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rfxcasey
12-24-2010, 02:01 PM
meh

rfxcasey
12-24-2010, 02:01 PM
meh

blairgowrie
12-24-2010, 02:28 PM
Early days yet Casey. Your opinion may change.

rfxcasey
12-24-2010, 03:06 PM
Well it HAS to be the greatest thing since breathing. After all it's Oleg approved so it must be divine in nature.......... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

blairgowrie
12-24-2010, 03:08 PM
Are you spamming?

rfxcasey
12-24-2010, 03:15 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by blairgowrie:
Are you spamming? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Who me? Have I ever??? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

blairgowrie
12-24-2010, 03:38 PM
GUILTY!

rfxcasey
12-24-2010, 03:44 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by blairgowrie:
GUILTY! </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Look, ok maybe it had something to do with the drop tank I forgot to get rid of before dog fighting. And perhaps I may have sustained a little damage prior to the complete failure. Geez, give a guy a break. I promise to try and behave myself. I certainly don't want to turn into another AJW. Much love BG.

blairgowrie
12-24-2010, 03:46 PM
Time you got that signature within Forum Rules.

rfxcasey
12-24-2010, 03:48 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by blairgowrie:
Time you got that signature within Forum Rules. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Oh why, is it too big or something??? It's not like I am advertising anything.

blairgowrie
12-24-2010, 03:53 PM
Here is a link to the Forum Rules for signature and yes it is too big. http://forums.ubi.com/eve/foru...0283/m/3971030057#XI (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/23110283/m/3971030057#XI)

rfxcasey
12-24-2010, 06:23 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by blairgowrie:
Time you got that signature within Forum Rules. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Well you could have just asked.

stugumby
12-24-2010, 08:06 PM
So to get back on topic here, whats the best estimator of ship speed when setting the torpedo kg sight. bow wave or best guess freighters 12 knots warships 20-30??

EJGrOst_Caspar
12-26-2010, 10:18 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by stugumby:
So to get back on topic here, whats the best estimator of ship speed when setting the torpedo kg sight. bow wave or best guess freighters 12 knots warships 20-30?? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I just will quote the intern explaination from the guy among our team, who is to thank for the ToKG, Maraz:


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">

Well we enter ship speed in Km/h so one must divide by two to estimate roughly the speed in knots.

For estimeting the ship's speed in game (without prior knowledge from having built the mission) the best thing to use is the inclination of smoke. As there is no wind modelled (or anyway it has no effect on smoke) the inclination of ship's smoke can give a hint about its speed.

10 knots
http://www.webalice.it/antonio.maraziti/10kts.jpg

20 knots
http://www.webalice.it/antonio.maraziti/20kts.jpg

30 knots
http://www.webalice.it/antonio.maraziti/30kts.jpg </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

TheGrunch
12-26-2010, 10:34 AM
That's really cool, Caspar, thanks!

wheelsup_cavu
12-26-2010, 07:18 PM
Cool tips Caspar. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif


Wheels

blairgowrie
12-27-2010, 06:16 AM
Really like most of what is in 4.10. But I have conducted two hosting sessions for coops and I am afraid both were a bit of a nightmare. Couldn't get QMT to work at all and in many of the missions, we spawned 6ft below ground. If the mission had previously been altered to include new aircraft, we kept getting the "aircraft not created" message.

Back to UP 2.01 for coops I am afraid.

JG52Uther
12-27-2010, 06:22 AM
It sure is a buggy patch. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif

FatCat_99
12-27-2010, 06:38 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG52Uther:
It sure is a buggy patch. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yes, if you use mods and content created with modded version of the game.

FoolTrottel
12-27-2010, 09:54 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by FatCat_99:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG52Uther:
It sure is a buggy patch. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yes, if you use mods and content created with modded version of the game. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Even if you do not use mods and content created with modded versions, I've seen enough issues to call this patch indeed 'buggy'...

Mind you, I'm not complaining about it, it's just that if you look at the number of changes in this patch, a larger number of bugs is to be expected. (Compared to earlier patches)

The patch is impressive, but 'buggy'...

EJGrOst_Caspar
12-27-2010, 11:11 AM
What is QMT ?

thefruitbat
12-27-2010, 11:22 AM
Quick mission tuner

http://www.il2-fullmissionbuil...k-mission-tuner.html (http://www.il2-fullmissionbuilder.com/quick-mission-tuner.html)

its really useful for tweaking co-ops on the fly when hosting, either adding some more planes by cloning existing waypoints for a flight, setting which flights are flyable by humans, changing plane type in a particular flight, etc....

blairgowrie
12-27-2010, 02:57 PM
I kept all my coop missions in a safe place from 3 years ago so I am going to resurrect them and place them in a dedicated 4.10. It will be interesting to see if Quick Mission Tuner works with that.

K_Freddie
12-27-2010, 03:46 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by FoolTrottel:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by FatCat_99:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG52Uther:
It sure is a buggy patch. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Yes, if you use mods and content created with modded version of the game. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Even if you do not use mods and content created with modded versions, I've seen enough issues to call this patch indeed 'buggy'...

Mind you, I'm not complaining about it, it's just that if you look at the number of changes in this patch, a larger number of bugs is to be expected. (Compared to earlier patches)

The patch is impressive, but 'buggy'... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
For so long we've waited.. so much hype...
..and I lost my 'selected pilots' configuration on the second mission.

Although as far as I understand this was a 'part-time' effort... maybe TD shouldn't promise any V4.11 ???
It seems TD has stuffed it up like any EA, Blizzard.. games. If you need help give the sh.tload to me .. I'll sort this cr.ap out, the way it's supposed to be.. or I'll just make my own sim http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

M_Gunz
12-27-2010, 06:54 PM
You do that Freddie. It will be just great.

EJGrOst_Caspar
12-28-2010, 02:16 AM
@blairgowrie: I'm sorry. I think, you understand, that we cannot care for external software.
If its not running with our patch, then its the task of the programmers of that software to align it to our product, not the other direction.

If there is any support needed, they can ask us via official contacts.

blairgowrie
12-28-2010, 06:12 AM
By no means a complaint EJGrOst_Caspar and sorry if it came across that way. I completely understand your position on this. I just wanted some of the others to know what they might come up against.

dwagener
12-28-2010, 07:06 AM
Overall I have to say I am impressed with 4.10.

Thanks for the effort and for extending/improving the life of the best computer game out there!

RegRag1977
12-28-2010, 07:22 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG52Uther:
It sure is a buggy patch. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif Yet the important thing is that making such a patch IS a GREAT FEAT...

