wanted revenge for WW1...

And then from WWII, the Allied and the Commies came into big disagreements on how to split Germany, so this lead to the "Cold war", which contains the Corea war and the Vietnam war, which then again led to terrorists and fearsom leaders in the Middle east...

Think over it guys!

[This message was edited by Metallicaner on Wed June 02 2004 at 05:08 AM.]

[This message was edited by Metallicaner on Wed June 02 2004 at 05:08 AM.]

Metallicaner
06-02-2004, 03:56 AM
Hey all...

All this memorial stuff these days for the heroes of WWII really got me thinking

When WW1 ended, or atleast right before it ended, the Allied said it was the "war to end all wars"....

I say it's "The war that lead to even more wars"

One of the main reasons why WWII happened was because Hitler and the rest of the population wanted revenge for WW1...

And then from WWII, the Allied and the Commies came into big disagreements on how to split Germany, so this lead to the "Cold war", which contains the Corea war and the Vietnam war, which then again led to terrorists and fearsom leaders in the Middle east...

Think over it guys!

[This message was edited by Metallicaner on Wed June 02 2004 at 05:08 AM.]

[This message was edited by Metallicaner on Wed June 02 2004 at 05:08 AM.]

Dmitri9mm
06-02-2004, 04:22 AM
I don't really want to start a flame-war or anything, but your analysis seems a bit simplified.
It is true beyond any doubt that the end of WWI planted the seeds for the next war. This has happened in almost every conflict from the ice-ages till today.
But blaming WWII on Hitlers(what's so interesting about that guy anyway?) and the German peoples thirst for revenge has nothing to do with reality.
The causes for WWII were complicated matters of economy and dominance of the worlds ressources and surely did not depend on one man or even the population of a single country in Europe.
The reason why Europe wasn't torn by war once again after WWII had nothing to do with people getting "tired" of war, neither was it because of the marshal-plan nor the Rome treaty. It was more likely, that the western governments had found a greater enemy: Socialism.
No harm intented, but be careful with your analysis. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

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arcadeace
06-02-2004, 04:56 AM
The Socialist explaining who the guilty ones were http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/crazy.gif

More intelligent members telling us the way it was?

Get real or find another place to explain evil, however you define it.

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CaptainGelo
06-02-2004, 05:00 AM
sry, but this is one of the treads that needs to be locked be4 it even starts......but who knows maybe there'll be no flams.......just wonder, what it got to do with Il2(exept for the word 2nd and war)?

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bazzaah2
06-02-2004, 05:20 AM
It is tempting to see history as single static process, but the reality is much more complex and dynamic than that. Fascinating subject - you should read 'War and Peace' to get a perspective on relation between individuals and processes in history.

As one of my old professors would have said, there are many histories.

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Huxley_S
06-02-2004, 05:42 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>All this memorial stuff these days for the heroes of WWII really got me thinking<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Seems like you need to do a bit less thinking and a bit more reading.

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PBNA-Boosher
06-02-2004, 05:56 AM
There is no good, nor is there evil. For every one believes they are fighting for the good side.

Metallicaner
06-02-2004, 06:03 AM
Topic is going to be deleted soon due to some half-brained reply's.

Read the main topic properly...

People during WW1 said that war would end all wars forever... But obviously it didn't... it even lead to even more wars

EDIT: The topic can't be deleted when it has replies

And like I said: ONE OF THE REASONS WWII got started, was to take revenge for losing the first world war

[This message was edited by Metallicaner on Wed June 02 2004 at 05:12 AM.]

Metallicaner
06-02-2004, 06:05 AM
"Seems like you need to do a bit less thinking and a bit more reading."

what?? Umm, yes, these memorials got me thinking about the war, or wars at all http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/crazy.gif

Dunkelgrun
06-02-2004, 06:34 AM
[QUOTE]
And like I said: ONE OF THE REASONS WWII got started, was to take revenge for losing the first world war
QUOTE]

Revenge is too strong a word.

In the 1930s the German people were ready to accept National Socialism because their country was in deep economic trouble as a result of the conditions imposed at the Treaty of Versaille. This rankled with the Germans because they believed that they did not actually lose WWI, although in reality they had very little resources, men or material, with which to carry on. Remember though, it ended with an Armistice.
The Nazis promised a revival in German fortunes.

If Germany was intent on revenge why did Hitler not want to fight Great Britain? Also, going to war against the USA was certainly not in his short-term plans.

As with all the others, this is a very simplified answer, but the best advice in this thread is to go and read a book. Lots of them. We should all do the same.

Cheers.

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Greenwidth
06-02-2004, 06:40 AM
At the outbreak of World War I, with popular patriotism at its peak, the slogan "The war to end all war" was - in David Lloyd George's opinion - bandied about with undue excitement:

"This war, like the next war, is a war to end all war" he remarked.

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tsisqua
06-02-2004, 08:42 AM
In WWI, Germany was undefeated . . . in the field.

It was an economic defeat, and the League Of Nations ruling made Germany responsible for the entire financial burden of the entire war. They were forced to pay restitution to all nations that fought them. Years later, along comes a man with a plan: "We owe nothing, and will pay nothing any longer". "We will be great again", and the poor German people wanted, and deserved that. However, he was a madman, and before anyone realized this, it was too late.

Tsisqua

Bewolf
06-02-2004, 09:11 AM
Tsiqua got it mainly right.

Hitler came to power not because he promised revenge, but because he promised revival of Germany to prewar grandness both econimcally and politically. Even on the brink of the attack on Poland the german ppl had absolutely no motivation to go to another war and that changed only after the great victories in the early stages of the war, and didn't last long.
Even the war itself was intended to be faught in the East, not the West. It was France and Britain declaring war on Germany, not vice versa.

It is true though, that the Versaille treaty made Hitlers raise so easy. It totally undermined the Weimar Republics democratic progresses. The economic crisis gave the last blow to the little respect it had.

Bewolf

Never discuss with stupid people.
They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Afreaka
06-02-2004, 09:12 AM
The speak from "WW5" by www.trailervision.com (http://www.trailervision.com)

WW1 was the war to end all wars
WW2 was worse
....
until now
WW5
america against the world
this summer there won't be a summer
WW5
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NegativeGee
06-02-2004, 10:15 AM
Having read what Dunklegrun, tsisqua and Bewolf said, it put me in mind of something Albert Speer said during his trial at Nuremburg in 1946:

"Hitler's dictatorship differed in one fundamental point from all its predecessors in history. His was the first dictatorship in
the present period of technical development, a dictatorship which made complete use of all technical means for the
domination of its own country. Through technical means like the radio and the loud-speaker, eighty million people were deprived of independent thought. It was thereby possible to subject them to the will of one man."

"As weaponry, both were good, but in far different ways from each other. In a nutshell, I describe it this way: if the FW 190 was a sabre, the 109 was a florett, or foil, like that used in the precision art of fencing." - G√ľnther Rall

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carguy_
06-02-2004, 10:43 AM
Ppl,please don`t say that Hitler is the only one responsible for killing milions of ppl as if he had nuked the whole continent with a single push of a button.

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jeroen_R90S
06-02-2004, 11:42 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by carguy_:
...with a single push of a button.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Will an autograph do then, as well?

Jeroen