PDA

View Full Version : desmond's journey(s16)



Acrimonious_Nin
02-09-2012, 03:12 AM
Ever since i played through the first journey it bugged me that once you get the ability to set down "walkways" right when your walking through that first gap where the squares assimilate around you , you hear s16 laughing..ok no biggie then you play through i believe its either the 2nd or 3rd journey and you start hearing that voice saying that there is a memory leak and that things are not working that well ??? and, i played the ps3 version, did anyone here hear random piano playing(horribly)for a short moment during the loading of a couple of the journey loading screens? -___- s16 is up to something even since he gave his littel "let me come with you" idea to desmond, and SPOILER-- when animus island is being deleted you hugs desmond and desmond is glowing around i checked this and i saw that it was not part of the deletion blue aura that happening? any chances that s16 is part of desmond now ? i mean his arm IS glowing blue by the end of the game --END SPOILER

rileypoole1234
02-09-2012, 03:14 AM
I highly doubt it. Like, really, really highly doubt it. I think his arm was glowing because of some sort of TWCB thing. That may be how he will open the grand temple.

Acrimonious_Nin
02-09-2012, 03:54 AM
I highly doubt it. Like, really, really highly doubt it. I think his arm was glowing because of some sort of TWCB thing. That may be how he will open the grand temple.
i was just speculating i mean it never glows blue -__-

LightRey
02-09-2012, 11:25 AM
lolwut? I don't even know what you're talking about. S16 laughing? A piano playing horribly?

The13Doctors
02-09-2012, 11:53 AM
While I never heard those things he did say he was keeping the Animus busy for Desmond to be able to roam. Although, you may have a good point when he hugged him, although he said he was saving him by doing so, it may have been saving both of them.

Sounds plausible enough.

LightRey
02-09-2012, 02:20 PM
While I never heard those things he did say he was keeping the Animus busy for Desmond to be able to roam. Although, you may have a good point when he hugged him, although he said he was saving him by doing so, it may have been saving both of them.

Sounds plausible enough.

I doubt it. He disintegrated in the exact same way as Animus Island. That strongly suggests that he was deleted along with it.

Acrimonious_Nin
02-09-2012, 04:36 PM
lolwut? I don't even know what you're talking about. S16 laughing? A piano playing horribly?
then it must be a glitch in my game only -__- when you step in and the screen looks like a computer loading screen is where the piano plays in only one of the journeys' and in the first journey when you go through the first Stonehenge like portal where you get the ability to create those walkways and slope; as your creating your first path if you listen s16 is giggling or something...

LightRey
02-09-2012, 05:26 PM
then it must be a glitch in my game only -__- when you step in and the screen looks like a computer loading screen is where the piano plays in only one of the journeys' and in the first journey when you go through the first Stonehenge like portal where you get the ability to create those walkways and slope; as your creating your first path if you listen s16 is giggling or something...

Well I can confirm the laugh, but it might not be S16 and even if it is, it's not really that much of a clue.

The13Doctors
02-09-2012, 11:10 PM
I doubt it. He disintegrated in the exact same way as Animus Island. That strongly suggests that he was deleted along with it.

Well we know he was smart, he was able to save himself by placing his sub-conscience and personality in the Animus before killing himself, maybe in his time he figured out a plan to escape. It isn't 100% certain but very possible. He could have imprinted his DNA in Desmond, maybe even his own self within him, the "Physical" Clay deleted but his subconsciousness saved within Desmond somehow.

It could be cool to see it come back later.

LightRey
02-09-2012, 11:13 PM
Well we know he was smart, he was able to save himself by placing his sub-conscience and personality in the Animus before killing himself, maybe in his time he figured out a plan to escape. It isn't 100% certain but very possible. He could have imprinted his DNA in Desmond, maybe even his own self within him, the "Physical" Clay deleted but his subconsciousness saved within Desmond somehow.

It could be cool to see it come back later.

