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Xaviercarier
10-11-2006, 01:16 PM
the limit in QM builder is 16 planes/side,
this is historically seen very few.
Also with the missions (single and campaign), the number of aircraft is always very low.
Is there a solution for it? normally 100 planes lying at the same time was normal, in Il2 10 is very much...

Xaviercarier
10-11-2006, 01:16 PM
the limit in QM builder is 16 planes/side,
this is historically seen very few.
Also with the missions (single and campaign), the number of aircraft is always very low.
Is there a solution for it? normally 100 planes lying at the same time was normal, in Il2 10 is very much...

blit_ZEN
10-11-2006, 02:16 PM
The stock missions & mission generator are a bit dull.

try lowengrins Dynamic Campaign Generator, i am currently flying an Ardennes campaign & usually have 20-30 a/c per side in each mission.

http://www.lowengrin.com/news.php

this little gem can generate many more varied missions/campaigns than the stock missions.

Also check out Uberdemons quick mission generator, this thing really fills up the world with a/c & still & moving objects.

http://www.uberdemon.com/

The best missions are made by hand & many are available, look up mission for the day, there are many places to find good mission/campaigns.

http://www.airwarfare.com/Sims/IL2/il2_main.htm

http://www.netwings.org/

check simhq & here for indispensible IL-2 links, good luck & have fun.

BTW with more than 35-40 a/c my P4-2.4 gig starts dogging, with an A-64 (1.8gig oc to 2.1gig) w/2gigs of ram & XT850PE i can put about 60 planes b4 it becomes a slide show.

both progs are a bit 2 learn but well worth the effort.

Skycat_2
10-11-2006, 03:16 PM
You're basing your opinion on the Quick Mission Builder? That's just an extra feature that allows you to set up some quicky dogfights and try out various planes.

Also, be careful what you wish for. This sim can now theoretically handle 64 vs. 64 planes I think, but good luck finding a computer that can run half that number without choking on the AI routines.

Chuck_Older
10-11-2006, 04:03 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Xaviercarier:
the limit in QM builder is 16 planes/side,
this is historically seen very few.
Also with the missions (single and campaign), the number of aircraft is always very low.
Is there a solution for it? normally 100 planes lying at the same time was normal, in Il2 10 is very much... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, the QMB is not very historically viable http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

QMB is not intended to give an historic encounter in the first place

Your PC might have trouble with for instance 100 bombers escorted by 30 fighters getting attacked by 50 interceptors

However, I have had quite good success with say, 40 bombers being attacked by 20 interceptors. But the QMB will not do that

the campaigns that come with the sim are not much better, typically

That's why there's a Full Mission Builder. I and other campaign and mission makers can spend a lot of time researching and making detailed scenarios. We have no deadlines but the ones we ourselves make, and we go at our own pace. Currently I'm giving a campaign of mine a Historical and Visual upgrade, and yes, you will see in that campaign, 17 or your own planes fight 20+ of your enemy's aircraft. In some cases, I use strictly historical numbers- I simply look up how many planes fought each other

In others, I must cut back on certain planes sometimes, because of AI restrictions.

For instance, on January 23rd 1942, historically, 24 bombers escorted by 30 fighters attacked rangoon and were met by 10 P-40s. Due to the way the AI works, recreating that encounter will ALWAYS have the bombers and escorts "win", because the AI will not use proper tactics. So I must playtest and fine-tune the aircraft.

In that example I thnk I revised that to 24 bombers escorted by 9 fighters versus 10 P-40s, and then it was alright

Lots more to consider than strict adherance to history. if the Ai will not show the same behavior as historically was evident, then a rigid adherance to real numbers of combatants will skew the scenario. Such is life until AI thinks for itself and things like discipline and self preservation are modelled http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

VW-IceFire
10-11-2006, 04:15 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Xaviercarier:
the limit in QM builder is 16 planes/side,
this is historically seen very few.
Also with the missions (single and campaign), the number of aircraft is always very low.
Is there a solution for it? normally 100 planes lying at the same time was normal, in Il2 10 is very much... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Well the QMB is somewhat limited...its meant to be a quick and dirty method of building a quick mission. To me its fun to do this as its great for practice. The FMB (full mission builder) is where its at for creating detailed missions.

Nothing is stopping you from creating a mission with 100 aircraft in it...but it'll be unplayable on all but the very fastest machines. That number of aircraft requires alot of CPU horsepower for all of the AI and physics going on. Particularly once a battle starts.