I appreciate the effort, Great great feat definitely http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/clap.gif , nice features, lots of bonus, and for the bugs, i think we can all wait until TD sort them out (they will do it, patience is all what we need): and remember it's not as if we paid for the patch!

As for me, call me stupid but i would have pay for this patch...Just my opinion though.

To sum up, my first impression is very good, this patch is a new milestone: IL2 is still living and rocking the WW2 sim world once again http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-happy.gif

M_Gunz
12-28-2010, 07:48 AM
Besides that, we might get another new sim out of this. I am holding my breath!

fabianfred
12-29-2010, 01:34 AM
QMT is that excellent little tool created by Nearmiss I think called Quick Mission Tuner..

BTW has anyone else noticed that the ships sink slower than before....a thing I was calling for for years...

Treetop64
12-29-2010, 08:29 AM
The patch has certainly brought new life to this sim. I have yet to run into any technical issues, though I don't use mods at all (except DCG, Mat Manager, and EnjoyR, and those aren't really considered mods). The realistic navigation, engine reliability, and pilot injury additions have definitely changed the way one plays the game - for the better. Much better. Can't wait for the 4.11 patch which, we're told, will primarily address AI behavior.

I've discovered tons of small detail changes, like the ship sinking rate that fabian mentioned, and the oil cooler flap now under user control on the Yak-1s (it was permanently stuck in the open position previously).

The Ju88s look like Ju88s now!

My impressions are very positive.

I think that if the patch was applied to a virgin, unmodded v4.09m installation then half of the issues mentioned wouldn't materialize.

tsisqua
12-29-2010, 09:25 AM
~S to All!

Old guy alert. LOL

Wanted to say hello to everyone, and to marvel a moment. I recently had to reformat and reload Windows, which meant a clean install of 1946. This patch came right on the heels of this, and so everything went in clean with no "alterations" to muck things up. Everything so far has been smooth as silk, and most of the problems I am seeing reported look like they are related to either previous installations or modifications to the 1946 folder.

How old is this game engine again? I will be a fan forever, and want to THANK TD for keeping it fresh and fun to play, even though it first apeared as the dinosaurs were losing control of the Earth.

Blessings to all, and many thanks for a great holiday gift.

Tsisqua (Now With High Speed)

M_Gunz
12-29-2010, 11:46 AM
Original IL2 came out after 4 years work.

Old_Canuck
12-29-2010, 02:19 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by tsisqua:
~S to All!

Old guy alert. LOL

Wanted to say hello to everyone, and to marvel a moment. I recently had to reformat and reload Windows, which meant a clean install of 1946. This patch came right on the heels of this, and so everything went in clean with no "alterations" to muck things up. Everything so far has been smooth as silk, and most of the problems I am seeing reported look like they are related to either previous installations or modifications to the 1946 folder.

How old is this game engine again? I will be a fan forever, and want to THANK TD for keeping it fresh and fun to play, even though it first apeared as the dinosaurs were losing control of the Earth.

Blessings to all, and many thanks for a great holiday gift.

Tsisqua (Now With High Speed) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hiya Tsisqua .. good to see you're still lurking about.

tsisqua
12-29-2010, 08:20 PM
Thanks, OC!

Good to see you are still here. Also saw Blaire is still around. Is Bearcat still about? He was always a good-hearted fellow.

"Original IL2 came out after 4 years work."

My question was only rhetorical, Gunz. I was here for pretty much the whole thing LOL. The most fun I've ever had with my clothes on.

Tsisqua

PhantomKira
12-30-2010, 12:39 AM
Bearcat's still here, holding the line against his new monitor.

M_Gunz
12-30-2010, 05:13 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by tsisqua:
Thanks, OC!

Good to see you are still here. Also saw Blaire is still around. Is Bearcat still about? He was always a good-hearted fellow.

"Original IL2 came out after 4 years work."

My question was only rhetorical, Gunz. I was here for pretty much the whole thing LOL. The most fun I've ever had with my clothes on.

Tsisqua </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You're not the only one here. I was just commenting on how old the basic engine really is.

knightflyte
12-30-2010, 08:04 AM
Virgin install. No problemo with 4.11.



4.10 and tsisqua in one day? Life is good. Long time no see. Hope all is well with you.

F19_Orheim
12-30-2010, 08:31 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by tsisqua:
~S to All!

Old guy alert. LOL

Wanted to say hello to everyone, and to marvel a moment. I recently had to reformat and reload Windows, which meant a clean install of 1946. This patch came right on the heels of this, and so everything went in clean with no "alterations" to muck things up. Everything so far has been smooth as silk, and most of the problems I am seeing reported look like they are related to either previous installations or modifications to the 1946 folder.

How old is this game engine again? I will be a fan forever, and want to THANK TD for keeping it fresh and fun to play, even though it first apeared as the dinosaurs were losing control of the Earth.

Blessings to all, and many thanks for a great holiday gift.

Tsisqua (Now With High Speed) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

always a pleasure to see u pop up once and awhile mate. hope all is well... and a happy new year I send to you friend

blairgowrie
12-30-2010, 03:37 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by tsisqua:
Thanks, OC!

Good to see you are still here. Also saw Blaire is still around. Is Bearcat still about? He was always a good-hearted fellow.

"Original IL2 came out after 4 years work."

My question was only rhetorical, Gunz. I was here for pretty much the whole thing LOL. The most fun I've ever had with my clothes on.

Tsisqua </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Don't forget you are still a bona fide member of the Danger Dogz and can fly with us anytime.

DKoor
12-30-2010, 06:18 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG52Uther:
It sure is a buggy patch. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
You still use it? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif

tsisqua
12-30-2010, 07:44 PM
Hi there, BG!

Thanks so much. Been through alot the last couple of years. Might be just what the doctor ordered. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Tsisqua

Erkki_M
12-31-2010, 01:44 AM
So far I like it a lot. Got the chance to fight some of the new Spitfires yesterday, and us 2 with 190s managed to bleed a higher-E Spitfire IX 25lbs' speed and E down, despite him trying to do the usual Spitfire moves, and force him to the deck. And I know the 190s definately werent changed. Whoah.

Over G is nice too, forces people to fly smarter, and more historically.

DKoor
12-31-2010, 01:59 AM
Yeah... the big question now is... does Ai suffer from G damage as well?
I *think* they suffer from new pilot model (bleed etc.).

JG52Uther
12-31-2010, 05:39 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DKoor:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by JG52Uther:
It sure is a buggy patch. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-indifferent.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
You still use it? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/53.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Only until UP catches up...

