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rafiqul84
04-01-2012, 05:59 PM
What improvements to the multiplayer would you like to see in the next game? Wonder how the new characters and game modes would shape up to be cos personally im gettin a bit bored of how the current ones dont really encourage alot of stealth.
Personally i would love it if they removed Mute from multiplayer altogether, It would stop idiots running up to your face and encourage people to hide in crowds more often.
Not sure as to how Ubi would go about handling smoke bomb.

n00bfi_97
04-01-2012, 07:48 PM
Ei "improvement" aktao hobe na. Emni emni jibon noshto na kore, ektu baire jao. Ekta job khojo, society ke shahajjo kore. Bata beshi bujhe.

Strigidae Moth
04-01-2012, 08:54 PM
Not sure how getting rid of Mute would help, I'd rather they got rid of smoke bomb. (doesn't seem like 17-18 century weapons anyway...don't quote me on that though)

jmk1999
04-01-2012, 10:55 PM
Just a warning:

Keep it constructive. Trolling will not be tolerated.

obliviondoll
04-02-2012, 08:51 AM
DISCLAIMER: this post will contain criticisms of Ubisoft. In context, this is unavoidable. I'll make sure it stays constructive, providing suggestions for how to improve instead of being negative about the criticism.

1. Lag needs to be addressed, not ignored. Restore AT LEAST the level of stability we had in pre-3.0 ACB. The point where there are still occasional problems, but the game is playable more often than not. Ace Combat: Assault Horizon does only slightly worse than pre-3.0 ACB, and it's netcode gets THRASHED by the fans. And it's STILL in MUCH better shape than ACB is now, and than ACR has EVER been. If you have to choose between having 5 - 10 minute wait times instead of nice, happy 3 - 5 minute wait times, or having a game that's ACTUALLY PLAYABLE, I'm sorry, but playability wins, and you've been choosing wrong so far.

2. ACTUALLY keep us up-to-date on things. The weekly updates that got abandoned WERE a great idea. Next time, KEEP THEM COMING. Don't just let us know what's happening for 2 months at a time, give us CONSTANT feedback, and PROVIDE A CONSISTENT METHOD TO REACH THE DEVS.

Having a specific designated community liaison (you know, like Gabe the "Community Developer" was meant to be) would help in this. NOT another "community developer" though, and not the same one thrown in with too many jobs at once. Pick someone up who has a reasonable amount of knowledge and understanding about both the community AND game design. Get a person who can have a direct line of communication with the devs, on some sort of regular (or even semi-regular) basis, and ALSO keeps in touch with the fans.

Make sure that person is not only providing feedback to the devs, but ALSO helping the fans to CONSOLIDATE our suggestions and CLARIFY things BEFORE putting them to the devs. Have regular (or, again, semi-regular) polls about potential fixes.

If you want an example with ACB, there was a lot of feedback saying that matchmaking was too slow - but NOBODY WAS QUITTING BECAUSE OF IT. When it got "fixed" the GAME-BREAKING LAG was introduced - and that MADE PEOPLE QUIT THE GAME. If there had been PROPER communication and a PROPER designated "liasion" (NOT a Community Developer who's too busy with other work to actually show up on the forums regularly and read everything), that person could create a POLL on the topic.

-Fix matchmaking no matter the cost
-Fix matchmaking, but not if lag will become any worse
-Fix the lag

See which one gets more support from people, THEN pass on the feedback ONCE IT'S CLEAR WHAT WE ACTUALLY WANT.

3. If there are Smoke Bombs again (they used smokescreens in that era, having an equivalent would be good), it needs to be toned down OR it needs a MUCH longer cooldown.

4. Relating to point 3, while Ubisoft released stats which prove they know how often players are using each ability, they should USE THAT INFORMATION TO BALANCE THINGS. If an ability is being abused, and one you think is better isn't, then YOU ARE WRONG. Players will ALWAYS gravitate towards THE MOST POWERFUL ABILITIES. If you think they're wrong, YOU'RE MISSING SOMETHING, NOT THEM.

An example of how to do this is provided by the last 3 Armored Core games, one of which was actually published by Ubisoft (For Answer). From Software, the developers, have kept a constant eye on which weapons and parts are the most actively-used, and ACTUALLY USED THAT INFORMATION TO BALANCE THE GAME. If a particular weapon is being abused, and particularly if it's being abused heavily by top-tier players, then they TAKE A CLOSER LOOK AT IT TO FIND OUT WHY.

Seeing that players are over-using Smoke Bomb, then REDUCING THE COOLDOWN AND BUFFING THE ABILITY WHILE NERFING SEVERAL OTHERS doesn't really make sense. And FURTHER BUFFING THE ABILITY in a patch isn't really a good way to encourage diversity.

