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glenndeweirdt
07-20-2005, 07:53 PM
Am I nuts or is everybody cheating online? How does an A2M zero get outturned and outclimbed by an F4F? What gives here, I can't stay alive two minutes and I have been playing flightsims since the original "Red Baron" came out in the 80's. Please tell me I'm not over the hill or just a sitting duck!

glenndeweirdt
07-20-2005, 07:53 PM
Am I nuts or is everybody cheating online? How does an A2M zero get outturned and outclimbed by an F4F? What gives here, I can't stay alive two minutes and I have been playing flightsims since the original "Red Baron" came out in the 80's. Please tell me I'm not over the hill or just a sitting duck!

Tully__
07-20-2005, 08:28 PM
Very little cheating, and what there is will cause obvious warping. Even then, most of the warping (sudden and impossible changes of direction, even allowing for dodgy flight models) is caused by lag and packet loss, not cheating.

While the Zero's best turn & climb performance is better than the F4F best turn & climb performance, their best performances don't occur at the same speeds. If both aircraft are travelling at high speed the F4F will outclimb and out turn the Zero (as it should).

I doubt you're over the hill, but until you learn the relative strengths of the aircraft as they are modelled in this sim you're probably a good approximation of a sitting duck, as the rest of us mostly were, even those who were old hands in other sims. In this sim real life tactics apply more than any other (though the limitations of the technology still limit the advantage of superior height due to poor target defintion when viewed against the ground).

F19_Ob
07-21-2005, 07:12 AM
I agree with Tully.

I myself was killed all the time by the aces online when I began with il-2 when it came, and I also had previous experience.
Now I'm one of the experienced ones, wich won't hinder me to mess up badly on occasion. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

A good advice is to always record tracks wich can be viewed later. This way one gets a better overview of the battle wich is unlikely from the cockpit.

There are several situations where a worse turning plane may outturn a better turning one momentarily by expending speed for a hard breaking turn with throttle idle.
Examples of a few other similar situations could be a fw 190 that may pull inside a yak3 momentarily when the yak is going at highest speed.
The fw190 cant outturn the yak in slow or medium speed but it has very efficient elevators at high speed while the yak become sluggisher in roll and turn until the speed decreases. many allied planes become sluggis at highest speeds aswell as some axis. The 109 and hurricane to mention a few.

Another typical situation is when a slow bomber turns out of reach of an attacker coming in with high speed. The opposit works aswell; A spitfire that has lost it's energy cant turn well and a 109 with slightly higher speed may turn inside the spit by doing a hard breaking turn with throttle idle, expending his energy.
This type of turn can't be done if the energy state is too low to begin with.
These are few of the resons why planes like il-2's may shoot down fighters on occasion and
also one reason for the claims that a plane is under-or over-modelled I belive.

I try to remember to give credit to the opponent once in a while since he may be an expert with years of practice behind him in that perticular plane.

I and my wingman regularly shoot down fighters in twoseater il-2's and yet it cant outturn or do anything better than the opposing fighters.
Our secret is that we use good tactics and fly high to increase the low energy level so we can maneuver for longer periods without losing all energy like we would if we flew low.
We also use the limited maneuverability and fire at ranges of 700-500m before the enemy is too close and can outmaneuver any of our moves.
The high rate of fire and the armament makes it likely to hit at these ranges where we aim at a spot in space infront of the enemy wich he must pass or is forced to evade. Most planes have armament and limited ammo wich only enables firing at closer ranges as 400-300m or closer.
On good sorties we have bagged a couple of 109's each and that is pretty impressive work for a doubleseater il-2, wich normally is a sitting duck against any fighter online.
Sometimes when luck is on our side we succeed in "supershoots" where we get 3 or more kills.

Lately this has become a personal hobby of ours, to try to use bombers as fighters. Sometimes it goes really bad though when there are lots of experienced fighter boys in the opposing team, but this agressive bomberflying has infact increased my life online since bombers usually only are the chased ones and not the attacker.

Well, a few of my personal experiences so far.
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

LeadSpitter_
07-21-2005, 02:35 PM
trim trim salabim.