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View Full Version : Higher ranked guards presence.



Sarari
10-29-2011, 04:38 PM
If you remember in the ACB trailer, Cesare ordered 12 Papal guards to kill Ezio and they all had spears. But through-out Brotherhood, we only see 4 Papal guards, not including the ones on the roof.

In the Revelations trailer, there were uncountable high ranked guards with spears trying to kill Ezio.

So my question is, will the presence of those high ranked guards be high and in a lot of your fights?

Sarari
10-29-2011, 04:38 PM
If you remember in the ACB trailer, Cesare ordered 12 Papal guards to kill Ezio and they all had spears. But through-out Brotherhood, we only see 4 Papal guards, not including the ones on the roof.

In the Revelations trailer, there were uncountable high ranked guards with spears trying to kill Ezio.

So my question is, will the presence of those high ranked guards be high and in a lot of your fights?

xx-pyro
10-29-2011, 04:45 PM
They all looked like normal guards to me in the Revelations (E3) trailer, although I could be mistaken. Either way, I don't tend to base games off trailers so I couldn't answer that question.

Sarari
10-29-2011, 04:48 PM
Ok that's fine.

SixKeys
10-29-2011, 04:56 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Sarari:
If you remember in the ACB trailer, Cesare ordered 12 Papal guards to kill Ezio and they all had spears. But through-out Brotherhood, we only see 4 Papal guards, not including the ones on the roof. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

There were definitely more than 4 Papal Guards in Brotherhood. Several of them you had to kill to find out the locations of Leonardo's war machines, one you had to chase down in the Aqueducts mission, several of them attacked you and Bartolomeo's troops when you went after the Baron de Valois, a few of Machiavelli's assassination missions included fighting Papal Guards and there was a fixed group of four or five of them that would respawn whenever you entered the inner area of the Vatican.

I do agree there should have been a lot more of them and they should have been tougher than they really were.

In Revelations there are two groups of guards, the Ottoman guards who are neutral towards you until you commit a crime (like most of the guards in the other games) and the Janissaries who are Templars and permanently suspicious of you. The two sections don't like each other and it's possible to sometimes lure them into a trap so they'll start fighting each other instead of you. To me that indicates there should be plenty of guards of both types to fight.

Jexx21
10-29-2011, 05:03 PM
that's wrong SixKeys..

There are the Ottomans, and the Byzantines (Templars). Ottoman guards are like the guards in AC2/ACB when you are incognito. Byzantine guards are like the guards in AC2/ACB when you are notorious. The Byzantines are like the Borgia/Medici guards of AC2, they'll attack the Ottoman Guards (Normal Guards) if you get into a conflict with both those guard types around, except unlike the guards in AC2, they'll attack the Ottoman guards on sight just like they'll do to you.

The Janissaries are NOT Templars, they are actually part of the Ottoman faction, but I think their AI is supposed to be like the Byzantines. The Janissaries are actually just very high-ranked Ottoman guards who aren't happy with the prince and that he's going to become Sultan.

Sarari
10-29-2011, 05:22 PM
I look forward to fighting the Janissaries. I hope we all haven't overrated them and they turn out to be as easy as the Papal guards.

Jexx21
10-29-2011, 05:24 PM
Well, there are supposed to be people who can't be kill streaked, and some guards are supposed to have bombs (that might just be in cutscenes though).

The Jannissaries should have everything.

Sarari
10-29-2011, 05:30 PM
I hope the Janissaries aren't the only difficult guards though.

Will they have the same type of guards in ACR? The fast ones, the regular ones, the Brutes, etc.?

SixKeys
10-29-2011, 05:38 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Jexx21:
that's wrong SixKeys..

There are the Ottomans, and the Byzantines (Templars). Ottoman guards are like the guards in AC2/ACB when you are incognito. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oops, that's right, for some reason I always get them mixed up.

I'm pretty sure there will be different archetypes of guards (Agiles, Brutes etc.), it would be strange if there weren't. Not sure if they've reworked them in any way or added any new ones, though.

Edit: Also, don't forget the Stalkers who can follow Ezio in the crowd and stab him when you're not expecting it. Personally I'm very curious about them.