5. This is really important... Let us play WITH our friends when we want to, and not AGAINST them. When we put together a team of 4 players, MAKE US WAIT FOR AT LEAST 3 ENEMIES instead of splitting us up. Having ACB's 6-player minimum to start a team game would be good, but like in both games, keep the game running until you drop below 4. Starting a game then IMMEDIATELY ending it because ONE player dropped isn't helpful when the game is unstable and occasionally boots people on startup. Bring back Alliance, or an equivalent 3-team mode, and if it's 2 vs. 2 vs. 2, let the game stay active with only 3 players (but require 6). Some FFA modes should be able to start with only 4 players, and should run as long as there are at least 2 (Assassinate, assuming lag is addressed well enough for it to be worth actually keeping, would be a decent 1 vs. 1 mode), others need at least 4 players (Wanted can't work with less than 4 people. It just can't).

PANiC_ATTACKER
04-02-2012, 03:09 PM
DISCLAIMER: this post will contain criticisms of Ubisoft. In context, this is unavoidable. I'll make sure it stays constructive, providing suggestions for how to improve instead of being negative about the criticism.

1. Lag needs to be addressed, not ignored. Restore AT LEAST the level of stability we had in pre-3.0 ACB. The point where there are still occasional problems, but the game is playable more often than not. Ace Combat: Assault Horizon does only slightly worse than pre-3.0 ACB, and it's netcode gets THRASHED by the fans. And it's STILL in MUCH better shape than ACB is now, and than ACR has EVER been. If you have to choose between having 5 - 10 minute wait times instead of nice, happy 3 - 5 minute wait times, or having a game that's ACTUALLY PLAYABLE, I'm sorry, but playability wins, and you've been choosing wrong so far.

2. ACTUALLY keep us up-to-date on things. The weekly updates that got abandoned WERE a great idea. Next time, KEEP THEM COMING. Don't just let us know what's happening for 2 months at a time, give us CONSTANT feedback, and PROVIDE A CONSISTENT METHOD TO REACH THE DEVS.

Having a specific designated community liaison (you know, like Gabe the "Community Developer" was meant to be) would help in this. NOT another "community developer" though, and not the same one thrown in with too many jobs at once. Pick someone up who has a reasonable amount of knowledge and understanding about both the community AND game design. Get a person who can have a direct line of communication with the devs, on some sort of regular (or even semi-regular) basis, and ALSO keeps in touch with the fans.

Make sure that person is not only providing feedback to the devs, but ALSO helping the fans to CONSOLIDATE our suggestions and CLARIFY things BEFORE putting them to the devs. Have regular (or, again, semi-regular) polls about potential fixes.

If you want an example with ACB, there was a lot of feedback saying that matchmaking was too slow - but NOBODY WAS QUITTING BECAUSE OF IT. When it got "fixed" the GAME-BREAKING LAG was introduced - and that MADE PEOPLE QUIT THE GAME. If there had been PROPER communication and a PROPER designated "liasion" (NOT a Community Developer who's too busy with other work to actually show up on the forums regularly and read everything), that person could create a POLL on the topic.

-Fix matchmaking no matter the cost
-Fix matchmaking, but not if lag will become any worse
-Fix the lag

See which one gets more support from people, THEN pass on the feedback ONCE IT'S CLEAR WHAT WE ACTUALLY WANT.

3. If there are Smoke Bombs again (they used smokescreens in that era, having an equivalent would be good), it needs to be toned down OR it needs a MUCH longer cooldown.

4. Relating to point 3, while Ubisoft released stats which prove they know how often players are using each ability, they should USE THAT INFORMATION TO BALANCE THINGS. If an ability is being abused, and one you think is better isn't, then YOU ARE WRONG. Players will ALWAYS gravitate towards THE MOST POWERFUL ABILITIES. If you think they're wrong, YOU'RE MISSING SOMETHING, NOT THEM.

An example of how to do this is provided by the last 3 Armored Core games, one of which was actually published by Ubisoft (For Answer). From Software, the developers, have kept a constant eye on which weapons and parts are the most actively-used, and ACTUALLY USED THAT INFORMATION TO BALANCE THE GAME. If a particular weapon is being abused, and particularly if it's being abused heavily by top-tier players, then they TAKE A CLOSER LOOK AT IT TO FIND OUT WHY.

Seeing that players are over-using Smoke Bomb, then REDUCING THE COOLDOWN AND BUFFING THE ABILITY WHILE NERFING SEVERAL OTHERS doesn't really make sense. And FURTHER BUFFING THE ABILITY in a patch isn't really a good way to encourage diversity.