MajorBloodnok
12-31-2010, 09:28 AM
Wow! I look away for a second (OK, maybe a few months) and the next patch appears. Downloading it as I write but just wanted to say thanks to team deadalus. Also I noticed this in the read me:

Fw 190 & Ta 152 cockpit "bar" made smaller.

Does this mean what I think it does?! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

Best regards

AndyJWest
12-31-2010, 10:21 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Fw 190 & Ta 152 cockpit "bar" made smaller.

Does this mean what I think it does?! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Yup. It helps a little in a turn fight, though you still find yourself firing blind sometimes. Definitely worth the change though. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

jarink
12-31-2010, 02:03 PM
I've been playing around with it the last couple days and have to say I'm a bit underwhelmed. It would be a great patch if mods had never happened, but they have and, frankly, a lot of mods surpass the content in 4.10. Overall, I'd give 4.10 a score of 7.5 on a scale of 10 for non-mod users and a 5 if you use mods.

Several of the new features sound nice at first, but then you discover they are actually pretty limited.
1) Radio navigation - Cool! Oh, wait, most maps are small enough that it doesn't make much difference.
2) Torpedo drop limits - Finally! But...until the damage models of all ships are truly fixed and we have more flyable naval torpedo aircraft (B6N, TBD, TBF, Barracuda, etc. etc.) in the game, it loses its luster.
3) More guided ordnance - Hs293, Fritz-X, AZON/RAZON, Bat-bomb. Even cooler! Oh, wait. There's only two flyable planes that can carry any of these weapons (He-111 and F4U-1D) WTH was the point of including these weapons? So the AI can have fun with them? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_mad.gif
4) New planes - Always nice! Crap. There's only one truly 'new' plane, the Do-217 and it's AI only. Most of the other new planes came from the mod community, which at least made them flyable. There was obviously a lot of work that went into the Hs-129. Gotta appreciate that. However, the skin remapping means that all previous Hs-129 skins are useless. Hope there's some talented skinners willing to make new skins for the new mapping.
<span class="ev_code_YELLOW">Did we really need another half dozen Spitfires???</span> (I know, I know. Someone will say "Yes!"; over two dozen was not enough.) http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
5) New QMB - Not so new if you've been using mods.
6) New FMB options - Finally, we can select multiple objects! This is actually a little better than what I've seen with other utilities.
7) MDS - I don't play online, so I can't comment.
8) G limits, pilot damage, joystick profiles - Nice, but none are what I would call a 'killer feature'.

This was a long-anticipated and hugely hyped patch and I think didn't fully live up to it. TD needs to do a better job of managing expectations for 4.11.

Edit: I re-read my post (I usually do to ensure I'm making sense) and I wanted to make it clear that I'm NOT saying 4.10 is garbage. It is a pretty good patch which fixed some long-standing issues and introduced some good new features and content. I just think that it falls a little short of what expectations are in this "Modded IL-2" world. No matter what anyone thinks of mods, they are here and frankly set the standards for new IL-2 content.

Treetop64
12-31-2010, 03:33 PM
Well, for a series of TD patches that comes with as much content as it does, and addresses as many issues as it does, and does so for free (excepting donations, of course), I've been more than happy with what has come.

IMHO the biggest features with the latest patch is the realistic navigation, realistic reliability, and realistic injury probability. All three significantly change how the game is played.

Granted, most maps are a bit small for the implementation of radio navaids, but if you fly in foul weather at all then navaids become your best friend, regardless of the size of the map. Moreover, I can only guess at the importance of navaids from the carrier when flying long-distance naval missions with no land features to aid with VFR type flying, and again, even more so in bad weather. Using dead reckoning while piloting over water is not easy, and it's doubtful that many would use DR in the game. Furthermore, it goes without saying that the gameplay is enhanced by not having the distraction of an indicator constantly telling you where the next waypoint is, unless the aircraft had equipment installed that had the capability of actually doing so, and only functioned when you want to use it.

I like that torpedo drop limits have finally been implemented, as I've gotten sick of seeing torpedoes successfully dropped from aircraft flying at full-tilt. Torpedo missions are especially dangerous because the aircraft has to fly so low and slow to make a successful drop. It would be nice, however, to do those missions in Devastators and Avengers, and in B5N2s and B6N2s...

Planes capable of carrying guided ordnance in WWII were relatively rare, so the low plane count in this regard is easy to live with. The addition of a flyable He-177, flammable engines and all, for this purpose would be very interesting, though. Guided ordnance - and its realistic application - is always a cool addition to the game.

The exclusion of old Hs-129 skins for the inclusion of a user-flyable, completely rebuilt, and vastly improved model of the plane, is a small price to pay. New skins are inevitably coming...

The term "Killer Feature" is highly subjective. The significance of it's meaning varies as much as there are people that use it. Specifically, the inclusion of G-Limits, pilot damage, and joystick profiles may not themselves be the Alpha and Omega of game enhancement, but they certainly add to the overall package.

Finally, comparisons with mods. Believe it or not, there are those that still fly without mods - yours truly included - and are perfectly happy doing so. I tried the mods, and honestly I wasn't terribly impressed with most of them. Many mods amounted to changing something without necessarily improving upon it. Some changes were actually made for the worse. Some of the sounds, cockpits, and other aesthetic features were nice, though. Ultimately, I made the decision that I wouldn't use mods until the patch sequencing is complete for the sim, if ever... http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

The thing I'm most looking forward to is the further changes to AI behavior. I fly exclusively offline, and while the AI is very good most of the time, there are the already well-known quirks that tend to spoil things from time to time. Some of those quirks are magnified while flying missions generated by DCG, instead of DGen, because of the way the AI manages it's routines depending on which waypoints have been passed. V4.11 will, we're told, primarily address the AI behavior. If it works well then it will be big.

M_Gunz
12-31-2010, 05:59 PM
Are things like G-limits and engine reliability possible for modders to do? No?
Will you be able to run mods on 4.10? Yes?

We should thank TD because is it not written that:

Users should not complain about the code they get. They are lucky to get anything at all.

Ba5tard5word
12-31-2010, 06:13 PM
As I've said before, most of the things the patch changes are pretty subtle. Look at the changelog, it's a pretty massive number of changes. More new planes would have been nice but we already have a massive number of planes in the stock game. The UP mods haven't really added a lot of new planes that have their own cockpits. 4.09 added some planes and some nice maps but didn't really change a lot in the game, 4.10 does some pretty major stuff like reliability, g-force, and bomb/torp arming, and opens up a lot of possibilities for MDS and online stuff.



