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Grand_Armee
08-06-2007, 07:51 PM
OK...I'm sick of stalling....and even sicker of spinning to my death.

Now, I know a stall is caused when your wings are no longer providing lift. So, avoiding the low-speed-stall isn't too difficult.

But stalls at other speeds are happening to me like crazy, and I can't seem to avoid it. When I've an aircraft with forward slats, it's not so bad. Once in a while I get a stall but rarely a spin unless somebody's rid me of some wing on one side or the other.

At high altitudes, I'm almost helpless. No sooner do I bank into a turn then I'm gone.

I use an ST-90 stick. It's got quite a strong spring to it.

Maybe one of you longtime flyers can give me some pointers, because it's truly embarrassing to start plummetting from the sky for no reason at all.

Many thanks, in advance.

Grand_Armee
08-06-2007, 07:51 PM
OK...I'm sick of stalling....and even sicker of spinning to my death.

Now, I know a stall is caused when your wings are no longer providing lift. So, avoiding the low-speed-stall isn't too difficult.

But stalls at other speeds are happening to me like crazy, and I can't seem to avoid it. When I've an aircraft with forward slats, it's not so bad. Once in a while I get a stall but rarely a spin unless somebody's rid me of some wing on one side or the other.

At high altitudes, I'm almost helpless. No sooner do I bank into a turn then I'm gone.

I use an ST-90 stick. It's got quite a strong spring to it.

Maybe one of you longtime flyers can give me some pointers, because it's truly embarrassing to start plummetting from the sky for no reason at all.

Many thanks, in advance.

MrMojok
08-06-2007, 08:04 PM
Well, for one thing, the high-altitude FM in this game is a bit dodgy, methinks.

But what planes are you flying, and at what altitudes and speeds is this occurring?

Grand_Armee
08-06-2007, 08:07 PM
The worst plane for me to stall is the FW-190 at any altitude.

However in anything except the bf-109 ...like the Jug, the P-51...all of them at high altitude, I'm a goner.

MrMojok
08-06-2007, 08:11 PM
OK-- on the 190s, one idea might be to tame your stick settings down a little bit. The idea is to use a program like IL2 Joy Control (http://mission4today.com/index.php?name=Downloads&file=details&id=1021)to change the curves on your yaw, pitch, and roll axis so that they max out LOWER than 100. This way, you will not pull full deflection on your virtual stick even if you pull the real joystick all the way to the stops.

MrMojok
08-06-2007, 08:12 PM
For Jug and P51, how high of an altitude are you talking about? When it stalls uncontrollably?

VW-IceFire
08-06-2007, 08:45 PM
Sounds like your hamfisting it. The plane isn't to be pushed around ...you have to treat it with allot of respect. Full deflection on any control is not necessary in most situations.

You have to remember that you can stall a plane at any speed in almost any situation if you try hard enough. Never push your plane that far...always keep it under control. If its at high altitude you have to realize that the air is thinner and by the time you're at 7000 meters you need to very gently move the plane around the sky and don't bother about turning hard because nobody can. By the time you get to a 9000 meter fight you're balancing on top of a pin between best turn rate and stall.

Be gentle but deliberate.

han freak solo
08-06-2007, 08:46 PM
I've only spent high altitude time (7000 meters and higher) in the P-47 for any length of time in the game. The jug will definitely fall from the sky if you don't baby the controls.

The indicated airspeed is really low that high up, so I guess it's ready to stall even at cruising speed.

It definitely blows to fall out of the fight that you spent time climbing in preparation for. Nearly impossible to get back up to the bombers before they're gone after a stall/spin. All you can do at that point is pick up some low altitude scraps. Mmmmmm. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

ake109
08-06-2007, 08:52 PM
OK it might not be the answer you want but try flying the Me-262. Damn thing will never spin out on you at any speed unless you lose an aircraft part.

M_Gunz
08-06-2007, 09:36 PM
Are you keeping the ball (or slip needle depending on which plane) centered?

ImMoreBetter
08-06-2007, 09:51 PM
It sounds to me that you are not flying gently enough.

A plane can only turn so sharp. Pulling too far back on the stick can cause a high-speed stall.

Just slowly pull back on the stick to make a turn. If your plane starts shaking you're near the limits of the design. It takes practice to learn what your plane can and cannot do.

Waldo.Pepper
08-06-2007, 10:05 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">hamfisting it </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Bingo. Practice is the only cure.

