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ACII_Addicted
11-22-2010, 02:44 PM
Now, to begin with, what i demand of anyone who reads this is that he completed all 3 games, and followed the story.

First, I read this conversation with the 6th sense in another discussion here, and then i remembered those words minerva(or whoever she was) in the final part of AC:B.

One of the two things i would like to mention is, and here is why i want you to have followed the story, isn't the sixth sense what the "Woman Narrator" of the Animus back in Abstergo told Altair during the introductory session? "The sixth sense your ancestors had or w/e"
In AC:B ending, sixth sense is somehow meant as "Knowledge" rather than Eagle Vision. Are these two possibly connected in a mysterious way?
Come to think of it now, Eagle Vision hasn't really been explained in any game so far...

Second thing to mention now, all people in the end of AC:B were from what we know so far, Assassins. While minerva was speaking, Desmond asked "Did you hear this?" And Lucy answered "Hear what?"
Why couldn't they listen to her then, and they could listen to what she said to Ezio back in the Vatican when Desmond was reliving the memory? Developer's mistake, or is Animus much more powerful than these "Who came before"? xD Who knows?

Hope i haven't been too detailed, thanks for reading, waiting for responses! =)

ACII_Addicted
11-22-2010, 02:44 PM
Now, to begin with, what i demand of anyone who reads this is that he completed all 3 games, and followed the story.

First, I read this conversation with the 6th sense in another discussion here, and then i remembered those words minerva(or whoever she was) in the final part of AC:B.

One of the two things i would like to mention is, and here is why i want you to have followed the story, isn't the sixth sense what the "Woman Narrator" of the Animus back in Abstergo told Altair during the introductory session? "The sixth sense your ancestors had or w/e"
In AC:B ending, sixth sense is somehow meant as "Knowledge" rather than Eagle Vision. Are these two possibly connected in a mysterious way?
Come to think of it now, Eagle Vision hasn't really been explained in any game so far...

Second thing to mention now, all people in the end of AC:B were from what we know so far, Assassins. While minerva was speaking, Desmond asked "Did you hear this?" And Lucy answered "Hear what?"
Why couldn't they listen to her then, and they could listen to what she said to Ezio back in the Vatican when Desmond was reliving the memory? Developer's mistake, or is Animus much more powerful than these "Who came before"? xD Who knows?

Hope i haven't been too detailed, thanks for reading, waiting for responses! =)

bsmith239
11-22-2010, 03:02 PM
This is interesting in that I just now realized the significance. Nobody on Desmond's team is a "True" assassin like Altair, Ezio or Desmond. They are like the recruits that Ezio invited into the order. Assassins but not of the bloodline.

This is why Desmond is important and why the others are not using the animus. I mean they could, and Shaun wants too, but nothing interesting happens for their ancestors.

Also, hearing Lucy say that might lend credence to the "Lucy is a Templar" line of thinking.

ACII_Addicted
11-22-2010, 03:21 PM
Minerva through the Apple could have also deliberately have her injured because of that?
But let's not forget that Machiavelly seemed as a traitor but really wasn't...

Also, none of the other Assassins can actually use the Eagle Vision, correct? Only decedents of Adam and Eve?

**** that story is so complicated and twisted!!!
So many versions could be implicated... damn ! xD

bsmith239
11-22-2010, 03:46 PM
Hybrids can use Eagle Vision but as Juno points out it is but a 'blue shimmer' instead of the truth or knowledge.

Theassassin4756
11-22-2010, 07:59 PM
Eagle Vision is the 6th sense as it lets the user gain much more insight to his surroundings.... look Altair, Ezio and Desmond can see things even without the slightest details of it.

The Full 6th sense would probly be what the apple alows Ezio and Altair do... See the Future.. 16 gained this ability but that along with the bleeding effect Drove him crazy... imagine being able to see the past, present and Future just by standing in a spot.

Abeonis
11-23-2010, 07:19 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ACII_Addicted:
Now, to begin with, what i demand of anyone who reads this is that he completed all 3 games, and followed the story.