It's possible, but as I said unlikely. We see him get deleted and I doubt he'd go with Desmond against his will. Besides, I'm pretty sure the devs recently said something about him not returning to the series.

Acrimonious_Nin
02-10-2012, 12:27 AM
wait good question how DID he get his subconscious in there? did he hack the animus , cut himself, then went inside the animus's blackroom? if so, then he was a very calculative person... what we see in AC:R seems like him not the program we see inside the rifts in AC:B...

LightRey
02-10-2012, 12:35 AM
wait good question how DID he get his subconscious in there? did he hack the animus , cut himself, then went inside the animus's blackroom? if so, then he was a very calculative person i wonder if he really did not calculate leaving with desmond somehow and desmond just doesn't know it lol

Well to an extent at least it had to do with his programming abilities. He created a program to preserve his imprint in the animus, which was basically a simulation of his real self. That simulation is what you saw in ACR. I like to compare it to someone thinking about what somebody they know well would do in a certain situation. That's basically what the animus would be doing with S16.

DarthEzio55
02-10-2012, 03:33 AM
I kinda didn't want 16 to get "deleted", because he had alot more potenial as n character, but hopefully he might reappear in ac3 somehow. I doubt that though.

LightRey
02-10-2012, 11:47 AM
I kinda didn't want 16 to get "deleted", because he had alot more potenial as n character, but hopefully he might reappear in ac3 somehow. I doubt that though.

Well it's not like he had any future. His body was gone and even if Desmond would take him along he'd still be stuck in there. It's not like he could have taken someone else's body and even if he could, why? It's not exactly right, is it?

dxsxhxcx
02-10-2012, 02:25 PM
let's hope they have something big planned for him in a DLC because his role in ACR was a complete disappointment... my opinion of course...

itsamea-mario
02-10-2012, 03:33 PM
Yeah, 3 games worth of build up and they end it with a few pointless dialogues and him getting deleted.
They'd better mention him again in some way, because they didn't really do it justice.

LightRey
02-10-2012, 03:37 PM
I'm not sure what you guys were expecting. It's not like he was one of TWCB or something. In the end he was just another subject.

itsamea-mario
02-10-2012, 03:44 PM
He was a significant character who they built up for 3 games, then killed off without living up to any expectations.

LightRey
02-10-2012, 04:19 PM
He was a significant character who they built up for 3 games, then killed off without living up to any expectations.

He was already killed off. In fact, we didn't even know some part of him was still "alive" until (near) the end of ACB.

SixKeys
02-10-2012, 05:47 PM
He was already killed off. In fact, we didn't even know some part of him was still "alive" until (near) the end of ACB.

Again with the semantics. I'm sure you know what itsamea-mario meant. S16 was an important character whose presence was felt in the games starting with the very first one. They made it clear he urgently wanted to communicate with Desmond, that he had some extremely important message to deliver, then when they finally met face to face (even if it was just a virtual projection of some sort), he was just sort of: "...Sup? 'Kay, I'm gonna go now, bye."

LightRey
02-10-2012, 05:50 PM
Again with the semantics. I'm sure you know what itsamea-mario meant. S16 was an important character whose presence was felt in the games starting with the very first one. They made it clear he urgently wanted to communicate with Desmond, that he had some extremely important message to deliver, then when they finally met face to face (even if it was just a virtual projection of some sort), he was just sort of: "...Sup? 'Kay, I'm gonna go now, bye."

Him wanting to talk to Desmond makes him more than a regular guy?

Gil_217
02-10-2012, 06:22 PM
Him wanting to talk to Desmond makes him more than a regular guy?

You made it sound like it's some regular and absolutely normal conversation.

LightRey
02-10-2012, 06:34 PM
You made it sound like it's some regular and absolutely normal conversation.

Well he's not some kind of god. Sure he knows some fairly interesting secrets, but in the end he's just a human with extensive knowledge of the Templars and the Assassins, most of which he already disclosed in the many hidden files he left behind inside the Animus. The fact of the matter is that in ACR, he really was just another Animus subject. Granted, he knew how to find a synch nexus and how to "survive" without a body inside the animus, but he was human.

