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MeSkate
10-07-2011, 12:09 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...Plhs4&feature=colike (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2Ma-ePlhs4&feature=colike)
in this video Altair helps a fellow assassin. The assassin asks Altair his name. Altair responds by saing "Altair son of Umar". In arabic Ibn is "son of". So why in the first game do they say that his name is Altair Ibn La-Ahad? Isn't his name maent to be Altair Ibn Umar? (btw for those who don't know, La-Ahad means no one.) When he clearly knows who his father is.

MeSkate
10-07-2011, 12:09 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...Plhs4&feature=colike (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2Ma-ePlhs4&feature=colike)
in this video Altair helps a fellow assassin. The assassin asks Altair his name. Altair responds by saing "Altair son of Umar". In arabic Ibn is "son of". So why in the first game do they say that his name is Altair Ibn La-Ahad? Isn't his name maent to be Altair Ibn Umar? (btw for those who don't know, La-Ahad means no one.) When he clearly knows who his father is.

SleezeRocker
10-07-2011, 12:11 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MeSkate:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...Plhs4&feature=colike (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2Ma-ePlhs4&feature=colike)
in this video Altair helps a fellow assassin. The assassin asks Altair his name. Altair responds by saing "Altair son of Umar". In arabic Ibn is "son of". So why in the first game do they say that his name is Altair Ibn La-Ahad? Isn't his name maent to be Altair Ibn Umar? (btw for those who don't know, La-Ahad means no one.) When he clearly knows who his father is. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If I remember the book Secret Crusades; I think that dad's last name is also Ibn La ahad...but I think it's altair's way of saying "yeah im Umar's son" in a way.

MeSkate
10-07-2011, 01:11 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SleezeRocker:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MeSkate:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...Plhs4&feature=colike (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2Ma-ePlhs4&feature=colike)
in this video Altair helps a fellow assassin. The assassin asks Altair his name. Altair responds by saing "Altair son of Umar". In arabic Ibn is "son of". So why in the first game do they say that his name is Altair Ibn La-Ahad? Isn't his name maent to be Altair Ibn Umar? (btw for those who don't know, La-Ahad means no one.) When he clearly knows who his father is. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If I remember the book Secret Crusades; I think that dad's last name is also Ibn La ahad...but I think it's altair's way of saying "yeah im Umar's son" in a way. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

why would he call himself altair son of no one, when he clearly knowns Umar is his father. He is contradicting himself which is stupid. And that isn't his way of saying I'm Umar's son. Hence Ibn (son of).

eagleforlife1
10-07-2011, 01:14 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MeSkate:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SleezeRocker:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MeSkate:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...Plhs4&feature=colike (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2Ma-ePlhs4&feature=colike)
in this video Altair helps a fellow assassin. The assassin asks Altair his name. Altair responds by saing "Altair son of Umar". In arabic Ibn is "son of". So why in the first game do they say that his name is Altair Ibn La-Ahad? Isn't his name maent to be Altair Ibn Umar? (btw for those who don't know, La-Ahad means no one.) When he clearly knows who his father is. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If I remember the book Secret Crusades; I think that dad's last name is also Ibn La ahad...but I think it's altair's way of saying "yeah im Umar's son" in a way. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

why would he call himself altair son of no one, when he clearly knowns Umar is his father. He is contradicting himself which is stupid. And that isn't his way of saying I'm Umar's son. Hence Ibn (son of). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Because his surname is La'Ahad he didn't choose that surname his name will go back generations. So it may be the founder of the La'Ahad family didn't know who his father was.

