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YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 10:50 AM
1) Disguising yourself like a ally of your target - i hate those missions, because they dont allow you to be creative. the idea itself is creative, but after all its not us that came up with it, so when we're doing the mission in a disguise all we have to do is walk right in there and kill them. Doesnt allow us to be creative at all.

2) Getting help from others - another annoying type of mission is where you HAVE TO use the assassins/thiefs/mercinaries. eg. the mission in sequence 7 i think it is in ACR, where im killling people, and the assassins come along and take all my kills. If there are kills to be made it should be our choice who does them. the whole idea of being a master assassin, i think, is so that i can do things alone. i dont want help it limits what i can do, and makes missions boring.

3) missions where you have to follow a set path - eg. in AC2, ACB and ACB where you had to find the keys for armour/library. there was no point in those missions, they may as well have made them cut scenes because there is only one way to go you have no choice but to go that way, to get to the destination, whereas in missions such as, leonardo's war machine, they give you the target, and you have to find your own way there, killing who you want, when you want, if you want, in whatever way you want and ALONE! theyre the best type of missions

4) In addition, i just remembered, the apple missions are sooo painful. They are agonisingly tedious and boring

ProletariatPleb
04-09-2012, 10:58 AM
1) Disguising yourself like a ally of your target - i hate those missions, because they dont allow you to be creative. the idea itself is creative, but after all its not us that came up with it, so when we're doing the mission in a disguise all we have to do is walk right in there and kill them. Doesnt allow us to be creative at all.

2) Getting help from others - another annoying type of mission is where you HAVE TO use the assassins/thiefs/mercinaries. eg. the mission in sequence 7 i think it is in ACR, where im killling people, and the assassins come along and take all my kills. no kills = no fun. the whole idea of being a master assassin, i think, is so that i can do things alone. i dont want help it limits what i can do, and makes missions boring.

3) missions where you have to follow a set path - eg. in AC2, ACB and ACB where you had to find the keys for armour/library. there was no point in those missions, they may as well have made them cut scenes because there is only one way to go you have no choice but to go that way, to get to the destination, whereas in missions such as, leonardo's war machine, they give you the target, and you have to find your own way there, killing who you want, when you want, if you want, in whatever way you want and ALONE! theyre the best type of missions
I agree with 3.
But nothing wrong with 1 and 2.
The whole point of being a 'Mentor' was having disciples.

LightRey
04-09-2012, 11:06 AM
I disagree with all 3 points. I'd also like to point out that there were different routes to take at several points in all for the Romulus lairs.

Captain Tomatoz
04-09-2012, 11:09 AM
Disguising was fun and I understand that you didn't come up with it but I thought it was still fun. The second point I agree with because it gave no freedom to do the missions on your own if you wanted, its always nice to have a choice. But I still felt badass with the assassin recruits fighting by my side :D. However I don't agree with the third point as even though they were linear they were still fun and it sometimes was a little tricky to find the path you had to take.

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 11:16 AM
I agree with 3.
But nothing wrong with 1 and 2.
The whole point of being a 'Mentor' was having disciples.

that doesn't necessarily mean you should HAVE TO do these things. one thing i thought was, whether you like these missions or not, the fact that you don't have the choice to do it or not is an automatic negative. not even a large choice, there should just be the choice to either do the mission that way or not. simple

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 11:18 AM
Disguising was fun and I understand that you didn't come up with it but I thought it was still fun. The second point I agree with because it gave no freedom to do the missions on your own if you wanted, its always nice to have a choice. But I still felt badass with the assassin recruits fighting by my side :D. However I don't agree with the third point as even though they were linear they were still fun and it sometimes was a little tricky to find the path you had to take.

dont get me wrong some of the lair missions are fun, eg, the ones with guards where you can do it stealthily or not, but the others where its one one climbing route and no guards is so restricting and quite tedious to an extent

LightRey
04-09-2012, 11:19 AM
that doesn't necessarily mean you should HAVE TO do these things. one thing i thought was, whether you like these missions or not, the fact that you don't have the choice to do it or not is an automatic negative. not even a large choice, there should just be the choice to either do the mission that way or not. simple
Tbh, it just sounds ridiculous. No kills = no fun? ssly? AC isn't all about killing y'know.

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 11:20 AM
I disagree with all 3 points. I'd also like to point out that there were different routes to take at several points in all for the Romulus lairs.

oooohh a couple of choices wow... tell me moreeee! :eek:

pacmanate
04-09-2012, 11:21 AM
I just don't like repetitive following of people, I think its gotten really old now.

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 11:22 AM
Tbh, it just sounds ridiculous. No kills = no fun? ssly? AC isn't all about killing y'know.

i know what you mean, but i sort of put that wrongly. coz i dont like killing all the time (eg. i enjoyed the ACR mission where the task was to not kill anyone whilst working your way through that restricted are to find sulieman) i know its not all about killing, but if there are kills to be made, it should be us that make them, or at least our choice who makes them, after all WE are the master

LightRey
04-09-2012, 11:24 AM
oooohh a couple of choices wow... tell me moreeee! :eek:
There were some alternative routes involving flags in each of the lairs and really just a few bits where you could choose which way to go.

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 11:25 AM
I just don't like repetitive following of people, I think its gotten really old now.

nah i like it, coz i use the rooftops, a lot of people use the ground... wtf... who does that, no wonder some find it boring

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 11:26 AM
There were some alternative routes involving flags in each of the lairs and really just a few bits where you could choose which way to go.

well thats not exactly amazing is it.

TagDoll
04-09-2012, 11:31 AM
I agree with 1 but not 2 and 3. I hated dressing as someone else, you're an assassin, you shouldn't have to disguise yourself. They could have easily found ways around it. Just made it feel like it didn't belong

LightRey
04-09-2012, 12:02 PM
well thats not exactly amazing is it.
Shouldn't have to be. They're tombs after all, not cities. You can't expect them to create entire free-roamable areas for every single side mission. You should be happy they already gave you a lot of freedom in the Leonardo's war machine missions.

pacmanate
04-09-2012, 12:09 PM
I hate missions where, there are no missions D: :(

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 12:45 PM
Shouldn't have to be. They're tombs after all, not cities. You can't expect them to create entire free-roamable areas for every single side mission. You should be happy they already gave you a lot of freedom in the Leonardo's war machine missions.

yeah why not jus be happy with 3 missions of freedom out of over 50 yeeeaaaahhh greeeaaaatt... no need for anymore...

