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AllorNothing117
04-08-2009, 02:50 PM
if you were flying the Huricane (the 1938 one) how would you go about that? 1v1 or say, 5v10, 5v15, 5v20 etc

I ask becasue me and my Dad (deskpilot) have both been flying this allot and finding it challanging, me more than him to be honest. I think this is becasue we are used to much better planes. (p-38, Lag, Tempest, Spitfire 25 pounds etc) By "better" I mean, faster, better guns and fuel injected.

AllorNothing117
04-08-2009, 02:50 PM
if you were flying the Huricane (the 1938 one) how would you go about that? 1v1 or say, 5v10, 5v15, 5v20 etc

I ask becasue me and my Dad (deskpilot) have both been flying this allot and finding it challanging, me more than him to be honest. I think this is becasue we are used to much better planes. (p-38, Lag, Tempest, Spitfire 25 pounds etc) By "better" I mean, faster, better guns and fuel injected.

AllorNothing117
04-08-2009, 02:59 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blush.gif Also....

A "Jug" is a P-47 right...

na85
04-08-2009, 03:33 PM
You'd better be hitting at convergence in the hurri.

What I would suggest is shooting for the outermost wing panels as you come down from above

or

Doing a head-on and killing the pilot (preferable).

The .303's in the hurri don't have a lot of hitting power so the traditional "blow off the wing at the root" strategy doesn't work.

AllorNothing117
04-08-2009, 03:37 PM
Hmmmmmmm... Sounds easier said then done, but I'll give it a go http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Odirroh
04-08-2009, 03:42 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AllorNothing117:
...
A "Jug" is a P-47 right... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I take this as a question.

Right!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P-47_Thunderbolt

Odirroh

ytareh
04-08-2009, 04:07 PM
Definitely head on and kill the pilot.And watch the convergence.Personally I would never have mine set for other than 100m except in rare cases eh when ground attacking ...But this could be one of those cases...

TinyTim
04-08-2009, 04:54 PM
Like ytareh said - head on, aim for cockpit, or one of the engines to set it alight. If there are no fighters around, and if you are going versus one bomber only, I'd even suggest loosing some E prior to attack and attacking the bomber head on in a shallow climb with speeds of about 250kph. This will give you enough time to really pump him with lead. If you do not shoot him down, you're in trouble however coz now you're low, slow and behind him. It will take ages to set up a position for a new pass, be it a headon or bnz pass.

With all those rapid firing .303s you can also try killing the dorsal gunner first and then go for a plane from dead 6, but it will take a lot of hits to kill a He-111 from that position.

Keep in mind He-111 fuel tanks are extremely hard to set aflame, so you better go for engines or cockpit.

I'd use a 150m convergence for the job, and knowing that a good old Hurricane sports a 105 mil sight, I wouldn't shoot till his wingtips touch the ring of the sight - that's when the Heinkel is about 200m away. Opening fire prior to that and you are only going to waste ammo (with a 150m convergence).

Oh, and BTW, record the attacks and review tracks from different angles immediately after the mission. It will help you improve gunnery.

If you want, you can also use arcade=1 mode (just change the line arcade=0 to =1 in your conf.ini file) to se exactly where and when your bullets are hitting.

general_kalle
04-08-2009, 05:17 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AllorNothing117:
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blush.gif Also....

A "Jug" is a P-47 right... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

depends on how you look at it...it could be something else provided you share my line of thought... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

alphalvr
04-08-2009, 05:52 PM
im virtually living in this plane at the momoent, during qmb practise and also flying `hurricane season` mission pack by cobra427so

im sure the head on is the best way to go, i havient been very successful but will be trying that., the lack of speed makes more than 1 attempt futile.

im gonna try that tip of shooting further out on the wings as i had been trying to go for fuel tanks (waste of time so far) or engines (slightly more success) but rarely catches fire or brings it down before i get a bullet in the head or lose my elevators.

i really wanna excell in this 1938 original before i go for better stuff http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif

WTE_Galway
04-08-2009, 06:47 PM
The 38 hurri against Ace he111 is a great matchup I still regularly fly it on QMB just for the hell of it.

I tend to like to go solo as i feel using AI as distractions for the gunners is a bit of a cheat.

You should be able to take out one he111 with ease, two without too much trouble, but will struggle with more due to lack of ammo.

