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View Full Version : Have you ever considered Assassin's Creed without Desmond?



LordWolv
03-02-2012, 08:19 AM
I just had the thought, what if the whole present day storyline didn't exist. What if the animus, Desmond, and reliving memories was never part of the game. The games wouldn't link (the transition between Altair and Ezio for instance) but they wouldn't have to, look at Prince of Persia. It would be a game, still about the Assassins and Templars, but it would follow the assassins. I'm not suggesting the game would be better like this of course, but it's worth a thought, would you prefer it? What would you think of Assassin's Creed if the present day storyline just wasn't there?

Tell me your thoughts, I think it's quite an interesting thing to think about.

The13Doctors
03-02-2012, 08:24 AM
We don't really need the modern day story. It's really intriguing but AC can very well survive with it solely being in various historic times, no need for an Animus User.

LordWolv
03-02-2012, 08:27 AM
We don't really need the modern day story. It's really intriguing but AC can very well survive with it solely being in various historic times, no need for an Animus User.
Exactly my point!
AC would work basically the same without the modern day story.

misterB2001
03-02-2012, 08:45 AM
None of it would have an end purpose. The stories are only as epic, because of what's at stake in the future. In my opinion, the desmond 2012 stuff makes the game what it is

pirate1802
03-02-2012, 08:49 AM
Exactly my point!
AC would work basically the same without the modern day story.

I third that! I didn't mind the present day story, but to me it was merely a storytelling technique. Never understood why some people like Desmond so much, he is as interesting as an apple -__-.I wish the next AC story arc would be based solely in the past. Infact, why not go way back in the past and explore the lives of the six assassins whose tombs were in AC 2 ?

Grygier
03-02-2012, 08:50 AM
i dread the day i will play only as Desmond =P... hopefully it will never come.

pirate1802
03-02-2012, 08:53 AM
i dread the day i will play only as Desmond =P... hopefully it will never come.

LOL! I dread too, and I feared AC 3 would be Desmond only, but they have been laid to rest after seeing the screenshots :)

misterB2001
03-02-2012, 08:55 AM
i dread the day i will play only as Desmond =P... hopefully it will never come.

Considering this is desmond last game as the main character and we play (in the main) as that cool looking dude in the American Revolution, I think we can safely say that it will never happen!

The13Doctors
03-02-2012, 08:59 AM
I third that! I didn't mind the present day story, but to me it was merely a storytelling technique. Never understood why some people like Desmond so much, he is as interesting as an apple -__-.I wish the next AC story arc would be based solely in the past. Infact, why not go way back in the past and explore the lives of the six assassins whose tombs were in AC 2 ?

I would love that!

YuurHeen
03-02-2012, 09:10 AM
I think its very cool that someone from the future is playing someone in the past. the whole synchronising, the jumps in time, etc.
it gives a extra dimension.
so a game with only the modern day would not work only because you dont have that.

pirate1802
03-02-2012, 09:14 AM
Because those six assassins were equal to Altair in greatness, so why only explore Altair's life? Without Desmond we would be free of the bloodline constraints. Agreed, ancient assassins would not have many tall buildings and inferior equipment, but who knows, maybe the next AC "season' would not lean on parkour so much, and ubisoft can come up with interesting ideas for even ancient assassins. coming to think of it now,

1. There will be more ACs after AC3. that has been confirmed
2. A MAJOR portion of why AC is so famous is because it explores places and periods of the past which no game has touched on before.
3. No Desmond after AC3.

So where do they go in the next story arc? Surely bringing in another Desmond-type dude and putting him in the animus would feel repetitive? I'm guessing the Next AC series would be Animus-less. I hope I'm right xD

The13Doctors
03-02-2012, 09:22 AM
Because those six assassins were equal to Altair in greatness, so why only explore Altair's life? Without Desmond we would be free of the bloodline constraints. Agreed, ancient assassins would not have many tall buildings and inferior equipment, but who knows, maybe the next AC "season' would not lean on parkour so much, and ubisoft can come up with interesting ideas for even ancient assassins. coming to think of it now,

1. There will be more ACs after AC3. that has been confirmed
2. A MAJOR portion of why AC is so famous is because it explores places and periods of the past which no game has touched on before.
3. No Desmond after AC3.

