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GunnarGunderson
12-22-2011, 10:07 AM
Anyone remember in AC1 how the Assassins and Templars were portrayed as two opposing faction each with their own ideologies and both of them doing good and evil? And now from AC2 onward it seems the Templars are all portrayed as completely evil whose only methods of achieving their goals are killing and stealing from the citizens. And the assassins are some morally upstanding group who fight for the people and only kill the evil templars. What ever happened to killing the people you interrogate? In AC:B Ezio just let them go to warn whoever they wanted. And The Fall didn't suffer this, Nikolai Orelov had his interrogation subject killed.


What I'm saying is hopefully AC3 brings back the grey morality and casts the assassins in a much darker light and maybe the protagonist will question his motives unlike Ezio who was more than happy to murder anyone even remotely responsible for his fathers death (except the actual guy responsible) without a second thought.

(And even though this is unrelated, maybe a bit more realism, those parachute bits in Revelations annoyed me)

Lass4r
12-22-2011, 10:31 AM
I felt very different than you. In ACR, from Sequence 7 and onwards you get alot of the same philisophical conversations with your targets as in AC1. The game seemed to question Ezio's motives alot, for example when Manuel Palaiologos questions Ezio's actions in Cappadocia.

Same thing later when Ezio confronts Ahmet, who mocks Ezio and how quickly he accepts contracts and resorts to violence. These men never comes across as completely evil either, they both want to do what they think is for the best. I was not sure by the end if Ezio made the right decisions, which seemed to definitely be the intention.

ProdiGurl
12-22-2011, 10:38 AM
Templars & Assassins as Lass4 details it above,
to me, is like the 2 opposing Political parties in America.

They both basically want the same things, but both sides are convinced that the way to achieve it is in completely different directions. That's the conflict.

Serrachio
12-22-2011, 10:42 AM
Originally posted by Lass4r:
I felt very different than you. In ACR, from Sequence 7 and onwards you get alot of the same philisophical conversations with your targets as in AC1. The game seemed to question Ezio's motives alot, for example when Manuel Palaiologos questions Ezio's actions in Cappadocia.

Same thing later when Ezio confronts Ahmet, who mocks Ezio and how quickly he accepts contracts and resorts to violence. These men never comes across as completely evil either, they both want to do what they think is for the best. I was not sure by the end if Ezio made the right decisions, which seemed to definitely be the intention.

The problem is, the ideologies shouldn't have come so late into the story.

It left a void for what we were familiar with, so everything else just became confusing.

crash3
12-22-2011, 10:52 AM
ACB and ACR just felt like Good vs. Evil, we need to bring it back to how it was in AC1, the citizen werent supporting the assassins at all, the assassins were a lot more reclusive and hiding away in the shadows they had a Dark Knight sort feel to them-thats how it should be in AC3

Assassins also have too many abilities as well in comparison to their templar enemies-why cant templars be equal to assassins in combat?

Assassin_M
12-22-2011, 10:56 AM
Originally posted by crash3:
ACB and ACR just felt like Good vs. Evil, we need to bring it back to how it was in AC1, the citizen werent supporting the assassins at all, the assassins were a lot more reclusive and hiding away in the shadows they had a Dark Knight sort feel to them-thats how it should be in AC3

Assassins also have too many abilities as well in comparison to their templar enemies-why cant templars be equal to assassins in combat?
I agree with you on ACB;ACR, however was not at all a battle between good and evil..
more like a battle between Good and Good.

Serrachio
12-22-2011, 11:35 AM
Originally posted by Assassin_M:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by crash3:
ACB and ACR just felt like Good vs. Evil, we need to bring it back to how it was in AC1, the citizen werent supporting the assassins at all, the assassins were a lot more reclusive and hiding away in the shadows they had a Dark Knight sort feel to them-thats how it should be in AC3

Assassins also have too many abilities as well in comparison to their templar enemies-why cant templars be equal to assassins in combat?
I agree with you on ACB;ACR, however was not at all a battle between good and evil..
more like a battle between Good and Good. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'd say ACB was sort of Good vs. Evil, with the Borgia's behaviour, but that ACR was more "Majority vs. Minority" with the Templars having fewer numbers (so it's said) against the Assassin's established guild in Constantinople.

ProdiGurl
12-22-2011, 11:47 AM
I'm not sure about less Templar numbers in Constantinople because of Yusuf's conversation w/ Ezio right before Ezio goes to protect the first Den in Den Defense.
Yusuf said they keep them so busy fighting & that he can't be in 2 places at the same time.

It sounded like they were keeping Yusuf & the Assassins very busy ?

crash3
12-22-2011, 11:48 AM
Originally posted by Serrachio:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Assassin_M:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by crash3:
ACB and ACR just felt like Good vs. Evil, we need to bring it back to how it was in AC1, the citizen werent supporting the assassins at all, the assassins were a lot more reclusive and hiding away in the shadows they had a Dark Knight sort feel to them-thats how it should be in AC3

Assassins also have too many abilities as well in comparison to their templar enemies-why cant templars be equal to assassins in combat?
I agree with you on ACB;ACR, however was not at all a battle between good and evil..
more like a battle between Good and Good. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'd say ACB was sort of Good vs. Evil, with the Borgia's behaviour, but that ACR was more "Majority vs. Minority" with the Templars having fewer numbers (so it's said) against the Assassin's established guild in Constantinople. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Problem is that it just feels too much like an out in the open gang war rather than some secret war behind the scenes of history. The next game needs to have a more secretive feel to it with more questionable motives-why take a person's life? JUSTIFY for example

Inorganic9_2
12-22-2011, 01:06 PM
Definitely needs to be more secretive.


However, the whole "good" ideology of the Templars addressed in AC:R and I was rather pleased with it. Especially with Ahmet. There were times in AC:R where I felt like Ezio was the monster/bad guy, like when you confront Manuel.

rileypoole1234
12-22-2011, 02:59 PM
Well Ezio kills an innocent man in ACR, so I agree that Ezio is questioning himself, and maybe isn't agreeing with himself, if that makes sense. I think the conversations with the targets were more like AC1. I love the fact that not everything Ezio does is right this time around. Made him more human. More real. I hope the ancestor in AC3 is as real as Ezio in ACR was. In ACB Ezio seemed like he was just there.