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DallasOConner
03-17-2008, 02:46 PM
Hey, guys, I'm doing something of a personal study on the gameplay, mechanics, and concept of Assassin's Creed, didn't want to use my own opinions as number one priority, and so I have a lot of questions for everyone.

These questions don't have all the best and correct answers, so if you have a different answer, please post it at the bottom, I'd like to read it. Also, if you have any comments, questions, suggestions, or just discussion, feel free to post. I'm very interested in hearing what everyone has to say about this stuff.

The poll is for a study of potential concepts, in case you were wondering.

Thanks again!

lostassassin123
03-17-2008, 03:02 PM
Wow, such an awesome poll!!!! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif
Great memories(I haven't played AC for 3 months >.&gthttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
Good luck in your researches http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

blarson11
03-17-2008, 03:09 PM
i played through it twice, and on the second time, i turned off all the hud elements. even then i really didnt use the eagle vision all that much...

membernametaken
03-17-2008, 03:26 PM
Good poll.

I really liked the question about the navigation system. It brings up a good point. I didn't get lost but the navigational system with the GPS was too easy to use. I would have liked everything to be more involved... I want to do real detective work and have things seem less like a calculated point A then to point B type thing...

Too many things felt scripted and not living/breathing like I had hoped they would be.

Good luck with your research.

DallasOConner
03-17-2008, 03:35 PM
@ lostassassin123, thank you thank you http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

@ membernametaken, that's exactly what I was getting at. You took the words right out of my mouth. I don't know if having street names is historically accurate or not, but I think it would add so much a better sense of direction and understanding. And I noticed so often that in cities as large as these, nothing was extremely unique. All of the houses looked the same and it was really confusing I felt.

I'm very surprised at the results of the fighting tactics so far. I know it's too early to be making assumptions but I'm surprised that people are mixing it up. I mostly conformed to mindlessly killing off the guard population, I'm sad to say. =/

Thanks to everyone who's helped so far, wished me luck, and complimented the poll. I appreciate it =)

ThePheonix1030
03-17-2008, 03:40 PM
Hm, now that you mentioned it, leading the scholars would've been a good advantage. They always seem to walk in circles.

DallasOConner
03-17-2008, 03:46 PM
Yeah, they have a set route.

Usually the only reason to save a scholar from the guards is because his buddies will get you into an area that is normally restricted, like the church in Jerusalem so you can eavesdrop on that conversation about Talal going all Robin Hood on everyone.

DallasOConner
03-17-2008, 10:37 PM
Ah, I knew I should've waited to post these polls. I thought of more questions and I don't want to add them or it'll reset my results in progress =/

Has to do with more fight mechanic questions and ladders...

Does anyone know if there is a way to write a poll into a reply?

adarwinter
03-18-2008, 02:04 AM
hey dallas, tell us what the research is for?
why not? come oooooon. tell us tell us tell us!!!

here specific answers -

1) the cities are huge and beautiful and every area look alike. im afraid that mixing it up more wouldnt do that much good cuz it still feel pretty realistic to me the way it is. navigation is really really easy cuz u have a map AND a GPS and they are both easy to use. and when u dont need to walk down the street but can walk on rooftops how can u get lost?

2) most of the times it was easy to get everywhere and that is the greatest things about it - feeling like u have freedom and NOT like u r only climbing the way the devs wanted u to. on rare occasions i had to plan my jumping which was a lot of fun but still im glad it wasnt the case all the time.

3) beggars shmeggars. u can either push them, punch them or run around. they never bugged me. i constantly wished there was a money system there where i can buy new equipment, weapons and cloths and if that was the case than i would toss the beggar a coin. maybe he can go bug a guard.

4)i unly used it to dinf my objective but it is so useless im not sure why its there. is it really that hard to figure out that the ones with swords are evil? this game could have been better if there were more types of enemies. not just the city watch 90% of the time.
there could have been thieves, violent thugs (not the poor ones with knifes on them but only use fists. tough ones), a rival faction of assassins or whatever. if he game had assassins trying to kill al-tair by quietly trying to sneak behind him and attack him than this vision would have been a useful thing.