MeSkate
10-07-2011, 01:28 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by eagleforlife1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MeSkate:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SleezeRocker:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MeSkate:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...Plhs4&feature=colike (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2Ma-ePlhs4&feature=colike)
in this video Altair helps a fellow assassin. The assassin asks Altair his name. Altair responds by saing "Altair son of Umar". In arabic Ibn is "son of". So why in the first game do they say that his name is Altair Ibn La-Ahad? Isn't his name maent to be Altair Ibn Umar? (btw for those who don't know, La-Ahad means no one.) When he clearly knows who his father is. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If I remember the book Secret Crusades; I think that dad's last name is also Ibn La ahad...but I think it's altair's way of saying "yeah im Umar's son" in a way. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

why would he call himself altair son of no one, when he clearly knowns Umar is his father. He is contradicting himself which is stupid. And that isn't his way of saying I'm Umar's son. Hence Ibn (son of). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Because his surname is La'Ahad he didn't choose that surname his name will go back generations. So it may be the founder of the La'Ahad family didn't know who his father was. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Dude i've got an arab friend an he helped me out, he said that what ever comes after ibn has to be altairs fathers name. Unless altair grandpa was on drugs I dont think someone would name their kid 'no one'. Also arabs don't use second names. (if anyone is offended by me using the term arab plz tell me, im not trying to discriminate.)

misterB2001
10-07-2011, 01:33 AM
Maybe al Mualim manipulates altair to hate his father to the point where he changes his name to ibn la ahad aka son of none. Maybe it will be a sequence in Revelations

MeSkate
10-07-2011, 01:36 AM
u mean son of no one. That could be or Ubisoft has made a mistake with who ever is taught them the arabic.

kriegerdesgottes
10-07-2011, 01:37 AM
Well you may not like it but the reasoning is because his surname is La'ahad. http://assassinscreed.wikia.co...i/Umar_Ibn-La%27Ahad (http://assassinscreed.wikia.com/wiki/Umar_Ibn-La%27Ahad)

ProletariatPleb
10-07-2011, 01:41 AM
In the Gamescom 10min gameplay he said "I did not know him well as a father, he was an Assassin, above all."

He barely knows his father, so maybe he decided to call himself son of none as he doesn't know almost anything about him.

MeSkate
10-07-2011, 01:42 AM
do u guys not understand that in any arabic name in real life or not anything after ibn is not a surname.
For example Marcus ibn Adam
Marcus Fenix's Father is Adam fenix (lol at the example)

MeSkate
10-07-2011, 01:43 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sidspyker24:
In the Gamescom 10min gameplay he said "I did not know him well as a father, he was an Assassin, above all."

He barely knows his father, so maybe he decided to call himself son of none as he doesn't know almost anything about him. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Wow that is a really good explanaion, thanks im going with this.

misterB2001
10-07-2011, 01:46 AM
Which is precisely why he would call himself ibn la ahad if al mualim had turned him against his father.

MeSkate
10-07-2011, 01:52 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by misterB2001:
Which is precisely why he would call himself ibn la ahad if al mualim had turned him against his father. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

this has nothing to do with al mualim, umar was excecuted whne Altair was 11 he barely KNEW his father.

kriegerdesgottes
10-07-2011, 01:56 AM
It even lists Altair's father as Umar ibn La'ahad in the Secret Crusade which is pretty canon.

Assassin_M
10-07-2011, 02:03 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by sidspyker24:
In the Gamescom 10min gameplay he said "I did not know him well as a father, he was an Assassin, above all."

He barely knows his father, so maybe he decided to call himself son of none as he doesn't know almost anything about him. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I was going to say this but you beat me to it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
this is the most likely explanation as Arab names are not written or said like the western ones.
Ibn La Ahad cannot be a family name, its probably a name he chose for himself, so altair`s correct name should be Altair Umar or Altair Ibn Umar, and Altair`s son would be Darim Altair Umar or Darim Ibn Altair Ibn Umar, and Maria should not be called Maria Ibn La Ahad, her name is to remain as it is, Maria Thorpe or Madam Altair, In Arab countries Wives are not given their Husbands` family Name.

misterB2001
10-07-2011, 02:04 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MeSkate:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by misterB2001:
Which is precisely why he would call himself ibn la ahad if al mualim had turned him against his father. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

this has nothing to do with al mualim, umar was excecuted whne Altair was 11 he barely KNEW his father. </div></BLOCKQUOTE> I don't see the relevance? He had a father, why would he claim to not have one just because he didn't know him that well. Doesn't quite make sense to me.