<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">The thing I'm most looking forward to is the further changes to AI behavior. I fly exclusively offline, and while the AI is very good most of the time, there are the already well-known quirks that tend to spoil things from time to time. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I almost always only fly against AI in co-ops and offline and I really prefer the AI in Ultrapack. The main change I like is that enemy fighters won't constantly do endless barrell rolls when you're tailing them, but they are still pretty competitive.

jarink
12-31-2010, 09:51 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by M_Gunz:
Are things like G-limits and engine reliability possible for modders to do? No?
Will you be able to run mods on 4.10? Yes?

We should thank TD because is it not written that:

Users should not complain about the code they get. They are lucky to get anything at all. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Um, try reading the "Edit:" note at the end of my post.

As for the other points, there are modders working on things like improved g-limits, better AI, vision-blocking clouds, engine reliability, etc.

I do appreciate the work TD did on the patch, especially since I'm sure Oleg had much more stringent criteria for inclusion of the changes they made. Sorry if I don't fawn all over people when I think they did a good job instead of an outstanding one. There's nothing wrong with a good job, you know.

ytareh
01-01-2011, 02:07 AM
It IS a GOOD job .Prob best patch ever .

PhantomKira
01-01-2011, 11:38 AM
I second Jarink's statement with regards to DCG and AI behavior based on waypoint passed. Specifically, the issue with their "brains" being turned off upon entry into the landing pattern. Following a first highly successful mission, I just lost almost my entire squadron of P-40s to a jump in the pattern by Zeros. I was the only one fighting back, the rest went down like flies.

wheelsup_cavu
01-01-2011, 05:32 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fabianfred:
QMT is that excellent little tool created by Nearmiss I think called Quick Mission Tuner.. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Shift_E made QMT.
http://forums.ubi.com/eve/foru...741029577#5741029577 (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/50910533/m/5771069207?r=5741029577#5741029577)

Nearmiss did some FMB tutorials.
http://www.avsims.com/
There may have been more things that Nearmiss did but I don't know about them.


<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fabianfred:

BTW has anyone else noticed that the ships sink slower than before....a thing I was calling for for years... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I hadn't noticed but I will be checking it out now. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif


Wheels

blairgowrie
01-02-2011, 04:15 PM
After flying many coops with my squad mates, the Danger Dogz, I can't say I enjoy the 2 second arming issue while trying to skip bomb nor the complexity of dropping torps at exactly the correct speed and height.
I 'd rather see a difficulty switch that allows you to select.

kimosabi79
01-03-2011, 10:50 AM
I don't know how I feel about this patch. Do I get any alternatives?

M_Gunz
01-03-2011, 11:33 AM
Run 2+ copies on the HD.

DKoor
01-03-2011, 12:43 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MajorBloodnok:
Wow! I look away for a second (OK, maybe a few months) and the next patch appears. Downloading it as I write but just wanted to say thanks to team deadalus. Also I noticed this in the read me:

Fw 190 & Ta 152 cockpit "bar" made smaller.

Does this mean what I think it does?! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

Best regards </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Bf-109 pits view also changed http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif . Not for the better or worse, but for more realistic...
* * * * *
Something that many users are complaining about (new more realistic bombing etc.)... man I don't understand any of it.

blairgowrie
01-03-2011, 12:47 PM
I get most of my enjoyment from ground pounding.
4.10 now makes it much more difficult to get positive results.

kimosabi79
01-03-2011, 02:00 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by M_Gunz:
Run 2+ copies on the HD. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I know that silly. I have 3 different copies on my desktop already. Answering alternatives was what I meant. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/partyhat.gif

Ba5tard5word
01-03-2011, 02:27 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by blairgowrie:
I get most of my enjoyment from ground pounding.
4.10 now makes it much more difficult to get positive results. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't really do much bombing runs as I prefer flying fighters so I haven't encountered any of this yet (though I've never even tried skip bombing and I've made maybe one sucessful torpedo hit) but is the consensus that the bombing/torping in 4.10 is more realistic, or that it's unnecessary?

blairgowrie
01-03-2011, 02:44 PM
It well may be more realistic but I can't sink or destroy anything anymore.

DKoor
01-03-2011, 03:15 PM
Hey it ain't that hard at all.

Practically the only thing you must do while skip bombing is to be above 25m alt.

Is that hard to achieve? I don't think so.

Torpedo stuff is whole another play... I'll get on it tonight http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif , I guess this one will be more harder.

PhantomKira
01-03-2011, 03:28 PM
I managed 10% detonation the last time I skip bombed in 4.10. Ten flights, one hit with a good fuse. It's doable, but you have to get used to the new "sight picture" before you'll get any meaningful results. The one successful hit was wayyy out in left field, so I thought, then "BOOM!". Er, okay, so that's how it ought to look, apparently.

Haven't done any dive bombing, yet, but since I'm in the habit of starting my pullout no lower that 3000ft, I don't think it'll be a problem.

blairgowrie
01-03-2011, 03:34 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by DKoor:
Hey it ain't that hard at all.

Practically the only thing you must do while skip bombing is to be above 25m alt.

Is that hard to achieve? I don't think so.

Torpedo stuff is whole another play... I'll get on it tonight http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_cool.gif , I guess this one will be more harder. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You will have to get the height and speed from the PDF for each torpedo type and there doesn't seem to be any latitude. We had squad members lined up ready ready to drop and 80% of their torps broke.

DKoor
01-03-2011, 03:56 PM
I just played around 10 missions or so... Ju-88 Torp... both type of torpedos... I successfully released from 80-120m height, speed was 250-290kph...

First I acquired a target, I practiced on stationery ship first.
I come in with a long run slowly descending from 250-300m... line up with the ship, use that scope for distant targets (nice but unusable for close range). After checking the scope, nicely line up with the ship hit level stabilizer, then watch your speed, heading and altitude... it is smart to start with a bit of higher alt say at least 150-200m, so you can descend and control your alt with throttle and trim elevator up to prevent the descent in altitude... to correct the heading I do all my corrections from this moment with rudder trim http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif , very easy, smooth and precise.
With speedbar I was able to get over 50% successful hits without practice.
I think with a bit of practice this wont be too hard... but it is essential that you do very very long torp runs so you can correct all "numbers" before releasing torps.

blairgowrie
01-03-2011, 04:30 PM
It might be interesting to have some other comparisons from other members. I know you are an exceptional pilot Koor.

Dance
01-03-2011, 05:03 PM
After being away from my pc over christmas and the new year I have not even downloaded the patch yet. Am now in two minds about bothering at all until a few fixes are applied?

