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View Full Version : Might be too late, but here goes: LSO idea



Chuck_Older
11-08-2004, 04:56 PM
I just posted about this in another thread.

I read with much interest the original LSO debate here, long before PF was shipped

I never read this about idea though, and I repeat it here:

I think, I really think, that at my 1024x768 resolution, I could make out an LSO from 4 or 5 hundred yards, if he were tall, about 7 feet.

His arms would be another matter. So let's change the rules for the LSO a tad.

He is off to the left of the deck, about 10feet or so, let's assume. His paddles are out, and brightly colored

If you need to come right, he moves to the right, 5-10 feet.

If you need to come left, he moves to the left, 5-10 feet.

As you 'center' yourself, he moves to his original position.

If you are too low, his paddles go over his head

If you are too high, he crouches

If you are 'waved off', his paddles go over his head and flash from bright to dull

Also seems to me this could be done in a very economical way, resources-wise. And what does he do when you're not landing? He isn't there for anyone but you. To 'activate' him, request a landing. You do request to land, don't you?

This is not a very accurate simulation of the LSO and one that I am uncomforatble with on that account

But as concession to gameplay, I believe that the LSO being included in this form is less of a detraction from historical accuracy as is his complete absence.

Yes I can grab a wire without him. It's sketchy http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-surprised.gif

Chuck_Older
11-08-2004, 05:06 PM
I'm looking forward to input on this...particularly from somebody "in the know" about PF.

I usually try to shoot down my own ideas to see if they're worth mentioning..I can't really put a hole in this one

Sockeye45
11-08-2004, 05:11 PM
Not shootin' ya down, Chuck, but for me, if an LSO was there, I'd want his signals to be historically accurate http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

CaptainFlunky
11-08-2004, 05:16 PM
Hmmm...7 foot tall LSO...

http://onfinite.com/libraries/135596/f59.jpg

I'm sorry I couldn't resist. I actually think it's a good idea, and muxh better than the CFS2 pop up box. I just wonder if it could be implemented. I often wonder how real pilots managed to see the LSO

http://onfinite.com/libraries/132788/a00.jpg

Chuck_Older
11-08-2004, 05:20 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Sockeye45:
Not shootin' ya down, Chuck, but for me, if an LSO was there, I'd want his signals to be historically accurate http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

that's the trouble...but still, if I weight his presence versus his absence...his presence wins out for me

Jungmann
11-08-2004, 08:50 PM
Real pilots landing on a carrier could pull down their goggles and stick their head out the side over the canopy rails and guage the approach. I wish that could have been moddled. We got this sketchy seat raising thing which is neither accurate nor very useful, IMO. The LSO must have only been useful for giving the pilot info for the last few hundred yards of the approach when the high AOA wing leading edge obscured the deck, since he couldn't be seen much further out than that, 7 feet tall or not.

J_Weaver
11-08-2004, 09:45 PM
Yea, I always wondered how a pilot could see a LSO.

heywooood
11-08-2004, 10:10 PM
Hey Chuck...I agree there needs to be an LSO and to activate the animation with a request for landing is a great idea...way back in the original thread I had suggested using 'padlock next friendly' as a further method of highlighting the lil' feller. He would then be captured in the green triangle and padlocked to the pilot view..(maybe the green triangle could be removed and maybe not)..

As far as the LSO signals actually meaning something...that would be great if it could be done, but in my mind it is secondary. I thought maybe a simple text screen or a cut screen after the landing that offers an LSO style grade or 'rating' of your landing would be as good..

Making the LSO slightly larger than life was another idea I had posted there as well since the Devs seemed convinced that he would be too small and too difficult to see...

I am also interested to see if anyone at 1c will visit this thread and offer hope.

Tully__
11-08-2004, 10:25 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by CaptainFlunky:
...I often wonder how real pilots managed to see the LSO... <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

They use Zoom view (or close to it).


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by heywooood:
..(maybe the green triangle could be removed and maybe not).. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Toggle Icons keyboard control already exists and already performs that duty.

VF15_Muto
11-08-2004, 11:25 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by J_Weaver:
Yea, I always wondered how a pilot could see a LSO. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Quite simple ... the pilots flew at the carrier from abeam of the stern on the carrier's port side on crosswind (or 'base'), and turned gradually, and then sharply, into the 'groove' less than 500 yards from the fantail ... no more than a few seconds in straight and level flight before cut. So they saw the LSO the whole way as they turned into the deck, and after leveling out all they were looking for was 'Cut' or 'Waveoff'. This they did by 1) cranking up the seat before descending from the Hawk Circle into the pattern and 2) sticking their head out the left side of the cockpit after leveling out in the groove.

The IJN had a light system which told the pilot if he was on proper glide slope or not for long, straight approaches, so they did not need an LSO and thus did not need to 'turn' into the deck aggressively to keep him in view.

Here's how it looked:
http://www.vf15-flyingaces.com/images/approachingthegroove.jpg

S~!
VF15_Muto
http://www.vf15-flyingaces.com/

VF15_Muto
11-08-2004, 11:55 PM
Here's a real picture...

http://www.vf15-flyingaces.com/images/carriertrap.jpg

Look how good those Navy boys were ... the first plane has already received the cut signal and is falling to the deck in standard, "controlled-crash" fashion. A deck handler is already starting to run down the deck to immediately free the plane's tailhook and get the plane beyond the crash barrier so that the next plane, which is less than 15 seconds behind the first (you can see him turning into the groove) can land safely.

S~!
VF15_Muto
http://www.vf15-flyingaces.com/

stansdds
11-09-2004, 04:05 AM
VF-15_Muto is correct, the turning approach was developed by the British and adopted by the U.S. It is far easier to see the deck and the LSO using this technique. And I would not have wanted to have been a deck hand at that time. I wonder how many received the leading edge of a propellor in motion or got ripped by an arresting cable. A most dangerous job.

perioikos
11-09-2004, 07:06 AM
A simple text-based LSO might be an option. The pilot would know what all the signals meant,and outside of the graphics it's just a communications issue.

SeaFireLIV
11-09-2004, 07:17 AM
A little man waving madly on the deck would suit me fine just for the immersion, never mind whether I could see him close or not.

VonKlugermon
11-09-2004, 08:39 AM
If the LSO was to much graphically, how about what someone mentioned the Japanese utilized? I'm not sure when VASI (Visual Approach Slope Indicator) was invented/utilized but it's fairly simple. Red light over white, on glide slope. White over white, to high. Red over read, to low. If we did get an LSO, guess they'ed have to have lighted paddles for night approaches.

Willy

FF_Trozaka
11-09-2004, 08:52 AM
i remember the LSO in CFS2 .. little bugger would always wave me off, and i would always land anyways http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/mockface.gif.. so for me would probably be wasted effort. However, i would like to see working lights on the back of the j-carriers. carrier deck lighting would be cool too.

x__CRASH__x
11-09-2004, 12:46 PM
If there was an LSO, the temptation to intentionally crash into him would be too great, and I would ruin too many missions.


-I'm just sayin'

Nige_Reconman
11-09-2004, 02:00 PM
I didn't mind the lso in cfs2 i thought it was a great idea to have it in that little box.

DuxCorvan
11-09-2004, 02:10 PM
How 'bout having that Boston Celtics LSO blade-chopped in HighGore settings on?

Really, Chuck, it's not a bad idea, but I'd hate having a gigantic break-dancing freak jumping up and down with a pair of ping-pong rackets before me... I would just try to strafe him... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif