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View Full Version : About Saving/Loading during campaign/missions



xwhitemousex
04-29-2004, 10:12 AM
How to make it more realistic and not have the feeling of,

"Argh, I died.. oh well, I'll load the saved game and run the time compression at x2048 for about 40 seconds and do it all over again"

Easy, in the most difficult/realistic setting, you shouldnt be allowed to save the game during the mission, unless you are well within safe waters such as near a port, or when you are actuallly docked in the pen.

To illustrate an example...

In the first Aliens vs Predator, you were unable to save the game during gameplay.

The first times you died, it didnt matter cause it didnt take all that long to get back to the same place... but the deeper you got, and further into the level/mission you got, the more reluctant you are to die, cause you know... I die now, its gonne be alot of work to get back...

You get a feeling inside that makes you afraid to die, thus you get more cautious, you start to jump at every sound of a hiss near you, open fire at anything that move. But when you finally do get to the end of the mission/level, there is a feeling that you actually accomplished something, and a great feeling of relief...

However they ruined it by allowing saves during the mission/levels and the whole intensity and fear of dying was lost.

I would love to see the Save Game option removed if you play the game at highest and most realistic difficulty.

Totally removed!

If you have the option to save the game, then you are going to use it, thats just human psychology. After the saves were implenented in the AvP patch, the whole atmosphere and fear of dying died with it.

Although, in easier difficulty, there could be an option to save the game in the middle of missions. IE, only 1 or 2 saves per mission at the 2nd highest difficulty, 2-3 at the next etc.

In any case, im selfish, I play at max realism nomatter what Simulator im playing, and please...

No option to save game during missions on max realism. It makes it ALOT more intense and exciting if you develop the fear of dying...

Just imagine a patrol mission where you spent hours, you expended all your torpedoes, your on the home stretch and suddenly a british destroyer picks you up on sonar... thats when it gets fun =D

xwhitemousex
04-29-2004, 10:12 AM
How to make it more realistic and not have the feeling of,

"Argh, I died.. oh well, I'll load the saved game and run the time compression at x2048 for about 40 seconds and do it all over again"

Easy, in the most difficult/realistic setting, you shouldnt be allowed to save the game during the mission, unless you are well within safe waters such as near a port, or when you are actuallly docked in the pen.

To illustrate an example...

In the first Aliens vs Predator, you were unable to save the game during gameplay.

The first times you died, it didnt matter cause it didnt take all that long to get back to the same place... but the deeper you got, and further into the level/mission you got, the more reluctant you are to die, cause you know... I die now, its gonne be alot of work to get back...

You get a feeling inside that makes you afraid to die, thus you get more cautious, you start to jump at every sound of a hiss near you, open fire at anything that move. But when you finally do get to the end of the mission/level, there is a feeling that you actually accomplished something, and a great feeling of relief...

However they ruined it by allowing saves during the mission/levels and the whole intensity and fear of dying was lost.

I would love to see the Save Game option removed if you play the game at highest and most realistic difficulty.

Totally removed!

If you have the option to save the game, then you are going to use it, thats just human psychology. After the saves were implenented in the AvP patch, the whole atmosphere and fear of dying died with it.

Although, in easier difficulty, there could be an option to save the game in the middle of missions. IE, only 1 or 2 saves per mission at the 2nd highest difficulty, 2-3 at the next etc.

In any case, im selfish, I play at max realism nomatter what Simulator im playing, and please...

No option to save game during missions on max realism. It makes it ALOT more intense and exciting if you develop the fear of dying...

Just imagine a patrol mission where you spent hours, you expended all your torpedoes, your on the home stretch and suddenly a british destroyer picks you up on sonar... thats when it gets fun =D

CB..
04-29-2004, 11:22 AM
all well and good regarding the fear of dying ;but there ought to be these days a more sophisticated way to achieve the same result,
especailly in a genre like this...i've played AVP and no mission was liable to take 10 hours to finish..a completely different kettle of fish..as the tension in action FPS games is a world removed from simulations such as this..

far better to utilise the crew management elements of the game to increase the players tendency to want to remain alive..and indeed a much more realistic approach..(in terms of the game itself) any commander who had little or no regard for the life of his crew and the safety of his boat would surely have found it increasingly difficult to maintain discipline..

frankly i'd rather have the crew mutiny and declare me unfit if i used unsound gung-ho tactics and behaved irresponsibly in battle...

other than that forcing a solid connection with the crew by stat building and significant crew interaction should help the player to realise that he has an awfull lot more to loose by dying than just the threat of a replay..it's likely that as in SH2 yu are barred from reloading a saved game if yu die ..which solves the instant re-try issue..

if we really want to create next generation gameplay and realism to go with the next generation graphics, then we need to get beyond the "beat the game" attitude encouraged as of old..computer games are capable of so much more than just presenting the player with a "what level are you on?, im at level 5!!" motivation

bowt time this motivation was left in the arcades where it belongs http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/59.gif

Egan2.0
04-29-2004, 12:46 PM
Hey xwhitemousex, I'm getting a funny feeling of deja vu from that post. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-wink.gif http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-tongue.gif

I agree with CB and maintain what i posted over at subsim:

Realistic patrol length + Realistic real life =save function throughout game.