So where do they go in the next story arc? Surely bringing in another Desmond-type dude and putting him in the animus would feel repetitive? I'm guessing the Next AC series would be Animus-less. I hope I'm right xD

They would probably have one with a filler character and story just to be able to keep key features in the game such as Synchronization (Health), maps, all of that. Unless they decide to just ignore reality and straight up use the Interface without it being part of the animus, maybe having it so that we know that it technically is being used by someone but we never get direct interaction, like we over hear the character cough occasionally when we are in the menu. You know, small subtle hints that show us that there's a user without it needing an actual story behind it.

YuurHeen
03-02-2012, 09:24 AM
Because those six assassins were equal to Altair in greatness, so why only explore Altair's life? Without Desmond we would be free of the bloodline constraints. Agreed, ancient assassins would not have many tall buildings and inferior equipment, but who knows, maybe the next AC "season' would not lean on parkour so much, and ubisoft can come up with interesting ideas for even ancient assassins. coming to think of it now,

1. There will be more ACs after AC3. that has been confirmed
2. A MAJOR portion of why AC is so famous is because it explores places and periods of the past which no game has touched on before.
3. No Desmond after AC3.

So where do they go in the next story arc? Surely bringing in another Desmond-type dude and putting him in the animus would feel repetitive? I'm guessing the Next AC series would be Animus-less. I hope I'm right xD

i hope your wrong. putting someone in animus 3.0 or 4.0 is going to happen or it wont be a ac game.

pirate1802
03-02-2012, 09:40 AM
Just give me a good chunk of historical gameplay and I'm a happy camper. I don't care if they put in animus 8.0 or 9.0

eagleforlife1
03-02-2012, 10:11 AM
I would be quite happy playign the historical game without Desmond. In fact I would prefer it.

LightRey
03-02-2012, 10:58 AM
None of it would have an end purpose. The stories are only as epic, because of what's at stake in the future. In my opinion, the desmond 2012 stuff makes the game what it is

Ditto.

gmoney8869
03-02-2012, 03:23 PM
IMO, the Desmond story is completely pointless and really drags the game down.

I for one, have never paid any attention to the present day story at all. I kind of listened to it in AC2, but by the end it was clear that it was incredibly stupid. The combination of memories-in-genetics and supernatural gods with magic artifacts is completely ridiculous. If you're going to do sci-fi, atleast make it not outright ludicrous.

It seems obvious that when making AC1, they were afraid people wouldn't be interested if there wasn't some stupid sci-fi, save the world kind of crap shoehorned in.

Every game is 99% in history! Dealing with a historical narrative! It makes no sense to have it all be dependent on a sci-fi story, when nearly everything you do in the game has no relevance to it. It is absurd.

These games would benefit greatly from simply removing all sci-fi from the plot. No present day, no Animus, no Abstergo, no supernatural time-bending Beings, no 2012, no end of the world. All of that is plain cliched idiocy.

Just have 2 secret societies that manipulate major historical events. That, in it of itself, is an interesting premise. And it is much simpler and more versatile than what they have now. I really hope that they do this going forward.

Xstantin
03-02-2012, 04:22 PM
I thought the Animus was the essential part of the game. The bleeding effect itself seems to be rather significant after ACB and ACR (Altair's child, S16). Without someone experiencing their genetic memories the games would be just a collection of cool-looking people in hoods climbing around and killing people. Plotwise the game needs an ancestor and a descendant sharing knowledge.

WhiteSheWolf
03-02-2012, 04:25 PM
None of it would have an end purpose. The stories are only as epic, because of what's at stake in the future. In my opinion, the desmond 2012 stuff makes the game what it is


Ditto.

I'm going to third all of that. Without Desmond/Modern Day storyline there are no Those Who Came Before, no Pieces of Eden, no sense of urgency (or at least not as much of one) no Subject 16, no battle stretched out through ages.

Personally...I've loved seeing Desmond grow throughout the series, and I want more of his story. I enjoyed the new single player missions in ACR/The Lost Archive for exactly that reason...

LightRey
03-02-2012, 04:29 PM
I thought the Animus was the essential part of the game. The bleeding effect itself seems to be rather significant after ACB and ACR (Altair's child, S16). Without someone experiencing their genetic memories the games would be just a collection of cool-looking people in hoods climbing around and killing people. Plotwise the game needs an ancestor and a descendant sharing knowledge.

Exactly. It's the Modern day stuff that connects everything. Without the modern-day stuff all these stories are just random events in the Assassin-Templar war. Granted, they're very interesting and cool, but losing the Modern-day story is like losing the one thing that adds the grand significance of the ancestors. They're not just top-level assassins that were essential to preserving the order, they're also key players in a story that spans thousands of years.