Sarari
10-29-2011, 06:38 PM
That's gonna scare the living hell out of me when they come to stab me. When they do I'll be to busy crapping my pants to chase them :P

KrYpToNiC95
10-29-2011, 08:53 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Sarari:
That's gonna scare the living hell out of me when they come to stab me. When they do I'll be to busy crapping my pants to chase them :P </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well they said we will hear whispers just before they stab us, does this mean we can stop them?

Sarari
10-29-2011, 09:35 PM
Whispers? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

I might be 16, but I'm still a B-word when it comes to pop ups.

Serrachio
10-30-2011, 12:48 AM
Whispers are like a breezing, whooshing noise, which sound like a woman is whispering along with them.

They were featured in ACB's multiplayer as an indicator that your pursuer was nearby, although they were faint unless you wore headphones or had a good sound system.

InfectedNation
10-30-2011, 01:58 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by KrYpToNiC95:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Sarari:
That's gonna scare the living hell out of me when they come to stab me. When they do I'll be to busy crapping my pants to chase them :P </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well they said we will hear whispers just before they stab us, does this mean we can stop them? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I think Darby/Falko said that they will almost appear out of nowhere and do serious damage to our health, but we might learn a way to defend ourselves.

Hopefully it's not some trick to make us buy loads of armour.....

eagleforlife1
10-30-2011, 03:29 AM
In real life, in this period of history Janissaries were equipped with rifles, hand grenades and the abus gun (an early bazooka invented by the Ottomans).

Sarari
10-30-2011, 07:49 AM
I remember in an interview someone said (I think it's Alex A.) that as we progress through the game you'll be able to counter their sneak attacks. I'm guessing as Ezio evolves, he becomes more aware of their presence.

SixKeys
10-30-2011, 07:52 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by InfectedNation:

I think Darby/Falko said that they will almost appear out of nowhere and do serious damage to our health, but we might learn a way to defend ourselves.

Hopefully it's not some trick to make us buy loads of armour..... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I also wonder if they have different weapons they will use to attack us. The devs have said that some guards are able to spot Ezio from among blend groups and some can throw bombs at him. Maybe the Stalkers will be able to use bombs as well, or throwing knives, crossbow or even a hidden gun. I'm probably overthinking this, but I think it would be cool. In multiplayer, you can get hit by a throwing knife that came out of nowhere and it'll slow you down, it'd be interesting if that could happen to Ezio. It'd force us to be more aware of our environment and immediately start scanning for potential Stalkers as soon as we hear whispers, to catch them before they can surprise us.

Sarari
10-30-2011, 08:55 AM
If I here whispers, I'm climbing up the nearest building.

crash3
10-30-2011, 02:15 PM
Im glad you brought this up, I remember an ACB trailer that said how the purpose of the Papal Guards was to kill Ezio and yet we only encounter the Papal Guards in a few missions and like you said there are only four Papal Guards in the whole of Rome during Free-Roam.

And if that wasnt bad enough, the Papal Guards were ridiculously easy to tackle, I personally think that the Papal Guards abilities were what I would have expected from the basic militia guards, considering the combat system put in place for ACB.

Now hopefully the storyline will be so good in ACR that we dont care about the combat difficulty. However at the same time I really do hope that even though the combat system is the same, that the guards' AI has improved and that there are a lot more elite guards such as the Janissaries in the game to make combat more challenging.

I think more challenging combat will be a good way of making us play more stealthy as that is what assassins are supposed to be but at the moment, being stealthy feels more like an option instead of a necessity because the combat is currently way too easy

MAKE COMBAT HARDER!!!!!! please.

xx-pyro
10-30-2011, 02:28 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by crash3:
Im glad you brought this up, I remember an ACB trailer that said how the purpose of the Papal Guards was to kill Ezio and yet we only encounter the Papal Guards in a few missions and like you said there are only four Papal Guards in the whole of Rome during Free-Roam.

And if that wasnt bad enough, the Papal Guards were ridiculously easy to tackle, I personally think that the Papal Guards abilities were what I would have expected from the basic militia guards, considering the combat system put in place for ACB.

Now hopefully the storyline will be so good in ACR that we dont care about the combat difficulty. However at the same time I really do hope that even though the combat system is the same, that the guards' AI has improved and that there are a lot more elite guards such as the Janissaries in the game to make combat more challenging.