5. This is really important... Let us play WITH our friends when we want to, and not AGAINST them. When we put together a team of 4 players, MAKE US WAIT FOR AT LEAST 3 ENEMIES instead of splitting us up. Having ACB's 6-player minimum to start a team game would be good, but like in both games, keep the game running until you drop below 4. Starting a game then IMMEDIATELY ending it because ONE player dropped isn't helpful when the game is unstable and occasionally boots people on startup. Bring back Alliance, or an equivalent 3-team mode, and if it's 2 vs. 2 vs. 2, let the game stay active with only 3 players (but require 6). Some FFA modes should be able to start with only 4 players, and should run as long as there are at least 2 (Assassinate, assuming lag is addressed well enough for it to be worth actually keeping, would be a decent 1 vs. 1 mode), others need at least 4 players (Wanted can't work with less than 4 people. It just can't).

nice post, pity its spoilt by the traditional OSB moan and groan in the middle! this complaint is really boring and ranks up there with moans about roofing and freerunning in the unofficial top 5 of pointless complaints about a game built on rooftop free running and distraction techniques! (smoke) . What next! no backstabbing?

1. Fix matchmaking
2. Get rid of gametype voting and kicking player into gametypes automatically!. replace with Maps if you must
3. Reduce gametypes, there are too many and spreads the player base.(which isnt help by you releasing mappack DLC and bad matchmaking) You know which ones arent being played so just drop them.

A nice to have would be more customisation of personas, and more custom items as you progress thru prestiges so you get items to wear or weapons that lower prestiges have not got, make prestige ranking worth something other than an indication of freetime and loneliness! ;)

abilities are just fine and any additions or removals are just part of the game and people should adapt and counter, Ubi have done fine with these so far!

PlasticAssasin8
04-02-2012, 10:27 PM
1. Fix matchmaking
2. Get rid of gametype voting and kicking player into gametypes automatically!. replace with Maps if you must
3. Reduce gametypes, there are too many and spreads the player base.(which isnt help by you releasing mappack DLC and bad matchmaking) You know which ones arent being played so just drop them.

^^^^^ this what he said.

Don't think they can ever get rid of lag, different connections , speeds etc from all over the world. The Ubi servers are more than likely right on the money.

But fix the little problems like said above and all is good as far as im concerned.

Ubi most like playing with friends, not to boost but to play and have fun.

CerealAssassin
04-02-2012, 10:42 PM
What improvements to the multiplayer would you like to see in the next game? Wonder how the new characters and game modes would shape up to be cos personally im gettin a bit bored of how the current ones dont really encourage alot of stealth.
Personally i would love it if they removed Mute from multiplayer altogether, It would stop idiots running up to your face and encourage people to hide in crowds more often.
Not sure as to how Ubi would go about handling smoke bomb.

remove mute? seriously lol

They need to address this:
Matchmaking/Playing with friends
Too many modes
Dont split the playerbase
ACB style detection meter

Sorted.

xCr0wnedNorris
04-03-2012, 01:48 AM
nice post, pity its spoilt by the traditional OSB moan and groan in the middle! this complaint is really boring and ranks up there with moans about roofing and freerunning in the unofficial top 5 of pointless complaints about a game built on rooftop free running and distraction techniques! (smoke) . What next! no backstabbing?
See, the interesting thing about that post is that it never mentions OSB specifically, but rather refers to smokebombs as a whole. Not every post saying Smoke is a bit too powerful is a rant about how terrible OSB is and how terrible OSBers should feel for doing it. Just so you know. :|

Collinwood01
04-03-2012, 04:37 AM
Hey everyone. Not to rain on this parade but no matter what you and I suggest, this will be just another complaint/ criticism thread. I think that in order for our ideas to be heard and taken seriously we NEED to work together to gather our ideas in a different forum, pick out the ideas that work for the most players possible, sign off on the ideas together as a group(such as: clan leader 1 advocates the ideas and represents "X" amount of players. clan leader 2 etc., etc.) The reason why I think another forum would be best for expressing ideas is because there are so many complaint/criticism threads here on this forum that all will be lost in a matter of a couple of days. Buried beneath another thread. If we set up a place where we would go SPECIFICALLY for AC MP discussions, then everyone would know what they are there for and the ideas conveyed so far. You could then setup a deadline for responses that represent more people and will be presented by such and such a date to UBISOFT. I think it should almost be petition like. The ideas conveyed should be presented as organized and constructive as possible and should be sent to someone who has a connection to the developers. Whether or not such a thing should be presented on these forums is debatable. A liason would be great. Someone who not only works for UBISOFT but plays the game as well and has just as much interest as we do. Its just an opinion and an idea but I think this would be a better way of getting through to the powers that be.