DualFace
03-02-2012, 04:38 PM
1. There will be more ACs after AC3. that has been confirmed

No it hasn't. Dunno where you're getting that from, but there's no point (although I know Ubisoft will attempt it) in making any
more games after ACIII (accepting the possibility that ACIII will end up being another trilogy within a trilogy as ACII was/is) as the
whole plot of AC-ACIII is to get the information on how to save the Earth from the Sun as the TWCB failed to do.

Ubisoft is already stretching it thin with all these iOS games, card games, spinoffs, PSP games, and trilogies within trilogies. It's
unbelievable at times.

RzaRecta357
03-02-2012, 04:41 PM
It's part gameplay mechanic too though remember. The animus is the reason for the health bars and what not. They'd have to just do traditional game style and say the hud is there for the game and not the animus.

I don't know. I've always been right into Desmonds story. I think it's awesome. Truly hoping we get to at least stab Viddic with his **** blade.

Also to the guy above me. I had to edit because Amancio did say they'd probably be doing more games after AC3 but they'll take a break for a bit.

AC is so rich with history they could churn out 100 games.


They did one trilogy in AC2. Like GTA3 did with SA and VC.

You're stretching our patience thin, with your bad assumptions.

D.I.D.
03-02-2012, 04:44 PM
I don't give a monkey's about the modern day thing or the ancient days of spandex. The pre-history looked like it was going to be good for a minute, and then turned into a pantomime of clichés.

I'd be perfectly happy if they got rid of the animus and just picked times in history with some kind of political intrigue, added their two factions and let us play that out.

playassassins1
03-02-2012, 04:45 PM
I kind of can't consider AC without Desmond. Because i actually like Desmond's story. But it would be fun to just play as Assassins outside Desmond's bloodline.

WhiteSheWolf
03-02-2012, 04:48 PM
No it hasn't. Dunno where you're getting that from, but there's no point (although I know Ubisoft will attempt it) in making any
more games after ACIII (accepting the possibility that ACIII will end up being another trilogy within a trilogy as ACII was/is) as the
whole plot of AC-ACIII is to get the information on how to save the Earth from the Sun as the TWCB failed to do.

Ubisoft is already stretching it thin with all these iOS games, card games, spinoffs, PSP games, and trilogies within trilogies. It's
unbelievable at times.

Actually Ubisoft has said many times that this is not the end of the franchise; just the end of Desmond's story. There's a lot that could be done after Desmond...say he does manage to save the world, there's still the whole issue of Those Who Came Before, Eve, and Desmond's kid...and the fact that even if the Templars are defeated this time, there are still many more Pieces of Eden out there and I doubt the Templars would give up and go away just because this time, they failed.

I do agree that the handheld spin offs are a little annoying, though.

LordWolv
03-02-2012, 05:05 PM
The other thing you should think about is whether you'd prefer it if you sacrificed all of the desmond gameplay for more missions as the ancestor..

pirate1802
03-02-2012, 05:09 PM
Actually Ubisoft has said many times that this is not the end of the franchise; just the end of Desmond's story. There's a lot that could be done after Desmond...say he does manage to save the world, there's still the whole issue of Those Who Came Before, Eve, and Desmond's kid...and the fact that even if the Templars are defeated this time, there are still many more Pieces of Eden out there and I doubt the Templars would give up and go away just because this time, they failed.

I do agree that the handheld spin offs are a little annoying, though.

There are so many interesting locations and time periods still left to visit xD So more ACs please.

LordWolv
03-02-2012, 05:11 PM
There are so many interesting locations and time periods still left to visit xD So more ACs please.
What AC does has endless possibilities (almost) - There will definitely be more. Many more.

Adogg4444
03-02-2012, 05:42 PM
The reason that I feel the modern day story line is essential is because Subject 16 and his glyphs/rifts were some of the most fun parts of the game for me.

pirate1802
03-02-2012, 05:56 PM
No it hasn't. Dunno where you're getting that from, but there's no point (although I know Ubisoft will attempt it) in making any
more games after ACIII (accepting the possibility that ACIII will end up being another trilogy within a trilogy as ACII was/is) as the
whole plot of AC-ACIII is to get the information on how to save the Earth from the Sun as the TWCB failed to do.

Ubisoft is already stretching it thin with all these iOS games, card games, spinoffs, PSP games, and trilogies within trilogies. It's
unbelievable at times.

http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2011/10/03/desmond-39-s-story-ends-in-2012-but-assassin-39-s-creed-doesn-39-t.aspx

Dieinthedark
03-02-2012, 11:15 PM
Desmond is a must, it's all his ancestors.