First, I read this conversation with the 6th sense in another discussion here, and then i remembered those words minerva(or whoever she was) in the final part of AC:B.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It was Juno.
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
One of the two things i would like to mention is, and here is why i want you to have followed the story, isn't the sixth sense what the "Woman Narrator" of the Animus back in Abstergo told Altair during the introductory session? "The sixth sense your ancestors had or w/e"
In AC:B ending, sixth sense is somehow meant as "Knowledge" rather than Eagle Vision. Are these two possibly connected in a mysterious way?
Come to think of it now, Eagle Vision hasn't really been explained in any game so far...
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Personally, I am of the opinion that Eagle Vision is a watered down version of the "sixth sense" Juno talks about. To quote her: "After, when the world became undone, we tried to pass it through the blood. Tried to join you with us. You see the blue shimmer. You hear the words. But you do not know. WE SHOULD HAVE LEFT YOU AS YOU WERE."

This suggests that after the war and catastrophe that followed, the First Civilisation actively sought to pass on the sixth sense to humanity, but was only ever able to pass on the watered down Eagle Vision, the "blue shimmer" as Juno calls it.

I believe that the sixth sense, or "knowledge" was a gift that allowed the TWCB to know all they needed to about the alignment and intentions of those they looked upon, whereas Eagle Vision only shows you the alignment and provides hints as to what should be done (like an advanced form of instinct or intuition).

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
Second thing to mention now, all people in the end of AC:B were from what we know so far, Assassins. While minerva was speaking, Desmond asked "Did you hear this?" And Lucy answered "Hear what?"
Why couldn't they listen to her then, and they could listen to what she said to Ezio back in the Vatican when Desmond was reliving the memory? Developer's mistake, or is Animus much more powerful than these "Who came before"? xD Who knows?

Hope i haven't been too detailed, thanks for reading, waiting for responses! =) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Firstly, Desmond is not in the Animus, so that has nothing to do with what is currently happening. Secondly, Juno was talking to Desmond, and only Desmond, not Lucy, Shaun or Rebecca; as such, it would make sense that she would only want Desmond to hear her words. This also seems to be linked to Desmonds Eagle Vision: "You see the blue shimmer. You hear the words. But you do not know."

Twitched90
11-23-2010, 10:17 PM
The 6th sense seems to be knowlege but you are told you you will not know until it is to late so the 6th sense might not be shown until the end of the story.

RequiemDogma
11-23-2010, 11:28 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Twitched90:
The 6th sense seems to be knowlege but you are told you you will not know until it is to late so the 6th sense might not be shown until the end of the story. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
You are told that you will 'activate it' and that you 'will not know until it is too late."
Desmond activated the apple (his DNA communed with it) and then, when it was too late (because he was being controlled) he realized the danger of it.

As for who heard Minerva say what, It is said that Desmond is the one chosen. This is all for him, it's not really about him being an Assassin, it's about his bloodline.

Vaddix
11-23-2010, 11:46 PM
Her name is Juno. The apple is in the Temple of JUNO. Why is everyone so confused? She Deonst even look like Minerva.

EgyptRaider
11-23-2010, 11:50 PM
People please.
Stop mixing up Juno and Minerva.
The both look tottaly different... well not tottaly, but everyone can smell the difference.
Juno = end of ACB
Miverva = end of AC2 and at the start of ACB
remember and never let go http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

BAMB0
11-24-2010, 09:12 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">
Second thing to mention now, all people in the end of AC:B were from what we know so far, Assassins. While minerva was speaking, Desmond asked "Did you hear this?" And Lucy answered "Hear what?"
Why couldn't they listen to her then, and they could listen to what she said to Ezio back in the Vatican when Desmond was reliving the memory? Developer's mistake, or is Animus much more powerful than these "Who came before"? xD Who knows?
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

They saw what Ezio saw. It was a recording of what Ezio saw through the Animus. They could see the future and knew Desmond would see that message long after through the eyes of Ezio. Which was then recorded by the rest of the crew. Now it is speaking to Desmond and Desmond alone. I'm sure if they recorded everything Desmond saw during that time they would also see Juno and what she was saying to Desmond.