5) social stealth is a great idea very poorly done. the fact that u can "blend" by walking slower or sitting on a bench and become invisible is rediculous.
besides, when fighting 30 guards is so easy - who needs to blend. i love the feel of virtual danger and that i need to run and hide to survive. if these kinda feelings where in AC than social stealth could have been a bless, BUT when i never felt there is a situation i couldnt get may way fighting through it than i never botheres being socially accepted.

6) since i could always fight my way through (and since fighting is the only type of semi challenge this game has) i never tried to blend. it was 10 times more fun to fight my way through the gates or at least run past them to have a lil chase going on. what is the fun about pressing a button and watching al-tair walk by himself and past the gates?

7) tactics? - again - since fighting 30 gurards is so easy than i just stayed and fight. once every 20 battles i would mess up so much that i need to run away and so i did. mostly if i ran away was because i knew a could kill every one and i just wandered if i could, just as easily, out run them.
what is the purpose of the whole football comparison that ubi said the pedestrians are like walking roadblocks if i can just push them?


8) if u didnt notice from my last few answers the game was peace-easy. there was no other game i had wished would have a difficulty settings more than this one. i constanly cross my fingers that a MOD will show up for the PC make the guards more lethal or make the synch bar limited to 10 bars or something. the only difficult parts are the ones where ubi knew the game is easy to they threw 100 guards at you and disabled the run away option (the end).
the game was meant to give u the option to fight or to run. the idea is great! but in a game that is supposed to be tough enaugh that u would need to run away occasionally it's missing its point!

9) the fighting mechanics are awsome! some of the best i have seen and the most realistic ones, no doubt.
problem is that even though all the guards know how to do the same clever things al-tair can (counter, defense breaks, block and dodge) they hardly use those things. they dont block enaugh and they surely dont break my defense enaugh. i could abuse the block most of the time! its easy just to hold the block button down and the penalty would come too rarely and damage too little.
the only fun guards are the templars and the commanding guards but these guards show up rarely and the templars are not only rare, they run out towards the end of the game. and even these two are too easy.
i would most definatly preffered fighting against less guards that constantly block, dodge and break my defense than fighting dozens of morons.

other open world games like GTA or oblivion present a great veriaty of quests and side quests and i feel so sorry for al-tair that his job is so repetitive and sucn an empty shell.
also it is a shame the only enemies for al-tair are the guards while so many other options could exist too - getting missions to kill other thieves or assassins like himself. going to the kingdom to find a murderer and fight him. delivering a secret note to someone without being discovered. the possibilities are endless yet all we do is pickpocket, eavesdrop and fight the same kind of enemies... that are too easy at that.

pardon my english and spelling and i hope i had helped.

DallasOConner
03-18-2008, 08:15 AM
Well... if you insist =p

I'm basically trying to build a package of ideas of where Ubisoft did a great job, and other areas of stuff like that. Yeah, I've read all the hype lately that people have posted on here about how Ubisoft doesn't listen to us, but I think they listen plenty more times than people are saying they listen.

I know that there are about a billion other threads about what every single person wants to see in the next game. And I'm another one of those people. I have two very innovative ideas that in my opinion have much potential and would actually blend well with the options they've already got on the table, instead of turning it upside down, (like Warrior Within's extreme change in fighting style turned it upside down, for example).

So, why am I posting a poll rather than just telling everyone what I think should happen? Well, you know, some people might like it and others might dislike it, and sooner or later everyone will start talking about it and arguing about it, and it'll just become another idea that Ubisoft "doesn't listen to," and there'll be one small fraction saying they like the crowds and another small fraction saying they want to go back to light and shadows, as in Splinter Cell's case.

So, what I'm doing with the polls is, if enough people vote and if the polls go in the direction that I think they might, I'll tell you all my ideas and see what you think, and if you like them, I'll contact Ubisoft seriously about it. If not enough people vote or it comes out differently than I expect, obviously my ideas wouldn't have much potential and so I won't waste anyone else's time.

I have a few other ideas too, one of the more obvious ones being the question about getting lost in cities.

