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View Full Version : ONLINE SERVER STATS....GOOD OR BAD?



9th_Spitin
08-04-2005, 10:55 AM

Udidtoo
08-04-2005, 11:12 AM
Are you serious? How else will the Uber Aces on here annouce to all and sundry that they are in fact uber aces?

VFS-214_Hawk
08-04-2005, 11:40 AM
Forget the kills, how many times do you return home? Kills are pointless if you lack the skills to get home alive http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

9th_Spitin
08-04-2005, 11:48 AM
Originally posted by VFS-214_Hawk:
Forget the kills, how many times do you return home? Kills are pointless if you lack the skills to get home alive http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

Very true.

Daiichidoku
08-04-2005, 11:56 AM
bad, stats do not reflect ANYTHING relably

a punk can take pods on a 190 anduse 5 lives to kill 10 wimpy twins...blenheims, for example...bail every time, and get 1000 points

meanwhile, another guy takes a G 50, takes on 3 fighters, kills them, and lands for 300 points

whos better, the 1000 points or the 300?

as the author said, i to believe stats does things to ppls minds, makes them kill stealy, or worse, make them scuttle away to land fo rthier precious points whilst a teamamte could REALLY use thier help


boycott points and stats!

kill/loss ratio is where is always been, where it will always be at!



speaking about bombers, why are so many so cheesy and cheap so as to go after what so many precieve as sitting ducks, the "easy" lumbering tgts?

bombers LAST on my list everytime, id rather take out the biggest threat first, a fighter

triggerhappyfin
08-04-2005, 11:58 AM
Good or bad?? Hard to say. They sure don´t mean nothing to me. Experiences worth to remember is what counts for me. Those are not measurable in any stats I know of.

rnzoli
08-04-2005, 12:28 PM
The option "BOTH" is missing. Stats are very important, they allow a numerical comparison between players, thus influence players behavior, and that can be a blessing and a curse as well!

Personally, I don't like the current stats provided by online servers, because they give in individualist focus.

On my little DS, the stats I track are flight time, successful landings and points, in that order of importance.

Another major improvement (I hope so) will be team stats, meaning that points taken by individual pilots can be voluntarily put in a team-bucket and shared evenly in post-flight stats.

With this, I hope I can see considerably more teamwork, because these stats will offer a way to collect points even without being an ace, e.g., by dutyfully helping team mates, escorting bombers, ground attack aircrafts, and bouncing all attackers.

VFS-214_Hawk
08-04-2005, 12:29 PM
Originally posted by Daiichidoku:
kill/loss ratio is where is always been, where it will always be at!

GETERDONE

THATS WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT!! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

I'll brag on myself here for a sec. While flying Aces High a few years ago, I had a kill death ratio of 52/1 while flying the A6M5 (early version) Most credits were F6Fs whele several were F4Us and F4Fs. Fly right, fly smart, kill kill kill.....and RTB! ...but I finally died http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_frown.gif

Atomic_Marten
08-04-2005, 01:13 PM
They serve no ther purpose than to

-make steal killers out of otherwise normal guys, if there is valid "KS" term anyway
-bring shame on cr@ppy pilots
-promote virtual aces
-give you opportunity to check some stats (facts) about your flying, and you can see where you need improving on
-encourage teamwork in some cases
-encourage 'serious' flying in some cases

Well that's pretty much it. IMO.

JG54_Arnie
08-04-2005, 01:33 PM
Bad, bad, bad, bad. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

Stats can be fun for a while, but in the end, I agree with what has been said about them in the posts above. I dont like em anymore. There is way more fun to be had when just flying for the sake of flying and having fun doing it. When flying for the stats it gets boring fast.

faustnik
08-04-2005, 02:10 PM
If people are having fun with them how can you say they are bad? If you are on a DF server, ultimate realism isn't your goal anyway. Stats are just another way for people to enjoy online DFs.

Stigler_9_JG52
08-04-2005, 02:20 PM
More information is always good.

But, of course, there are "lies, ****ed lies and then statistics". Any stats taken out of context can be detabed and misconstrued to mean anything anyone wants.

So, YES, I'd like it if my favorite server had my stats for me to compare against others... but, depending on the structure of the server itself, I could make different judgments on "who the statistics say is the top pilot". I might think the guy with the most "points" is best, others might think the guy with the best K/D ratio is best, another might favor the guy with the most raw number of kills, etc., etc., etc., ad nauseum.

VFS-214_Hawk
08-04-2005, 04:02 PM
If you are on a DF server, ultimate realism isn't your goal anyway.

WRONG!!

JG7_Rall
08-04-2005, 04:39 PM
I'd prefer team stats. but individual stats are moronic

rnzoli
08-04-2005, 04:54 PM
Originally posted by Stigler_9_JG52:
depending on the structure of the server itself, I could make different judgments on "who the statistics say is the top pilot".

Here lies one deep problem: there is no such thing as "THE top pilot". Top in what aspect? Most patient? Best shooter? Or has the most time to play day and night?