M_Gunz
08-06-2007, 10:14 PM
Really if you fly with slip you do not have to be heavy on the stick to spin, esp in turns.

VMF-214_HaVoK
08-06-2007, 11:54 PM
Dont white knuckle the stick. And what are your sensitivity settings? Mine are quite high but I have been flying this sim for many years. From what you describe either your to quick and hard on the stick or your stick itself is not calibrated properly and is spiking. Above all this you are just going to have to practice more. I rarely stall an aircraft regardless of what I fly so the problem lies with you in some way not the sim or the plane if you were thinking along those terms.

S!

PikeBishop
08-07-2007, 04:45 AM
Has your joystick got force feedback......very good for 'feeling' the stall approaching.
Regards,
SLP

tagTaken2
08-07-2007, 07:24 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by PikeBishop:
Has your joystick got force feedback......very good for 'feeling' the stall approaching.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Absolutely . Stalls virtually disappeared after I got my MSFFB stick.
In addition to the above, another thing particularly at height, is elevator trim. I have it on a slider, which helps ALOT http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/inlove.gif The plane will turn a lot more willingly if its nose isn't pointed downwards, IMHFO.

M_Gunz
08-07-2007, 08:04 AM
It's better to turn nose low than nose high unless you're going for a wingover with no one
on your six. Nose slightly high turns bleed speed, the mark of a poor pilot. Nose low,
lose some alt at the start and regain later turns give you gravity assist.

buzzsaw1939
08-07-2007, 11:48 AM
Han Freak solo.....I keep seeing this kind of statement in here about the indicated airspeed, it has nothing to do with altitude or ground speed, if your running out of air speed, then your running out of power, and better get your nose down, you fly by indicated airspeed at all times. I'm still learning this game, but I doubt it's modeled that bad. I would qoute, but I haven't figured out to do that yet! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

DuxCorvan
08-07-2007, 12:51 PM
Spend as much as money as these sim fanatics, or deactivate spins except in FR servers. Unless you have a very expensive joystick and pedals, you will never manage them completely.

Control sensitivity is quite 'over the top' for short range and/or inaccurate calibrate-able hardware, and 'cutting the edges' in the joy setup may help you in normal flying but will render you a sitting duck in high-G combat maneuvers.

That's the truth. And please, people, refrain from 'real men fly with all settings on' arrogant cr*p. This is meant for fun, and those settings are there for something.

On the other side, being gentle may help a lot. FFB joysticks, while less accurate than the good non-FFB ones, are very helpful because you can actually sense the plane shake and flutter when it's reaching a stall limit, and that helps a lot avoiding the thing.

zardozid
08-07-2007, 01:17 PM
Flying with a light touch...

People yank hard on the stick and ham fist it all over the place, but the game attempts to model the actual fight characteristics of the fighter. The one kind of information it doesn't adequetly communicate to the PC fighter pilot is the effects of G-forces on the behavior of the pilot. In a real airplane the gentile angles one has to fly to keep from stalling his fighter doesn't always seem so gentile.

One of the things that bothers me about the AI (and said by others) is that the AI pilots fly on the edge all the time. Even "rookies" are pro's at this...

M_Gunz
08-07-2007, 03:04 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by buzzsaw1939:
I would qoute, but I haven't figured out to do that yet! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Reply with quote button is on the bottom right of posts in unlocked threads.

It's the one just left of the yellow triangle with the ! in it.

VMF-214_HaVoK
08-07-2007, 03:42 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Spend as much as money as these sim fanatics, or deactivate spins except in FR servers. Unless you have a very expensive joystick and pedals, you will never manage them completely. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Sorry but I completely disagree with this comment. I flew this sim for years with just a MS Sidewinder Precision 2. I had no pedals, no throttle quadrant, and no TIR. I was every bit effective as I am now. I did not stall more or lose more dogfights because I only had a twisty stick. And I only fly FR settings for the most part. All the other items are nice and provide more enjoyment and immersion but in no way will it make you a better virtual pilot. Your either good or you are not. I have seen people flying this sim with only a few months under their belt and be extremely successful online. And I have also seen people who have been flying this sim for 6 years who are almost as bad as they were the day they started.

I usually agree with most of the stuff you say Dux but this one is way off base man. How can you speak for everyone and know how well they can or cannot fly based on what setup they have? Fact is many of the online aces (at least the ones I know) only have a 40 dollar stick.

S!

Bellator_1
08-07-2007, 03:52 PM
If you've got force feedback you can feel the stall approaching, so back off when the buffeting starts getting excessive.