And the question about the beggar is seemingly easy to figure out that I was suggesting a money system where you can pay them to shut up and go away, but actually I'd rather not have a money system in Assassin's Creed. Sure, it'd be kinda cool to buy a better sword or a flaming fire shield that deflects Chuck Norris, but I don't want this to turn into an RPG where you can max out your stealth skill and run around like you're invisible. That question is actually for something completely different lol.

adarwinter
03-18-2008, 08:55 AM
when i think of a money system than i think of things that do not "max u out" but rather give more options. like COD4 or rainbow6 vegas.
having weapons that differ from one another by their weight (heavier weapon will make u run slower, jump less farther and grab on to ledges for shorter times), damage (more damage causes more health loss on enemies), defense (better defense means u get less damaged when blocking and your block can last longer combos before the defense eventually breaks) , durability (how long till a weapon wares out and breaks down) and price.
of course other things can be bought like armor(better armor which protects you more but slows u down and hinders the free running. light armore that protects u less but still allows u to free run just like now etc), gloves (for easier grab on ledged) boots (helps friction on ground for faster running and less chance of getting knocked over), more weapons (spear, two handed swords, bows, short axes, knives and dagger and crossbows) which all have kinds with different characteristics and each equipment is good for something else.
of course having these kinda of characteristics to a weapon requires more in depth mechanics to combat, which i have more ideas for but as u said, dallas, suggesting them will probably result in "just another idea"...

Robbinho1992
03-18-2008, 10:22 AM
Nice poll. I generally thought the game is good for a quit play around after you finish the main story, and doing jsut random stuff now, cant wait for the second.

Crash_Plague
03-18-2008, 05:48 PM
Nice poll, It was fun!

I especially agree with the scholar leading! At first I thought I could lead them http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

I really would have liked to lead them.

DallasOConner
03-18-2008, 07:22 PM
Well, imagine somebody who lives in a city that has no theater, so he puts up a poll that asks if people would go to the movies if there was a theater. Comes back after a week and finds two people are in favor of it and one person says they don't care.

Yeah, two people is majority of the poll, but that's such a tiny number that if he even bothered to take that to the guys in charge, they'd see no potential profit margin in paying a lot of money on entertainment when they could be spending it on something more profitable.

In another scenario, the guy comes back after a week to find that almost five hundred people have said they'd be frequent movie-goers and a hundred more have said they'd go occasionally. He takes it to the city and they see the money behind the numbers.

If I get 50 people to vote here, that's less than a small fraction of the fan community for Assassin's Creed, and the potential behind my ideas might not be shared by the greater number of fans. But if I get something a lot bigger, Ubisoft would take it a bit more seriously. I'd really like to back up my opinion with a large number here, and if I don't get that number, I wouldn't attempt to share the idea because although I think it'd make the game a heck of a lot better, maybe a lot of other people think it'd be worse.

As for the beggar situation, I won't tell you exactly what I have in mind, but I'll give you my reasoning behind why money wouldn't work so well.

Imagine you're running from the guards. They're ticked off about another stall you knocked over, and up ahead, you see a barricade of beggars whose lives' purpose is to harass you endlessly. So if there's a money system, you stop and pay them all generously, right? Well, you'd have to stop running and pay every single one of them, and by that time, the guards have caught up and you're toast. And if Ubisoft implemented a button where you could throw money away so they'd chase it, that could destroy their button scheme as it is. So it'd just be so much easier to tackle through them and let them cry about it.

Okay, and here is that hint you wanted. The idea that I have would fit right into their current control scheme without changing anything at all for the most part. You wouldn't have to stop for the beggars, as a matter of fact you could press the magic button while running and the path would automatically be cleared, no people killed in the process, no innocent people tackled over, no black magic involved where you teleport them out of your way. And the better part about this magic button, it can be used in so many different scenarios than just for beggars. It's very context sensitive and extremely entertaining in my opinion, and I hope so in yours as well.

Well, maybe that wasn't the best hint, but I'd just hate to spoil the surprise =p

LaurenIsSoMosh
03-18-2008, 07:43 PM
Sorry about all the questions, I'm just so curious.