LightRey
04-09-2012, 01:09 PM
yeah why not jus be happy with 3 missions of freedom out of over 50 yeeeaaaahhh greeeaaaatt... no need for anymore...
There were only 6 key missions and 4 war machine missions. -__-
Please take your ridiculous exaggerations elsewhere. Also, these are first world problems. Show some respect to the people that poured months if not years of work into these games.

Razrback16
04-09-2012, 01:14 PM
I think following people was fine because it's bound to happen occasionally in a story like that, but I agree on items such as forcing you to have help. I know exactly which mission in sequence 7 you were talking about, and I agree. He has 2 master assassins flanking him with a lot of enemies approaching. I would have preferred the recruits just go take out riflemen and leave all the hand-to-hand combat to me because they do get in the way in those missions. I'd much rather fight 50 guys by myself than with help. No question about it.

Inorganic9_2
04-09-2012, 01:32 PM
Disguising was an awful idea. Especially that one in Brotherhood where you had to choose the route. They made the guards so dumb, just to fit in with the disguise thing. I can;t believe they didn't notice their leader's facial hair, bone structure, voice and body type had entirely changed...not to mention the addition of a crossbow and probably some blood to his uniform as well -__-

kalo.yanis
04-09-2012, 01:37 PM
I actually found the library key missions to be one of the most exciting in ACR. Having a few linear missions doesn't hurt that much.

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 02:37 PM
There were only 6 key missions and 4 war machine missions. -__-
Please take your ridiculous exaggerations elsewhere. Also, these are first world problems. Show some respect to the people that poured months if not years of work into these games.

yeah well im not just talking about the key missions, im talking about the limiting missions all the way through. and what the hell do you mean show respect you're pathetic. you're only saying that to make it sound like you're the good guy here. i made this thread to show what i thought the bad types of missions were, and see if others agreed, not to slate the game, or its makers, so take your snake attitude and apply to a thread maker that isn't dumb enough to fall for it. you're the type who goes on threads to tear hem down.

just to add, i appreciate those of you who's comments aren't blunt and/or ignorant

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 02:47 PM
I actually found the library key missions to be one of the most exciting in ACR. Having a few linear missions doesn't hurt that much.

yeah true but i thought the problem with revelations was that it had too many linear missions

UrDeviant1
04-09-2012, 03:02 PM
There's only really 2 missions I remember being a pain.

The one near the beginning of ACR, where we had to scuffle with Leandros, each on a horse and cart, while avoiding rough terrain.

And the one In ACB where we had to beat a thief In a race, to achieve 100% sync.

They're the ones that stick out most, and both took a few goes to complete!

TorQue1988
04-09-2012, 03:05 PM
1) Disguising yourself like a ally of your target - i hate those missions, because they dont allow you to be creative. the idea itself is creative, but after all its not us that came up with it, so when we're doing the mission in a disguise all we have to do is walk right in there and kill them. Doesnt allow us to be creative at all.

2) Getting help from others - another annoying type of mission is where you HAVE TO use the assassins/thiefs/mercinaries. eg. the mission in sequence 7 i think it is in ACR, where im killling people, and the assassins come along and take all my kills. no kills = no fun. the whole idea of being a master assassin, i think, is so that i can do things alone. i dont want help it limits what i can do, and makes missions boring.
I disagree with all your points. The only things that bothered were the "complete in 7 minutes" full synch conditions for the lairs and the sequences that automatically move you from one mission to another (like the awful 8th sequence from ACB).

3) missions where you have to follow a set path - eg. in AC2, ACB and ACB where you had to find the keys for armour/library. there was no point in those missions, they may as well have made them cut scenes because there is only one way to go you have no choice but to go that way, to get to the destination, whereas in missions such as, leonardo's war machine, they give you the target, and you have to find your own way there, killing who you want, when you want, if you want, in whatever way you want and ALONE! theyre the best type of missions
I disagree with all your points. The only things that bothered me were the "complete in 7 minutes" full synch conditions for the lairs (and the timed missions in general) and the sequences that automatically moved you from one mission to another (like the awful 8th sequence from ACB).

LightRey
04-09-2012, 03:39 PM
yeah well im not just talking about the key missions, im talking about the limiting missions all the way through. and what the hell do you mean show respect you're pathetic. you're only saying that to make it sound like you're the good guy here. i made this thread to show what i thought the bad types of missions were, and see if others agreed, not to slate the game, or its makers, so take your snake attitude and apply to a thread maker that isn't dumb enough to fall for it. you're the type who goes on threads to tear hem down.

just to add, i appreciate those of you who's comments aren't blunt and/or ignorant
Such a smart way to counter a regular counter statement with swearing. Really shows how much you respect other people's opinions if they disagree with yours. If you weren't talking about the key missions, please specify which you were talking about, because I can't think of any and 6 is nowhere near your claim of 50.

Captain Tomatoz
04-09-2012, 03:42 PM
I disagree with all your points. The only things that bothered me were the "complete in 7 minutes" full synch conditions for the lairs (and the timed missions in general) and the sequences that automatically moved you from one mission to another (like the awful 8th sequence from ACB).

I agree, the 8th sequence of brotherhood made me think that it was kind of rushed.

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 04:06 PM
Such a smart way to counter a regular counter statement with swearing. Really shows how much you respect other people's opinions if they disagree with yours. If you weren't talking about the key missions, please specify which you were talking about, because I can't think of any and 6 is nowhere near your claim of 50.

