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View Full Version : (temp thread) =VELOCITY GRAPH READING 101= by Tagert



LEXX_Luthor
09-08-2004, 12:17 AM
Couldn't read the original thread, and to compare text with grafs in different click windows instead of scrolling up/down left/right...


TAGERT reported:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>When I first started looking at some of the SPEED reports posted here in this forum I noticed that a lot of people were having trouble getting a *feel* for the raw numbers. I thought to myself, a graph of those numbers would really help a lot of people *see* what the *numbers* are trying to tell them. And for the most part the graphs do just that.. But there is still a small group of people who are struggling with the graphs. It appears that they are having problems looking at a *velocity* graph and realizing how little differences in speed (velocity) will effect the distance (position) between two objects.

That combined with people not realizing that one mans trash is another mans treasure. That is to say what you *think* of as FAST when you see the word FAST may cause another person to *think* of something totally different.

For example, if you walk up to a guy who drives dragsters and tell him "My car is really FAST!" In your mind you thinking your 1972 Datsun B-210 doing 80mph down hill is pretty darn FAST! Where as the image in the mind of the dragster driver is thinking 300mph is 5 seconds is fast. It is not until you both sit down and compare notes that the drag racer will stand up laughing and walk away from you! Wink But at least the two of you have now compared numbers and thus calibrated the word fast between the two of you.

So, in the hopes of helping the few people left who still don't realize how BIG an effect a LITTLE speed DIFFERENCE can effect SEPARATION over time... I present the following.

VELOCITY GRAPH READING 101
At the end of this course you should be able to look at a velocity graph and realize that even though the SPEED is NOT very different between planes the SEPARATION can be!

PICK A SPEED.. Say 650km/h

http://www.geocities.com/grantsenn/divetests/CLASS101/HOW2READGRAPHS_650kmh.jpg

The P47 reached 650km/h in 30.50
The 190 reached 650km/h in 32.00
The 109 reached 650km/h in 36.00

NOTE: Even though the time difference between the P47 and 190 is only 1.50sec.. The SEPARATION at 32sec is 135 meters. And at 32sec the P47's velocity is now 666km/h to the 190s 650km/h.. A speed difference of 16km/h

NOTE: Even though the time difference between the P47 and 109 is only 5.50sec.. The SEPARATION at 36sec is 338 meters. And at 36sec the P47's velocity is now 708km/h to the 109s 650.00km/h.. A speed difference of 58km/h

So, it should be CLEAR that a LITTLE speed DIFFERENCE makes a BIG difference in SEPARATION


PICK A TIME.. Say 35sec

http://www.geocities.com/grantsenn/divetests/CLASS101/HOW2READGRAPHS_35sec.jpg

At 35.00 seconds the P47 velocity is 697.48 km/h
At 35.00 seconds the 190 velocity is 684.13 km/h
At 35.00 seconds the 109 velocity is 642.43 km/h

NOTE: Even though the velocity difference between the P47 and 190 is only 13.35km/h at 35.00sec.. The SEPARATION at 35.00sec is 148 meters.

NOTE: Even though the velocity difference between the P47 and 109 is only 55.05km/h at 35.00sec.. The SEPARATION at 35.00sec is 323 meters.

So, it should be CLEAR that a LITTLE time DIFFERENCE makes a BIG difference in SEPARATION

Class dismissed<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

LEXX_Luthor
09-08-2004, 12:17 AM
Couldn't read the original thread, and to compare text with grafs in different click windows instead of scrolling up/down left/right...


TAGERT reported:: <BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>When I first started looking at some of the SPEED reports posted here in this forum I noticed that a lot of people were having trouble getting a *feel* for the raw numbers. I thought to myself, a graph of those numbers would really help a lot of people *see* what the *numbers* are trying to tell them. And for the most part the graphs do just that.. But there is still a small group of people who are struggling with the graphs. It appears that they are having problems looking at a *velocity* graph and realizing how little differences in speed (velocity) will effect the distance (position) between two objects.

That combined with people not realizing that one mans trash is another mans treasure. That is to say what you *think* of as FAST when you see the word FAST may cause another person to *think* of something totally different.

For example, if you walk up to a guy who drives dragsters and tell him "My car is really FAST!" In your mind you thinking your 1972 Datsun B-210 doing 80mph down hill is pretty darn FAST! Where as the image in the mind of the dragster driver is thinking 300mph is 5 seconds is fast. It is not until you both sit down and compare notes that the drag racer will stand up laughing and walk away from you! Wink But at least the two of you have now compared numbers and thus calibrated the word fast between the two of you.

So, in the hopes of helping the few people left who still don't realize how BIG an effect a LITTLE speed DIFFERENCE can effect SEPARATION over time... I present the following.

VELOCITY GRAPH READING 101
At the end of this course you should be able to look at a velocity graph and realize that even though the SPEED is NOT very different between planes the SEPARATION can be!

PICK A SPEED.. Say 650km/h

http://www.geocities.com/grantsenn/divetests/CLASS101/HOW2READGRAPHS_650kmh.jpg

The P47 reached 650km/h in 30.50
The 190 reached 650km/h in 32.00
The 109 reached 650km/h in 36.00

NOTE: Even though the time difference between the P47 and 190 is only 1.50sec.. The SEPARATION at 32sec is 135 meters. And at 32sec the P47's velocity is now 666km/h to the 190s 650km/h.. A speed difference of 16km/h

NOTE: Even though the time difference between the P47 and 109 is only 5.50sec.. The SEPARATION at 36sec is 338 meters. And at 36sec the P47's velocity is now 708km/h to the 109s 650.00km/h.. A speed difference of 58km/h

So, it should be CLEAR that a LITTLE speed DIFFERENCE makes a BIG difference in SEPARATION


PICK A TIME.. Say 35sec

http://www.geocities.com/grantsenn/divetests/CLASS101/HOW2READGRAPHS_35sec.jpg

At 35.00 seconds the P47 velocity is 697.48 km/h
At 35.00 seconds the 190 velocity is 684.13 km/h
At 35.00 seconds the 109 velocity is 642.43 km/h

NOTE: Even though the velocity difference between the P47 and 190 is only 13.35km/h at 35.00sec.. The SEPARATION at 35.00sec is 148 meters.

NOTE: Even though the velocity difference between the P47 and 109 is only 55.05km/h at 35.00sec.. The SEPARATION at 35.00sec is 323 meters.

So, it should be CLEAR that a LITTLE time DIFFERENCE makes a BIG difference in SEPARATION

Class dismissed<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

LEXX_Luthor
09-08-2004, 12:36 AM
Awsum grafs Tag.

Rather slim differences--BUT--all three fighters here are supposed to be "well diving" aircraft overall. Need dive grafs for Yak~3 vs Fw~190A9 or other reportedely poor-diving "light" vs well-diving "heavy" fighters.

That is what they are Whining about.

May not be advisable to extrapolate your grafs to La~7 vs P~47D27 or Spit vs P~47D27. Need to conduct these tests too.


Thanks

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