Ba5tard5word
01-03-2011, 05:15 PM
There are some bugs but they are pretty minor. Supposedly they will be fixed in 4.10.1 but we have no idea when that will come out. If you use UP or other mods, UP won't work with 4.10 now but they have an update in the works supposedly that will let you run UP with 4.10, I asked how long when 4.10 came out and they said "a month." I'm pretty much waiting for that, I don't like the stock AI anymore and like the mod planes and maps and sounds and so on.

ElAurens
01-03-2011, 05:21 PM
DKoor, try making a torp run in the A 20.

You have to have combat flaps down, and are just about at stall speed. It's not pretty.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Dance
01-03-2011, 05:34 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ba5tard5word:
There are some bugs but they are pretty minor. Supposedly they will be fixed in 4.10.1 but we have no idea when that will come out. If you use UP or other mods, UP won't work with 4.10 now but they have an update in the works supposedly that will let you run UP with 4.10, I asked how long when 4.10 came out and they said "a month." I'm pretty much waiting for that, I don't like the stock AI anymore and like the mod planes and maps and sounds and so on. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Thanks B5, I guess it's about par for the course
patch-wise but I am concerned about issues like that mentioned by ElAurens. Mods are not an issue, I use them or not as the mood takes me.

"You have to have combat flaps down, and are just about at stall speed. It's not pretty."
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

M_Gunz
01-03-2011, 05:58 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by kimosabi79:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by M_Gunz:
Run 2+ copies on the HD. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I know that silly. I have 3 different copies on my desktop already. Answering alternatives was what I meant. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/partyhat.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

TD has been pretty clear that they don't work to fit mods. That's a lot of extra work. Then there's this idea of one version of IL2 where players on the same server could have confidence that no one is flying a hacked model. That has been a long time IL2 goal, mostly maintained until a blurt about JAVA and other news hit the boards.

Closed architecture and open mods are mutually exclusive. Gotta run different copies.

rfxcasey
01-03-2011, 09:00 PM
I don't think there should be any need to apologize for pointing out issues, just giving the heads up to the community.

After playing with 4.10 for a few days it really isn't as annoying as I first anticipated. I've actually be doing really good in coops since it came out so I'm glad it hasn't nerfed the sim from my perspective.

As far as the 2 second fuse, and this is by no means meant to be derogatory to anyone, but I guess some people just have never been bombing correctly or should I say realistically from the onset. I have noticed not difference with the 2 second bomb delay and really haven't altered my technique at all. I see a lot of people when ground pounding have the tendency to get as low as possible so they can drop their bomb right on the target with little adjustment for speed and height that is normally required in a more realistic bombing run.

I will concede that when skip bombing you have to be a bit higher, more like the high I would normally bomb on land with a P-47/P-38 for instance. For me personally the main reason I like to come in on a ship as low as possible is to avoid the wall of lead. Skip bombing if 4.10 now puts you pretty much right in the sweet spot for the ships AA. I have always preferred dive bombing ships though not really sure on the historical date on d-bombing a ship in say a Spitfire. One thing that has affect me in this is the constraints the G-limit puts on pulling out of a dive as I used to like to get as low as possible so I could be assured of a direct hit.

The main focus should really be on that 2 second fuse as I have read that even near miss will damage the ships with the shockwave now so getting your bombs to blow whether a direct hit or not is most important as an unexploded bomb isn't going to do any damage at all.

For skip bombing you have to be at about 40 or 50 meters now though in really life I don't thing skip bombing was the preferred ship attacking technique as I assume you conditions would have to be very very mild to pull it off successfully.

Treetop64
01-03-2011, 10:33 PM
I agree. In RL, sea conditions would almost always rule out any skip bombing techniques. Only on specially planned missions, with particular weapon types (dam busters, etc.) would skip bombing ever have been considered, and even then it was considered only on isolated, fresh water locations (rivers, lakes, etc.).

It would have to be absolutely glass-smooth at sea for skip bombing to have a chance of working. Absolutely no swells. Only the tiniest of tiny waves. Certainly no whitecaps. Nothing. I've been sea for more than two years in total and I can remember only two days when the sea was ever that calm.

For all the feverish calls of realism demanded from so many, I have to admit that I'm rather surprised by all the noise being made about the addition of the two second bomb fuse. That was one of the fundamental realism features missing since day one. Now it's there, and we hate it?! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Apparently skip bombing is a very common technique in the sim! God forbid having to change your tactic to get the job done now! Now you have to bomb the target the same way the real guys had to do it: level from altitude, at a shallow dive angle, or coming straight in vertically from the top!

An almost equal amount of noise is being made about the new realistic torpedo release parameters. Really...? http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

You're gettin' lazy, guys...

M_Gunz
01-04-2011, 02:22 AM
It's a 2 second arming period. You can still set zero delay fuse on target strike.. as long as the fall time is over 2 seconds.

Jure_502
01-04-2011, 02:33 AM
First of all I would like to thank the TD for realising the patch. I'm very glad seeing the new weather and navigation tools, it's like a new sim now!

I was playing a bit with new weapons and I have a question on LT 350 torpedos. In 4.10 guide says - It was dropped from high altitude -
so I'm wondering what altitude this may be. I tested with various altitudes with no succsess.

Nicholaiovitch
01-04-2011, 04:10 AM
Like many, I have experimented with bombing and torpedo launching in 4.10 with similar results to previous entries.

Clearly, both these forms of attack now require a lot of practice before trying to achieve reasonable results.

Skip bombing as has been pointed out is now a matter of level flight at 30m/100ft, as fast as you can get the machine to go, and for each variant a picture from the cockpit of the ship much further out than before when you hit drop. Problem is, you will die achieving this unless the flak is set to a very low level….but it is possible.

The torpedo issue is far more complex. I thought I would try the Beaufighter as I have done a fair amount of research into “The Strike Wings” missions flown in 1943. I have many missions constructed to replicate specific attacks on convoys off the Dutch coast, both in 4.09 and in 2.01. Unfortunately, only the Mk21 is available in 4.10. (can we have the Mk10…pretty please?)

Easy, I thought…just build a single mission with one Beaufighter attacking one ship, set him to “Ace”, load, engage AP and watch to learn how the master achieves the result with the new parameters!

Well it was interesting……poor old Beafighter had to fly straight and level at 100ft, reduce to just above stall speed at 120-130mph (we only have the Mk13a torp. available …limits 30m/205kph) and then…what a letdown…….”torpedo failed entry into water” message!!