Pulling full elevator deflection in a fighter will result in a accellerated stall which is where the critical AoA of the wing is reached, the boundary layer seperating from the upper wing surface, but there's usually lots of warning in the form of buffeting before you reach this point. When turning you shouldn't emmidiately jerk into a maximum performance turn, rather gradually increase your elevator deflection until you feel you're at the absolute limit close to the critical AoA. This can be done quickly and safely.

buzzsaw1939
08-07-2007, 04:36 PM
Thanks M_Guns... I got the quote alright, can't figure out how to get my message in!! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_confused.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/35.gif

f.ip2
08-07-2007, 10:43 PM
Grand_Armee

I am quite new here as well and my few first take offs with the BF109 and Zecke where very fast a stall, spin and crash. 4 our of 5 carrier take offs were that.

Gentle Gentle Gentle. The game itself tells you when you reach stall because you can hear it from the wind noise and plane shake. at that point reduce elevator.

that did the trick for me. no force feed back needed when you do not want to buy one.

just independed rudders might be very nice because it relieves stress from you hands.


i fly a saitec pro and to be honest it sucks to have rudders and stick and guns on that one.

that joystick is pretty much a not very ergonomic stick because how much pressure and resulting hand shake it produces when you want to press the other buttons. and than to use the z twist for rudder is painful.

M_Gunz
08-08-2007, 06:30 AM
I am noticing that the person who started the thread has dropped his bait in and appears to
have gone to sleep, answers no questions after posting his 'problem'. Someone wanting to
get over such would be perhaps more active about it, like Birdy was with the same recently?

han freak solo
08-08-2007, 07:32 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by buzzsaw1939:
Han Freak solo.....I keep seeing this kind of statement in here about the indicated airspeed, it has nothing to do with altitude or ground speed, if your running out of air speed, then your running out of power, and better get your nose down, you fly by indicated airspeed at all times. I'm still learning this game, but I doubt it's modeled that bad. I would qoute, but I haven't figured out to do that yet! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't remember the differences in indicated airspeed at various altitudes in the game, and I can't check them out since I'm at work.

What I remember is cruising the jug on the deck was always about 250 indicated and up at 7000 meters might be 170 indicated (in the game). I'll have to try and revisit this tonight, if I can.

tagTaken2
08-08-2007, 07:50 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by VMF-214_HaVoK:
I flew this sim for years with just a MS Sidewinder Precision 2. I had no pedals, no throttle quadrant, and no TIR...

All the other items are nice and provide more enjoyment and immersion but in no way will it make you a better virtual pilot. Your either good or you are not.
S! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You're lucky enough to have a good stick to begin with.

I disagree with the "other items" comment. If you stuck two noobs in a room, one with FFB stick, TIR, HOTAS and pedals... and the other with just a twisty stick... who do you think would begin to kick a##?

So, you're saying it comes down to a knowledge or intuition of tactics?

This is true, but don't disrespect the gear. It can make a huge difference.

VMF-214_HaVoK
08-08-2007, 11:44 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">You're lucky enough to have a good stick to begin with.

I disagree with the "other items" comment. If you stuck two noobs in a room, one with FFB stick, TIR, HOTAS and pedals... and the other with just a twisty stick... who do you think would begin to kick a##?

So, you're saying it comes down to a knowledge or intuition of tactics?

This is true, but don't disrespect the gear. It can make a huge difference. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I have had newbies on my rig, friends of mine that wanted to try the sim. They done much better back when I had just one stick. Now when a bud sits down at my rig with the TIR, X-52, and pedals they are totally lost and confused. Its easier to learn the sim with just a twisty stick. And you missed the point, Dux claimed that your never gonna get it if you dont shell out money for a high dollar stick.

The fact is that I was damn good online with just a twisty stick and no TIR. I had a kill/death ratio of over 8.0 in ZvW server. Im not using this chance to brag about how good I am, but Im attempting to prove a point.

Also do you have pedals? I do and if I got them when I first started the sim I probably would have gave up. It took me months to get use to them. I know people that bought TIR and gave it away because it drove them crazy. It took me weeks to adapt to it.

And FYI when I started in 2001 I used a 10 dollar Gravis from walmart for months. Then several Logitech 3D pos. And then finally to the Sidewinder. I have only owned the X-52 for almost 2 years, the pedals for about 1 year, and TIR for about 6 months.