My advice is take your time. You do not have a huge speed advantage, especially once they dump the bombs, so its tempting to get sucked into a tail chase and get pinned by the rear gunner.

The optimal tactic for me is to climb 500 feet to 1000 feet above and to one side and dive steeply (stuka like) into one of the bombers and aim for one of its engines zoom past and then loop back up and fire vertically from underneath into the same engine or if fuel is leaking into the fuel leak. If you have enough speed overshoot and wingover back down for a second pass.

Once you lose too much speed break away and spend a minute or two regaining height.

If you damage a bomber enough for it to start lagging behind the formation ignore it and move on to the next bomber in formation.

mortoma
04-08-2009, 08:21 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I tend to like to go solo as i feel using AI as distractions for the gunners is a bit of a cheat. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Really, why? In the battle of Britain I'm sure there were lots of Hurris attacking 111s and similar bombers simultaneously.

Did the RAF pilots think this was a cheat? I doubt it, mostly likely they were probably glad all the gunners were not concentrated solely on them!! And I'd think that a lone Hurri pilot would not only hesitate to attack a stream of bombers on his own but it also would probably be frowned on by the top brass. It would have been suicide in most cases. Teamwork my son, teamwork.

woonks73
04-09-2009, 12:46 AM
the replies here have some very good advices....

Just my 1cent.....

in any dogfight, the key is to identify yours and your enemy strength and weaknesses. so, what advantages do hurricane MK I have over He 111?

MK I can outturn, outclimb, outaccelerate, outdive, outroll the He 111. This is good, because even at co E, u can engage and disengage at will.

What about weaknesses?

you got weak armor, only plywood and canvas, a few good shots will easily bring you down. your 8 x MG .308 are mere pea shooters to the tough well built He11l. you need to shoot up n close to do some damage, and shoot lots of it.. Hence convergence is very important cause u need to concentrate all the peas into one sweet spot.

Taking into account all the above, there is only one sensible tactic. High speed slashing attacks. Keep your energy and speed high during the attacks.

But isnt hurricane a good turning plane? yep, almost in the class of Zero.but against heavily defended bomber formation, TnB into the He111 six is almost suicidal as the rear gunner can easily shoot and damage your weak armoured MK I.

In short, it is not about the plane, it is about the pilot who knows what he is doing.....

Perhaps after He111, you may want to challenge Zero. It outperform the hurricane is every flight performance, having one at your six is almost a death sentence. Your only consolation is... zero paper thin armour made your 8 x MG .308 pea shooters seem like tachyon cannons!!!!

jamesblonde1979
04-09-2009, 02:38 AM
Head on, lot's of lovely perspex to shatter. The trick is to be fast enough to have maximum stability but slow enough to have time for a good squirt.

Take your time and set up an attack that leaves you with plenty of time to get the pipper on the target.

AllorNothing117
04-09-2009, 03:33 AM
"
I take this as a question.

Right!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P-47_Thunderbolt"

Thanks for the Wiki link http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif Why didn't I think of that?

"im virtually living in this plane at the momoent, during qmb practise and also flying `hurricane season` mission pack by cobra427so

im sure the head on is the best way to go, i havient been very successful but will be trying that., the lack of speed makes more than 1 attempt futile.

im gonna try that tip of shooting further out on the wings as i had been trying to go for fuel tanks (waste of time so far) or engines (slightly more success) but rarely catches fire or brings it down before i get a bullet in the head or lose my elevators.

i really wanna excell in this 1938 original before i go for better stuff Thumbs Up"

Thats almost exactly what my dads doing right now. "Living" in it. I think the trick is to fly fast enough that the guns don't get you, but also slow enough to get "a good squirt" as someone eles said... Tricky, but it sounds like all the same stuff I learn't to do in better planes so I think the problem is more that I'm strugleing with the plane, rather then strugleing with the tactics. It's just so damb slow! Convergence at 100m?!?!? Surley once you get to 100m your peeling off so you don't hit the target plane right? Or are you going so slow that you don't need to until about 50m in which case the gunners have killed you surely?

