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Chevy350
03-23-2009, 01:47 PM
im thinking of getting track ir, and have a few questions.

does it slow down your frame rate? i dont have a very good computer and im afraid it could make it unplayable.

is the headset clip worth getting? cause id rather not wear a hat but i dont want it to perform worse than the regular hat system.

is there any known website thats cheaper than here: http://www.naturalpoint.com/trackir/

and also i remember ive seen an ad somewhere on the internet a few times that gives you 10% or 10 dollars off. or something. anyone know where that is?

Chevy350
03-23-2009, 01:47 PM
im thinking of getting track ir, and have a few questions.

does it slow down your frame rate? i dont have a very good computer and im afraid it could make it unplayable.

is the headset clip worth getting? cause id rather not wear a hat but i dont want it to perform worse than the regular hat system.

is there any known website thats cheaper than here: http://www.naturalpoint.com/trackir/

and also i remember ive seen an ad somewhere on the internet a few times that gives you 10% or 10 dollars off. or something. anyone know where that is?

Bearcat99
03-23-2009, 02:02 PM
I run an AMD Fx-60 w 4G DDR400 on a 9800GTX.. I get no frame loss from TIR...

The headset clip is not worth the money...

$10 TIR discount (http://www.naturalpoint.com/trackir/promo/promo_landing.html?promoname=hyperlobby)

So thats $120 for a TIR4 .......... that's your best bet that I know of........

noobisoft
03-23-2009, 02:08 PM
Hi Chevy350,

I'll leave the frame rate question for others more knowledgeable than I, though I've not noticed it slowing down my game play.

I bought mine as the TrackIR + ProClip bundle from NaturalPoint several months ago and I do not regret it. FYI, there are free / low cost homemade options available out there, but they are apparently forbidden to name on this forum.

A few points I'd not heard of prior to buying mine follow. I'd caution that there is a very slight delay with TrackIR between when you move your head and when the view shifts. You get used to this quickly and I suspect most users don't even notice it any more. Another other issue is that if you use the infrared LED ProClip (which I think is better than the hat mounted reflectors), you will need to position the sensor slightly off center on your monitor. (On the same side you wear your clip on.) This has an impact that makes using the 6DOF mod a little odd in that you have to relate your motion to the location of the sensor, not the center of your monitor.

You will also have to adjust the light sensitivity in the NaturalPoint software to get full range and smooth results.

Though not perfect, I consider TrackIR a worthwhile purchase.

Cheers

TheFamilyMan
03-23-2009, 03:55 PM
With my TrackIR4 there is no noticable impact on FPS, though I use a dual core 4200+. As for the response lag spoken to above, I've never noticed any ever though I'm not a twitch-master gamer either. I also agree that the Pro clip is optional. The regular clip fits also nicely onto the top of most headphones/headsets; that's how I wear it with my senn 959 headphones.

Congrats on your decision to get a TrackIR. Its impact on IL-2 enjoyment and immersion is beyond compare. With a lttle time, you will swear that you moved your head to look at exactly where your TrackIR enhanced view is showing.

ytareh
03-23-2009, 04:06 PM
This is ESSENTIAL hardware.I think I would quit IL2 if I had to go back to flying without TIR3 Pro (4 not needed if youre on a budget although Vector Expansion -a clip with 3 reflective pads that goes on the hat brim)
I would prefer go back many many graphics cards than give up my TIR ...Just get it !

Choctaw111
03-23-2009, 04:25 PM
The TrackIR enhances Il2 way more than a good joystick, in my opinion. A good stick is nice, but a TrackIR is way better.
The TrackIR software has such a small "footprint" that there is no FPS loss and the "immersion factor" goes through the roof with the TrackIR.

Stiletto-
03-23-2009, 04:40 PM
What Choctaw said.. A half decent joystick is essential, but a Track IR is much more important than a top of the line flight control IMO.

I still have my old TrackIR 2, hmm that was 5 years and 3 months ago I got that.. I have thought about upgrading my version but it was never necessary for IL-2 before it had the 6 DOF.. I am wondering if a TrackIR 5 will ever come out.. I would hold off for that, I remember less than a year after I got my TrackIR2 the 3 came out.. I felt outdated http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

ash1976
03-24-2009, 03:31 PM
I'm thinking along the TrackIR line too (once I'm better organised with stick/throttles).

I see the comment above about TrackIR3 and 4 and 6DOF ...

Can someone explain the differences (if any) between these??!! Price/availability/functions?

Not intending to hijack your thread Chevy350 & hope any answers will help you too http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/25.gif , just hoping for some xtra info now the oracles are speakin http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

thanks,

Ash

Jabout
03-24-2009, 03:50 PM
It does have a bearing on frame rates, in that if you don't have V-Sync on you will be prone to tearing and jaggies.

Nevertheless, you just have to get it (and persevere for a few hours till you get the right settings/calibration for you and just get used to the motion).

tagTaken2
03-24-2009, 04:14 PM
I never noticed a hit on framerates with my last PC, P4 1.7GHz, if that helps.

Tir is too expensive for what it is, but once you've got it, you can't go back.

I've also never noticed a lag, I'm thinking the poster might need to adjust something?

Fur_Cough
03-27-2009, 06:06 AM
I started off with one of the free software+webcam based head trackers (can't recall which one) and made my own LED trackclip type thing. This did have a hit on framerates (single core AMD 2800 + Radeon 9800), but was a great way to try out head tracking.