I just hate to see new pilots mislead in thinking that they can not be successful unless they drop a few hundred on sim gear. Its so not true.

And of course it comes down to knowledge or intuition of tactics. It does not matter if you have a 10 dollar stick on a 300 dollar one, if your good your good and if you stink you stink. The gear dont make the sim pilot, his/her brain does.

S!

birdy1964
08-08-2007, 12:56 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by M_Gunz:
I am noticing that the person who started the thread has dropped his bait in and appears to
have gone to sleep, answers no questions after posting his 'problem'. Someone wanting to
get over such would be perhaps more active about it, like Birdy was with the same recently? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Thankyou M_Gunz for your remark about my responces to yours and others who have offered me advice. I appreciate the time and effort people make to help people like myself, new to the game and lacking in knowledge. I would just like to say that I have had some success in reducing my stalls by handling the joystick with alot more finess but also I have recentley replaced my old stick , which broke, with a new one, exactly the same one as I had before a logitech exreme 3d pro and now my dead spot has disappeared and I am having more success. Thankyou for your guidance and I hope to see some of you in the air real soon, please go gentle on me if you see mehttp://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

buzzsaw1939
08-08-2007, 03:20 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by han freak solo:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by buzzsaw1939:
Han Freak solo.....I keep seeing this kind of statement in here about the indicated airspeed, it has nothing to do with altitude or ground speed, if your running out of air speed, then your running out of power, and better get your nose down, you fly by indicated airspeed at all times. I'm still learning this game, but I doubt it's modeled that bad. I would qoute, but I haven't figured out to do that yet! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't remember the differences in indicated airspeed at various altitudes in the game, and I can't check them out since I'm at work.

What I remember is cruising the jug on the deck was always about 250 indicated and up at 7000 meters might be 170 indicated (in the game). I'll have to try and revisit this tonight, if I can. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

After reading my reply to you, I realized I could have been more clear. yes airspeed will decrease with altitude, less dense air! when you say it can stall at cruising speed, I'm assuming your talking about IAS, because thats all you have. if you have super chargers, prop and mixture set right, and your speed is that low, your too high, and better get down. by your IAS, your stall will be the same at any altitude, not counting high speed stalls, which as you know, can happen by sudden change in angle of attack. I hope that makes more sense.

Good hunting! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

M_Gunz
08-08-2007, 06:51 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by han freak solo:
What I remember is cruising the jug on the deck was always about 250 indicated and up at 7000 meters might be 170 indicated (in the game). I'll have to try and revisit this tonight, if I can. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You are going by the MPH guage and maybe have the speedbar reading MPH as well?

One big change in this series is the default speedbar reads KPH which really can throw new
players used to sims showing MPH or Knots, I know it took me a while to change. Glance down
at the speedbar and be thinking that 300 means good and fast but in KPH it is about 190 MPH
which is slow esp for the higher wingloaded planes. Have to get used to the numbers alone
meaning different, I'd get my yucks reading posts of people thinking they could pull hard
at 300 kph in turns where under 340 is close to stall.

M_Gunz
08-08-2007, 07:55 PM
Anybody can do this. Without combat take a plane to good alt and get over 400kph even if a
slight dive is needed. Set view able to watch and begin a turn hard enough to slow you down.
Keep the ball centered by ruddering toward the ball when it is not centered and drop the nose
enough to be slowing down not quickly but still you slow down to edge of stall, slightly into
stall, nosing down just enough to keep that speed long enough you have stable condition.
Always being gentle. Always keeping the ball centered.
Now ease up on rudder so the ball leaves center and see what happens.

Stall does not mean zero lift until the stall is greatly deep.
In stall your Drag to Lift ratio increases HUGELY but you still have loads of Lift.

In stall it is possible to have some degree of control, especially for loosening stick directions.

In stall, using side stick WILL cause one wing to stall more and the other to possibly leave
stall which will impart strong spin to your plane as one wing will have much less drag.

Use rudder only to keep level when going very slow. Drop the nose to gain speed. Even adding
massive power near stall is a rookie mistake, the torque will overcome the wings and tail while
p-factor will add slip unless you're quick on the rudder.

Some of you guys seem to think that flying is about as complicated as driving an automatic on
perhaps a wet road. There is more to it and without knowing the basics you will always have
problems. My favorites are the ones that have shot down a lot of newbs online and call that
proof of how good they are. If you keep getting spins you have more to learn.

han freak solo
08-08-2007, 08:50 PM
Okay, I believe the new guys might confuse the gauges with the speedbar. But for those of us who haven't used the speedbar in a loooong time......