I think more challenging combat will be a good way of making us play more stealthy as that is what assassins are supposed to be but at the moment, being stealthy feels more like an option instead of a necessity because the combat is currently way too easy

MAKE COMBAT HARDER!!!!!! please. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Why would people want stealth to be a necessity? That takes away half the play style of the game. Some missions I like to be stealthy, some I like to fight my way through guards- I don't want to be forced into either option, and all 3 games have done a pretty good job of allowing me either option.

Calvarok
10-30-2011, 03:17 PM
People don't really want options to be taken away, I don't think. They just want their option to be a decent challenge.

thekyle0
10-30-2011, 03:36 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Why would people want stealth to be a necessity? That takes away half the play style of the game. Some missions I like to be stealthy, some I like to fight my way through guards- I don't want to be forced into either option, and all 3 games have done a pretty good job of allowing me either option. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Don't they already necessitate stealth by desynching the player when they're detected during certain missions? Perhaps it would be better to make combat more difficult so that stealth is at least the easier option if not the necessary one.

LightRey
10-30-2011, 03:41 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by thekyle0:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Why would people want stealth to be a necessity? That takes away half the play style of the game. Some missions I like to be stealthy, some I like to fight my way through guards- I don't want to be forced into either option, and all 3 games have done a pretty good job of allowing me either option. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Don't they already necessitate stealth by desynching the player when they're detected during certain missions? Perhaps it would be better to make combat more difficult so that stealth is at least the easier option if not the necessary one. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Not all missions are about stealth. Especially the mercenary-related missions are about all-out combat.

Sarari
10-30-2011, 04:01 PM
I usually prefer to be stealthy. It just makes me feel more........assassiny http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif

But if I'm in the mood to be a b.a. and make a dramatic entry, I'll just go in and kill everybody and slowly walk to my target.

I tend to make my gameplays as if they were movies lol. I know a little weird but I have my moments with AC http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

thekyle0
10-30-2011, 04:02 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Not all missions are about stealth. Especially the mercenary-related missions are about all-out combat. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Yep, and in situations like that where a combative approach is necessary to the narrative I wouldn't have a problem with them limiting the player to that playing style. However, not to put words in xx-pyro's mouth, but I think he, I, and many other players would appreciate being able to choose our own approach for the majority of missions. Besides allowing the player to make choices, they should tailor the difficulty of the game play to encourage the player to try other approaches by making one especially difficult for certain missions. I would at least prefer that to arbitrary restrictions like "You will be desynched if detected" or "You must fight these guards because the story says they find you." In my mind at least I see this system as encouraging the player to do one of two things when they're struggling with a mission.

A. Try a different approach.
B. Improve your skills with your initial approach by practicing in the open world or the training system.

LightRey
10-30-2011, 04:58 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by thekyle0:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Not all missions are about stealth. Especially the mercenary-related missions are about all-out combat. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Yep, and in situations like that where a combative approach is necessary to the narrative I wouldn't have a problem with them limiting the player to that playing style. However, not to put words in xx-pyro's mouth, but I think he, I, and many other players would appreciate being able to choose our own approach for the majority of missions. Besides allowing the player to make choices, they should tailor the difficulty of the game play to encourage the player to try other approaches by making one especially difficult for certain missions. I would at least prefer that to arbitrary restrictions like "You will be desynched if detected" or "You must fight these guards because the story says they find you." In my mind at least I see this system as encouraging the player to do one of two things when they're struggling with a mission.

A. Try a different approach.
B. Improve your skills with your initial approach by practicing in the open world or the training system. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I would agree, but let's not forget that AC generally allows for a lot of freedom during missions, certainly much more than most games out there. I'm all for giving us much freedom, but there will always be mission where a certain kind of approach is required and I think that's necessary. Some things need to be somewhat scripted.

iN3krO
10-30-2011, 05:51 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by xx-pyro:
Why would people want stealth to be a necessity? That takes away half the play style of the game. Some missions I like to be stealthy, some I like to fight my way through guards- I don't want to be forced into either option, and all 3 games have done a pretty good job of allowing me either option. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I want stealth to be necessary if you can't manage to combat properly (in ac1 that hapenned often in my first playthought).

The new guards are supposed to be even better then papal guards but ezio will still be able to touch them with a finger and they fall back death -.-'' that is just stupid...