Coolgerb
11-24-2010, 12:13 PM
I wonder if we should incorporate Templar Vision in this discussion too?

It's basically the same effect, but there are a lot of things that confuse me:

-The way Templar Vision currently works, is that because of game balance (probably), or is it an even weaker version of Eagle Vision? And why exactly would it be weaker if not just for game balance?

-Is it real, or was it only putt in the game for variation? If it is real, then there are a lot of templar descendants of those that came before.

-If it is real, are assassins and Templars aware of each other being able to do this? Or if the Templars don't really have it, do they know of the hybrids' skill? And wouldn't there be hybrids who are part of the Templars, or not part of either side (but are aware of everything unlike Ezio in his younger years)?

xcamthemandudex
11-24-2010, 03:54 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by bsmith239:

This is why Desmond is important and why the others are not using the animus. I mean they could, and Shaun wants too, but nothing interesting happens for their ancestors. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Exactly, Rebbecca was a Prussian gunner. I personally think that somehow Ezio, Desmon, Altiar are decedents of Adam/Eden/Eve (either one) since in the second game when you completed the "truth" video, you see two people running through a building that also happens to be in a seemingly natural landscape.

*EDIT*
I think we will be meeting more assassin's in the next game(s) who will hopefully have some answers after watching the Templars.

*EDIT*
If I had to guess, Eagle vision and the "sixth sense" are one and the same. Even though Minvera (better known as her Greek counterpart, Athena) is the suppose to be all knowing, I do not believe that she knows of Desmond's Eagle Vision. As for Juno (goddess of good council), I do not believe she is a balanced and just as Mythology would depict. Perhaps Desmond is much more than just a former bartender turned savior assassin of the world... perhaps he is a deity, or a sort of demi-god. If I recall correctly, the "Ones Who Came Before," had mated with some humans (maybe my mind is making up memories). Perhaps Desmond was the final design of them... after all, they did say that humans where made in their (the "Ones Who Came Before") own image.


*EDIT*
Either way, both the goddesses have temples. So maybe these Temples which were mentioned in AC2 and ACB (were they mentioned in ACB?) could (most likely) have something to do with the gods/goddesses of several different religions/myths.

xcamthemandudex
11-24-2010, 04:13 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Coolgerb:
I wonder if we should incorporate Templar Vision in this discussion too?

It's basically the same effect, but there are a lot of things that confuse me:

-The way Templar Vision currently works, is that because of game balance (probably), or is it an even weaker version of Eagle Vision? And why exactly would it be weaker if not just for game balance?

-Is it real, or was it only putt in the game for variation? If it is real, then there are a lot of templar descendants of those that came before.

-If it is real, are assassins and Templars aware of each other being able to do this? Or if the Templars don't really have it, do they know of the hybrids' skill? And wouldn't there be hybrids who are part of the Templars, or not part of either side (but are aware of everything unlike Ezio in his younger years)? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Theoretically, it could be a side effect of using Desmond's DNA (shown in the cut scene in the first time you choose multiplayer) and the bleeding effect. It could possibly be Eagle Vision, but in a much more water-downed state until they train their Templars to use it and harness its strength.

xcamthemandudex
11-24-2010, 04:25 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TerminalDogma:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Twitched90:
The 6th sense seems to be knowlege but you are told you you will not know until it is to late so the 6th sense might not be shown until the end of the story. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

As for who heard Minerva say what, It is said that Desmond is the one chosen. This is all for him, it's not really about him being an Assassin, it's about his bloodline. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

So then he probably is a demi-god/deity or decedent of Eden/Adam/Eve.

RequiemDogma
11-24-2010, 04:41 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Coolgerb:
I wonder if we should incorporate Templar Vision in this discussion too?

It's basically the same effect, but there are a lot of things that confuse me:

-The way Templar Vision currently works, is that because of game balance (probably), or is it an even weaker version of Eagle Vision? And why exactly would it be weaker if not just for game balance?