Anyway, like I mentioned earlier in the thread the only plane in this sim I spent any time at high altitude is the P-47. Particularly the P-47D-10. Da Razorback, baby! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/metal.gif

Just to refresh my memory, I tried her out at 1000 feet compared to 32,800 feet (about 10,000 meters). This is in the game. I am not a real pilot. Even though I had basic aerodynamics/pilots classes 20+ years ago, I don't fall back on that info much because I don't remember it. Fer instance, the highest I ever took a C-152 was maybe 7000 feet above sea level. I'm a newb. Ha. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

Some numbers tonight from the P-47D-10 in the game. Trimming the plane is assumed and actual numbers may vary. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif


At 1000 feet straight and level.
Fuel: Full tanks
Ammo: Extra ammo
Prop: 2400 rpm aka 85%
Manifold Pressure: 43" hg aka 80% throttle
Radiator: set at 2
Mix control: automatic
Supercharger: automatic
Indicated airspeed: 290 mph


At 32,800 feet straight and level.
Fuel: Full tanks
Ammo: Extra ammo
Prop: 2400 rpm aka 85%
Manifold Pressure: 37" hg aka 80% throttle
Radiator: set at 2
Mix control: automatic
Supercharger: automatic
Indicated airspeed: 210 mph

If I increase throttle to 44" hg aka 100% throttle at 32,800 feet, the indicated airspeed only increases to 215 mph. (Note: I write mph not knots because apparently the USAAF birds didn't go to knots until sometime later. Anyone can educate me as to when.)

Try the planes out for responsiveness too. You'll notice that up high, the controls are less precise. All this means to the new high altitude guys out there is that you're just that much closer to stalling speeds when you decide to yank a plane around that high. If you don't have force feed back like I don't, you listen to the PC speakers for the buffeting sound of impending doom.

M_Gunz
08-08-2007, 10:21 PM
I can't say for sure if this is why but knots is a nautical term and army vs navy... that was
the USAAF not the USAF back then.

Down low to up high you have IAS but in say a turn the force to overcome is by TAS and weight.
TAS to IAS is greater the higher you go so with the same basic lift by IAS the plane has to
overcome more inertia high up. Turn radius should increase at the same IAS but then it should
for all at the higher alt so they should still be comparable.

han freak solo
08-09-2007, 08:10 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by M_Gunz:
Turn radius should increase at the same IAS </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It appears to modeled that way in the game, too.

You can miscalculate a pursuit up high when your used to turning down low. I know this has made me pull the stick back further than I should causing me to lose energy and altitude. And even . . . stall. For shame. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/disagree.gif

I forgot what TAS even meant until you brought it up. This game limits me to what I see on the instrument panel. My knowledge lessens on aerodynamics day by day. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

berg417448
08-09-2007, 08:17 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by han freak solo:



(Note: I write mph not knots because apparently the USAAF birds didn't go to knots until sometime later. Anyone can educate me as to when.)

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

"June 26, 1946--The Aeronautical Board agreed unanimously that the knot and the nautical mile be adopted by the Army Air Forces and Navy as standard aeronautical units of speed and distance, and directed that use of the terms be specified in all future procurement of air speed indicators, charts, related equipment, and future issues of applicable handbooks and technical orders."

han freak solo
08-09-2007, 08:22 PM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

Grand_Armee
08-11-2007, 04:56 AM
Originally posted by M_Gunz:
I am noticing that the person who started the thread has dropped his bait in and appears to
have gone to sleep, answers no questions after posting his 'problem'. Someone wanting to
get over such would be perhaps more active about it, like Birdy was with the same recently?

M Gunz,
I didn't drop bait, and run. I read a few replies and got on with life. Took the Missus out to a movie... worked some overtime... repaired our faulty washing machine. The usual stuff us guys have to do.

The first reply that made sense to me said I may be a bit hamfisted. I know I don't have the hands of a brain surgeon or a violinist. So, I took some time to try to be more deft. I didn't expect to come back and find this thread on page two and two pages long since it started getting replies very slowly.

I've read about force-feedback sticks, rudder pedals, and all kinds of gear. I'm lucky to have TrackIR. I have a basic stick, and still rely heavily upon the keyboard...for rudders as well.

For those who gave answers, again I thank you. I still stall, but I'm getting a bit better.

M_Gunz
08-11-2007, 10:42 AM
Okay, sorry for that but it seemed that way with so many posts.