But seriously, what did you guys expect?

Gil_217
02-10-2012, 07:04 PM
Well he's not some kind of god. Sure he knows some fairly interesting secrets, but in the end he's just a human with extensive knowledge of the Templars and the Assassins, most of which he already disclosed in the many hidden files he left behind inside the Animus. The fact of the matter is that in ACR, he really was just another Animus subject. Granted, he knew how to find a synch nexus and how to "survive" without a body inside the animus, but he was human.

But seriously, what did you guys expect?

To be honest, I wasn't expecting too much from him, therefore I was surprised he even appeared in ACR, but the conversations between them felt so strange, it looked like they knew each other or something, no big reaction or surprise when they saw each other, even though they were in a machine but whatever, it looked like it lacked something, I mean, like someone mentioned earlier, they built him up pretty much, and in the end most people were like: "That's it?"

With this said I wasn't disappointed like some people were because my expectations regarding him weren't that big.

LightRey
02-10-2012, 07:07 PM
To be honest, I wasn't expecting too much from him, therefore I was surprised he even appeared in ACR, but the conversations between them felt so strange, it looked like they knew each other or something, no big reaction or surprise when they saw each other, even though they were in a machine but whatever, it looked like it lacked something, I mean, like someone mentioned earlier, they built him up pretty much, and in the end most people were like: "That's it?"

With this said I wasn't disappointed like some people were because my expectations regarding him weren't that big.

well they did already meet under similar conditions during ACB, so I think that explains the way they reacted. The only thing I found weird is that S16 seemed to want to tell Desmond something important in ACB, but in ACR he doesn't even bring it up. I guess whatever he wanted to say either lost priority or he simply didn't have anything to add (for whatever reason).

itsamea-mario
02-10-2012, 10:00 PM
I expected ubi to demonstrate their story writing talent and not prematurely end a storyline.
It seems like they planned all this stuff, building up the characters potential and raising questions, only to realise they couldn't be bothered finishing it properly.

It's like having the first two LOTR books and then Return of the king is released in the form of haiku.
(well not 'exactly' like that)

Look at this from a writers point of view, not a players.

LightRey
02-10-2012, 10:30 PM
I expected ubi to demonstrate their story writing talent and not prematurely end a storyline.
It seems like they planned all this stuff, building up the characters potential and raising questions, only to realise they couldn't be bothered finishing it properly.

It's like having the first two LOTR books and then Return of the king is released in the form of haiku.
(well not 'exactly' like that)

Look at this from a writers point of view, not a players.

I think you just got overly excited. The buildup wasn't really much of anything. There were the blood messages, which turned out to be just a simple warning, depictions of things relevant to TWCB and clues to the glyphs, and other than that there was S16's message in ACB. That's not really much of a buildup if you ask me.

dxsxhxcx
02-10-2012, 10:53 PM
one simple thing would've made me happy in ACR, Desmond asking what S16 wanted to say with everything he wrote in his room, the glyphs and the ACB message and them he saying that he (Desmond) would understand everything in time, the complete neglection of all the past events that happened between them in the previous games is one of the things that helped to destroy the character, to add to this Desmond doesn't even look surprised when he sees (for the first time) the person who have been trying to warn him about something since the first game, he acted like if he knew S16 would be there to help him, like if everything was under control, Desmond doesn't even knows the name of the person who saved him at the end of the game, if it wasn't the encyclopedia WE wouldn't know his name, I don't know what the writers drank that they thought that the mention of the name of a character who is around since the first game wouldn't be important enough to be answered in the game...