Sarari
10-30-2011, 06:32 PM
Here's what I do when I wanna be stealthy. If I see a bunch of guards surrounding my target and I know I can kill the guard without causing attention towards me, I will make a stealthy move on him.

But if I find no way of being stealthy in any way, I'll just bust in and kill everybody. For instance, remember that bridge in ACB that was always restricted? Well the only way I could sneak past them was if I swam, or climbed along side the bridge. But that was boring. So all I did was go in and kill those guards.

Also, I've learned to accept the openness and freedom of AC. It gives us the ability to do whatever we want, whether it's being stealthy or not. Also, I hate the don't be detected missions. It really ****es me off when only one guard on the rooftop sees me and then I desynchronize.

crash3
10-31-2011, 02:18 PM
Dont get me wrong I am all for having options when approaching missions, however I noticed that someone wrote that being stealthy is boring so they just run in and kill all the guards, isnt that proof that the game is too easy?

Stealth needs to be harder and more intense with cleverer, more aggressive guards that attack on sight like in AC1 (remember the patrols of guards with their swords unsheathed?)
But also harder combat to make the player be more aware of the fact that they are an ASSASSIN not some invincible warrior so they need to be stealthy to avoid being killed

I think combat would be more thrilling if it was harder, imagine trying to remain undetected then you get spotted and you fend off say the first 5 guards but then eventually you get overwhelmed and are forced to flee and hide then approach your target a different way

That is how playing as an assassin should be!
give us a challenge!

LightRey
10-31-2011, 02:24 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by crash3:
Dont get me wrong I am all for having options when approaching missions, however I noticed that someone wrote that being stealthy is boring so they just run in and kill all the guards, isnt that proof that the game is too easy?

Stealth needs to be harder and more intense with cleverer, more aggressive guards that attack on sight like in AC1 (remember the patrols of guards with their swords unsheathed?)
But also harder combat to make the player be more aware of the fact that they are an ASSASSIN not some invincible warrior so they need to be stealthy to avoid being killed

I think combat would be more thrilling if it was harder, imagine trying to remain undetected then you get spotted and you fend off say the first 5 guards but then eventually you get overwhelmed and are forced to flee and hide then approach your target a different way

That is how playing as an assassin should be!
give us a challenge! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I don't think the game was ever about challenging people (and it shouldn't be). It's about the intricate story and the amazing gameplay (and the freedom of it).

Sarari
10-31-2011, 02:56 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I don't think the game was ever about challenging people (and it shouldn't be). It's about the intricate story and the amazing gameplay (and the freedom of it). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
This is true. The game is meant for a person to have fun, which is understandable, but as he said before, we are assassins. Not untouchable warriors. I'm not saying they should limit our abilities, but they should at least make the guards and/or approach to be more difficult.

Now, since the game is to easy, I like to challenge myself with stealth. I suggest to anybody who thinks the game is to easy to be as stealthy as possible. It really gives that sort of intensity and focus to the game. If you're fine with killing every guard you see, then that's also fine of course! lol

LightRey
10-31-2011, 03:00 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Sarari:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I don't think the game was ever about challenging people (and it shouldn't be). It's about the intricate story and the amazing gameplay (and the freedom of it). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
This is true. The game is meant for a person to have fun, which is understandable, but as he said before, we are assassins. Not untouchable warriors. I'm not saying they should limit our abilities, but they should at least make the guards and/or approach to be more difficult.

Now, since the game is to easy, I like to challenge myself with stealth. I suggest to anybody who thinks the game is to easy to be as stealthy as possible. It really gives that sort of intensity and focus to the game. If you're fine with killing every guard you see, then that's also fine of course! lol </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I generally do whatever I feel like. Most often I feel like playing as if it were real, which means I kill only when necessary and generally be stealthy. However, sometimes I just like to kill everybody in the area or sit back while my recruits handle everything. It really depends on my mood, especially when I'm replaying the game.

Sarari
10-31-2011, 03:28 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">I generally do whatever I feel like. Most often I feel like playing as if it were real, which means I kill only when necessary and generally be stealthy. However, sometimes I just like to kill everybody in the area or sit back while my recruits handle everything. It really depends on my mood, especially when I'm replaying the game. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yea same. Hahahaha I usually pretend it's a movie to make it melo-dramatic :P