You are not trolling and we all know now. I know maybe more also from your PM.
You can share my answer as you will, it may save me much typing in future!

You see, in the last month or so there have been a few threads on the same thing and I see
in every one that the majority are missing 75% of what is going on in the critical area of
flight near stall, in stall and the spin. Perhaps 1 in 2 or 3 don't know the difference
between stall and spin which really just makes for loads of complaints about FM what is
really lack of piloting!

After a while and much typing, I get a bit of attitude....... so sorry there!

M_Gunz
08-11-2007, 10:57 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Grand_Armee:
I have a basic stick, and still rely heavily upon the keyboard...for rudders as well. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

OMG I did not know! That is horrible! You really really need proportional rudder control!

If you have a MIDI port (the old joystick port) then you can make a basic rudder control from
examples on the web. Look for the easiest, some of those projects are way overdone! If you
use a LINEAR HALL SENSOR (magnetic, Digikey has some for cheap btw but get linear not switch)
then you can dispense with gears, pulleys or anything like those.

Even if it is just a box with a salvaged volume dial, make or get a rudder control! The 'hard'
part will be making a connector -- check Radio Shack for those, I use crimp-type. Adding a
resistor is not necessary but doesn't hurt, it's been a long time but 200-300 ohms might be
okay but check sites just in case -- if the volume dial doesn't turn all the way down then
it is the same as having the extra resistor anyway for less work.

VMF-214_HaVoK
08-11-2007, 12:55 PM
Grand_Armee is not a troll or on a fishing trip. I seen him last night in SoF II for a few hours. Its always nice to see people fly under the same name they use here. Many dont (you know who you are).

So you are using the keyboard for rudder control? I think I did this for about 2 months when I first got the sim and it does suck. I tell you what, since you seem like a nice fella and really want to learn this sim I got something for ya. If you are willing to pay shipping I will send you my trusty ole Sidewinder Precision 2. Its a great stick and the best thing next to a hotas setup which cost a nice chunk of change. If your interested please email me at trevlee@gmail.com

S!

Xiolablu3
08-11-2007, 02:01 PM
I used to have a Precision Pro, very similar and very nice stick with a twist rudder, which is great once you get used to it.

You can get an extra bit of roll rate by using the rudder twist.

I now have a Force Feedback Pro, which is basically the same stick but with force feedback added.

han freak solo
08-11-2007, 04:02 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Sidewinder Precision 2 </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yep, good stick. I still use the same one I bought back in 2002. I did find myself needing to add CH pedals to it sometime in 2005, but the Precision 2 is worth the money for just shipping costs. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif

Grand_Armee
08-12-2007, 03:18 AM
Havoc,
Thank you for your kind offer. Thank you also for not telling everyone else how easily you shot me down...on more than one occasion.
I've already ordered a forced-feedback stick locally, though. Should arrive this week...then I'll have one less excuse for lackluster performance.

VMF-214_HaVoK
08-12-2007, 02:14 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Grand_Armee:
Havoc,
Thank you for your kind offer. Thank you also for not telling everyone else how easily you shot me down...on more than one occasion.
I've already ordered a forced-feedback stick locally, though. Should arrive this week...then I'll have one less excuse for lackluster performance. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

No problem man. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif What stick did you decide to go with by the way?

S!

Grand_Armee
08-12-2007, 11:44 PM
I went for the Saitek Cyborg Evo forced-feedback. Hopefully it will get me more in-touch with my simulated aircraft. Right now, there's nothing physical involved....it's all eyes. Can't feel that stall coming...or the buffeting, or anything.....not even the shake of my guns. It's all just on the screen.

My wife's first question after dropping another $100 on something to go with this sim: "Okay, *******it....How long before there's a simpit in the spare bedroom!?!?"

...I showed her that Ostrich simpit somebody had posted a couple of months ago.

Speaking of my dearly beloved...she doesn't believe that my: wearing headphones, calling "get him off my arse!", and weaving the stick about madly constitutes a reason for her not to interrupt with some earth shattering question about whether all of my laundry has been gathered to wash.

VMF-214_HaVoK
08-13-2007, 02:48 AM
Wow, a 100 bucks! Things are a bit more expensive down under I guess. BTW I think all of our wives have said the exact same thing at one point or another. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

S!

M_Gunz
08-13-2007, 01:48 PM
Difference might be due to shipping alone. I see them on net for $70. Amazon ships free but
I dunno about to Australia, would bet against that.