DKoor
04-09-2009, 04:56 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by AllorNothing117:
if you were flying the Huricane (the 1938 one) how would you go about that? 1v1 or say, 5v10, 5v15, 5v20 etc

I ask becasue me and my Dad (deskpilot) have both been flying this allot and finding it challanging, me more than him to be honest. I think this is becasue we are used to much better planes. (p-38, Lag, Tempest, Spitfire 25 pounds etc) By "better" I mean, faster, better guns and fuel injected. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Yo m8... I don't have a textual tips, I give you my tracks.
Problem is, on track is Hurricane Mk.IIb, however I find that it is essentially the same business.
http://www.esnips.com/doc/efa6...Hurri-vs-4xHe111-405 (http://www.esnips.com/doc/efa646ab-a81e-4ade-9201-58b51d5487da/KunaHurri-vs-4xHe111-405)

And here is P-40M vs four Heinkels;
http://www.esnips.com/doc/7bed...DKoor40M-4xHe111-405 (http://www.esnips.com/doc/7bed0e22-1bc3-4ed4-b270-f3ecfcdefa4c/DKoor40M-4xHe111-405)

Put them in your records folder. I hope you'll like them http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif .

AllorNothing117
04-09-2009, 05:58 AM
Thank you very much, I will watch these now http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

AllorNothing117
04-09-2009, 06:50 AM
Thos tracks were useful in as much as understanding how to attack from the side, which I definatly need to practice. That said, you realy wouldn't have got away with that in the Hurricanne 1938 becasue it's pretty much 1 hit and your screwed in that plane. Although I would be satiisfied if I could kill 1 without dying and you did get 4! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

I recomend you try the 1938 hurricane, it realy is made of sugar paper. That is, if your up to the challange of course http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif I will keep watching those tracks and trying it out myself to get better at attacking from the side.

Xiolablu3
04-09-2009, 01:25 PM
I think the Hurricane that the RAF used in 1940 was quite a bit higher powered than the 1938 Hurri we have which was used by the Finns.

FlatSpinMan
04-09-2009, 08:01 PM
This campaign has lots of intercept missions against HeIII's in a Hurri. You go up against small numbers initially, which can make it easier than massed formations.
http://mission4today.com/index...file=details&id=3288 (http://mission4today.com/index.php?name=Downloads&file=details&id=3288)

Once you get the hang of it it's quite good for taking down bombers. If you get the jump on them, Bf-110's are easy, too. 109's are hard though, I tended to evade and get some distance. If they insisted on attacking I'd try and roll away and take snapshots.
I always felt that a 109 kill in a Hurri MkI was a well-earned one.

woonks73
04-09-2009, 09:22 PM
I think it is this one. The earliest version of Hurricane.

the first Mk. I production machines were ready fairly quickly, and deliveries started in October 1937. They mounted the 1,030 hp (768 kW) Rolls-Royce Merlin Mk. II or III engine and were armed with eight .303 inch Browning machine guns. These early planes were rather simple, with fabric-covered wings, a wooden 2-bladed fixed-pitch propeller, and without armour or self-sealing tanks.

The Hurricane MK I in BoB is this version.

In 1939 the new Mk. I included a de Havilland or Rotol constant-speed metal propeller, ejector-exhaust stacks for added thrust, metal-covered wings, armour and other changes. At the start of the war the RAF had taken on about 500 of this later design and it formed the backbone of the fighter squadrons during the Battle of France and into the Battle of Britain. The first RAF ace of the war, Cobber Kain, flew the Hurricane with 73 Squadron.

So, Hurricane MK I 1938 is slower and as flimsy as the Oscar/Zero...More handicap to worry about. I think the Oscar guys may have some useful advice since hurricane MK I vs bomber tactic is not much different than the early version Oscar Ki43-Ia vs bomber tactic. Both are flimsy,and MK I has slightly better armament.

Yeah, this is fun!!

Boosher
04-10-2009, 04:54 AM
I know this sounds rather simplistic, but so long as you can get off a concentrated burst at the nose of an He-111 with the Hurricane, you should (theoretically) see blood spatters going off in the bomber like fireworks on the 4th of July. That greenhouse cockpit does not offer very much protection, and the eight .303's in the Hurri can do some serious damage so long as you can get a good burst to connect with the bomber's nose.

I'm not really saying anything new here. Everyone else's advice is the same as my own, apart from that: Practice, practice, practice!

Sillius_Sodus
04-10-2009, 11:32 AM
There was a video on Youtube somewhere that showed a Hurricane attacking HE-111's. The pilot in question attacked the bombers from an almost vertical dive and on every pass did considerable damage to the wings with a relatively short burst. The speed he built up in the dive allowed him to zoom back up and repeat the attacks.