Nimits
10-11-2006, 04:51 PM
I think (according to Oleg) the sim can handle (in the sense it will not necessarily crash) hundreds of planes per side. However, you would need a Cray to run it with acceptable frame rates.

vocatx
10-11-2006, 06:40 PM
Yeah, I've got two co-ops on my hard drive right now that are impossible for me to run. If I ever get a processor to run them I'll be on cloud nine!

One is a Pearl Harbor attack with at least two hundred aircraft and the other is a Battle of Britian mission with (I think) over three hundred aircraft. The PH mission is a total slide show with framerates never topping single digits. The BoB is better, but I can only run it stutter free at half speed.

Lots of planes are possible, just not do-able.

LEXX_Luthor
10-11-2006, 07:41 PM
For large numbers of AI bombers, it helps to turn OFF the parachute option, or the cpu must calculate hundreds of parachuting crewperson collison models as bombers get shot down. Its sad we had to wait until PF to get this option, and even then, it was made to simulate Japanese not using parachutes (at least early war), but as in so many ways, the community knows more than our often ignorant sim developers, as the best useful of this feature is making large bomber formations work better for all WW2 theaters. Speaking of "developers"...

My education course teacher told us about how he was principle of elementary school, and how he told the construction "developers" to wait one year until putting down concrete sidewalks, as the kids will show where to put the sidewalks by their footpaths they naturally make over the first year. In many ways, the kids know so much more than the old people (adults). But this guy was a rare item, and of course he had alot of problems fighting the school buearacracy. He told us about when he was in the infantry in WW2 (West Europe), he met an 8 year old German girl, a dedicated Nazi, as one example of the ways adults can brainwash children.

Chivas
10-11-2006, 09:09 PM
I just set up a interception of 100 Ju88's by 80 Spit V over Servastopol. The fight ended around Saki. I shot down 3 ju88 before have to land with a shot up engine at Saki.

Average 50+ frames...I did notice a couple of stutters but nothing that was bothersome. This on Perfect with a 2.13 gig cpu.

zbw_109
10-12-2006, 12:37 AM
I would say its to keep it accesible to everyone plus the game engine is pretty old

captainbong1970
10-12-2006, 02:16 AM
put the line AirIntensity=High in your config.ini file, that will give you a few more planes

Flying_Nutcase
10-12-2006, 08:22 AM
I used to practice my flying skills in the QMB over and over and...well...over.

I had a feeling the Full Mission Builder was where I should have been. And after discovering it, i realised I was right.

Forget the QMB. The Full Mission Builder will let your creativity flow. Or use a utility mission generator as mentioned above.

There're some FMB tutorials via my sig and at airwarefare.com. Remember the FMB forum here too! Good luck. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://www.il2-fullmissionbuilder.com/images/fmb-tutorials.jpg (http://www.il2-fullmissionbuilder.com/)

foxyboy1964
10-12-2006, 03:41 PM
When I'm playing a campaign and finish a mission I particularly enjoy I just copy and paste it from my Campaign folder to the Missions folder. You can then edit it to your hearts desire or your rigs on fire, whichever comes first. Of course, if the campaign missions dont float your boat to begin with...well...just ignore this post.

Aymar_Mauri
10-12-2006, 04:56 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LEXX_Luthor:
For large numbers of AI bombers, it helps to turn OFF the parachute option </div></BLOCKQUOTE>How?

marc_hawkins
10-12-2006, 06:59 PM
easy answer go hither:

http://www.users.on.net/~mjtm/IL-2/ (http://www.users.on.net/%7Emjtm/IL-2/)<div class="ev_tpc_signature">

http://i35.photobucket.com/albums/d156/marc410/yellow15_1s.jpg
"... if anyone tries to tell you something about an
aeroplane which is so damn complicated that you can't understand it,
you can take it from me it's all balls." R.J. Mitchell

Gitano1979
10-16-2006, 03:31 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LEXX_Luthor:
...For large numbers of AI bombers, it helps to turn OFF the parachute option, or the cpu must calculate hundreds of parachuting crewperson collison models as bombers get shot down... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Nice to know... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif i'm gonna try...

Eagle1_Division
10-16-2006, 08:32 PM
I made a pearl harbor map that has the actuall number of planes that were there. None of the planes have player checked, it laggs to bad to actually play (; but surprisingly its preatty entertaining. There are about 170 planes in all, about the actual number of planes in pearl harbor (:

IT LAGGS LIKE NOTHING EVER SEEN BEFORE!!! I have a gigabite of ram and an XP, i have to set settings to very lowest to get acceptable frame rates