PANiC_ATTACKER
04-03-2012, 10:19 AM
1. Fix matchmaking
2. Get rid of gametype voting and kicking player into gametypes automatically!. replace with Maps if you must
3. Reduce gametypes, there are too many and spreads the player base.(which isnt help by you releasing mappack DLC and bad matchmaking) You know which ones arent being played so just drop them.

^^^^^ this what he said.

Don't think they can ever get rid of lag, different connections , speeds etc from all over the world. The Ubi servers are more than likely right on the money.

But fix the little problems like said above and all is good as far as im concerned.

Ubi most like playing with friends, not to boost but to play and have fun.

cheers, nice to see some people agree on somethings.

obliviondoll
04-03-2012, 11:17 AM
Hey everyone. Not to rain on this parade but no matter what you and I suggest, this will be just another complaint/ criticism thread. I think that in order for our ideas to be heard and taken seriously we NEED to work together to gather our ideas in a different forum, pick out the ideas that work for the most players possible, sign off on the ideas together as a group(such as: clan leader 1 advocates the ideas and represents "X" amount of players. clan leader 2 etc., etc.) The reason why I think another forum would be best for expressing ideas is because there are so many complaint/criticism threads here on this forum that all will be lost in a matter of a couple of days. Buried beneath another thread. If we set up a place where we would go SPECIFICALLY for AC MP discussions, then everyone would know what they are there for and the ideas conveyed so far. You could then setup a deadline for responses that represent more people and will be presented by such and such a date to UBISOFT. I think it should almost be petition like. The ideas conveyed should be presented as organized and constructive as possible and should be sent to someone who has a connection to the developers. Whether or not such a thing should be presented on these forums is debatable. A liason would be great. Someone who not only works for UBISOFT but plays the game as well and has just as much interest as we do. Its just an opinion and an idea but I think this would be a better way of getting through to the powers that be.

This is a good point, but if we stop supporting the negative and rage-filled threads, and keep constructive and sensible threads like this alive, we'll be seeing the good threads survive and the stupid ones fading into obscurity instead.

It's how WE act that controls the tone of the forums.

If they keep locking down the rage threads, it's not going to help much if we just post a new one when each disappears. If we stop posting them, or stop posting IN them, that will kill them off more effectively than ANY moderator action.

EDIT: In relation to the comments about Smoke Bomb, I know it's a tired complaint, but that's because it's still not being addressed in anything like a sensible manner. Old but legitimate complaints shouldn't happen - NOT because we should stop talking about them, but because THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN FIXED ALREADY. It's still a legitimate complaint, so it's still worth keeping on the list, imo.

Other than that, I agree with the comments about my post (but then, that was the only point being disagreed with). Also, the smoke problem is a lesser complaint compared with the others, so focusing on them is probably a good idea.

jmk1999
04-03-2012, 11:21 AM
This is a good point, but if we stop supporting the negative and rage-filled threads, and keep constructive and sensible threads like this alive, we'll be seeing the good threads survive and the stupid ones fading into obscurity instead.

It's how WE act that controls the tone of the forums.

If they keep locking down the rage threads, it's not going to help much if we just post a new one when each disappears. If we stop posting them, or stop posting IN them, that will kill them off more effectively than ANY moderator action.
well said... glad to see some sensibility among the chaos. :)

Archybad
04-03-2012, 01:50 PM
1. Smoke bombs should either be removed entirely, or have their muting effect removed.

Currently, they are overpowered. They can be used as a slightly weaker, or sometimes even stronger, version of nearly every ability. I have no problem with them as an ability to stop people in their tracks, however if they were going to be used like this, I'd suggest a shorter cooldown and an increased range. Players caught in smoke can still attack, stun, and use abilities.

2. Bring back Sprint boost.

Sprint was almost never used in Brotherhood because there was no real use for it. Now that people are starting to use knives however, sprint would be a useful ability.

3. Make the stun range shorter.

And preferably remove contested kills. Congratulations, you knew who your pursuer was and failed to avoid him. Srs? I'll admit, it seemed like a good idea at the start, but it's just silly. Stop holding people's hands because they can't avoid their pursuers.

4. Remove the circle/b prompt.

Have a generic action prompt that appears over targets within kill range.

5. Remove all priorities from precision locking.

Priorities are okay for the tap locking, but when I go into precision lock, I want full control. I don't want to be stood trying to lock an upright target for 10 seconds just because there's someone nearby who's grounded.

6. L1 prompts on decoy.

Put them on. I'd like to see decoys taking priority on your tap lock, just so it's a little more useful.

7. Leaderboards should be based on average score.

However the option to quit should be disabled after you've spent 2 minutes in the match.

8. You should be able to stun until you die whilst poisoned.

I know it was changed back because people complained, but I see no problem with it. It's something I really liked about poison at the start of AC:R.

