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medcsu11
08-28-2011, 12:07 AM
I havent complained at all about the stealth system and how it has gone down in the AC series, and this is not a complaint. However, after playing Deus Ex I can say THAT is how a solid stealth game should be and if the cover move system was implemented in AC (along with cover on the roof, ziplines, etc etc) it would be even better then the series currently is.

I say this because wow, the DEx stealth option is so very good.

medcsu11
08-28-2011, 12:07 AM
I havent complained at all about the stealth system and how it has gone down in the AC series, and this is not a complaint. However, after playing Deus Ex I can say THAT is how a solid stealth game should be and if the cover move system was implemented in AC (along with cover on the roof, ziplines, etc etc) it would be even better then the series currently is.

I say this because wow, the DEx stealth option is so very good.

Blind2Society
08-28-2011, 12:11 AM
So you reccommend Dues Ex then? I was debating on trying it out.

Animuses
08-28-2011, 12:12 AM
Imo too many people are worrying about the stealth system, but aren't really ackowledging the economic system. It's out-played, it's boring, change it!
I really liked it in AC2, it was new, not too difficult and I like money.
They used the same system in Brotherhood... It became way too easy and just threw money in your face. It was tedious and I want to punch it.
I'm worrying about the economic system in Revelations. Alex said they added new features to it, but wouldn't that mean it's the same system only with new features?

medcsu11
08-28-2011, 12:27 AM
I would rather not have it so easy to make cash to be honest. I ended ACB and AC2 with so much cash, 100 times more then the total of all items purchased.

And yes, Blind, I have never recommended a game, but I would most certainly do so for Deus Ex. Perfect blend of story, combat, stealth, RP, etc. Excellent title.

Calvarok
08-28-2011, 12:34 AM
Alex said they consolidated it with the Assassin's Dens feature. Which is a good idea. Upgrades purchasable directly from your Assassin Den is cool.

But yeah, Deus Ex looks amazing. However, as I've said before, I think that the edges of roofs are the cover systems of AC. You can do silent takedowns from them, be sure that you'll be undetectable from ahead from them, and the movement system from place on a wall to place on a wall to letting go of the wall to climbing over the wall is very fluid.

However, I do think that a crouch button that makes you move quieter and allows you to take cover without sticking to the wall would be a useful and cool addition to AC.

ShaneO7K
08-28-2011, 04:12 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Blind2Society:
So you reccommend Dues Ex then? I was debating on trying it out. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

It gets repetitive at points and the AI wouldn't be the smartest i've ever seen. There are more issues I have with the game that reviews don't bother to mention.

But yeah the stealth is pretty good, but for it to work well in an AC game a few other things would have to be changed.

Dag_B
08-28-2011, 05:38 AM
There are a lot of games which stealth and hide mechanics are much better than those in assassins creed. Even games like GTA IV. xD
AC just lacks of everything... No crouching, no sneaking... Just walking slow and hanging in roofs out of sight. -.-"

I am happy they included now these bomb with that you can distract the guards and walk away unseen. It's a little bit more handy than the dead bodies in the older games. xD
The sad thing is, from the gameplay we saw yet: There will be no real reason to do that. You can just kill those 100 guards in a minute and walk away... No reason to stay unseen.

Hope they will try something new for AC 3. I mean, if it will really play in a time where shooting weapons are more around you need possibilities to crouch and hide behind walls to not getting shot.

ProdiGurl
08-28-2011, 06:04 AM
I was just at the store yesterday checking that out after seeing a big poster for the game there. That'll be one I play with later when the price drops. I have too many other games I want.

So can I ask what type of stealth you're talking about in detail?
Currently, I'm trying to get this gold mask in ACII, doing racing - now this to me doesn't amount to stealth, it amounts to complete annoyance lol
I HATE RACES in any games - but esp. in this type of game where I wouldn't expect it (in my stereotype ideal of what an assassin is).

Mr_Shade
08-28-2011, 09:13 AM
And here I am running about shooting everyone that moves.. and blowing stuff up...