-Is it real, or was it only putt in the game for variation? If it is real, then there are a lot of templar descendants of those that came before.

-If it is real, are assassins and Templars aware of each other being able to do this? Or if the Templars don't really have it, do they know of the hybrids' skill? And wouldn't there be hybrids who are part of the Templars, or not part of either side (but are aware of everything unlike Ezio in his younger years)? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
As far as this goes, I don't think it should be a factor, the Templar agents appear to be abstergo's attempt at using someone elses DNA to induce skill bleeding into a different user.
Also, while they were all assassin's in their own right, they are killed as part of the memory sequences. Their bloodlines have ended.

The last portion of the game doesn't suggest that there was only a single hybrid bloodline created however, and even then, Desmond only aquired the ability through bleeding.

Other characters who have the ability in multiplayer you can almost guarantee didn't actually have it, and are only there for variations sake.

Novice89
11-25-2010, 02:00 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by xcamthemandudex:
So then he probably is a demi-god/deity or decedent of Eden/Adam/Eve. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well, since Juno wants Desmond to awaken his "sixth sense" and find eve I assume that TWCB intent to revive their line. Maybe they want to (sorry for this poor word) breed their own kind again, so that mankind can stop the catastrophe. Just a guess though.

Regarding the Templars' vision, abstergo loaded the eagle vision through the mass of anima (i have no idea what the plural form of animus could ****ibly be ^^) into their templarbrothers and -sisters. at least the developer says so in the dev diaries, i think.

spookier
11-28-2010, 05:17 AM
Sorry, I know its already widely accepted, but I thought I'd share this from the AC1 tutorial:
"...Called Eagle Vision, this sixth sense allowed your ancestor to discover the intentions of those around him."

Proof that Ubisoft know what they're doing with the story. :P

ConnerJoyce
11-28-2010, 05:48 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by xcamthemandudex:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by bsmith239:

This is why Desmond is important and why the others are not using the animus. I mean they could, and Shaun wants too, but nothing interesting happens for their ancestors. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Exactly, Rebbecca was a Prussian gunner. I personally think that somehow Ezio, Desmon, Altiar are decedents of Adam/Eden/Eve (either one) since in the second game when you completed the "truth" video, you see two people running through a building that also happens to be in a seemingly natural landscape.

*EDIT*
I think we will be meeting more assassin's in the next game(s) who will hopefully have some answers after watching the Templars.

*EDIT*
If I had to guess, Eagle vision and the "sixth sense" are one and the same. Even though Minvera (better known as her Greek counterpart, Athena) is the suppose to be all knowing, I do not believe that she knows of Desmond's Eagle Vision. As for Juno (goddess of good council), I do not believe she is a balanced and just as Mythology would depict. Perhaps Desmond is much more than just a former bartender turned savior assassin of the world... perhaps he is a deity, or a sort of demi-god. If I recall correctly, the "Ones Who Came Before," had mated with some humans (maybe my mind is making up memories). Perhaps Desmond was the final design of them... after all, they did say that humans where made in their (the "Ones Who Came Before") own image.


*EDIT*
Either way, both the goddesses have temples. So maybe these Temples which were mentioned in AC2 and ACB (were they mentioned in ACB?) could (most likely) have something to do with the gods/goddesses of several different religions/myths. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
The truth video of Adam and Eve are from subject 16's memories, not desmonds.

Wind91
11-28-2010, 07:15 AM
subject 16 and Desmond are related, Altair, ezio, etc. are both of their ancestors. Only difference is that Desmond's DNA is supposedly a perfect hybrid of human and Ancient.

Also - Adam and Eve technically can be accessible by all humans since they are the starting point.

rawrsmitch
11-28-2010, 01:14 PM
What if this "sixth sense" has something to do with the negative side of the bleeding-effect? Someone in this thread said that the Apple showed the past, present and future. What if Desmond is able to see bits from the past. (What he now thinks of as an illusion)