1) first when did i swear. if you think hell is a swear word, my gosh are you immature cannot actually believe you even picked up on that and brought it up soooo petty and pathetic

2) here we go talking about respect again, you dont even know what respect is. you shouldn't have respect for someone unless you know a lot about them so, yeah your right i dont have respect for whatever you're talking about, only a naive narrow minded person talks about respect for someone or something the dont know much about

3) also, ive actually been very accepting of others opinions and then giving my own back to carry on the debate, so jus take a second to notice that you're the only person on this forum i have a problem with, becuase you're words are: blunt and ignorant

4) well the key missions are 6 examples of linear paths yes. examples of missions where you have to use assassins, well the one i mentioned earlier, the one with the courtesans where you poison the guys who pick up the box, the altair missions where the assassins help you, the list goes on, the disguise one where you're a janissary. another linear one where all the ships are on firre and you have to catch the boat

AnthonyA85
04-09-2012, 04:09 PM
In my opinion, the worst missions were the timed ones, especially when they had ridiculous/impossible-to-meet full synch requirments, in particular, the romulus lairs that had a time limit on them, the last assassin tomb in AC2 was the worst offender. It was the most poorly designed mission of them all, i know they were meant to get harder as the game progressed, but not to the point they became nigh unbeatable.

Mal Practice is another poorly planned mission, i wouldn't mind the time limit, if it didn't put such restrictive full synch requirments in (I STILL can't complete that mission, so i just stopped trying.), another horrible mission that i hate is the one where you have to beat Cessare to the apple, and you can't call on your assassins, and you only have 3 smoke bombs (I REALLY could have used some of ACR's caltrop bombs in that mission)

I'm not really fussed about follow missions, i just find it annoying when the target constantly turns round.

LightRey
04-09-2012, 04:34 PM
1) first when did i swear. if you think hell is a swear word, my gosh are you immature cannot actually believe you even picked up on that and brought it up soooo petty and pathetic

2) here we go talking about respect again, you dont even know what respect is. you shouldn't have respect for someone unless you know a lot about them so, yeah your right i dont have respect for whatever you're talking about, only a naive narrow minded person talks about respect for someone or something the dont know much about

3) also, ive actually been very accepting of others opinions and then giving my own back to carry on the debate, so jus take a second to notice that you're the only person on this forum i have a problem with, becuase you're words are: blunt and ignorant

4) well the key missions are 6 examples of linear paths yes. examples of missions where you have to use assassins, well the one i mentioned earlier, the one with the courtesans where you poison the guys who pick up the box, the altair missions where the assassins help you, the list goes on, the disguise one where you're a janissary. another linear one where all the ships are on firre and you have to catch the boat
1) I was talking about the word "pathetic" not "hell". When using such a word to describe an individual it is, at least in my eyes, swearing.

2) There is a difference between having no respect for someone and disrespecting them. Furthermore, regardless of their motivations or anything of the sort, you should respect other people's opinions. If you do not, then at the very least refrain from expressing your lack of respect on these forums as that generally involves breaking the rules. *Refers back to the use of the word "pathetic".*

3) I'm very accepting of other people's opinions. They have the full right to express them. I take issue with your arguments, since they are either wrong or very much lacking in necessary detail.

4) I believe we were talking about linear missions, not the other examples. Regardless, even if we count those, I sincerely doubt we'd get 50 in total, certainly not with ACB alone.

POP1Fan
04-09-2012, 04:49 PM
1) Disguising yourself like a ally of your target - i hate those missions, because they dont allow you to be creative. the idea itself is creative, but after all its not us that came up with it, so when we're doing the mission in a disguise all we have to do is walk right in there and kill them. Doesnt allow us to be creative at all.

2) Getting help from others - another annoying type of mission is where you HAVE TO use the assassins/thiefs/mercinaries. eg. the mission in sequence 7 i think it is in ACR, where im killling people, and the assassins come along and take all my kills. no kills = no fun. the whole idea of being a master assassin, i think, is so that i can do things alone. i dont want help it limits what i can do, and makes missions boring.

3) missions where you have to follow a set path - eg. in AC2, ACB and ACB where you had to find the keys for armour/library. there was no point in those missions, they may as well have made them cut scenes because there is only one way to go you have no choice but to go that way, to get to the destination, whereas in missions such as, leonardo's war machine, they give you the target, and you have to find your own way there, killing who you want, when you want, if you want, in whatever way you want and ALONE! theyre the best type of missions

4) In addition, i just remembered, the apple missions are sooo painful. They are agonisingly tedious and boring

1) The whole ideea it's pretty cool and the mission's themselves weren't bad, but after being in all the games in the Ezio trilogy they got pretty old.Not bad, but not the best either.
2) I don't get this one.There are no missions where the Assassins take ALL the killing. Sure they come and take on some dudes, but they have a very bad A.I. I remember a mission in Revelations whre you have to protect a guy and don't let him get hit and my assassin "friend" just kept screwing it up.So the assassins are pretty useless xD It never felt, for me, that they take the fun of killing away (this sound very wierd).
3) This is the one I highly disagree.The best mission in the whole franchise yet for me is the Forum of the Ox in Revelations.Sometimes it's better to follow a specifc path even in a more "freedom" like game as long as they don't overuse it.
4) There are 2-3 apple missions in all the games....I don't get what you are on about these.

And I have to agree about the timed missions.Those are the hardest missions in the series.I hate them.And if anything, yes, these are the worst.

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 04:50 PM
1) I was talking about the word "pathetic" not "hell". When using such a word to describe an individual it is, at least in my eyes, swearing.

2) There is a difference between having no respect for someone and disrespecting them. Furthermore, regardless of their motivations or anything of the sort, you should respect other people's opinions. If you do not, then at the very least refrain from expressing your lack of respect on these forums as that generally involves breaking the rules. *Refers back to the use of the word "pathetic".*

3) I'm very accepting of other people's opinions. They have the full right to express them. I take issue with your arguments, since they are either wrong or very much lacking in necessary detail.

4) I believe we were talking about linear missions, not the other examples. Regardless, even if we count those, I sincerely doubt we'd get 50 in total, certainly not with ACB alone.

1) Exactly what is was saying, but you completely missed my point, picking up on a wrod like that and referring to it as swearing in order to make me look bad is so petty and immature

2) As i said before, and as backed up by my response to people in this forum, i have been respectful of their opinions and you can see that and you know it just read them

3) YOU are not at all respecting of opinions and are highly contradictory. You said " I'm very accepting of other people's opinions. They have the full right to express them. I take issue with your arguments, since they are either wrong or very much lacking in detail" That is the most contradictory statement i've ever heard. One minute you respect opinions, then you dont. You say my opinion is wrong. OMG huge LOL's. An opinion cannot be wrong. End of... Also, to prove further that you are not respecting of opinions, the first thing you said in this forum was. "i disagree with all 3 points" You gave no explanation why. The only thing you added was roughly, "there are also several choices of routes in the Romulus lairs" so from that point on, i knew you were not a respectful peron, as YOU have been saying to ME this whole time.