There can be many "top pilots", and the first thing before looking at any stats is to know what to look for and why. Or not to look at all http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Stigler_9_JG52
08-04-2005, 05:53 PM
Exactly. That's my whole point.

Some people make *any* kind of statistics out to be a bad thing. Methinks they might just be embarassed at finding out they might not be as far up the list as others in the categories they find relevant.

It's just information. Pure and simple. It's up to the invididual to value it or not; to attach an importance to it or not; and so on.

Lucius_Esox
08-04-2005, 05:57 PM
Good or bad?? Hard to say. They sure don´t mean nothing to me. Experiences worth to remember is what counts for me. Those are not measurable in any stats I know of.


Totally agree. My stats suck. It says I'm a bad virtual pilot,, I'm not I just don't care about who thinks I'm a good one. I know when I've done well and if the other guy is good enough so does he, and visa versa of course.

One thing I am excellent at though, enjoying the game in my own way.

Salute to to others who do the same whilst playing fair(ish) lol http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/784.gif

Mackane1
08-04-2005, 07:08 PM
You should know when a kill is yours regardless of stats.

1) When you've caused him to spew heavy black smoke.
2) When you set him on fire.
3) When you've stopped his engine.

Apart from blowing him up or sawing off a wing, the above three are all reasons to dissengage.
Let the "points junkies" come in and waste their ammo afterwards...it doesn't matter...you're the one who took him outta' the fight.

9th_Spitin
08-05-2005, 07:26 AM
Example, Last night on WC's I was in a B-25, left engine on fire, half of the tail missing and going down, I watched 3 axis fight to get the last shot in to get those coveted points for stats. It was so obvious. I was dead, going down on fire with half of the tail gone, they were close enough to see that and kept on firing. LOL. It was funny to watch.

neural_dream
08-05-2005, 02:41 PM
I keep a personal logbook of all my online flight time and decide myself whether i got a kill or no. I also write down a line about why i think i got killed.

the only statistical thing that i find really interesting and can't measure myself is the %air shots accuracy or whatever is its name.

VFA-25_Peckens
08-05-2005, 02:51 PM
i really dont like stats just because of the kill stealing even though it should be about staying alive with your squad rather than getting kills, otherwise i think u should only get points for killing ground targets cause u really cant kill steal ground targets

tHeBaLrOgRoCkS
08-05-2005, 03:39 PM
Worst thing Oleg ever did in Il2 was introduce a score system. If your team is dead then guess what you lost if your alive your wining

RedDeth
08-05-2005, 09:11 PM
killstealing is due to stats???


WHAT ARE YOU INSANE??????

killstealing was always to jack up your in game score.

now that you have stats the moderators kick every kill stealer instantly.

or more often now than before stats were available.

kill stealing has always been a problem and it NEVER increased when stats started. to state otherwise is just sheer mental rambling.

9th_Spitin
08-05-2005, 10:37 PM
I a m not saying it is due to Stats, but it does increase when stats are involved. For you to say that it NEVER increased when stats started is sheer mental rambling.

faustnik
08-05-2005, 10:47 PM
kill stealing has always been a problem

That's for sure! RedDeth has it right.

Weren't those real WW2 fighter pilots into stats? Seems to me a good kill/death ratio was pretty high on their list of priorities. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Monson74
08-06-2005, 07:24 AM
Stats are just fine but some people get addicted. Personally I think it's fun to see how well/bad I'm doing & it encourages me to try to stay alive. I fly almost exclusively on the Warclouds WF server & I think the "Streak"-feature is very nice - not that I rank very high myself but I've never claimed to be an ace. Live & let live - if you don't like stats don't look at them. As for the kill stealing - it has always been a problem & always will be stats or not - because some people can't get enough.

Serpentmaster09
08-06-2005, 07:49 AM
I cant stand stats either. They only serve to pad the egos of the uberplane set. Lets jump in the fastest plane with the biggest one-hit-wonder weapon and weeeeeeee I'm Joe-Ace-Pilot. Man I am real good just read my stats. The newesr phenom is the sig with your stats plastered on them so that everyone can see how good you think you are. Sooooooooo Cheesy

x__CRASH__x
08-06-2005, 08:10 AM
I agree that stats haven't caused kill stealing. Nor do I believe that they increase kill stealing. Spitin', what you described is just normal online DF server behavior. It's seen all the time. Usually the people involved are not on organized comms, and aren't working as a group.

For example, on War Clouds last night. I was in a bf-110 attacking trucks in a city. I was attcked by a Spitfire. He took some shots and pulled away, he was followed by a Mustang, who took some shots and pulled away, followed by a spitfire who finished me off. Was that kill stealing? Heck no! That was an organized attack until the target was down. How do I know? Because each fighter only stayed on my 6 for a brief moment to add his ammo to my skin without losing precious E. Who was this organized group? It was the 9th, who had been plaguing me at the city all evening.
How does kill stealing look? Well, all 3 of thos fighters would be hovering around jockying for position trying to get in the shot. Not waiting their turn and moving away.
It's not the stats that do this. Its just the mentality. If you are in a squad, or even just on Red or Blue comms on War Clouds, you are on a team working for a goal. Thats the big difference between the two.