ProletariatPleb
10-07-2011, 02:09 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by misterB2001:
I don't see the relevance? He had a father, why would he claim to not have one just because he didn't know him that well. Doesn't quite make sense to me. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

My explanation is, he's an Assassin, Al Mualim taught that they should be emotionless killing machines(he doesn't say EXACTLY that..clearing up for people like Lightrey &gt;_&gt; :P[joke again]). Read the codex if you don't believe me, he was knows as the 'Angel of Death' among the Brotherhood and he wasn't a very social guy as you know(if you've played AC1).



<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Assassin_M:
I was going to say this but you beat me to it http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif
this is the most likely explanation as Arab names are not written or said like the western ones.
Ibn La Ahad cannot be a family name, its probably a name he chose for himself, so altair`s correct name should be Altair Umar or Altair Ibn Umar, and Altair`s son would be Darim Altair Umar or Darim Ibn Altair Ibn Umar, and Maria should not be called Maria Ibn La Ahad, her name is to remain as it is, Maria Thorpe or Madam Altair, In Arab countries Wives are not given their Husbands` family Name. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Better luck next time brother :P

gharlazufarc
10-07-2011, 02:34 AM
I can understand if the "Ibn La-Ahad" is only used by Altair, so it's like an epithet or something. But the stupid thing is Altair's family also use that name.
That's like saying the name of Charles the Fat's father is Geoffrey the Fat and his son is William the Fat.

itsamea-mario
10-07-2011, 02:40 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by eagleforlife1:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MeSkate:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SleezeRocker:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MeSkate:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v...Plhs4&feature=colike (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2Ma-ePlhs4&feature=colike)
in this video Altair helps a fellow assassin. The assassin asks Altair his name. Altair responds by saing "Altair son of Umar". In arabic Ibn is "son of". So why in the first game do they say that his name is Altair Ibn La-Ahad? Isn't his name maent to be Altair Ibn Umar? (btw for those who don't know, La-Ahad means no one.) When he clearly knows who his father is. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If I remember the book Secret Crusades; I think that dad's last name is also Ibn La ahad...but I think it's altair's way of saying "yeah im Umar's son" in a way. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

why would he call himself altair son of no one, when he clearly knowns Umar is his father. He is contradicting himself which is stupid. And that isn't his way of saying I'm Umar's son. Hence Ibn (son of). </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Because his surname is La'Ahad he didn't choose that surname his name will go back generations. So it may be the founder of the La'Ahad family didn't know who his father was. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

That's not how Arabic names work.

MeSkate
10-07-2011, 02:41 AM
hey assassin m thast what i've been trying to say since the begining

ProletariatPleb
10-07-2011, 02:44 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by gharlazufarc:
I can understand if the "Ibn La-Ahad" is only used by Altair, so it's like an epithet or something. But the stupid thing is Altair's family also use that name.
That's like saying the name of Charles the Fat's father is Geoffrey the Fat and his son is William the Fat. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Unfortunately, the game is about Alta´r, not Umar, so either we'll know about it in revelations, or never.

MeSkate
10-07-2011, 02:44 AM
guys this is sorta off topic but how do i put a picture as my signiture, sorry imnew to the forums.

Assassin_M
10-07-2011, 02:49 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MeSkate:
guys this is sorta off topic but how do i put a picture as my signiture, sorry imnew to the forums. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
You have to upload it on an Image host website like Imageshack and then copy the link to your uploaded Pic and put it between these your pic

MeSkate
10-07-2011, 02:51 AM
thanks

Assassin_M
10-07-2011, 02:56 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MeSkate:
thanks </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You are most welcome http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif waiting to see what it looks like http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

MeSkate
10-07-2011, 02:57 AM
well here it is, not so epic but alright.

Assassin_M
10-07-2011, 03:01 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by MeSkate:
it didn't work </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Due to strict forum rules lets continue this on Private Messaging.