4) The arguement was about the lack of missions of freedom, NOT JUST linear missions, no one ever said it was, in fact my forum description explains that very well, again, my opinion, you didn't have to be so ignorant and 'disrespectful' of my opinion.

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 04:53 PM
I don't know how after such contradiction and hypocrisy you can even try to justify yourself ???????????

UrDeviant1
04-09-2012, 04:55 PM
Opinions can be wrong If they go against fact.

Just sayin' :p

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 05:01 PM
no thats labelled under a different word. eg. if you say man chelsea have the most trophies in the prem. that would be an incorrect fact, not an opinion. an opinion is a subjective statement. that is not a subjective statement. it is an incorrect fact. if i say fifa is the best game, it is my opinion, others can disagree

Sukramo
04-09-2012, 05:02 PM
Missions were you have to follow someone and dont get detected. Specifically following Tarik in the bazaar. Actualy any mission related to Tarik.

And yeah the final AC2 tomb was horrible because you had to use the "dubble jump" meachanic which wasent nearly well enogh explained. I struggled for hours until I understood what to do.

Then Brotherhood comes along and gives you good instructions in the training grounds. I really love Brotherhood:)

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 05:03 PM
Opinions can be wrong If they go against fact.

Just sayin' :p

also, if so, give an example please.

UrDeviant1
04-09-2012, 05:06 PM
I know, I was more pointing out the part when you said "opinions can't be wrong" :P

No biggie.

SixKeys
04-09-2012, 05:07 PM
For me the worst types of missions are timed ones. I hate having to rush through a mission, even if it's just for 100% synch. The one in ACB where you had to stop La Volpe from killing Machiavelli was a pain in the *** and the timed lairs/tombs are annoying.

I also hate missions where there's only one way to get to your objective or to kill your target. In ACR it's impossible to kill Leandros any other way than with the hidden blade, he doesn't even put up a fight even though Ezio just walks right up to him.

I have to say I love the disguise missions. Especially the Janissary camp in ACR because the guards were suspicious of you even when you were in disguise and you had to move carefully. In ACB the money chest mission becomes pretty funny if you're wearing a skin like the Florentine noble outfit. "Hey guys, our captain is suddenly a 17-year-old random civilian with nothing covering his face. Seems legit." :cool:

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 05:07 PM
I know, I was more pointing out the part when you said "opinions can't be wrong" :P

No biggie.

they can't. give an example of a wrong opinion... please

UrDeviant1
04-09-2012, 05:09 PM
I also hate missions where there's only one way to get to your objective or to kill your target. In ACR it's impossible to kill Leandros any other way than with the hidden blade, he doesn't even put up a fight even though Ezio just walks right up to him.

If you stand next to him for a few seconds, he'll draw his sword and attempt to fight you.

Worked for me anyway.

SixKeys
04-09-2012, 05:13 PM
they can't. give an example of a wrong opinion... please

The earth is flat.



If you stand next to him for a few seconds, he'll draw his sword and attempt to fight you.

Worked for me anyway.

That's weird. When I replayed the mission I actually waited for a while to see if he would react in any way, after he said his line he just stood there looking from side to side, just chillin'. Eventually I just walked up to him and killed him.

UrDeviant1
04-09-2012, 05:14 PM
they can't. give an example of a wrong opinion... please

Well. If said Man U are the most Influential football club anywhere, that opinion would be false, because It's neither backed up by research or proof. Rather It would come down to personal taste, which Is similar to an opinion but not the same, because someones 'taste' In something, cannot be wrong.

UrDeviant1
04-09-2012, 05:18 PM
That's weird. When I replayed the mission I actually waited for a while to see if he would react in any way, after he said his line he just stood there looking from side to side, just chillin'. Eventually I just walked up to him and killed him.

It must be a case of sometimes It works, sometimes It don't.

It didn't work on my first playthrough, but on my second It did.

edit: sorry for double post, I'll go find out how to edit/multi-quote.

LightRey
04-09-2012, 05:26 PM
1) Exactly what is was saying, but you completely missed my point, picking up on a wrod like that and referring to it as swearing in order to make me look bad is so petty and immature

2) As i said before, and as backed up by my response to people in this forum, i have been respectful of their opinions and you can see that and you know it just read them

3) YOU are not at all respecting of opinions and are highly contradictory. You said " I'm very accepting of other people's opinions. They have the full right to express them. I take issue with your arguments, since they are either wrong or very much lacking in detail" That is the most contradictory statement i've ever heard. One minute you respect opinions, then you dont. You say my opinion is wrong. OMG huge LOL's. An opinion cannot be wrong. End of... Also, to prove further that you are not respecting of opinions, the first thing you said in this forum was. "i disagree with all 3 points" You gave no explanation why. The only thing you added was roughly, "there are also several choices of routes in the Romulus lairs" so from that point on, i knew you were not a respectful peron, as YOU have been saying to ME this whole time.

4) The arguement was about the lack of missions of freedom, NOT JUST linear missions, no one ever said it was, in fact my forum description explains that very well, again, my opinion, you didn't have to be so ignorant and 'disrespectful' of my opinion.
1) Then don't call it swearing, it hardly matters. It's still against the rules.

2) It doesn't matter who you respect or not, it matters whether and how you show it. Calling people names is against forum rules, regardless of whether they can or should be considered actual swearwords.

3) I'm not arguing that your opinion is false, I'm arguing that the arguments that you are giving to support your opinion are either flawed or incorrect. There is a significant difference and I'm rather surprised you did not realize that. You are free to have your own opinion, but you are trying to reason it and I see flaws in your reasoning. That is what I'm "attacking", if you will. I don't take issue with what you feel, but with why (you think) you're feeling it.
I gave no explanation why because it wasn't my intention to engage in a detailed discussion about it immediately. This is not my thread. I am in no way, be it socially or otherwise, obligated to go into any detail about my opinion. You, however, posed this as to us and one would expect to see at least some significant detail in the reasoning. Loose references without any clear specifics behind the reasoning can hardly be considered convincing arguments.