To be fair, it is possible to launch a torpedo from the Beaufighter…just….but you can’t see the target as the nose is so high at 130mph (205kph) and you will die unless it is an unarmed ship! Incidentally the RAF used 150ft./200-220mph and 900yds to launch their torpedoes in 1943. (from the book “The Strike Wings”)

The Ju88 is a good deal better. Accurate flying at 100m/300kph with a LTF5 Italian and using your Norden bomb controls to set 35deg off the bow, estimated ship’s speed (usually 5-6kts for freighters…15 or so for others unless the mission builder is trying to catch you out!) and with a salvo set for 2deg. split…I have managed to hit a fair few. It is great to be able to point the sight directly at a moving ship with parameters you can pre-set before you even take-off. You can also launch a long way out (you have to experiment as the torpedo self destructs after too long a voyage!)

All in all…a bit like the “Curate’s egg”…but I’m sure with some tweaking and patching down the line we will get the realism we all seek...or do we?

Nicholaiovitch http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

DKoor
01-04-2011, 04:44 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by blairgowrie:
It might be interesting to have some other comparisons from other members. I know you are an exceptional pilot Koor. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Thanks mate, but in all honesty I think I'm not better than average veteran of this game http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif . I guess I just "advertise" myself better http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ElAurens:
DKoor, try making a torp run in the A 20.

You have to have combat flaps down, and are just about at stall speed. It's not pretty.

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Hey thanks, now you had me all interested, you found me a new occupation http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif.
From the ordnance drop down list I see it has some new (?) torpedo, I must admit I never released that type of torpedoes before in game.

RamsteinUSA
01-04-2011, 06:50 AM
The AI can still see through clouds..

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ba5tard5word:
As I've said before, most of the things the patch changes are pretty subtle. Look at the changelog, it's a pretty massive number of changes. More new planes would have been nice but we already have a massive number of planes in the stock game. The UP mods haven't really added a lot of new planes that have their own cockpits. 4.09 added some planes and some nice maps but didn't really change a lot in the game, 4.10 does some pretty major stuff like reliability, g-force, and bomb/torp arming, and opens up a lot of possibilities for MDS and online stuff.



<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">The thing I'm most looking forward to is the further changes to AI behavior. I fly exclusively offline, and while the AI is very good most of the time, there are the already well-known quirks that tend to spoil things from time to time. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I almost always only fly against AI in co-ops and offline and I really prefer the AI in Ultrapack. The main change I like is that enemy fighters won't constantly do endless barrell rolls when you're tailing them, but they are still pretty competitive. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

JG52Uther
01-04-2011, 06:53 AM
I can't skip bomb at all now,and thats after more than an hour of trying.On Spits Vs 109s a few days ago,nobody was having any luck at all with bombing.
It might be realistic but I like to think there is a fun element to this game as well.Because of that,I would like it to be an option,like most of the other difficulty settings.
If the TD mod team won't do it,I'm sure another one will.

csThor
01-04-2011, 09:13 AM
Sorry, Uther, but I (totally unused to any kind of skip bombing) just managed two successful skip runs on the QMB Pacific Islands map (with A-20 and Beau, failed with B-25 because I dropped too early). Drop from at least 150 feet and you're fine ... of course this only works against unarmed merchant ships, but anyone trying that vs a heavily armed warship is nuts anyway.

Is it impossible? Heck, no! Is it a little more difficult? Yep.

VonKlugermon
01-04-2011, 09:31 AM
Interesting point, Thor about attacking heavily armed ships - maybe 4.XX patch will include realistic damage modeling for ships so you can reduce/eliminate AA fire by strafing/bombing.

FoolTrottel
01-04-2011, 09:33 AM
Low level bombing is more difficult now.

It still can be done successfully, but because we need to stay up about 40-50m, one needs to be very aware of the aircraft's speed, and correct aiming for that. Something we did not need to do when dropping from way lower... As speed is more of a factor, it will take some time to adjust for that, to learn how to...

Especially if ones flies a range of ground pounders... an attack in an IL2 will usually be performed at a lower speed than one in a P-38...

JG52Uther
01-04-2011, 10:10 AM
Not saying it is impossible Thor,just that I can't can't do it.
Thats why I would like it as an option,so I can choose to have it or not.

thefruitbat
01-04-2011, 10:39 AM
My two cents.

I like the fact that its more difficult/realistic now.

I've always felt that it was to easy compared to everything i've read. Bombing in il2 pre 4.10 even for a casual ground pounder like me (and if you ask anyone in the dangerdogz they will tell you i hate ground pounding, as i have a very strong aversion to flak), was very easy to attain positive results.

Rockets were like lasers, and skip bombing was ridiculously easy, and you could plant a bomb from 10 foot above a tank you were trying to hit. realistic, no.

In a practise environment, i can still skip bomb ships nearly everytime, and put my bombs pretty damn close on the ground to a target i'm trying to hit. It does require however a much more thought out and controlled approach.

In combat, its a different situation, in a co-op the other night we were flying zeros with 250kg bombs attacking midway, and as we were approaching the islands we got bounced by loads of wildcats. now i wanted desperately to get rid of my bomb before fighting the wildcats, and with three following me in, and me constantly looking over my shoulder to see if i was going to make it to the ship i had targeted before they got into guns range, surprise surprise, i dropped to low.

Was i ****ed off, no. it just means to me that when i do hit in a pressure situation, it will be all the more rewarding.

In real life many time the number of bombs missed than hit, and it took lots of training and practise and then combat before real pilots were hitting things.

If we want a simulator, then why should we expect to hit with an hour or so practise everytime?

As to whether it should be a difficulty setting, thats a different thing altogether. Maybe since so many people aren't getting the results they expect and want, and although its a simulator, it also a game, primarily for fun.

However, personally I'll always prefer to have it turned on if that becomes the case.

JG52Uther
01-04-2011, 10:49 AM
Yeah its funny,I fly with all the other difficulty settings ticked,don't even use the speedbar usually,but I WOULD like the option to use it or not.
Actually,I would prefer a way of setting the fuse myself,as apparently that was possible in real life,depending on the mission.
If I blow myself up by the bomb hitting the plane or another bomb when I drop so be it,but at least the damn bomb would go off! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

ElAurens
01-04-2011, 10:51 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by thefruitbat:
and you could plant a bomb from 10 foot above a tank you were trying to hit. realistic, no.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

However, considering the really awful damage modeling of tanks in the sim, the only way to take one out is with a direct hit, no matter the size fo the bomb. I think this is another one of those situations were a deveation from reality on the DM of ground untis and tanks in particular, necessitates a deveation from reality in the bombing procedure.

It really is disheartening to drop a 1000 pound less than a meter from a tank and have it have zero effect.