CFord664
10-07-2011, 04:47 PM
It could also be tied to the Taqiyya, the Muslim tradition of hiding the truth to avoid persecution (a rather smart tradition, IMO). Alta´r could have changed his name to hide who his father is and reduce attempts by his enemies to use his familial ties against him.

Sarari
10-07-2011, 05:11 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by CFord664:
It could also be tied to the Taqiyya, the Muslim tradition of hiding the truth to avoid persecution (a rather smart tradition, IMO). Alta´r could have changed his name to hide who his father is and reduce attempts by his enemies to use his familial ties against him. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
That right there is one hell of an explanation. Very well thought out. Also, he might have changed his name because he didn't know his father well enough so he just decided to say Ibn-La Ahad.

Serrachio
10-07-2011, 05:20 PM
Or, from a more real-world perspective, we did not know of Altair's father until the release of the Secret Crusade, which came after Assassin's Creed 1 was released.

With that in mind, it would be a lot easier for us to address Altair as Ibn La-Ahad, as it is the name we came across first.

dxsxhxcx
10-07-2011, 06:11 PM
maybe Altair didn't see a purpose in carrying his father's name since the assassins weren't allowed to have a closer relashionship with their parents

MeSkate
10-07-2011, 06:27 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by CFord664:
It could also be tied to the Taqiyya, the Muslim tradition of hiding the truth to avoid persecution (a rather smart tradition, IMO). Alta´r could have changed his name to hide who his father is and reduce attempts by his enemies to use his familial ties against him. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

thats an excellent explanation.

Chamboozer
10-07-2011, 07:30 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by CFord664:
It could also be tied to the Taqiyya, the Muslim tradition of hiding the truth to avoid persecution (a rather smart tradition, IMO). Alta´r could have changed his name to hide who his father is and reduce attempts by his enemies to use his familial ties against him. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Or, more likely he just changed his name because he felt like it. It's not like there's some law that says he needs to keep his name in the 'son b. father' format.

Calvarok
10-07-2011, 09:29 PM
MAybe Arabic names worked a little differently back then, or the Assassins have a different naming structure than the rest o the world.

ace3001
10-07-2011, 09:37 PM
IMO, it's simply cause at first, Altair's father wasn't gonna be brought into the fray, and to add to the "air of mystery" surrounding Altair, they called him "son of none".
And then whoever who wrote the character of Umar didn't quite grasp how Arabic names work, and called him Umar Ibn La-Ahad as if "Ibn La-Ahad" was a family name.

Animuses
10-07-2011, 09:47 PM
They should've never included his father in any form, it's quite pointless.

ace3001
10-07-2011, 09:54 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Animuses:
They should've never included his father in any form, it's quite pointless. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>I doubt he'll be in the game, other than for the "son of Umar" part. He's just given some attention in the novel, Assassin's Creed: Secret Crusade.

Animuses
10-07-2011, 09:58 PM
I know, but some things just need to be untouched.

LightRey
10-08-2011, 04:19 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Calvarok:
MAybe Arabic names worked a little differently back then, or the Assassins have a different naming structure than the rest o the world. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Well wasn't Alta´r's mother a Christian? Maybe that's got something to do with it.

ace3001
10-08-2011, 04:50 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LightRey:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Calvarok:
MAybe Arabic names worked a little differently back then, or the Assassins have a different naming structure than the rest o the world. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Well wasn't Alta´r's mother a Christian? Maybe that's got something to do with it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>What would that have to do with it? You mean she wanted her husband's "surname" to continue as a family name? Highly unlikely. I'm certain that we're just giving excuses to what is actually one of the few minor flaws in the AC universe and characters. Altair Ibn La'Ahad was obviously named so in order to increase his "mysteriousness", and the La'Ahad part could have been actually added later, even after his father's death. But the writer of Umar's character messed this up by not understanding Arabic naming conventions.