4) It was what we were specifically discussing. I simply presumed that with missions that lacked freedom you were still referring to the linear missions. It was an honest mistake. Regardless, you have still refrained from going into any detail on which specific missions lacked freedom except for the 6 mentioned.

Anyways, since you are insisting so much I will be happy to post my reasoning regarding all 4 points:
1. I liked the disguises. They generally (not always) added some realism to the games. Not just because it can be considered somewhat odd that Ezio's basically always wearing the same clothes all the time, which is especially weird since he likes to remain anonymous and therefore not recognizable (duh) (though that would not affect his situation as much as many seem to think), but more so because it is exactly the kind of thing he would be taking advantage of. It's such an obvious thing to do. Besides, it's not like the games were filled with these missions and especially the one where Ezio dressed up as a bard in ACR was very fun to play.

2. I can only think of a few missions in which you're actually forced to call in help from the guilds and in most of those missions you could choose to leave behind the group and just do everything yourself (not that I ever found it so freedom impairing that I ever did so). A good example of this would be the assassination mission of one of The Conspirators in ACII, when you get assistance from some mercenaries, which you can promptly leave behind if you want to.

3. The only missions to which this seems to apply are the Assassin Tomb/Templar Lair/Romulus Lair/Memory Seal missions, which are few in number (~7 for each game, depending on whether you downloaded the DLC) and most of them are entirely optional. Naturally, they're freedom impairing in some ways, as you can't really influence your route much, but they do have many optional detours for treasures and flags or just (slight) shortcuts. However, I've always seen the main point of these missions as solving some freerunning puzzles, which was very fun to do. You had to figure out how to get from point A to point B to point C, etc. I liked that very much.

4. I have little to say about this. They were few in number and I think the main reason they put it in there was because people could actually use the apple as a weapon. I was not at all disappointed in it (though I would have liked a few more attacks :p), but instead I was psyched that I actually got to use the apple as a weapon. I completely did not see that one coming in ACB and it was 10x as badass in ACR.

kriegerdesgottes
04-09-2012, 05:35 PM
If it's timed, I hate it.

LightRey
04-09-2012, 05:45 PM
If it's timed, I hate it.
I didn't mind the timed missions much. There were only a few of those too and usually they were fairly easy to complete within the time limit. I must say that the timed full synch requirements were kinda lame. Especially in ACB where it was practically impossible to get all the treasures and flags and complete it in time to get full synch.

TorQue1988
04-09-2012, 05:56 PM
I didn't mind the timed missions much. There were only a few of those too and usually they were fairly easy to complete within the time limit. I must say that the timed full synch requirements were kinda lame. Especially in ACB where it was practically impossible to get all the treasures and flags and complete it in time to get full synch.
Yeah, they basically forced us to rush through these missions, instead of taking our time and exploring.

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 06:01 PM
Well. If said Man U are the most Influential football club anywhere, that opinion would be false, because It's neither backed up by research or proof. Rather It would come down to personal taste, which Is similar to an opinion but not the same, because someones 'taste' In something, cannot be wrong.

thats so contradictory what you jus sed im so confused. but first, influencial to who ? to kids across the world ? if so then it is not wrong... but it's also not right. no-one knows. thats the point of an opinion it is subjective statement that cannot be proven either way, who's to say it's false ? you can't say whether it's true or false because you simply cant speak for others like that. if you mean to you personally, that is your opinion so it can't be wrong. the point is, an opinion cannot be wrong... good debate though lol

naran6142
04-09-2012, 06:05 PM
they can't. give an example of a wrong opinion... please

in my opinion the earth is flat... i think this kind of opinion is what he was getting at

personally i didnt like the apple missions either, but the worst kind of mission for me is the ones where you are dependent on allies, like a mission in Ac2 where you follow a thief on roof top if he falls you ave to start over

D.I.D.
04-09-2012, 06:07 PM
3) missions where you have to follow a set path - eg. in AC2, ACB and ACB where you had to find the keys for armour/library. there was no point in those missions, they may as well have made them cut scenes because there is only one way to go you have no choice but to go that way, to get to the destination, whereas in missions such as, leonardo's war machine, they give you the target, and you have to find your own way there, killing who you want, when you want, if you want, in whatever way you want and ALONE! theyre the best type of missions

I think you'd have to see how different people play those missions. I've done things which seemed obvious to me, which have surprised people watching me play it, and equally I've seen other people do surprising things I hadn't thought of.

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 06:16 PM
1) Then don't call it swearing, it hardly matters. It's still against the rules.

2) It doesn't matter who you respect or not, it matters whether and how you show it. Calling people names is against forum rules, regardless of whether they can or should be considered actual swearwords.

3) I'm not arguing that your opinion is false, I'm arguing that the arguments that you are giving to support your opinion are either flawed or incorrect. There is a significant difference and I'm rather surprised you did not realize that. You are free to have your own opinion, but you are trying to reason it and I see flaws in your reasoning. That is what I'm "attacking", if you will. I don't take issue with what you feel, but with why (you think) you're feeling it.
I gave no explanation why because it wasn't my intention to engage in a detailed discussion about it immediately. This is not my thread. I am in no way, be it socially or otherwise, obligated to go into any detail about my opinion. You, however, posed this as to us and one would expect to see at least some significant detail in the reasoning. Loose references without any clear specifics behind the reasoning can hardly be considered convincing arguments.

4) It was what we were specifically discussing. I simply presumed that with missions that lacked freedom you were still referring to the linear missions. It was an honest mistake. Regardless, you have still refrained from going into any detail on which specific missions lacked freedom except for the 6 mentioned.

Anyways, since you are insisting so much I will be happy to post my reasoning regarding all 4 points:
1. I liked the disguises. They generally (not always) added some realism to the games. Not just because it can be considered somewhat odd that Ezio's basically always wearing the same clothes all the time, which is especially weird since he likes to remain anonymous and therefore not recognizable (duh) (though that would not affect his situation as much as many seem to think), but more so because it is exactly the kind of thing he would be taking advantage of. It's such an obvious thing to do. Besides, it's not like the games were filled with these missions and especially the one where Ezio dressed up as a bard in ACR was very fun to play.