ElAurens
01-04-2011, 10:52 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ElAurens:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by thefruitbat:
and you could plant a bomb from 10 foot above a tank you were trying to hit. realistic, no.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

However, considering the really awful damage modeling of tanks in the sim, the only way to take one out is with a direct hit, no matter the size of the bomb. I think this is another one of those situations were a deveation from reality on the DM of ground untis and tanks in particular, necessitates a deveation from reality in the bombing procedure.

It really is disheartening to drop a 1000 pound less than a meter from a tank and have it have zero effect. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

ElAurens
01-04-2011, 10:52 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ElAurens:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ElAurens:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by thefruitbat:
and you could plant a bomb from 10 foot above a tank you were trying to hit. realistic, no.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

However, considering the really awful damage modeling of tanks in the sim, the only way to take one out is with a direct hit, no matter the size of the bomb. I think this is another one of those situations were a deveation from reality on the DM of ground untis and tanks in particular, necessitates a deveation from reality in the bombing procedure.

It really is disheartening to drop a 1000 pounder less than a meter from a tank and have it have zero effect. </div></BLOCKQUOTE> </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

ElAurens
01-04-2011, 10:53 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by thefruitbat:
and you could plant a bomb from 10 foot above a tank you were trying to hit. realistic, no.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

However, considering the really awful damage modeling of tanks in the sim, the only way to take one out is with a direct hit, no matter the size of the bomb. I think this is another one of those situations were a deveation from reality on the DM of ground untis and tanks in particular, necessitates a deveation from reality in the bombing procedure.

It really is disheartening to drop a 1000 pounder less than a meter from a tank and have it have zero effect.

ElAurens
01-04-2011, 10:54 AM
Sheesh, silly forum glitches.

http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

thefruitbat
01-04-2011, 10:54 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by ElAurens:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by thefruitbat:
and you could plant a bomb from 10 foot above a tank you were trying to hit. realistic, no.
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

However, considering the really awful damage modeling of tanks in the sim, the only way to take one out is with a direct hit, no matter the size fo the bomb. I think this is another one of those situations were a deveation from reality on the DM of ground untis and tanks in particular, necessitates a deveation from reality in the bombing procedure.

<span class="ev_code_RED">It really is disheartening to drop a 1000 pound less than a meter from a tank and have it have zero effect</span> </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

no argument from me there, but thats always been the case re tanks.

so maybe another approach is look at tanks DM vs bombs?

Edit, El you spammer you! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/crackwhip.gif http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

EJGrOst_Caspar
01-04-2011, 02:50 PM
Tank DM is indeed quite problematic.

M_Gunz
01-04-2011, 02:54 PM
When the right thing that worked changes into the wrong thing that doesn't..
And you've practiced the one down to the reflexes, then you're well trained in 'bad habits'.

It's gonna take longer to change.

TheGrunch
01-04-2011, 03:12 PM
I think anyone that's played a musical instrument or played a sport for a decent period of time can attest that a very strongly ingrained muscle memory is one of the hardest habits of all to change.

Woke_Up_Dead
01-04-2011, 03:26 PM
My first impressions are very positive, nice job TD.

I like the HS-129 German attack plane the most out of the new, flyable planes. The cockpit is very nice, as is the way it handles. The RE-2000 fighter is nice too, I like the manual gunsight that appeared after the primary one got shot out. The two new AI bombers (D0-217 and Cant) look nice too, it's a shame they are not flyable since we could always use more strategic bombers in the game and the SM.79 was done so well for the 4.09 patch.

There are someliers in France and California that can distinguish and describe the differences of all their region's wines based on varietal, vintage, and vineyard. I'm sure there are also players of this game that can do the same for all the Spitfires we now have.

The bombers' gunners seem to be a little less deadly on the few tests that I tried, the 109 and P-51 pilots will now be able to attack bombers without having their glass engines knocked out half the time, that's an improvement.

The G-limits don't make the wings fall off as often as I expected it to, but making your plane creak and groan too much will definitely impact its performance; I couldn't get an A-9 past 450km/h on deck after damaging it in high-G turns. This will definitely add an interesting element to online play; smart players in slower planes will look for B&Zers in fast planes maneuvering too aggressively, knowing that they will then be catcheable.

As for the 2-second fuse I don't think it makes things so much harder as some are suggesting it does. I suspect it's simply a case of players who have refined their bombing tactics to a high level in versions 4.0-4.9, now having a hard time adjusting to something that's quite a lot different, but actually only a bit harder. I drop bombs only occasionally and never really developed a specific approach, speed, etc; no two of my bombing runs ever looked the same. Therefore, I now find skip-bombing to be no different than before; I successfully sank an enemy destroyer with an IL2 a couple of times offline and my overall success rate is about the same as before. Dropping a single bomb on small and tough ground targets is now noticeably harder than before, but that's what rockets, cassette type bombs, and better tactics are for.

My two cents about TD's patches vs mod packs; it's an issue of quality over quantity for me. Yes, there is tons of stuff in UP, and for a few days it was fun trying out all those new planes not available in the official game; but man, there is a lot of ugly crap in that mod pack as well. I uninstalled it after a couple of weeks, and I'm happy that TD comes out with patches that are high quality, well tested, don't take up 3.5 Gigs on my hard drive, don't slow down my framerate, and don't triple the loading time of the game; good work guys.

Finally, a little tip for those that are complaining about needing multiple installs of the game for different patches; you only need one install plus this tip I found on the community help forum:

"Quoted from "bruce" at 1c forum:

"I found a dead simple solution to this.

In your main IL2FB/PF/46 directory, wherever it is, and whatever it's called, create two zip files. I called them "reassert 408.zip" and "reassert 409.zip"

Into these zips place the following files from each patch:

files.SFS
il2_core.dll
il2_corep4.dll
mg_snd.dll
mg_snd_sse.dll

When you want to play under 4.08, simply 'unzip to here'.
When you want to play under 4.09, simply 'unzip to here'.

A quick and painless switch, endlessly repeatable, as far as I can see.

There are probably complications that I am unaware of, and difficulties for others, but it works for me every time.

Regards. "

I also added the FB.exe from each version to the zip file and I have no trouble switching between 4.08, 4.09, and 4.10 this way. (I think that's the name of the file, I'm on my work computer now, it's the one you double-click to start the game)

WTE_Galway
01-04-2011, 03:35 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by VonKlugermon:
Interesting point, Thor about attacking heavily armed ships - maybe 4.XX patch will include realistic damage modeling for ships so you can reduce/eliminate AA fire by strafing/bombing. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Historically should only work on very small ships, destroyers and merchant ships:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> Interview with Joe FOSS, USMC (US Medal of Honor)

http://www.researcheratlarge.com/Aircraft/VMF-121/

Q. Do you feel that fighter strafing is worth while in making the torpedo and bombing attacks more effective?

A. There's a lot of pro and con on that because sometimes it will cost you about 50% of your fighters. You really lose the fighters on that deal. When you do get out and get out alive on a strafing attack on warships, you just aren't good, you're lucky.