GeneralTrumbo
03-02-2012, 11:42 PM
I don't give a monkey's about the modern day thing or the ancient days of spandex. The pre-history looked like it was going to be good for a minute, and then turned into a pantomime of clichés.

I'd be perfectly happy if they got rid of the animus and just picked times in history with some kind of political intrigue, added their two factions and let us play that out.
Please tell me; in what game has the 2012 end-of-the-world theory came about by an ancient civilization that existed before humans? I would love to hear of another.

GeneralTrumbo
03-02-2012, 11:47 PM
http://www.gameinformer.com/b/news/archive/2011/10/03/desmond-39-s-story-ends-in-2012-but-assassin-39-s-creed-doesn-39-t.aspx
Game informer just assumed that there would be more by what Amancio said. The thing is, all he really said there will be more things to do with Assassins Creed. That could range anywhere from movies to comics, books, etc.

The13Doctors
03-02-2012, 11:54 PM
There shall be more, still they could always do what I suggested, have the Animus but not a story behind it.

LordWolv
03-03-2012, 06:57 AM
Exactly. It's the Modern day stuff that connects everything. Without the modern-day stuff all these stories are just random events in the Assassin-Templar war. Granted, they're very interesting and cool, but losing the Modern-day story is like losing the one thing that adds the grand significance of the ancestors. They're not just top-level assassins that were essential to preserving the order, they're also key players in a story that spans thousands of years.
Links aren't necessary in games at all, look at CoD, PoP etc. But yes, true.

BeCk41
03-03-2012, 07:05 AM
yep, you don't actually need the animus... in fact it just makes the story much more complicated to a point where your really confused as to what is going on. I think they could continue the game most def without the animus user as no one is really interested in the present day problems. Its all about reliving memories of the past.

Il_Divo
03-03-2012, 07:05 AM
I have considered it. And then I also considered how much less enjoyable the series would be without it.

pirate1802
03-03-2012, 07:22 AM
Game informer just assumed that there would be more by what Amancio said. The thing is, all he really said there will be more things to do with Assassins Creed. That could range anywhere from movies to comics, books, etc.

"Assassin's Creed is all about cycles," Amancio says. "We have the Ezio cycle and the Altair cycle, and both of those are set to conclude in Revelations, and we have the Desmond cycle, which is set to end on December 2012. But there's many cycles within the brand – that's the whole point. History is our playground."

I do think he meant by cycles, games. Since Altair, Desmond and Ezio cycles were also games primarily.

SlimeDynamiteD
03-03-2012, 08:08 AM
I just had the thought, what if the whole present day storyline didn't exist. What if the animus, Desmond, and reliving memories was never part of the game. The games wouldn't link (the transition between Altair and Ezio for instance) but they wouldn't have to, look at Prince of Persia. It would be a game, still about the Assassins and Templars, but it would follow the assassins. I'm not suggesting the game would be better like this of course, but it's worth a thought, would you prefer it? What would you think of Assassin's Creed if the present day storyline just wasn't there?

Tell me your thoughts, I think it's quite an interesting thing to think about.

Well then let me ask you a question:
Have you ever considered Desmond without Assassin's Creed? Eh? Ehhhh?

See? It just wouldn't work.

LordWolv
03-03-2012, 08:12 AM
Well then let me ask you a question:
Have you ever considered Desmond without Assassin's Creed? Eh? Ehhhh?

See? It just wouldn't work.
Before starting with how right you are, I have two points.
Firstly, I wasn't suggesting it would be better, it was just a thought.
Secondly, your example is completely unrelated. Almost all of gameplay time is spent as the ancestor, and so would actually work.

SlimeDynamiteD
03-03-2012, 08:17 AM
First of: I never said you implied that it would be better.
Secondly: My example is completely related, what would Desmond's life be if not for the sake of the Assassins? He would just be another NYC Bartender.

Now that's just wrong. He has so much potential.

LordWolv
03-03-2012, 08:20 AM
First of: I never said you implied that it would be better.
Secondly: My example is completely related, what would Desmond's life be if not for the sake of the Assassins? He would just be another NYC Bartender.

Now that's just wrong. He has so much potential.
I'm sorry to break it to you, but desmond isn't actually a real person, and if the modern day storyline didn't exist he wouldn't be bartender, because he wouldn't exist. I'm sorry I have to tell you that this way.

SlimeDynamiteD
03-03-2012, 08:27 AM
That's insane.
Let's take you as an example:

If I don't know you, it doesn't mean you don't exist.