2. I can only think of a few missions in which you're actually forced to call in help from the guilds and in most of those missions you could choose to leave behind the group and just do everything yourself (not that I ever found it so freedom impairing that I ever did so). A good example of this would be the assassination mission of one of The Conspirators in ACII, when you get assistance from some mercenaries, which you can promptly leave behind if you want to.

3. The only missions to which this seems to apply are the Assassin Tomb/Templar Lair/Romulus Lair/Memory Seal missions, which are few in number (~7 for each game, depending on whether you downloaded the DLC) and most of them are entirely optional. Naturally, they're freedom impairing in some ways, as you can't really influence your route much, but they do have many optional detours for treasures and flags or just (slight) shortcuts. However, I've always seen the main point of these missions as solving some freerunning puzzles, which was very fun to do. You had to figure out how to get from point A to point B to point C, etc. I liked that very much.

4. I have little to say about this. They were few in number and I think the main reason they put it in there was because people could actually use the apple as a weapon. I was not at all disappointed in it (though I would have liked a few more attacks :p), but instead I was psyched that I actually got to use the apple as a weapon. I completely did not see that one coming in ACB and it was 10x as badass in ACR.

You see, what i find amazing is that through all of this, you still don't see how you have been disrespectful, the very thing you have been calling me for the last 5 or so comments, but also contradictory.

You contradict saying: respect other people's opinions, and then you say directly (for some reason you're now denying it even though there is pure evidence on this forum) that my opinion is wrong. Disrespectful.

Not only that, but you slate my opinion so bluntly in your first comment, then try to justify it by saying that it's not your forum, and that you're not obligated to give your detailed opinion. But, you see, the second you made a mistake was calling me disrespectful of others opinions, because whether you're obliged to give details or not, the very fact that you so bluntly dismissed my opinion was disrespectful in itself.

These are the exact reasons why i haven't taken your comments so lightly. You don't respect me, i don't respect you. Simple.

And as for your constant pestering about this whole free missions thing. Just to clear things up, the reason i said that it was only 4, was in response to your comment saying that i should be happy with the war machine missions, of which there are only 4 (forgive me i said 3 back then, got it wrong) and i gave an estimate of the amount of missions it was out of, that being 50. So i didn't say there are 50 linear missions at all, no i absolutely didn't. You were just ignorant (hate that word but that's what you were to ignore half of what i was actually saying) and decided that i said that there were only 4 free missions, and there were 50 linear missions.

Look back to that part of the forum if you don't believe me... please

thekarlone
04-09-2012, 06:29 PM
I like the three types of missions. They offer a great variety of gameplay. I don't like a game which allows us to make everything the way we want every moment. There should be some rules in certain points of the game.


Assassin's Creed is not "ok, there is a target, kill him the way you want". AC has a storyline and the story itself marks the the way we assassinate/play every moment.

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 06:34 PM
I think you'd have to see how different people play those missions. I've done things which seemed obvious to me, which have surprised people watching me play it, and equally I've seen other people do surprising things I hadn't thought of.

how do you mean? for like romulus lairs where theres only one way to get to the key, how can people do it different? eg. the first one. just asking

UrDeviant1
04-09-2012, 06:41 PM
Am I wrong In thinking an Opinion can contradict fact, therefore making It Invalid?

Because I always thought that even though an opinion Is true to oneself, If It's contradicting evidence, It's "wrong".

Or does the fact an Opinion's subjective, automatically rule out the possibility of It being "wrong"?

And why do I even care :confused:
I'll put It down to boredom.

LightRey
04-09-2012, 06:49 PM
You see, what i find amazing is that through all of this, you still don't see how you have been disrespectful, the very thing you have been calling me for the last 5 or so comments, but also contradictory.

You contradict saying: respect other people's opinions, and then you say directly (for some reason you're now denying it even though there is pure evidence on this forum) that my opinion is wrong. Disrespectful.

Not only that, but you slate my opinion so bluntly in your first comment, then try to justify it by saying that it's not your forum, and that you're not obligated to give your detailed opinion. But, you see, the second you made a mistake was calling me disrespectful of others opinions, because whether you're obliged to give details or not, the very fact that you so bluntly dismissed my opinion was disrespectful in itself.

These are the exact reasons why i haven't taken your comments so lightly. You don't respect me, i don't respect you. Simple.

And as for your constant pestering about this whole free missions thing. Just to clear things up, the reason i said that it was only 4, was in response to your comment saying that i should be happy with the war machine missions, of which there are only 4 (forgive me i said 3 back then, got it wrong) and i gave an estimate of the amount of missions it was out of, that being 50. So i didn't say there are 50 linear missions at all, no i absolutely didn't. You were just ignorant (hate that word but that's what you were to ignore half of what i was actually saying) and decided that i said that there were only 4 free missions, and there were 50 linear missions.

Look back to that part of the forum if you don't believe me... please
I explained how it was not contradictory. You don't seem to have read what I said carefully enough or you simply do not understand, but I'll say it again regardless. I take issue with your reasoning, not your opinion. The way you feel about something is not something I can (or should try to) change, nor is it something I can really debate. It's how you feel. period. However, you gave reasons for these claims. Reasons I find lacking in both necessary detail and gravity. So again, it is not your opinion I take issue with, it's the reasoning behind it.

I presume you meant to say "not your thread", instead of "not your forum". Again, I did not dismiss your opinion, I dismissed your reasons. To give an example of what I mean: if you say the sky is blue because fairies painted it blue, I would argue that that is wrong, but not because the sky isn't blue (as it obviously is), but because the explanation you give for it being blue is flawed. Likewise I am now arguing that the explanation you give for these missions being bad is weak. Obviously you do feel that way and I respect that, but the reasoning you give does not in the least seem reasonable enough to so strongly dislike these missions, but even if it were, you provide so little detail that it is almost impossible to figure out what exactly you dislike about them. You provided no direct examples, no descriptions of your experience with them, not even a simple list of particular missions you disliked. So far all I know is that you seemed to dislike the Romulus Lairs and the missions with the Apple, but other than you have named none.