Q. It does silence the anti-aircraft?

A. Yes, it does on destroyers and transports, but on cruisers and battleships the anti-aircraft keeps pegging away. The only thing that I silenced on the battleship was pompom guns. The anti-aircraft there was still plenty of that around - I got one hit right under my wing. I had an idea of turning one way but just happened to turn the other way. It hit where I would have been.

</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

VonKlugermon
01-04-2011, 07:40 PM
Awww, but it does work in real life! I imagine on cruisers and battleships it was just more dangerous/difficult because of the greater number of guns. From what I've seen, except for maybe 5-inch guns and larger turrets, AA gunners are pretty exposed (even on the larger ships) and strafing during a bombing or torpedo attack should at least suppress some of the smaller stuff. Not to mention onboard fires would drive the crews from position.

Anyway, it was just a thought!

Willy

M_Gunz
01-04-2011, 08:44 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Woke_Up_Dead:

Finally, a little tip for those that are complaining about needing multiple installs of the game for different patches; you only need one install plus this tip I found on the community help forum:

"Quoted from "bruce" at 1c forum:

"I found a dead simple solution to this.

In your main IL2FB/PF/46 directory, wherever it is, and whatever it's called, create two zip files. I called them "reassert 408.zip" and "reassert 409.zip"

Into these zips place the following files from each patch:

files.SFS
il2_core.dll
il2_corep4.dll
mg_snd.dll
mg_snd_sse.dll

When you want to play under 4.08, simply 'unzip to here'.
When you want to play under 4.09, simply 'unzip to here'.

A quick and painless switch, endlessly repeatable, as far as I can see.

There are probably complications that I am unaware of, and difficulties for others, but it works for me every time.

Regards. "

I also added the FB.exe from each version to the zip file and I have no trouble switching between 4.08, 4.09, and 4.10 this way. (I think that's the name of the file, I'm on my work computer now, it's the one you double-click to start the game) </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Nice!

TheGrunch
01-05-2011, 01:56 AM
Well, having spent a lot of time messing about in a 262 this morning vs. 4 B-17Gs, I can certainly say that if the gunners' performance has been altered, they're still fairly uncanny, catching me about 50% of the time in high-speed beam attacks and even a few 400+ mph head ons at about 10-15 degrees angle-off the nose. Interestingly though, as many others have said I find the G-limits don't affect my flying much at all, even in the 262.

EDIT: Oops, I'd left the AI set to 'Veteran'. Still, Veteran difficulty is about as accurate as I can imagine unguided air gunners achieving against high-speed, high-angle off targets. I dread to think what flying against Ace difficulty would have been like.

DKoor
01-05-2011, 04:53 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by TheGrunch:
Well, having spent a lot of time messing about in a 262 this morning vs. 4 B-17Gs, I can certainly say that if the gunners' performance has been altered, they're still fairly uncanny, catching me about 50% of the time in high-speed beam attacks and even a few 400+ mph head ons at about 10-15 degrees angle-off the nose. Interestingly though, as many others have said I find the G-limits don't affect my flying much at all, even in the 262.

EDIT: Oops, I'd left the AI set to 'Veteran'. Still, Veteran difficulty is about as accurate as I can imagine unguided air gunners achieving against high-speed, high-angle off targets. I dread to think what flying against Ace difficulty would have been like. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Hi mate... B-17 on any settings vs Me-262 is like a chicken vs fox.
They are so easy to down when you are in the pit of 262.

The only problem people may have is that they naturally try to have a comfortable firing solution but in this game that often means also being riddled by Ai gunners.
To avoid that, specifically in 262, fly extremely fast and attack B-17s only from higher positions, otherwise they will turn you into scrap metal.
In short, find the very most uncomfortable position to shot them and fly fast as hell, that usually throws off their aim http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif .

In previous game versions (v4.05) I have been able to shot down 25 ACE B-17s in one mission with Me-262 on realistic settings without time alterations, so one could say that I "found" a way to kill them, so to speak.

http://www.filefactory.com/fil...na262_25b17g_405.zip (http://www.filefactory.com/file/b44e54b/n/kuna262_25b17g_405.zip)

...sure they were deadly, but obviously I didn't gave them much chance http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif .

TheGrunch
01-05-2011, 04:57 AM
Hmm, I'll have to have a look in a minute. I was certainly able to down 4 without much difficulty at all with them set to Rookie, but on Veteran I was getting shot up pretty badly.

DKoor
01-05-2011, 05:46 AM
Don't worry m8... the only thing you need to do really is take a good position.

You have a speedy aircraft take advantage of it.
Also elephant 3cm cannons will make short work of anything, I usually just saw thru bombers with it, regardless of bomber size their wing collapses under fire.

Always attack from favorable position and you will be fine, it is speed as much as your favorable (to gunners very unfavorable) position that will make you victorious.
Simply give up when you aren't in totally dominant position to attack, no.#1 reason whey people get killed during bomber attack missions is lack of patience.

Me-262 pit is very clear it isn't hard to track down bomber when you search for firing solution, adjust your aim with rudder.

Also do not make very long attack runs on same course that makes the gunners adapt (just like The Borg http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif ) and they lock you down.

TheGrunch
01-06-2011, 02:55 AM
Wow, that was inspirational, DKoor. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/11.gif

I was doing the right sort of attacks from the right angles, but without enough of a height advantage, and thus, too slow. I'd set the bombers up at 7500m, y'see, so the 262 wasn't as happy about climbing. I needed to be more patient, as you said.

DKoor
01-06-2011, 07:03 AM
Thanks http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif . If you fly at higher altitudes it usually takes more time to get into position somehow. Anyway, the only real difference is that you're gonna need a bit more time.

And one more thing... use very little stick inputs during pullouts from dives, rather assist yourself with tons of elevator trim up. When you reach more or less vertical-up position set trim on neutral, rinse and repeat.
This way you will lose less energy... in theory it should work same with trim or stick input, but i think this game punishes too much stick input in the cost of more energy wasted. So anytime you can, use trim as it is smoother.

I often see people using combat flaps during combat, but IMO it is usually just a waste of precious energy, in the end, in hot dogfights or else it almost always boils down to who has more energy in the end. So it is always smarter idea to use a lot of trim for sharp turns etc.

Meh... I just write too much http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif .