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View Full Version : The philosophical elements of the Ac1 storylines and the failings of later creed ga.



mattnexus
03-01-2011, 12:18 AM
games

I really enjoyed the philosophical jouney that was creed 1. I feel that while creed 2 and brotherhood brought much improvements in storyline that they lacked much of those refinements of the first game. What are others thoughts on this, I would like to offer my thoughts to ubisoft that they should bring back these deeper story moments

such as Al Mualim

What is the truth?" "We place faith in ourselves.We see the world for what it truly is, and hope that one day all of mankind would see the same. " "What is the world?" "The world is an illusion, one to which we can submit, as most do, or transcend." "What does it mean to transcend? " "To recognize that nothing is true and everything is permitted. That laws arise not through divinity but through fate. I realize now that our Creed demands us not to be free, but to be wise."

mattnexus
03-01-2011, 12:18 AM
games

I really enjoyed the philosophical jouney that was creed 1. I feel that while creed 2 and brotherhood brought much improvements in storyline that they lacked much of those refinements of the first game. What are others thoughts on this, I would like to offer my thoughts to ubisoft that they should bring back these deeper story moments

such as Al Mualim

What is the truth?" "We place faith in ourselves.We see the world for what it truly is, and hope that one day all of mankind would see the same. " "What is the world?" "The world is an illusion, one to which we can submit, as most do, or transcend." "What does it mean to transcend? " "To recognize that nothing is true and everything is permitted. That laws arise not through divinity but through fate. I realize now that our Creed demands us not to be free, but to be wise."

Xanatos2007
03-01-2011, 12:32 AM
There's already another thread like this, (http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/5251069024/m/8421061119/p/1) but I do agree. The philosophical aspects of AC1, while not exactly 'cinematic', were one of the best aspects of the game. It's for that reason alone that it still sits in my Top Two Games category.

L0rdeKing
03-01-2011, 12:49 AM
I really enjoyed the special atmosphere that AC1 had - like you are working for a secret organization and such - plus I liked the idea of how Altair's character developed from an arrogant man who seeks to finish his missions in whatever way and mean to a wise man who seeks knowledge and understands the motives of his targets unlike Ezio who was pushed throughout the game by single negative emotion plus I find it hard for a bunch of thieves and courteasans to be trained assassin's but what the hell, it is ubisoft and I really wonder why can't they implement a hand to hand combat style like the one in Batman Arkham Asylum it was really close to the one in AC series and yet more realistic and awesome they were close to it in ACB but alas ruind by the enemy's AI and I still wonder why a game about assassin's lack stealth come on UBI you made splinter cell.
in the end I really liked that special air that AC1 had and wish to feel it again in recent games.

Xanatos2007
03-01-2011, 12:57 AM
Yeah, I sometimes have trouble using punctuation too.

SolidSage
03-01-2011, 01:41 AM
Yeah, take that ^.
Bet you feel sheepish now don't you, Mr Nonpunctuationer? http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

Lignjoslav
03-01-2011, 03:35 AM
Agreed, and the interpretation of the creed in AC2, as explained by Machiavelli during Ezio's initiation, seems to have become much more, well, Machiavellian.

Xanatos2007
03-01-2011, 04:09 AM
The AC2 interpretation seemed a bit shallow when compared to AC1's and they didn't really dwell long enough on the idea to fulfil the "Creed" part of "Assassin's Creed".

Ubidevs, screw the short attention span of the casual gaming audience and show us what you can do with AC as a thought-provoking work of art.

iN3krO
03-01-2011, 04:45 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Xanatos2007:
The AC2 interpretation seemed a bit shallow when compared to AC1's and they didn't really dwell long enough on the idea to fulfil the "Creed" part of "Assassin's Creed".

Ubidevs, screw the short attention span of the casual gaming audience and show us what you can do with AC as a thought-provoking work of art. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

One thing i like on AC:B is that i need to help citzens to they come to my brotherhood (there was something like that on ac1)...

For me ac1 is still better than ac2, at ac2 there's no challenging which make the game unreal, and not to talk about story, at ac1 when you kill ur target, he tells u what he really thinks in the deep of his emotions... at ac2 they just tell u to up -.-''

Ac1 had less mission types and where really repetitive but the philosophical aspect and combat gameplay of ac2 up the game...

<span class="ev_code_RED">Please do not bypass the Language Filter.</span>

heypeter17
03-01-2011, 10:29 AM
I agree with all of you.
AC1 had the best writing hands down.