What number of people do you want to vote? And why don't you want people to know what your idea is? And this is just a guess, but is it something like a more sensitive gentle push system or an evasive/dodge leg maneuver?

DallasOConner
03-18-2008, 07:58 PM
I don't mind the questions, at least I guess that means I'm interesting some people =p

I don't have a specific number I want to achieve, but I'm hoping for at least a hundred, and if the topic gets that hot and people start really wanting to know, then I'll tell you all about it.

I'm keeping this a secret not because I'm scared of someone else stealing my idea or something like that, but I want to give this idea the best shot it has. Once I tell everyone about it, I don't care if someone steals it and talks to Ubisoft claiming that it's their own idea. I'd actually be flattered, and I'm not doing this to land a job inside or get my name in the credits. I'm just another fan who wants an even more amazing game, whether or not this makes it into the final cut. I'm keeping it quiet simply because I feel that letting it out before anyone is interested will make it just one of those other arguments that everyone wants to see in the game and the other everyones don't want.

The more sensitive unequipped arm button, well, you're in the right frame of mind but on the wrong track, I guess you could say. This is going to be something you can utilize in many different situations.

adarwinter
03-19-2008, 02:08 AM
Originally posted by DallasOConner:
I don't mind the questions, at least I guess that means I'm interesting some people =p

I don't have a specific number I want to achieve, but I'm hoping for at least a hundred, and if the topic gets that hot and people start really wanting to know, then I'll tell you all about it.

I'm keeping this a secret not because I'm scared of someone else stealing my idea or something like that, but I want to give this idea the best shot it has. Once I tell everyone about it, I don't care if someone steals it and talks to Ubisoft claiming that it's their own idea. I'd actually be flattered, and I'm not doing this to land a job inside or get my name in the credits. I'm just another fan who wants an even more amazing game, whether or not this makes it into the final cut. I'm keeping it quiet simply because I feel that letting it out before anyone is interested will make it just one of those other arguments that everyone wants to see in the game and the other everyones don't want.

The more sensitive unequipped arm button, well, you're in the right frame of mind but on the wrong track, I guess you could say. This is going to be something you can utilize in many different situations.

u r right about not letting ppl know about your idea. u SHOULD keep this wrapped until u think it is time to tell your thoughts. becase of that reason i will not even try and guess your idea nor offer my own idea, which might be just as good but all this discusion should take place in the same thread where YOU will post your original thought.

good luck.

DallasOConner
03-19-2008, 03:23 AM
Well, if you don't want to say your own ideas, you don't have to, but everyone here is very welcome to talk about ideas they'd like to see, relating to the questions I've posted, like navigation systems for example.

Reading what everyone wants will be really useful to me, and peoples' suggestions and improvements to my ideas help a lot too, as long as it's constructive criticism =p

Oh, and guessing, I'm all for it, but if someone guesses it right, I'll probably give up my career chances in intelligence, seeing how I'm the worst with keeping something quiet...

adarwinter
03-19-2008, 09:32 AM
dallas, u said something about more question regarding the combat. since i am one of those who really love the combat mechanics but deeply disapointed with the combat itself i have much to say (as it can be read on the boards of the last month). i wouldnt mind at all if u start a new thread with more question in a form of a poll but -
A) i am no forum moderator.
B) it might take away from the focus of this thread.

u can also make another post in this thread with questions in bold so it will be easy for ppl to see and i guess most of us will be happy to answer. but this will be harder to follow (since u cant make another poll as an inside reply) and it will be harder for ppl to come across these questions.

DallasOConner
03-19-2008, 09:30 PM
Well, the focus on this thread has kinda dropped anyway lol.

A hundred was a little overshot, I guess. I'm thinking of what to do next, probably going to wrap this up in the next few votes and record the results, then spend awhile comparing answers, thinking of improvements or alternatives, and then refer it to Ubi.

I was extremely impressed that most people didn't have any trouble climbing. I guess it's just my bad luck that I always pick the wrong part of the wall to climb...

adarwinter
03-20-2008, 06:05 AM
u had issues with getting to roof tops?
pffft. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

the climbing was one of the only aspects of the game i felt that actually almost made it to its full potential.