9. Firecrackers should be more blinding.

I like that they actually fade away in Revelations, but I also admit it fades far too fast. Imo, it should last about half the firecracker duration before it starts fading.

10. There should be a bonus for killing a VIP with pursuers nearby.

Say, +50 per pursuer. at most that's a +200 bonus, and it would help make the VIP kill round a bit more rewarding. It's not really needed, but it'd give people a tiny bit of incentive to not use the gun solely to get kills, and rather keep it a strategic weapon for use when you really can't get the VIPs another way.

Sukramo
04-03-2012, 04:37 PM
Make it so you can always see your steak progress.

Change contested kill to just give the target 100 kill, no more loosing silent, hidden and acrobatic.

Longer smoke cooldown.

Change reset cooldown streak somehow, currently its quite insane.

Active season changing of maps. Starcraft 2 changes maps over seasons due to how balanced they are and new ones are added.

More guides for new players. Its better than Brotherhood right now, but still a long way to go.

Remove the god**** animus loss streak.

Change gun so you cant improve it so you can lock onto your taget and kill him in 0.005 seconds.

Give us acces to basic abilites at level 1. Being forced to play with the 2 Ubisoft sets was stupid.

More control over your camera in loading screans. In ACB I could move it all round. In ACR its too fixed.

obliviondoll
04-03-2012, 06:51 PM
1. Smoke bombs should either be removed entirely, or have their muting effect removed.

Currently, they are overpowered. They can be used as a slightly weaker, or sometimes even stronger, version of nearly every ability. I have no problem with them as an ability to stop people in their tracks, however if they were going to be used like this, I'd suggest a shorter cooldown and an increased range. Players caught in smoke can still attack, stun, and use abilities.

2. Bring back Sprint boost.

Sprint was almost never used in Brotherhood because there was no real use for it. Now that people are starting to use knives however, sprint would be a useful ability.

3. Make the stun range shorter.

And preferably remove contested kills. Congratulations, you knew who your pursuer was and failed to avoid him. Srs? I'll admit, it seemed like a good idea at the start, but it's just silly. Stop holding people's hands because they can't avoid their pursuers.

4. Remove the circle/b prompt.

Have a generic action prompt that appears over targets within kill range.

5. Remove all priorities from precision locking.

Priorities are okay for the tap locking, but when I go into precision lock, I want full control. I don't want to be stood trying to lock an upright target for 10 seconds just because there's someone nearby who's grounded.

6. L1 prompts on decoy.

Put them on. I'd like to see decoys taking priority on your tap lock, just so it's a little more useful.

7. Leaderboards should be based on average score.

However the option to quit should be disabled after you've spent 2 minutes in the match.

8. You should be able to stun until you die whilst poisoned.

I know it was changed back because people complained, but I see no problem with it. It's something I really liked about poison at the start of AC:R.

9. Firecrackers should be more blinding.

I like that they actually fade away in Revelations, but I also admit it fades far too fast. Imo, it should last about half the firecracker duration before it starts fading.

10. There should be a bonus for killing a VIP with pursuers nearby.

Say, +50 per pursuer. at most that's a +200 bonus, and it would help make the VIP kill round a bit more rewarding. It's not really needed, but it'd give people a tiny bit of incentive to not use the gun solely to get kills, and rather keep it a strategic weapon for use when you really can't get the VIPs another way.

1. I think limiting kill range is fair, but not removing the ability to kill altogether. Shouldn't affect stun at all though (unless they're idiots and ignore the "shorten stun range" idea) DEFINITELY allow ability use in Smoke though.
2. Oh yes. So much yes.
3. Shorten stun range? Definitely. Remove Contested Kills? Not so much. I keep saying that stun and Contested Kill should NEVER have had the same range. Stun needs to be MUCH shorter. I've said that since the beta. The core problem with contested kills is that circle prompt. Remove that (as you suggested) and they're nowhere near as much of a problem anyway.
4. Again, I agree.
5. Remove priorities from precision locks. And an established lock should ALWAYS override ALL other priorities. ALWAYS. If you're locked onto someone, you should be LOCKED onto them. Not "well, I might be aiming for him, but I'm not sure" - that defeats the whole purpose of it being a LOCK. The priority of who you're GOING to lock when you tap-lock is free to be messed with, but THAT'S ALL.
6. If your target goes high profile, you get the L1 prompt. That's fine. If they send a decoy running in high profile, it doesn't. Needed to be fixed in ACB. And OF COURSE the L1 prompt should actually work as a tap-lock priority.
7. Bring back Templar Score. And this, as you described it, should be the "main" leaderboard outside of that system.
8. You should be able to stun your poisoner any time until you die. BUT you should be restricted from stunning any of their TEAMMATES (not FFA opponents with the same target). Obviously, because you don't HAVE teammates in FFA modes, this won't apply. Alternatively, full freedom to stun whoever you want, BUT implement some kind of disincentive for Poison stealing in Team modes. Like the one I used to keep suggesting, where a stolen poison gives the "intercept" bonus AND the "kill" bonus to the Poisoner, which Acrobatic/Hidden if such extras were earned, and the killer only gets their Approach bonuses (meaning they get literally NOTHING for a chase kill).
9. I quite liked them in ACB, but I think with a longer blind duration, ACR firecrackers would have been better instead of useless.
10. Wow that's an awesome I idea. Probably difficult to implement it though. Call it "infiltrate" maybe? Most sensible way I can see is to make ability kills not count, so you only get it if you pressed square/X to kill, not with Poison/Gun. Problem being that getting in that close and landing a Poison is kind of not very easy.