ThaWhistle
03-01-2011, 10:48 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Lignjoslav:
Agreed, and the interpretation of the creed in AC2, as explained by Machiavelli during Ezio's initiation, seems to have become much more, well, Machiavellian. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

speaking of machiavelli, it seems that the whole "machiavellian" thing might not be a representation of the real machiavelli. Most of his other works are very idealist and republican, whereas the prince seems to go against it. He worked actively in the Florentine republic after the medici left, and when they came back, he didn't exactly get a warm welcome.

it is possible the prince was written more as a satire then as a serious piece of work.


and about AC1, The gameplay was super repetitive and not really varied. However, what was there was damn good, and the story was even better. I think thats what really made it what it was. If it didn't have a good story, it probably would have fallen flat on its face. It would have been "that Prince of Persia spin-off"

And as evidenced by all the awards and nominations hte ACB writers are getting, I think its evident that the big thing driving this series is the story.

the way the assassinations actually built up and then climaxed made them feel alot more important too. In ACII, alot of the venice missions seemed like it was almost a filler. The bonfire of the vanities missions reminded me of AC2 in that you could use cunning and some sort of plan to kill the targets. Having not played ACB yet, I have nothing ot say about that.


When it comes down to it though, AC1 is still my favorite of the series.

Mic_92
03-01-2011, 11:00 AM
I agree. Although AC2 is my favorite, there was something special about AC1 and saddly I didn't see it till the 3rd time I played the game on an HDTV with earphones. It's amazing how I missed more than half of the experience I lacked those two thing.

I also miss the fact that the assassinations have much more weight than in the latter games. I really liked how in the first game the events would start automatically when you arrived at the marker on the map, it made the world feel more alive to me.

Oatkeeper
03-01-2011, 11:16 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by heypeter17:
I agree with all of you.
AC1 had the best writing hands down. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Its not just the writing, Its the narrative as a whole.

You may wonder what the difference is, too keep it simple the narrative for games is not just told through the writing, but through every carefully placed element of the game, including the gameplay mechanics themselves.

For more on Narrative in games I suggest these (the first is more about writing, but it touches on narrative being a factor too):

http://www.escapistmagazine.co...eo-Games-Bad-Writing (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/extra-credits/1887-Video-Games-Bad-Writing)

http://www.escapistmagazine.co...-Narrative-Mechanics (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/extra-credits/2545-Narrative-Mechanics)

crash3
03-01-2011, 02:15 PM
The philosophical conversations with the assassination targets after you kill them also make the characters feel more significant and that it was a real achievement to have killed them-in AC2 and ACB all you get is "I only wanted respect", "Rest in peace"-so them im like oh, i just spent hours building up to this moment and that is all i get for killing this person

Aso i felt that the holographic goddesses in AC2 and ACB just spoke a load of weird riddles that answered no questions as if ubisoft had no idea what to say-i think the holographic goddesses were too farfetched and instead there should just be cryptic writing on a wall in a temple that you activate that Sean Hastings can decrypt then you piece together the story bit by bit-or maybe simply hear a voice speaking to you in the tempe but those holographic images are too farfetched in my opinion for something thats meant to be philosophical

BK-110
03-01-2011, 02:39 PM
That aspect of the first game was great. I loved the whole development with Alta´r beginning to question his and the brotherhood's ways as more and more of the conspiracy was revealed.

ThaWhistle
03-01-2011, 02:41 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by crash3:
The philosophical conversations with the assassination targets after you kill them also make the characters feel more significant and that it was a real achievement to have killed them-in AC2 and ACB all you get is "I only wanted respect", "Rest in peace"-so them im like oh, i just spent hours building up to this moment and that is all i get for killing this person

Aso i felt that the holographic goddesses in AC2 and ACB just spoke a load of weird riddles that answered no questions as if ubisoft had no idea what to say-i think the holographic goddesses were too farfetched and instead there should just be cryptic writing on a wall in a temple that you activate that Sean Hastings can decrypt then you piece together the story bit by bit-or maybe simply hear a voice speaking to you in the tempe but those holographic images are too farfetched in my opinion for something thats meant to be philosophical </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

i forgot about that, when that one guy you kill says "what, were you expecting a confession?" I laughed, and then thought, or nuts, no more plot exposition...

ACHILLES4713
03-01-2011, 04:57 PM
OMG! Yeees! An OP that is on the same page as me! While AC2 and ACB are not terrible games, I think that the franchise is getting a little off track from the vision that Jade Raymond and co. had. Yes, AC1 was a little monotonous, but the story and the writing were sooo good. The assassination conversations with the victims were golden!

DylanJosh9
03-02-2011, 05:55 AM
I also agree with everyone here. AC3 really needs better writing.

IIwangcarsII
03-02-2011, 08:55 AM
I LOVED the atmosphere in AC1! I really hope AC2 has a similar atmosphere, it made the game seem mysterious and fun to play.

mattnexus
03-05-2011, 02:49 PM
I agree with many of the responses, hopefully the writing picks up in ac3,