Il_Divo
03-03-2012, 08:28 AM
Before starting with how right you are, I have two points.

Secondly, your example is completely unrelated. Almost all of gameplay time is spent as the ancestor, and so would actually work.

This is true, but keep in mind that with a framed narrative, you can always remove the framing and keep the focus of the story, with only a few changes. It's not all that difficult. AC2 could have been just the story of Ezio out for revenge, but the framing always gives these actions a larger context. Especially in the case of Revelations, which was set on tying the stories of Altair, Desmond, and Ezio, together.

What works against AC (as you say) is that in your typical framed narrative, the characters in the present recalling the events are also the characters involved in the narrative, which means that the whole thing is needed to conclude the tale. Not so much with AC where Altair's/Ezio's stories are not even remotely dependent on Desmond in the telling.

LordWolv
03-03-2012, 08:29 AM
That's insane.
Let's take you as an example:

If I don't know you, it doesn't mean you don't exist.
Shush.

SlimeDynamiteD
03-03-2012, 08:33 AM
You know I'm right :o

LordWolv
03-03-2012, 08:35 AM
You know I'm right :o
Not in the slightest. Desmond is pixels with a voice actor, if he'd never been chosen to made he never would.

freddie_1897
03-03-2012, 10:30 AM
i just realised, there won't be any side games after AC3 until AC4, because its Desmonds last game, i mean we aren't going to continue playing as conner if we aren't playing as desmond

pacmanate
03-03-2012, 10:41 AM
^ thats a good thing, leave the next AC to the next gen

eagleforlife1
03-03-2012, 10:53 AM
I wouldn't mind expansions of Connor to pass the time though. Or Vita games of Shao Jun/Nikolai Orelov.

WhiteSheWolf
03-03-2012, 11:07 AM
I'm sorry to break it to you, but desmond isn't actually a real person, and if the modern day storyline didn't exist he wouldn't be bartender, because he wouldn't exist. I'm sorry I have to tell you that this way.


I'm sure there is a person in the world somewhere, dead or living or not borne yet, that is/has been/will be named Desmond Miles and is/has been/will be a bartender. It's not like "Miles" is an uncommon name.

Just like all of those poor souls named Harry Potter in the world...

The13Doctors
03-03-2012, 11:15 AM
I wouldn't mind expansions of Connor to pass the time though. Or Vita games of Shao Jun/Nikolai Orelov.

Same. I am getting too hyped and excited with Conner, I wouldn't want them to just leave Conner so quickly and have to wait 3 years for AC4, I will have lost interest in the series by then.

I am actually hoping for at least another release for Connor, like in France or something, you know, keep him alive. With 7 studios, or even, they could make it yearly.



I'm sure there is a person in the world somewhere, dead or living or not borne yet, that is/has been/will be named Desmond Miles and is/has been/will be a bartender. It's not like "Miles" is an uncommon name.

Just like all of those poor souls named Harry Potter in the world...


Well yeah, but he wouldn't be featured or even exist in a video game, unless one of his family members were the CEO of Ubisoft, then in a game of the near Modern Age, they can put him as a backdrop bartender character.

...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u2ALsvU50wQ

SlimeDynamiteD
03-03-2012, 06:24 PM
Not in the slightest. Desmond is pixels with a voice actor, if he'd never been chosen to made he never would.

You never know, maybe he'll be one of the NPC's walking around the city.

pacmanate
03-03-2012, 07:13 PM
You can't say that they aren't squeezing the franchise dry with all these spin offs etc. Part of me says they did it on purpose for AC III because just by reading the stuff in the game it just seems like a 10/10 game and I havent even seen anything for it yet!

GeneralTrumbo
03-03-2012, 07:14 PM
Assassins Creed would be crap without Desmond. Fact.

Alabama Love
03-03-2012, 07:37 PM
If we never heard about Desmond, we would all be so confused right alongside Ezio when Minerva comes along =p

n3krOiZ
03-03-2012, 08:53 PM
the game without it would work but i think i wouldn't like it so much as i do now.

Now i'm thinking, wouldn't be nice if we were altair, ezio, connor and we see ezio hearing about desmond and talking to desmond and after Ac3 we get Ac4 where we play as desmond (when we are all WTF was that **** about desmond at Ac2?).. maybe it would have been a nice way of developing but this one is pretty much nice..

About the connor expansion, if this games ends by 1784 they could make and expansion where we play by 1789 at french revolution... the thing is, how would they explain it from desmond prespective?