FilipinoNinja67
04-03-2012, 07:01 PM
Stun range should not be shorter, i would understand if the pursuers had long weapons but there is no reason why i should be out of stun range when you are able to kill me if you have a knife.

I would like to see high profile increasing your kill range but having low profile kills being faster (im talking holding the R asston). Same thing with stuns.

I love contested kills

I love sprint boost

I love your VIP idea

I love Alliance

I don't like the removal of a stun prompt unless you mean removing it whenever a pursuer is in low profile.

I think they should work harder on rewarding stealth more, or rewarding non stealthy a little less.

They should definitly keep gun, even though i hate it i know it has its purpose and is pretty awesome in Escort.

obliviondoll
04-03-2012, 07:14 PM
I don't like the removal of a stun prompt unless you mean removing it whenever a pursuer is in low profile.
They already give you a SEPARATE notification for this.

When your pursuer is in high profile, they get marked as a pursuer. The stun prompt that normally shows up above the heads of pursuers instead of a kill prompt should be removed. Leaving it blank would be an improvement, because you don't know if that person coming up is another player who happens to be going your way or if they're trying to kill you. If they're high profile, then you get a prompt informing you that they're your pursuer, but otherwise, no real clues. A better option would be to replace the kill prompt with a generic action prompt and apply it to EVERYONE you can interact with - target, pursuer, NPC, regardless of whether you can stun, kill or both.

And the reason stun range should be shortened isn't for "realism" - it's for game balance. Just like a spear doesn't increase your kill range. Your range for contesting someone's kill should match kill range, but your range to stun them should be shorter. Anything else removes (or at least reduces) the cat-and-mouse feel that made ACB so great and failed to show up in ACR.

EDIT: Also, I'd like to see Contested Kill moved to the kill ****on instead of stun - you can EITHER go for the high-point, but more risky, stun, OR you can get the easier, but less valuable Contested Kill.

Archybad
04-03-2012, 07:30 PM
1. I think limiting kill range is fair...
Only as long as it's still greater than stun range.

5. Remove priorities from precision locks. And an established lock should ALWAYS override ALL other priorities. ALWAYS. If you're locked onto someone, you should be LOCKED onto them. Not "well, I might be aiming for him, but I'm not sure" - that defeats the whole purpose of it being a LOCK. The priority of who you're GOING to lock when you tap-lock is free to be messed with, but THAT'S ALL.

8. You should be able to stun your poisoner any time until you die. BUT you should be restricted from stunning any of their TEAMMATES (not FFA opponents with the same target). Obviously, because you don't HAVE teammates in FFA modes, this won't apply. Alternatively, full freedom to stun whoever you want, BUT implement some kind of disincentive for Poison stealing in Team modes. Like the one I used to keep suggesting, where a stolen poison gives the "intercept" bonus AND the "kill" bonus to the Poisoner, which Acrobatic/Hidden if such extras were earned, and the killer only gets their Approach bonuses (meaning they get literally NOTHING for a chase kill).
I'll concede the no stunning their teammates, but I think the intercepted is fine as it is.


Stun range should not be shorter, i would understand if the pursuers had long weapons but there is no reason why i should be out of stun range when you are able to kill me if you have a knife.
I'd be fine with equal ranges if the game wasn't so drastically affected by lag.

They should definitly keep gun, even though i hate it i know it has its purpose and is pretty awesome in Escort.
I didn't say get rid of it, I said increased incentive to not use it. I know it has it's uses, and I do use it when it's needed.

FilipinoNinja67
04-03-2012, 08:13 PM
They already give you a SEPARATE notification for this.