LightRey
10-08-2011, 04:52 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by kolitha.kuruppu:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by LightRey:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Calvarok:
MAybe Arabic names worked a little differently back then, or the Assassins have a different naming structure than the rest o the world. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Well wasn't Alta´r's mother a Christian? Maybe that's got something to do with it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>What would that have to do with it? You mean she wanted her husband's "surname" to continue as a family name? Highly unlikely. I'm certain that we're just giving excuses to what is actually one of the few minor flaws in the AC universe and characters. Altair Ibn La'Ahad was obviously named so in order to increase his "mysteriousness", and the La'Ahad part could have been actually added later, even after his father's death. But the writer of Umar's character messed this up by not understanding Arabic naming conventions. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
You're probably right.

Jcray21
02-21-2012, 10:17 PM
I hate to bump this but reading some of the comments are completely ridiculous. First, Arab, East African, names do not have surnames no matter the religion. So Altair should be ibn Umar, and Umar should be Ibn who ever his father was. Second, In Islam it is forbidden to not take your fathers, biological, name. Even if someone is adopted they take the name of their biological father. Now, as far as the issue of Altair being Muslim it can not be clear because it is a fantasy video game. In reality the Assassins were a real thing, they existed around the time set in the AC 1. It was a Shia sect of Islam. Now if Altair and the Assassins in the AC 1 are part of this order than there is NO CHANCE that a Shia would be named Umar. Umar is a common Sunni Muslim name because it is a name of the 2nd Kalifa and close companion of the Prophet Muhammad. Shia's consider Umar to be an usurper and many to be an apostate and would not name their child after him.

The fact is this is an error in the story of AC, it should be Altair ibn Umar. Clearly the makers of the game or writers of storyline don't know how the naming structure of the Middle East and East Africa work. But, given that the Assassins in the game don't seem to have a religion, if you don't take the obvious references to Islam in Masayf, than perahps it is just part of the Assassin identity in the the story line, but if that is the case all Assassins at that time should be Ibn La-Ahad.

JumpInTheFire13
02-22-2012, 02:11 AM
There was a big debate about this on the AC Wiki, it was a lot more comprehensive

The13Doctors
02-22-2012, 02:52 AM
It wasn't a referenec to his last name, not a direct one anyways, that was the day he became famous, therefore at that point he wasn't, so when Altair said his surname the other Assassin recognized it because of Umar, which is Altair's father. Quite simple really. Umar is Altair's Father so he was called for it.

How is this an active topic? It's quite simple.

LightRey
02-22-2012, 08:42 AM
I hate to bump this but reading some of the comments are completely ridiculous. First, Arab, East African, names do not have surnames no matter the religion. So Altair should be ibn Umar, and Umar should be Ibn who ever his father was. Second, In Islam it is forbidden to not take your fathers, biological, name. Even if someone is adopted they take the name of their biological father. Now, as far as the issue of Altair being Muslim it can not be clear because it is a fantasy video game. In reality the Assassins were a real thing, they existed around the time set in the AC 1. It was a Shia sect of Islam. Now if Altair and the Assassins in the AC 1 are part of this order than there is NO CHANCE that a Shia would be named Umar. Umar is a common Sunni Muslim name because it is a name of the 2nd Kalifa and close companion of the Prophet Muhammad. Shia's consider Umar to be an usurper and many to be an apostate and would not name their child after him.

The fact is this is an error in the story of AC, it should be Altair ibn Umar. Clearly the makers of the game or writers of storyline don't know how the naming structure of the Middle East and East Africa work. But, given that the Assassins in the game don't seem to have a religion, if you don't take the obvious references to Islam in Masayf, than perahps it is just part of the Assassin identity in the the story line, but if that is the case all Assassins at that time should be Ibn La-Ahad.

Alta´r isn't Muslim.

Gold333
03-06-2012, 05:19 AM
Alta´r isn't Muslim.

Lol, that's ridiculous.

He's a Syrian man in the 12th century, what did you think he was Jewish?

Read up on Nizari Ismaili muslims. The assassins were mercenaries belonging to a sect of the Shi'a branch of Islam.

