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cueceleches
01-25-2005, 08:52 AM
Hi!

I´m well into a BOE campaign with the Mustang. I started with Operation Overlord with mostly CAP and CAS missions and now I´ve moved with the front to almost the German border. Since then, all my missions have been escort the Fortresses to Berlin and surroundings, and til now haven´t fought but 109s and 190s. But in the last 2 missios, 110s have appeard also, and I´m having trouble downing them, as the rear gunners seem to be more like snipers.
I´ve tried various tactics: dive hard from above, climb from their bottom, etc...and still they manage to shoot my engine. It seems that high deflection shoots do work, but are terribly hard to achieve, as well as head ons.
What tactics do you usually try when attacking aircraft with rear gunners??? I would appreciate some help!

Thanks!

deckchair5
01-25-2005, 09:55 AM
You have the answers. Get on their six and you're caned. Too easy. Pick your target. Plan your approach path and safe exit zone. Takes ages to set up attack position so patience! It's all in the set up. Then get close, even CLOSER. Aim for the max effected areas of the target, no spray and pray. Exit to your safe zone, scan, plan and set up again

Excellent stuff here http://mywebpages.comcast.net/Tailspin/index.htm

icrash
01-25-2005, 09:58 AM
A lot depends on the plane being attacked. Head to head gives the best shot at the pilot and knocking out the opposing plane. The 110 I'd give the edge to because all its guns are in the nose (doesn't spread as much when target closes in than wingmount guns) and would probably hit from the side. It would force the pilot to turn in to get his guns on target on turn away to get rear gunner on target. Boom & zoom from an angle to keep the rear gunner from having a clean shot. This may also give you a chance to hit from below when climbing back up. Some you just have to face the gunner & hope you are better. This is a B-17 field of fire, you face at least one gunner at all times. Add to this other gunners if they are in formation.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v117/icrash/fieldofire.bmp
Good luck with your gunnery.

cueceleches
01-25-2005, 10:04 AM
The most logic approach, from my pint of view, should be from under its belly, and exiting the attack by rolling and diving again before entering the rear gunner fire zone. But it seems that in the sim ,the fire zone of the gunner is way exaggerated, being able to shoot aiming quite down.
If I understand well, the best way is the deflection shot, but at high angles (let´s say between 45º and 90º) which is way too difficult. I don´t find great difficulty positioning myself for a good attack, as my P51 is way faster than the 110, but the attack itself is a problem, and I find myself trying to put a 0.5 secs burst in the wing root or engines in order to make the most damage possible. Nevertheless, 90% of the time, the evasive maneuvers from the 110 frustrates my good setup.

Well, I guess no one ever said that aerial gunnery is easy!!

arrow80
01-25-2005, 10:20 AM
cueceleches: If you have problems with gunners in bombers and don't like it to be that challenging you have the option in conf.ini under:
[DGEN]
MaxBomberSkill=X
where you can set maximum bomber skill and thus also gunner skill in dgen campaigns. 0 - rookie,1-average, etc.
I don't have problems to kill bombers with fast and angled slashing attacks, or head-on attacks which resemble to some point historical reality.
Now the gunners are challenging but anyone who wants can dumb them down and shoot them like ducks...I don't want to.

cueceleches
01-25-2005, 10:31 AM
Thanks Arrow, but I don´t want to tune them down, as the fun is the challenge. The fact is that I am much more skillful against B17s though they should be more difficult because of the gunnery concentration against the fighter. It is just the 110 which I find more difficult, but it doesn´t mean at all I don´t like it, but the opposite. The more difficulties I find in the sim, the more I enjoy trying to figure better tactics out. That´s why I like to learn from other people´s experencies.

TgD Thunderbolt56
01-25-2005, 10:43 AM
High deflection slash attacks.

Most peeps don't have the patience or desire to get proper position. If you do though, you'll live ALOT longer, be sure.

TB

the_pool_guy
01-25-2005, 11:08 AM
It all depends on you but I avoid head-on attacks with the Me-110 - it possesses awesome front firepower and is also decently armoured. I prefer slashing attacks and generally aim for an engine which catch fire fairly easily, or the cockpit. But my favourite tactic - if unknown to the 110 - is to tag along under its belly and line-up for the killer shot. It's an old WW1 tactic much loved by Albert Ball and it does the job. Just make sure you fill her up with plenty of lead and cannon shot. She'll fall to the ground...

Jay

civildog
01-25-2005, 10:05 PM
The real Luftwaffe pilots found that the optimum attack angle against the B-17 was a diving attack directly toawrds the cockpit at a steep angle. It's very effective in the game, too.

You fly high above and past the bombers until you get far enough in front and above them that you can then roll over and down towards them, aiming at the cockpit. This means the only guns that will have a clear shot at you will be the dorsal turret. And you will be pounding the pilots and navigator/bombadier with your guns.

From this angle you can also aim at the inboard engine nacelles. Set your convergences for 500 meters so you can get good hits without diving through the formation. Although, if I'm really moving diving through and then zooming away to climb back for another run from the front often works.

It seemed to work for the real pilots. Until we get Rammjaegers in the game that's how I do it in a FW A-8. Otherwise attacking B-17's from any rear aspect is just slow suicide.

civildog
01-25-2005, 10:08 PM
For 110's I just stay under and to the side while pounding on the engines since they catch fire so easily. They seem pretty vulnerable that way, and I have even seen the rear gunner shoot pieces off his tail trying to get at me!