Jexx21
08-28-2011, 09:33 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Mr_Shade:
And here I am running about shooting everyone that moves.. and blowing stuff up... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Dues Ex is like Assassin's Creed. (Although, the first Dues Ex came out a decade and a few years ago as a PC exclusive, so technically Assassin's Creed is like Dues Ex. But Dues Ex didn't suffer from the same thing as AC or Dues Ex: HR) It offers a lot of ways to accomplish something, but the most direct approach is the fastest and most effective.

RzaRecta357
08-28-2011, 10:15 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Mr_Shade:
And here I am running about shooting everyone that moves.. and blowing stuff up... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's why deus ex rocks so much http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

sassinscreed
08-28-2011, 10:52 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by medcsu11:
I havent complained at all about the stealth system and how it has gone down in the AC series, and this is not a complaint. However, after playing Deus Ex I can say THAT is how a solid stealth game should be and if the cover move system was implemented in AC (along with cover on the roof, ziplines, etc etc) it would be even better then the series currently is.

I say this because wow, the DEx stealth option is so very good. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

in deus ex you use guns
in assassins creed you use swords

deus ex plot is in future
assassins creed plot is in past

so how can you compare them?

Calvarok
08-28-2011, 11:25 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sassinscreed:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by medcsu11:
I havent complained at all about the stealth system and how it has gone down in the AC series, and this is not a complaint. However, after playing Deus Ex I can say THAT is how a solid stealth game should be and if the cover move system was implemented in AC (along with cover on the roof, ziplines, etc etc) it would be even better then the series currently is.

I say this because wow, the DEx stealth option is so very good. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

in deus ex you use guns
in assassins creed you use swords

deus ex plot is in future
assassins creed plot is in past

so how can you compare them? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Because they're both stealth games that allow you to go into open combat if you want to. Deus ex is more challenging in both of those aspects, so it's comparable.

We're not comparing the actual mechanics, just the overall experience.

Dag_B
08-28-2011, 07:38 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Calvarok:
Because they're both stealth games </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Nah. AC should be but isn't.
Since the first game they did their best to remove that part.

They don't even let you find out how to climb certain walls. It's just running from one checkpoint to another. &gt;.&gt;
I remember a part in Brotherhood where I was like "Ok, I'll try to climb there, than jump over there and then... oh, or I'll just walk that white shiny checkpoint." Meh.

AC has more from a jump and run than a stealth game if you ask me. ^^
There is no reason besides the 100% synchronisation tasks to stay unseen. I mean, I could stand a minute behind a corner to get the back of the guard to kill it unseen. Or I'll just run towards the guard and kill the 5 that will follow with a combikillthingy. Doesn't make a difference. Than why wait that minute?


I hope AC 3 will be more like AC1 was... You know, collecting informations and find you own way to assassinate your victim. That with a nice stealth system and the improved sidemissions they tried out in 2, Brotherhood and Revelations would be cool.
I don't like the idea to make it all more linear but more spectacular.

Calvarok
08-28-2011, 11:35 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Dag_B:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Calvarok:
Because they're both stealth games </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Nah. AC should be but isn't.
Since the first game they did their best to remove that part.

They don't even let you find out how to climb certain walls. It's just running from one checkpoint to another. &gt;.&gt;
I remember a part in Brotherhood where I was like "Ok, I'll try to climb there, than jump over there and then... oh, or I'll just walk that white shiny checkpoint." Meh.

AC has more from a jump and run than a stealth game if you ask me. ^^
There is no reason besides the 100% synchronisation tasks to stay unseen. I mean, I could stand a minute behind a corner to get the back of the guard to kill it unseen. Or I'll just run towards the guard and kill the 5 that will follow with a combikillthingy. Doesn't make a difference. Than why wait that minute?


I hope AC 3 will be more like AC1 was... You know, collecting informations and find you own way to assassinate your victim. That with a nice stealth system and the improved sidemissions they tried out in 2, Brotherhood and Revelations would be cool.
I don't like the idea to make it all more linear but more spectacular. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Deus Ex is exactly the same. You can fight to do things quicker, or you can use stealth for extra benefits. Assassin's Creed has missions that force you to remain undetected or fail, so in that case, it's actually more of a stealth game.