LightRey
02-10-2012, 11:25 PM
one simple thing would've made me happy in ACR, Desmond asking what S16 wanted to say with everything he wrote in his room, the glyphs and the ACB message and them he saying that he (Desmond) would understand everything in time, the complete neglection of all the past events that happened between them in the previous games is one of the things that helped to destroy the character, to add to this Desmond doesn't even look surprised when he sees (for the first time) the person who have been trying to warn him about something since the first game, he acted like if he knew S16 would be there to help him, like if everything was under control, Desmond doesn't even knows the name of the person who saved him at the end of the game, if it wasn't the encyclopedia WE wouldn't know his name, I don't know what the writers drank that they thought that the mention of the name of a character who is around since the first game wouldn't be important enough to be answered in the game...

We already know what he wanted to say with everything in his room and so did Desmond. They were clues to find the glyphs. He doesn't see him for the first time in ACR either. He saw him in ACB under almost identical conditions. That is when he acted surprised. Their meeting in ACR was simply a reunion. S16 even announced that they'd see each other again ("find me in the darkness" and whatnot) and the lack of telling his name was just a tease.

You guys were just overhyped.

itsamea-mario
02-10-2012, 11:33 PM
I don't care about the physical aspect of what he did, sure that wad explained.
But they had all this mystery about who he was, then suddenly they give us his name and face, don't give him a propper introduction, a few petty lines of dialogue, ignore most of what transpired last time, then end the character.

He may not have been particularly important to the plight of the assassins.
But he was an important character in the story, and they didn't pull it of well.

LightRey
02-10-2012, 11:41 PM
I don't care about the physical aspect of what he did, sure that wad explained.
But they had all this mystery about who he was, then suddenly they give us his name and face, don't give him a propper introduction, a few petty lines of dialogue, ignore most of what transpired last time, then end the character.

He may not have been particularly important to the plight of the assassins.
But he was an important character in the story, and they didn't pull it of well.

I think you're romanticizing it too much. The good thing about AC is that it stays a little more (just a little) realistic. This isn't some story where all good guys die epic deaths and have an unusually interesting background with lots of fantastic tales, where each side character is interesting and hugely dynamic, etc. Some people, important as they are, are just regular people and they die when they get deleted or get stabbed in the gut.

This is not Harry Potter or an epic of Greek mythology.

itsamea-mario
02-10-2012, 11:51 PM
But he did die an epic death, I personally think the animus island deletion was a pretty epic scene.
And even if his background was dull, it would have been nice to have atleast a glimpse of it.

Character development is vital to ANY story, and as far as I'm cconcerned 16 wasn't as developed as he should have been.
So I just hope they atleast talk about him in AC3.

Or of course feature him in a DLC..

LightRey
02-10-2012, 11:59 PM
But he did die an epic death, I personally think the animus island deletion was a pretty epic scene.
And even if his background was dull, it would have been nice to have atleast a glimpse of it.

Character development is vital to ANY story, and as far as I'm cconcerned 16 wasn't as developed as he should have been.
So I just hope they atleast talk about him in AC3.

I wouldn't call it epic, but heroic. Epic implies that it was grande. I think they deliberately kept his background from us to preserve some of the mystery. That's probably why his name and the fact that he was a master programmer can only be found in the encyclopedia.

I'm not saying there shouldn't be any character development, but S16, because of the mystery behind him, was never meant for such a thing. He was not someone to relate to or whose character was to be explored more deeply than the surface. You know as well as I that every good story has characters that are still quite significant, but that have little depth to them. Character development is meant for the main characters, the characters whose lives you actually get to see a part of. Not the ones that were supposed to be dead until the last moment of the previous segment, who then afterwards turn out to be sort of alive and then really only get a few short moments to have a conversation with the main character. Character development with S16 would only have made sense if they'd given his character more depth and make him relatable, which they couldn't really since ACR only takes a few days.

itsamea-mario
02-11-2012, 12:28 AM
They kicked the sense of mystery in the face when he suddenly appeared at the beginning going "sup, remember all that trippy stuff I said? No? Good."
Also he does have the memories of most of his ancestors(I think he does anyway)

I think they could have done the animus island as a whole better, given it more space, more complex, last longer, you know, like they advertised...
I blame the multiplayer...