Then I bought a 2nd hand TIR3 with trackclip pro from ebay, and it's FANTASTIC. Very little lag or framerate issues (since TIR hardware does a lot of the processing).

TIR3 doesn't have the 6DOF vector expansion out-of-the-box, nor does it support trackclip pro, but you can pay to upgrade - mine came with upgrade already. There may be some slight performance improvements with TIR4, but I doubt I'd notice. Don't bother with a TIR2 though.

TrackClip pro isn't that great IMHO. It's a bit flimsy, got to be plugged in to USB (yet another dangly wire to deal with) AND you've got to wear headphones, but I don't have the alternative so can't compare performance.

Now I've got a Quad 6600 and Geforce 9800GTX+, everything is maxed out, no tearing, and no framerate issues.

If you don't want to spend the cash, hunt down a second hand one, while trying out one of the free ones. But actually, that's a lot of hassle and if you have the cash, you won't regret the spend.

alphalvr
03-27-2009, 06:56 AM
well ive been playing a downloaded scripted campaign where there is a lot of activity.

on the qmb with 6 planes i get 60fps 90% of the time but on some of these scripted nazi invasions over britain my fps fell to a staggering 10-15 fps with all the in game options maxed at the resolution 1 below 1600/1200.

to be honest i expected my tir bto be a slideshow but that still seemed very smoth in its operation, very impressive!

Woke_Up_Dead
03-27-2009, 01:25 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Fur_Cough:
I started off with one of the free software+webcam based head trackers (can't recall which one) and made my own LED trackclip type thing. This did have a hit on framerates (single core AMD 2800 + Radeon 9800), but was a great way to try out head tracking.

Then I bought a 2nd hand TIR3 with trackclip pro from ebay, and it's FANTASTIC. Very little lag or framerate issues (since TIR hardware does a lot of the processing).
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Hey Fur_Cough, what kind of a hit on framerates did you get with your free, home-made version? And how much better is TIR3, not only in terms of framerates but in overall performance and experience?

Fur_Cough
03-30-2009, 05:25 AM
I didn't do a specific test, but I guess it was about a 20% drop in frame rates, down from a smooth 35 to a noticably juddery 23-28. So, it had a noticable effect on framerate, but not so much that I couldn't enjoy my first head tracking experiences. Enough to decide that I can't seriously fly without head tracking of some kind.

Getting the right performance is possible, but requires some tinkering. For example, as the webcam is not IR-specific you can get quite a lot of interference from other parts of the spectrum (at one point I had to play with all the curtains drawn and lights off). You've also got to get the head-mounted bit right. I ended up making my own trackclip type thing from LEDs, which was reasonably effective, and cost about £10 and about 4 hours of my time. By that time, I knew I wanted a proper TIR.

TIR is superior to any free system in every way. My guess is with TIR3 frame rate drops about 5%, which isn't noticable. It's easy, reliable and smooth. TIR sample rate is about 4 times higher than the webcam-based systems. For the head-mounted part not used anything but the trackclip pro, and once set up it works very effectively.

My advice - play around with one of the free ones if you like to tinker. But as soon as you do, you're going to want the genunine TIR anyway, so you might as well just buy one and save yourself time and hassle.

Feathered_IV
03-30-2009, 05:32 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">The headset clip is not worth the money... </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


What price dignity? I'm very pleased with mine. I prefer it to a sweaty cap and geek-antlers. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/partyhat.gif

julian265
03-30-2009, 06:40 AM
Using my DIY tracker on a single AMD3000+, it up around 2-4% of the CPU's time, and did not impact appreciably on my frame rate. Atmospheric effects and more than 20 people on the server had a huge effect, however.

On the E8400 it's not noticeable even in the process viewer.

TIR5? Yeah, that'll just change the communication method again.

I can't stand hats, I attached mine to the head-set.

Skoshi Tiger
03-30-2009, 06:43 AM
Being the oldest and wisest in my house hold, and chief rule-maker (in my own mind http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif ) I have often embarrassed my stepdaughters with our “No hats inside policy” (It’s important to keep their new boyfriends inline!). Of course rules are more like guidelines and as such are subject to amendment and alterations! Now it’s a “no hats inside except for when you’re sitting in front of the computer” rule! And no! the Wii is NOT a computer!

Fish44
03-30-2009, 12:32 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by noobisoft:

.............I'd caution that there is a very slight delay with TrackIR between when you move your head and when the view shifts............

Cheers </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Have u tried to reduce the 'smoothing' to increase the response?

Chevy350
03-30-2009, 01:32 PM
well i got it a few days ago, and wow it does help alot. it seemed way too responsive at first, especially in the head roll, i had to turn that way down.

and i tried the 6 dof mod, and it is impossible haha, i move around to much to make playing like that possible.

and i also decided why not order the track clip pro, and i used it a few times and realized the hat clip was way better. i had the clip on the left side of my headphones and i could only look so far to the left before it would bug out and quit tracking. i tried adjusting it 39993445 times but i still couldent get looking the the left to run smoothly. so im sticking with the goofy hat setup for now at least.

also i never noticed the game slowing down at all with trackir. thanks for the input everyone

Urufu_Shinjiro
03-30-2009, 01:57 PM
I love the 6DOF mod, but it does take some tinkering with the profile, once you have that set up right it's a dream, just work on the profile, read some guides on trackIR profiles etc., you'll get it right and be glad you did.