If anything, I'd say stats actually calm you down and make you fly smarter. If you are paying attention to your stats, and care about them, then you are less likely to make stupid moves which risk injury or death. Of course you could then fly a bf-110, get shot down every sortie, and watch your stats go into the toilet... but who's watchin anyway? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

The solution... Have fun on servers like War Clouds. Use them to practice your organization. But for the real deal, fly coops, online wars, or well organized DF competitions (*cough*Ghost Skies*cough*) that will bring out the best in your squad.

~S~

9th_Spitin
08-06-2005, 08:39 AM
Originally posted by x__CRASH__x:


For example, on War Clouds last night. I was in a bf-110 attacking trucks in a city. I was attcked by a Spitfire. He took some shots and pulled away, he was followed by a Mustang, who took some shots and pulled away, followed by a spitfire who finished me off. Was that kill stealing? Heck no! That was an organized attack until the target was down. How do I know? Because each fighter only stayed on my 6 for a brief moment to add his ammo to my skin without losing precious E. Who was this organized group? It was the 9th, who had been plaguing me at the city all evening.


~S~

LOL, well, we do take a kill as a team kill, not a pilot kill. S~

But also last night I smoked a 110 (not yours), he was going down, I took alot of hits from him until I killed the rear gunner. I spent quite some time working on him and some unknown pilot jumped in front of me for 1 sec and took a shot to take my kill. It was obvious that the 110 was going in. I return to base with a squeeling engine, oil on my windscreen and no kill, he on the other hand got my kill and got killed soon after.

The 9th Motto used to be if someone blatently jumps in front of you just keep your finger on the triger, now that just gets you banned from the server.

x__CRASH__x
08-06-2005, 08:48 AM
Spitin,
As frustrating I know it is, its just a fact of servers that you have to rise above. Look at it this way... 9th is a good team with good team work skills. Thats proven. The kind of acclaim you should be seeking is from established teams such as JG27, who will quickly acknowledge your skills in the air. We've seen it and enjoy the competition. If some loner jack@ss wants to be stupid to steal the kill... well... if you "accidently" take his wing off, so be it! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

FYI: I think that was me in the 110 again. I was in the gunner position pouring it into you. I switched back to pilot to try to evade, and then you took out my rear gun. Eventually I bit it.

9th_Spitin
08-06-2005, 10:04 AM
Yea, I know. We have realized it is a part of the DF servers for the 6 yrs we have been flying on-line, but that does not meen that we have to like it...LOL.

I wish I had enough energy to stay last night and fight some more, but after 4 hrs of fishing and then flying, I was worn out. We will see you tonight for sure.

S~

Monty_Thrud
08-06-2005, 10:19 AM
I would say gamers care about their Stats and Simmers couldnt care less

x__CRASH__x
08-06-2005, 10:24 AM
Originally posted by 9th_Spitin:
I wish I had enough energy to stay last night and fight some more, but after 4 hrs of fishing and then flying, I was worn out. We will see you tonight for sure.

S~
Maybe we could set up a squad vs squad DF for kicks? Since Ghost Skies isn't going yet, we are itching for some good competitive fun. PM me if you are interested in putting something together.

Hoarmurath
08-06-2005, 10:43 AM
The problem with the stats isn't the killstealing.

But on these servers, it has become more and more frequent to see planes disappearing in mid air when not in favorable position.

Some pilots seem to do it to have a better K/D ratio.

I never saw someone doing this before servers stats were implemented.

x__CRASH__x
08-06-2005, 10:47 AM
Thats the death kick that does that. Not the stats. It was worst when death kick was at 1. People would just disconnect when someone was on their six, then come right back in to start over.
With WC deathkick set to 3, I havent' see this at all.

LuvBug7
08-06-2005, 10:47 AM
There bad! I play Ghost Recon Jungle Storm more than GR2. THe servers on there r bad as well. I hate cheaters and the lag is so horible.

x__CRASH__x
08-06-2005, 10:48 AM
Originally posted by LuvBug7:
There bad! I play Ghost Recon Jungle Storm more than GR2. THe servers on there r bad as well. I hate cheaters and the lag is so horible.
You do realize this is an IL-2 forum?

CannonFodda_99
08-06-2005, 07:46 PM
I remember in CFS2, online, the player who did the most damage to an aircraft got the kill. That would be nice here http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif.


Cannon

rnzoli
08-07-2005, 03:06 AM
Originally posted by CannonFodda_99:
the player who did the most damage to an aircraft got the kill.

No, this would not solve the problem of individualism.

Imagine a team of 4 guys. The first slighly smokes the opponent's engine, it slows down. The second hits its control surface, making it less manouverable. The third dissects the wing and the plane crashes. The 4th doesn't hit anything, he was flying above the others to protect them.

Awarding the kill to the third guy is misleading, because this was a team-work entirely, so all deserve credit not just one.

The stats I am working on will credit all team mebers with 1/4 of the points taken by the guy who delivered the final blow. Including the one covering them above.