Anyway whatever his significance may be, I think ubisoft finished him poorly.
And epic doesn't really mean big either, epic is rarely used to mean it's definition, it's more it means what the sayer intends, and you know full well I wasn't saying 16's death was fitting of a long poem..

As I said, they could have done more, or less earlier on..

SixKeys
02-11-2012, 12:43 AM
I still don't understand why Desmond didn't ask anything about the stuff S16 rambled on about at the end of ACB. That's the thing that makes no sense about their meet-up. 16 said all kinds of stuff like "the Sun... your son... find Eve" etc. Why didn't Desmond ask him what any of that meant? After so much mystery and build-up they were both just so casual with each other. 16 had time to write long-winded database entries about every mosque Ezio stumbled upon in Constantinople but couldn't take the time to explain who the hell Eve is or why Desmond has to find her?

LightRey
02-11-2012, 12:44 AM
They kicked most of the sense of mystery, yes, but the fact that people are upset they didn't really get to know him is enough to say that some of it still remains, if only a little.

"most of his ancestors"? You do realize he has at least tens of thousands of those, right? He has the important memories of a few of them, but I think most of what he knew he had already disclosed in the Truth files.

They advertized nothing about the size of Animus Island. All of the big stuff in the trailers was from Desmond's Journey and I would once again point out that the MP has no effect on the time or effort spent on SP as it is handled by a separate studio.

"Epic" is a reference to Greek/Roman Epics, which are stories about half gods (children of a human and a god), such as Aeneas, Herakles, etc. They're all about performing superhuman feats. That is what "epic" implies, something a regular human would not be able to do.


I still don't understand why Desmond didn't ask anything about the stuff S16 rambled on about at the end of ACB. That's the thing that makes no sense about their meet-up. 16 said all kinds of stuff like "the Sun... your son... find Eve" etc. Why didn't Desmond ask him what any of that meant? After so much mystery and build-up they were both just so casual with each other. 16 had time to write long-winded database entries about every mosque Ezio stumbled upon in Constantinople but couldn't take the time to explain who the hell Eve is or why Desmond has to find her?

That's the one thing I don't get about it, though I disagree that it was a huge buildup. Most of the buildup was caused by our own speculation.

As for the database. Assuming he did write it (since he really seems to be the only one who could have), it might just have been part of keeping the animus busy, which I suspect was what he spent most of his time doing during ACR, which would explain why he didn't take the time to explain some of the inadequately answered questions.

What bothers me most is why Desmond didn't ask. Maybe he wasn't completely with it because he was in a coma and all that.

Acrimonious_Nin
02-11-2012, 12:45 AM
They kicked the sense of mystery in the face when he suddenly appeared at the beginning going "sup, remember all that trippy stuff I said? No? Good."
.
hahaha :D he did say that...

itsamea-mario
02-11-2012, 01:01 AM
They kicked most of the sense of mystery, yes, but the fact that people are upset they didn't really get to know him is enough to say that some of it still remains, if only a little.

"most of his ancestors"? You do realize he has at least tens of thousands of those, right? He has the important memories of a few of them, but I think most of what he knew he had already disclosed in the Truth files.

They advertized nothing about the size of Animus Island. All of the big stuff in the trailers was from Desmond's Journey and I would once again point out that the MP has no effect on the time or effort spent on SP as it is handled by a separate studio.

"Epic" is a reference to Greek/Roman Epics, which are stories about half gods (children of a human and a god), such as Aeneas, Herakles, etc. They're all about performing superhuman feats. That is what "epic" implies, something a regular human would not be able to do.

I meant significant ancestors, going back to the year zero would put the number of ancestors somewhere in the order of 10^12(?)

Remember the trailer where Desmond was banging on some Walls, and it showed complex structures covered in writing?
Cos I remember seeing none of that in game.

Yes those are epics, but not all epics are those.
An epic is simply a long story/poem with a hero , doesn't have to be a god or demigod.
Although since those epics refer to human interpretation of TWCB in since 16/Desmond have fairly high concentrations of TWCB DNA, there are sort if the closest things to demigods, so it is sort of an epic, in a (very) roundabout way.

Also my last post was supposed to be my finished post, when I summerise what I'm trying to say, that means I'm finished, let it die.
Or in other words:
LIGHTREY
ლ(ಠ益ಠლ)

Y U NO LET ME FINISH!?

LightRey
02-11-2012, 01:20 AM
I meant significant ancestors, going back to the year zero would put the number of ancestors somewhere in the order of 10^12(?)

Remember the trailer where Desmond was banging on some Walls, and it showed complex structures covered in writing?
Cos I remember seeing none of that in game.

Yes those are epics, but not all epics are those.
An epic is simply a long story/poem with a hero , doesn't have to be a god or demigod.
Although since those epics refer to human interpretation of TWCB in since 16/Desmond have fairly high concentrations of TWCB DNA, there are sort if the closest things to demigods, so it is sort of an epic, in a (very) roundabout way.

Also my last post was supposed to be my finished post, when I summerise what I'm trying to say, that means I'm finished, let it die.
Or in other words:
LIGHTREY
ლ(ಠ益ಠლ)

Y U NO LET ME FINISH!?

Desmond was banging on an animus wall and he was on animus island, which looked just as dull. The complex structures were all in the style of (if not actually in) Desmond's Journey. Besides, nobody said anything about these structures being part of animus island.

Untrue. In Greek mythology the word "heros" (romanized of course) means half-god. All actual epics are about such half-gods and the current definition still holds the sentiment of something beyond human ability. Also, S16 might not have such a high concentration of TWCB DNA. We don't even know if he even had eagle vision and being related to Adam and Eve doesn't really mean anything.

Congrats, if it's supposed to be your last post, then stop posting. Just because you say you don't want to continue doesn't mean I shouldn't respond.

itsamea-mario
02-11-2012, 01:28 AM
But I feel I have to defend and justify myself, just like I am doing now.

LightRey
02-11-2012, 01:30 AM
But I feel I have to defend and justify myself, just like I am doing now.

Fantastic. So do I. See the problem?

Acrimonious_Nin
02-11-2012, 02:51 AM
Fantastic. So do I. See the problem?
yeah i do, but do you see what i see...i see 2 people contributing to getting off topic for something so mundane as desmond this is about s16 so stop helping his posts go off track and be a bit of a team player please and keep it on subject or don't say anything at all. Thank You lightrey you know the rules better than I so why do you persist?

itsamea-mario
02-11-2012, 08:24 AM
Because he has an insatiable need to prove his own rightousness, all the time.

LightRey
02-11-2012, 01:28 PM
yeah i do, but do you see what i see...i see 2 people contributing to getting off topic for something so mundane as desmond this is about s16 so stop helping his posts go off track and be a bit of a team player please and keep it on subject or don't say anything at all. Thank You lightrey you know the rules better than I so why do you persist?

What are you talking about? We were talking about S16 the entire time.

itsamea-mario
02-11-2012, 01:31 PM
And how I think they cut his storyline too short.
And lightrey I'd trying to argue against my opinion.

This is relevant.

Acrimonious_Nin
02-11-2012, 08:26 PM
well then lol my bad haha

natsuto
02-15-2012, 03:25 AM
In fact, the ACR, he really just an animus theme. Indeed, he knew how to find the relationship between a synchronous and how to "survive" there is no hostility in the body, but he is.

Acrimonious_Nin
02-15-2012, 04:52 AM
In fact, the ACR, he really just an animus theme. Indeed, he knew how to find the relationship between a synchronous and how to "survive" there is no hostility in the body, but he is.
could you rephrase that please i did not understand
https://encrypted-tbn3.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcSpW_rdaFp6OJw3vJOVie4nXgNmCzeEX 7agcPsd69szoZ8uzeNJUQ