Since you seem to put so much emphasis on there being 50 missions, I assume you actually counted them. If so, that would mean that you could relatively easily provide me with a list of examples of these missions you dislike so much. I would really like some examples and preferably some details on which particular parts or elements you disliked so much about these missions, specific to each mission. I'm asking you for this because without that, your arguments are empty words.

Dieinthedark
04-09-2012, 06:56 PM
^OMG LightRey wins already, he's not disrespectful!

Personally, I disliked timed missions but nothing to throw a fit over. The disguise missions I liked simply because they were a good pace breaker. The other 3 the OP mentioned didn't bother me either...

lothario-da-be
04-09-2012, 07:50 PM
i like everything but i think the overal missions in acr were less fun then the ones from 2 and brotherhood

SixKeys
04-09-2012, 08:00 PM
Assassin's Creed is not "ok, there is a target, kill him the way you want". AC has a storyline and the story itself marks the the way we assassinate/play every moment.

Not exactly. The first game was exactly what you just described, you had the freedom to plan your mission stealthily or just rush in and kill everybody. It was made like that for a reason. Beyond AC2 they introduced the full sync system and with it the idea that there's only one right way to do a mission.

Captain Tomatoz
04-09-2012, 08:11 PM
Not exactly. The first game was exactly what you just described, you had the freedom to plan your mission stealthily or just rush in and kill everybody. It was made like that for a reason. Beyond AC2 they introduced the full sync system and with it the idea that there's only one right way to do a mission.

In AC1 you got documents that had maps of the where the guards were and info that could help you in your mission which I thought were really good and helped you plan the way you wanted to kill targets :D

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 08:12 PM
I explained how it was not contradictory. You don't seem to have read what I said carefully enough or you simply do not understand, but I'll say it again regardless. I take issue with your reasoning, not your opinion. The way you feel about something is not something I can (or should try to) change, nor is it something I can really debate. It's how you feel. period. However, you gave reasons for these claims. Reasons I find lacking in both necessary detail and gravity. So again, it is not your opinion I take issue with, it's the reasoning behind it.

I presume you meant to say "not your thread", instead of "not your forum". Again, I did not dismiss your opinion, I dismissed your reasons. To give an example of what I mean: if you say the sky is blue because fairies painted it blue, I would argue that that is wrong, but not because the sky isn't blue (as it obviously is), but because the explanation you give for it being blue is flawed. Likewise I am now arguing that the explanation you give for these missions being bad is weak. Obviously you do feel that way and I respect that, but the reasoning you give does not in the least seem reasonable enough to so strongly dislike these missions, but even if it were, you provide so little detail that it is almost impossible to figure out what exactly you dislike about them. You provided no direct examples, no descriptions of your experience with them, not even a simple list of particular missions you disliked. So far all I know is that you seemed to dislike the Romulus Lairs and the missions with the Apple, but other than you have named none.

Since you seem to put so much emphasis on there being 50 missions, I assume you actually counted them. If so, that would mean that you could relatively easily provide me with a list of examples of these missions you dislike so much. I would really like some examples and preferably some details on which particular parts or elements you disliked so much about these missions, specific to each mission. I'm asking you for this because without that, your arguments are empty words.

OMG, it's just impossible to argue with someone who keeps ignoring what the other says and goes off on their own diverted route to avoid the fact that they've been proven to be inconsistent. Everytime you reply, you mention the same thing that i pulled you up on for being inconsistent. That's exactly what someone does when they know they've messed up

Not only that, but you also misjudge everything i'm saying, and you ignore half of it, and extract only what YOU want to hear for the purpose of proving me wrong

If you look at your response, it is clear you have issues with my reasoning (although earlier you had issues with my opinion and are now denying it but anyway i'll continue) but i have provided significant reasoning in my thread description. Look at the first 3 paragraphs. Unlike your first answer. So i think you'll find that your reasons for having your issues are extremely invalid and are proven wrong in my very first comment

Don't see why there's problem

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 08:15 PM
Read through what i sed again, and return when you have an answer that doesn't take us 5 steps backwards again

Captain Tomatoz
04-09-2012, 08:20 PM
This thread is becoming more and more off topic

SixKeys
04-09-2012, 08:23 PM
In AC1 you got documents that had maps of the where the guards were and info that could help you in your mission which I thought were really good and helped you plan the way you wanted to kill targets :D

True, but you didn't have to use them. The documents also pointed out several different routes and options (one would show you the guards' locations, another would point out a convenient escape route etc.). The later games have gone down an increasingly movie-like route where the creators want to create impressive cinematic moments, trimming down the options the player can do to play the scene the way they want. I actually like that in AC1 you're able to change the camera angles to whatever you want and move the character around. You're creating your own movie in a sense instead of having the devs dictate what you're supposed to be seeing.

BTW, YoooDonny and LightRey, if you insist on continuing to argue about petty details, could you take it to PMs, please?

LightRey
04-09-2012, 08:49 PM
True, but you didn't have to use them. The documents also pointed out several different routes and options (one would show you the guards' locations, another would point out a convenient escape route etc.). The later games have gone down an increasingly movie-like route where the creators want to create impressive cinematic moments, trimming down the options the player can do to play the scene the way they want. I actually like that in AC1 you're able to change the camera angles to whatever you want and move the character around. You're creating your own movie in a sense instead of having the devs dictate what you're supposed to be seeing.

BTW, YoooDonny and LightRey, if you insist on continuing to argue about petty details, could you take it to PMs, please?
Don't worry. I'm not even reading that last one.

Captain Tomatoz
04-09-2012, 08:54 PM
True, but you didn't have to use them. The documents also pointed out several different routes and options (one would show you the guards' locations, another would point out a convenient escape route etc.). The later games have gone down an increasingly movie-like route where the creators want to create impressive cinematic moments, trimming down the options the player can do to play the scene the way they want. I actually like that in AC1 you're able to change the camera angles to whatever you want and move the character around. You're creating your own movie in a sense instead of having the devs dictate what you're supposed to be seeing.


I was agreeing with you before :D. And I also agree with this completely. I do like the cinematic missions, just as long as they aren't in every mission.

rileypoole1234
04-09-2012, 09:01 PM
I agree with number 2 for this game specifically. Connor seems like a lone hunter type assassin. Getting help may seem a little weird.