Basically: It's a sandbox stealth game with extensive action-adventure elements.

darkghost1995
08-29-2011, 06:14 AM
Dues Ex is definitely a must buy game every element works so well together and there are so many choices for routes

ShaneO7K
08-29-2011, 06:39 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Calvarok:

Deus Ex is exactly the same. You can fight to do things quicker, or you can use stealth for extra benefits. Assassin's Creed has missions that force you to remain undetected or fail, so in that case, it's actually more of a stealth game.

Basically: It's a sandbox stealth game with extensive action-adventure elements. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I was slightly disappointed by Deus Ex, but one feature I find great is being able to go through the game without actually killing anyone not including bosses. Which is similar to MGS4.

Dag_B
08-29-2011, 07:07 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Calvarok:
Deus Ex is exactly the same. You can fight to do things quicker, or you can use stealth for extra benefits. Assassin's Creed has missions that force you to remain undetected or fail, so in that case, it's actually more of a stealth game.

Basically: It's a sandbox stealth game with extensive action-adventure elements. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Wait so every game which has at least one mission that says "stay unseen" is a complete stealthgame in your oppinion?

Really those missions are just a lame excuse because they didn't manage to include real reasons for stealth.

Fighting vs. sneaking should be real options in stealth games. (Or at least, a lot of the missions should include sneaking and stuff.) I fight, get hurt and might have real trouble with that or I choose the longer way where I stay unseen. Both ways should have their advantages and disadvantages. Short vs. long, dangerous vs. safe.

In AC you could fight without having any trouble or walk slowly which takes a lot more time. Why should I choose the longer way if fighting is not a problem and also a very safe way to walk from A to B? Because a message says "Stay unseen"? Yeah, great reason.
Not to mention that most time you do not have that options in the newer games, just run to the checkpoint, no freedom to find your own way.


The Assassins Creed Series is a good series and I like the games but I would love them even more if a could be a sneaky assassins not an imba warmachine. For that I could play... dunno, Prototype?

dxsxhxcx
08-29-2011, 07:38 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Dag_B:
The Assassins Creed Series is a good series and I like the games but I would love them even more if a could be a sneaky assassins not an imba warmachine. For that I could play... dunno, Prototype? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

even in Prototype die is an option, and Prototype's protagonist literally IS a war machine while Ezio is just a human... :P

Dag_B
08-29-2011, 09:34 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by dxsxhxcx:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Dag_B:
The Assassins Creed Series is a good series and I like the games but I would love them even more if a could be a sneaky assassins not an imba warmachine. For that I could play... dunno, Prototype? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

even in Prototype die is an option, and Prototype's protagonist literally IS a war machine while Ezio is just a human... :P </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
That's the point. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif
Even Alex Mercer has more trouble with his given enemies (and he has superduperpowers to deal with those monsters) than Ezio with dozens of guards (and just a normal sword).

Should be more like the other way around...

Ioder
08-29-2011, 11:01 AM
Prototype is a great game, I liked the challenge of it, it is easy to die in that game.

After looking at all of the Deus Ex comments I started looking it up. I. Need. To. Buy. It. Today.

medcsu11
08-29-2011, 12:32 PM
Deus Ex is a great story too.

I dont think the comparison between the two games is outlandish, at all. The "no kill" cheevo isnt hard at all. However, if you REALLY want a challenge (just finished it, have to be super patient and save a LOT), play DE on Hard Mode, without killing anyone (just knock outs), and without setting off ANY alarm.

Now THAT is how a stealth game should be. You can turn turrets/robots against people for kills, but if you're a badass, find a way to just knock everyone out in every area, no exceptions.

Ioder
08-29-2011, 04:59 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by medcsu11:
Deus Ex is a great story too.

I dont think the comparison between the two games is outlandish, at all. The "no kill" cheevo isnt hard at all. However, if you REALLY want a challenge (just finished it, have to be super patient and save a LOT), play DE on Hard Mode, without killing anyone (just knock outs), and without setting off ANY alarm.

Now THAT is how a stealth game should be. You can turn turrets/robots against people for kills, but if you're a badass, find a way to just knock everyone out in every area, no exceptions. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I love playing games like this.