When your pursuer is in high profile, they get marked as a pursuer. The stun prompt that normally shows up above the heads of pursuers instead of a kill prompt should be removed. Leaving it blank would be an improvement, because you don't know if that person coming up is another player who happens to be going your way or if they're trying to kill you. If they're high profile, then you get a prompt informing you that they're your pursuer, but otherwise, no real clues. A better option would be to replace the kill prompt with a generic action prompt and apply it to EVERYONE you can interact with - target, pursuer, NPC, regardless of whether you can stun, kill or both.

And the reason stun range should be shortened isn't for "realism" - it's for game balance. Just like a spear doesn't increase your kill range. Your range for contesting someone's kill should match kill range, but your range to stun them should be shorter. Anything else removes (or at least reduces) the cat-and-mouse feel that made ACB so great and failed to show up in ACR.

EDIT: Also, I'd like to see Contested Kill moved to the kill ****on instead of stun - you can EITHER go for the high-point, but more risky, stun, OR you can get the easier, but less valuable Contested Kill.

"Cat and mous feel in brohood", i hope you are talking about wanted because that is the only mode that had this feel, the rest of the modes were "chase down your pursuers with smoke and mute". How would making the stun/kill range equal not be fair?

I have no idea what you're talking about at all in the "Edit" part, it makes no sense (to me at least) at all.

PANiC_ATTACKER
04-03-2012, 08:22 PM
1. Smoke bombs should either be removed entirely, or have their muting effect removed.

Currently, they are overpowered. They can be used as a slightly weaker, or sometimes even stronger, version of nearly every ability. I have no problem with them as an ability to stop people in their tracks, however if they were going to be used like this, I'd suggest a shorter cooldown and an increased range. Players caught in smoke can still attack, stun, and use abilities.

2. Bring back Sprint boost.

Sprint was almost never used in Brotherhood because there was no real use for it. Now that people are starting to use knives however, sprint would be a useful ability.

3. Make the stun range shorter.

And preferably remove contested kills. Congratulations, you knew who your pursuer was and failed to avoid him. Srs? I'll admit, it seemed like a good idea at the start, but it's just silly. Stop holding people's hands because they can't avoid their pursuers.

4. Remove the circle/b prompt.

Have a generic action prompt that appears over targets within kill range.

5. Remove all priorities from precision locking.

Priorities are okay for the tap locking, but when I go into precision lock, I want full control. I don't want to be stood trying to lock an upright target for 10 seconds just because there's someone nearby who's grounded.

6. L1 prompts on decoy.

Put them on. I'd like to see decoys taking priority on your tap lock, just so it's a little more useful.

7. Leaderboards should be based on average score.

However the option to quit should be disabled after you've spent 2 minutes in the match.

8. You should be able to stun until you die whilst poisoned.

I know it was changed back because people complained, but I see no problem with it. It's something I really liked about poison at the start of AC:R.

9. Firecrackers should be more blinding.

I like that they actually fade away in Revelations, but I also admit it fades far too fast. Imo, it should last about half the firecracker duration before it starts fading.

10. There should be a bonus for killing a VIP with pursuers nearby.

Say, +50 per pursuer. at most that's a +200 bonus, and it would help make the VIP kill round a bit more rewarding. It's not really needed, but it'd give people a tiny bit of incentive to not use the gun solely to get kills, and rather keep it a strategic weapon for use when you really can't get the VIPs another way.

oh man! it was all going so well , then a fool posts!

n00bfi_97
04-03-2012, 08:50 PM
oh man! it was all going so well , then a fool posts!

Yeah, you. GTFO, OSB addict. You're perfect example of a n00b glorified by ACR.

Most of these suggestions are great, and I thought of some myself whilst playing today.

Something I noticed while playing DM is that I contested my pursuer from his blend group, but only because of the prompt. As already mentioned, reducing the stun prompt range when at Silent or above is a great idea, but another thing I'd like to add: You can Contest your pursuer only if you're locked onto him. What I mean to say is, he can only be Contested if locked onto by his target. If not, then nothing will happen. However, if you surprise your pursuer and he doesn't press the kill asston, then whether you locked onto him or not won't matter, you'll stun him.

obliviondoll
04-03-2012, 09:12 PM
"Cat and mous feel in brohood", i hope you are talking about wanted because that is the only mode that had this feel, the rest of the modes were "chase down your pursuers with smoke and mute". How would making the stun/kill range equal not be fair?

I have no idea what you're talking about at all in the "Edit" part, it makes no sense (to me at least) at all.
Of course in Wanted. Also in Alliance, for the most part. But also with a GOOD team in Manhunt. With high-level play, the dynamic in ACB team games was still pursuer-first. It's only noobs and PUGs where the targets actually had control of the match.

And I'm not saying it's unfair. I'm saying it's not MEANT to be fair. Pursuer is MEANT to have the advantage. That's why he's called "pursuer" and not "stun target" (paraphrasing Squiiddish... but not a direct quote)

NO mode in ACR did the same on ANY level. Pursuers are consistently seen as a source of points there.

As for the edit, I was saying that they should make it so when you mash stun and your pursuer kills you, you just die. When you press KILL you can contest them.

Serrachio
04-03-2012, 09:14 PM
Yeah, you. GTFO, OSB addict. You're perfect example of a n00b glorified by ACR.

Most of these suggestions are great, and I thought of some myself whilst playing today.

Something I noticed while playing DM is that I contested my pursuer from his blend group, but only because of the prompt. As already mentioned, reducing the stun prompt range when at Silent or above is a great idea, but another thing I'd like to add: You can Contest your pursuer only if you're locked onto him. What I mean to say is, he can only be Contested if locked onto by his target. If not, then nothing will happen. However, if you surprise your pursuer and he doesn't press the kill asston, then whether you locked onto him or not won't matter, you'll stun him.

No. Contesting shouldn't be prioritised to locks. All that need to be changed is the stun prompt range, regardless of the stealth meter. It'd be much easier to implement that way than having to put in code just because a certain someone was at this point or that point in the stealth meter.

I could go over all the stuff that was wrong with ACR, but it'd take time, so I'd rather not do it now.

FilipinoNinja67
04-03-2012, 09:35 PM
@obliviondoll

That makes sense. Alliance was ruined by stunlocking *tear* *tear* :(

obliviondoll
04-03-2012, 09:41 PM
Alliance stunlocking wasn't nearly as bad once you found the right ways to counter it.

Except that after the pre-3.0 patch the lag broke most of them more often than not, and the targeting went even more wonky, so it was sometimes impossible to even force-lock a pursuer near a grounded target.

FilipinoNinja67
04-03-2012, 09:51 PM
Alliance stunlocking wasn't nearly as bad once you found the right ways to counter it.

Except that after the pre-3.0 patch the lag broke most of them more often than not, and the targeting went even more wonky, so it was sometimes impossible to even force-lock a pursuer near a grounded target.

I did find the ways to counter it but those ways still were not fun at all. There's nothing stealthy about running up with a mute and poisoning :/

obliviondoll
04-04-2012, 01:28 PM
So you never found out how well Firecrackers and Knives worked?

Or Firecrackers/Smoke (Smoke vs. Pursuers when they're stunlocking your targets, not OSB)

Or having one of you go Aerial and the other stay at ground level?

Gun's also a viable counter, when it comes to that.

Also, another really good suggestion I came up with for leaderboards - actually an idea I had back in ACB days, but had forgotten about lately.

Add a "podium %" stat - Every match where you earn the "Podium" bonus for having one of the top 3 scores in the game counts as an increase to the percentage, and every time you miss out counts as a negative.

PANiC_ATTACKER
04-04-2012, 01:51 PM
Yeah, you. GTFO, OSB addict. You're perfect example of a n00b glorified by ACR.

Most of these suggestions are great, and I thought of some myself whilst playing today.

Something I noticed while playing DM is that I contested my pursuer from his blend group, but only because of the prompt. As already mentioned, reducing the stun prompt range when at Silent or above is a great idea, but another thing I'd like to add: You can Contest your pursuer only if you're locked onto him. What I mean to say is, he can only be Contested if locked onto by his target. If not, then nothing will happen. However, if you surprise your pursuer and he doesn't press the kill asston, then whether you locked onto him or not won't matter, you'll stun him.

no.. they are not great, you have ruined the thread. I rarely use OSB. I use DOSB

FilipinoNinja67
04-05-2012, 01:27 AM
So you never found out how well Firecrackers and Knives worked?

Or Firecrackers/Smoke (Smoke vs. Pursuers when they're stunlocking your targets, not OSB)

Or having one of you go Aerial and the other stay at ground level?

Gun's also a viable counter, when it comes to that.

Also, another really good suggestion I came up with for leaderboards - actually an idea I had back in ACB days, but had forgotten about lately.

Add a "podium %" stat - Every match where you earn the "Podium" bonus for having one of the top 3 scores in the game counts as an increase to the percentage, and every time you miss out counts as a negative.
No, i did. I used that for my Manhunt anti stun locking class to break them up and make them waste their abilities. It did not work as well as it does in manhunt. I also used it in chest capture and in escort and i called it my "Seeker" class. I needed a teamate for that class to work and at that time i was in VAA and no one would play with me.

Yeah, i would love to play against the stun lockers that you played against, the ones i constantly dealt with all ran to the corners of the maps where no npcs came and there were no roofs. They recognized me later on though and knew not to stun lock and still lost.

Gun will not win you the game against stun lockers, you know it, and the rest of the community knows it.