YoooDonny
04-09-2012, 10:21 PM
Don't worry. I'm not even reading that last one.

great, you've finally accepted defeat. see ya later, that was a good debate

LightRey
04-09-2012, 10:31 PM
I agree with number 2 for this game specifically. Connor seems like a lone hunter type assassin. Getting help may seem a little weird.
I dunno. Wolves hunt in packs.


great, you've finally accepted defeat. see ya later, that was a good debate
sure. Accepted defeat. That's what it is.

Sukramo
04-09-2012, 10:37 PM
Any mission that restrics freedom, (Instant desync if something is done "wrong") is bad in my book. That stuff belongs in the full sync.

JCearlyyears
04-09-2012, 11:09 PM
I understand what you mean when you say that you don't want help, to an extent. I wish they wouldn't have taken all of my kills. I couldn't kill a single person in the part where your assassins automatically kill everyone. I know killing isn't the point of the game entirely, but it can be fun and I wish they didn't kill everyone, just enough for me to notice their presence.

Akaskas
04-09-2012, 11:31 PM
Personally I liked the missions you described. And also, arguing over minute details is petty, and although I think LightRey provided the better argument, it was immature of both him and the thread starter to argue publicly.

BBALive
04-09-2012, 11:50 PM
The missions where you have to follow somebody without being spotted. They're so tedious.

FilipinoNinja67
04-10-2012, 04:01 AM
Yes! I hate being stealthy in this game too BBA! I think we should just get an AR-15 and just shoot everyone!

I hate those missions where you just carry a box... I don't mind some of them but they are pretty boring to start out the game with. :/

pirate1802
04-10-2012, 05:45 AM
I think people are mixing "worst kind of missions" with just "missions they don't like". The two are different. Not to be too specific but some people said they don't like missions that ask you to follow someone without being detected, or the ones which instant desync's you on being detected. I mean AC is a stealth-based game, you expect these kinds of missions in an AC game. personally I LOVE these types of missions, it ups the stakes in an otherwise too easy game, and really gives me the "assassino" feel, to be following someone without getting caught. that is why I also loved those missions which required you to complete them without killing anyone (full sync option) like the Topkapi Palace mission in ACR.

ZombieAttkPlan
04-10-2012, 06:31 AM
Tbh, it just sounds ridiculous. No kills = no fun? ssly? AC isn't all about killing y'know.

It may to him.

LightRey
04-10-2012, 10:15 AM
It may to him.
Naturally, but if that is the case he shouldn't be expecting every mission to be fun, because it clearly isn't the sole focus of the games.

BBALive
04-10-2012, 12:49 PM
Yes! I hate being stealthy in this game too BBA! I think we should just get an AR-15 and just shoot everyone!

I hate those missions where you just carry a box... I don't mind some of them but they are pretty boring to start out the game with. :/

It isn't about the fact that it is a stealth-based mission. I love stealth. Metal Gear Solid is my favourite video game franchise of all time. However, following somebody for 15 minutes is rather boring.

Besides, Assassin's Creed is hardly a stealth game. Compared to Splinter Cell, Thief, Hitman and Metal Gear, Assassin's Creed is little more than a 3rd person action game with minor social stealth elements. This is fact.

frogger504
04-10-2012, 01:57 PM
I agree with 3.
But nothing wrong with 1 and 2.
The whole point of being a 'Mentor' was having disciples.

Same, 3, yeah.

1 and 2, nah.

SixKeys
04-10-2012, 03:02 PM
I like the missions where you have to follow someone but there were maybe too many of them in some games. It's a fun challenge if there's maybe two such missions in a game (as part of the main plot like in AC2) but it can get tedious if too many missions share the same formula, "follow X to a checkpoint, then kill him with your hidden blade. Instant desynch if you're detected".

It would be interesting if some tailing missions allowed you to be detected by the person's bodyguards. If you were caught snooping around, the guards would give chase and you'd have to hide. Once you'd lost them, you would have to use Eagle Sense or other clues to find your target's tracks again.

BBALive
04-10-2012, 04:24 PM
I like the missions where you have to follow someone but there were maybe too many of them in some games. It's a fun challenge if there's maybe two such missions in a game (as part of the main plot like in AC2) but it can get tedious if too many missions share the same formula, "follow X to a checkpoint, then kill him with your hidden blade. Instant desynch if you're detected".

It would be interesting if some tailing missions allowed you to be detected by the person's bodyguards. If you were caught snooping around, the guards would give chase and you'd have to hide. Once you'd lost them, you would have to use Eagle Sense or other clues to find your target's tracks again.

Despite the fact that I disliked those types of missions, I would happily play them without complaint if instead of following a target, you had to 'track' them. For example, they leave clues (footprints, blood trail) and you have to track them to a certain location. I think that would be a lot more fun than follow target, wait and blend or hide while he turns around, follow target, rinse and repeat.

You could even use animals to help you track them.

LightRey
04-10-2012, 04:26 PM
Despite the fact that I disliked those types of missions, I would happily play them without complaint if instead of following a target, you had to 'track' them. For example, they leave clues (footprints, blood trail) and you have to track them to a certain location. I think that would be a lot more fun than follow target, wait and blend or hide while he turns around, follow target, rinse and repeat.

You could even use animals to help you track them.
Well it sounds very much like that is exactly the kind of thin you'll be doing in ACIII.

BBALive
04-10-2012, 08:03 PM
Well it sounds very much like that is exactly the kind of thin you'll be doing in ACIII.

Indeed.

pirate1802
04-11-2012, 05:11 AM
Despite the fact that I disliked those types of missions, I would happily play them without complaint if instead of following a target, you had to 'track' them. For example, they leave clues (footprints, blood trail) and you have to track them to a certain location. I think that would be a lot more fun than follow target, wait and blend or hide while he turns around, follow target, rinse and repeat.

You could even use animals to help you track them.

That sounds great!

InfectedNation
04-11-2012, 09:42 PM
Sequence 7 in Brotherhood (Thieves sequence with Michletto and Pietro) was beyond awful... except the ending with the traitor and Machiavelli.
Literally the most unenjoyable part of a video game ever.