Today they would unequivocally be called terrorists.

Funny how the same thing is considered either a national source of hatred and a rolemodel at the same time isn't it?

The13Doctors
03-06-2012, 05:28 AM
Lol, that's ridiculous.

He's a Syrian man in the 12th century, what did you think he was Jewish?

Read up on Nizari Ismaili muslims. The assassins were mercenaries belonging to a sect of the Shi'a branch of Islam.

Today they would unequivocally be called terrorists.

Funny how the same thing is considered either a national source of hatred and a rolemodel at the same time isn't it?

Assassins were of no religion. They knew the truth, that religion is part of a plan by Templars to separate and control people. Altair was an Assassin (Religion)

Or something like that.

Assassins aren't restricted to the bindings of religion.

Calvarok
03-06-2012, 05:33 AM
Actually, Assassin's in Al Mualim's time were Muslim.

The13Doctors
03-06-2012, 05:35 AM
Actually, Assassin's in Al Mualim's time were Muslim.

Al Mualim was the one who shared those teachings.

Calvarok
03-06-2012, 05:55 AM
Yeah, I'm just saying. And you don't have to be atheist to be an Assassin. Assassin's don't say that believing in a higher power is definitely false, but that using those beliefs as an excuse for doing terrible things or oppressing people, or covering up the truth, that is unacceptable. There are Assassins who believe in God, but what they oppose are the systems of control perpetrated by organized religious organizations like the Catholic church. And if I were in the AC universe, I don't think that the revelation that humanity was created by a previous race would make me believe any differently about whether or not there is something out there bigger than myself.

It's not like AC has ever bluntly said "100% for sure, nothing happens when you die". It's not about pushing beliefs on anyone, atheistic or otherwise. It's saying that putting blind faith in what authority tells you can be dangerous, because they have their own agenda, and don't know for sure what the purpose of life is any more than you do.

EvanKutz
03-06-2012, 06:10 AM
Well said, Calvarok.

The13Doctors
03-06-2012, 06:11 AM
Never said they were athiest. They just weren't religious. Gods in the AC world are TWCB. Afterlife has nothing to do with it.

Altair was of no religion, as he knew the truth.

pirate1802
03-06-2012, 06:52 AM
Never said they were athiest. They just weren't religious. Gods in the AC world are TWCB. Afterlife has nothing to do with it.

Altair was of no religion, as he knew the truth.

This. Pretty sure both the Assassins and Templars were agnostic.

Calvarok
03-06-2012, 06:57 AM
It is true that most major AC religions were inspired by TWCB or people with PoEs, which does indeed mean that neither the Assassins or Templars could be counted as being of any recognized faith. However, the idea of belief in an afterlife or greater purpose is not suddenly unviable simply because most major organized religons were misinterpretations or falsifications of past events.

LightRey
03-06-2012, 11:04 AM
Lol, that's ridiculous.

He's a Syrian man in the 12th century, what did you think he was Jewish?

Read up on Nizari Ismaili muslims. The assassins were mercenaries belonging to a sect of the Shi'a branch of Islam.

Today they would unequivocally be called terrorists.


Funny how the same thing is considered either a national source of hatred and a rolemodel at the same time isn't it?

You do realize that the Assassin Order in the games is radically different from the order irl, right? We already know that Alta´r wasn't Muslim. He basically says he doesn't believe in any god in AC1 in fact.

GeneralTrumbo
03-06-2012, 11:06 AM
You do realize that the Assassin Order in the games is radically different from the order irl, right? We already know that Alta´r wasn't Muslim. He basically says he doesn't believe in any god in AC1 in fact.
Can you please quote what he said? I haven't played AC1 in a while.

LightRey
03-06-2012, 12:13 PM
Can you please quote what he said? I haven't played AC1 in a while.

I can't from the top of my head. I do remember this one quote where he refers to "[Sibrand's] God" (so not his own), but that's not saying much. Regardless, I think anyone who's played the games could see that he wasn't particularly religious.