Having no save function is fine for ten minutes of bang bang but not not for an 8 week patrol.

SailorSteve
04-29-2004, 02:09 PM
Also if you're running in real time it's WEEKS, not hours; and you don't spend weeks sitting in front of the computer, you go to work, you go out, you go to the store, so running in real time might work for a flight sim, in a sub it's right out.

______________________________
Always keep you clothes and your weapons where you can find them in the dark.

Shan_Hackett
04-29-2004, 02:38 PM
I also never use time compression. So every minute is tedious (But wholely emersive).

The very real need for an ingame save feature, if for nothing else, than "Real-Life" functionality, has to be there, no matter what realism level the player sets.

SailorSteve
04-29-2004, 04:21 PM
Never? You start a patrol and leave it running for 6-8 weeks? What do you do if your lookouts spot a convoy while you're asleep, or at work?

______________________________
Always keep you clothes and your weapons where you can find them in the dark.

xwhitemousex
04-29-2004, 04:24 PM
Limited saves then, once per game day or something. The whole Save, dead, load... dead... load... dead... load... dead... load... get a kill, save... dead... load...

You get the idea ><

Its kinda dull hehe. If you cant save every minute of your patrol then it means you have to do a bigger effort to stay alive. just my opinion though =p

Shan_Hackett
04-29-2004, 05:20 PM
The wife goes crazy...Study is in next room...(Thin walled), b4 going to bed, i set AI to "Man AA Guns", and crank up the volume....Er! By about 20Db's.

But usualy i time it right, so when its night time ingame, its night time in the real world.
So when i goto bed, it's relatively the same time ingame. Which means i can run pretty much safely, early to mid war, on the surface.

During daylight hrs, im running submerged anyway. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_cool.gif

Bruno_Lotse
05-10-2004, 02:10 PM
My vote - no limits on saving function. We are running on Windows OS. Windows crashes no matter what or runs out of memory which also means 'finita la comedia'. I am running my SH2 4x max cruising speed. Real time when I am engaged. It might be day - ok, two days - ok, week - ok and then boom!!! ran out of memory!!! Reboot your machine. Without saving I wouldn't afford 'immersion'.

Bruno Lotse
U45

HeibgesU999
05-10-2004, 03:06 PM
i say let people save the game whenever they want. not saving is okay for the 2hr canned missions with the game.

you folks should try playing the 8 week plus patrols at Atlanik and Raiders. You would quickly see how absurd it would be not to be able to save.

and if you are familiar with SH1, I'm sure you remember the crash to desktop at higher Time Compression bug.

Kriegspiel
05-10-2004, 03:20 PM
The best method I have seen is with Far Cry http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/smileys-gun2.gif. The game automatically saves points in each level. You don't know where or when the game will save, but it forces you to do your best every second so you can get to the next save point. The game saves several points within each level so it's easy to get back to the level you were at without having to wade through one stack of saves. The feature is nice also because you don't have to remind yourself to save every few minutes and it does not take a bunch of game time to get back where you were.

The bottom line is: It is still work and hassle to get back to where you were killed, but at least you don't have to start completely over--especially in a long campaign.

I can almost bet you they will develop that type of save feature in their campaign.

[This message was edited by Kriegspiel on Mon May 10 2004 at 02:31 PM.]

Willey
05-11-2004, 10:27 AM
I want to have a free savegame system. There could be limitations though. No saving possible when enemy units have contact to you, if they're not aware of your presence you should still be able to save. Probably you'll save when you got contact and then you'll go in and try it. You could do the attack again if it failed, but that's everybody's own story. Saving while trying to escape a DD which is DCing you is lame though. That's why it should not be possible, while they have contact to you.

Erbogast-v.K
05-11-2004, 12:00 PM
I totally agree with Egan2.0 and SailorSteve.
Long range boat of type IX could leave port for a 4 months patrol ( type-IX U177 left Kiel for her maiden voyage to the south Atlantic on 17 september 1942, and then ran into Bordeaux on 22January 1943), thus I think that it's impossible to simulate 4 months of patrol in a 2 hours game, which is the average length that we can spend playing on our computer per day.
So please keep the saving system of SHII, to make SHIII realistic.

HKLE
05-12-2004, 07:03 AM
Hi folks

Why not allow a tick off on the possibility to save during missions in a custom difficulty menu ? This would end some of these discussions here and everybody is happy - or not ?

I personally favor the possibility to save whenever I want to do so. I have not so much time to play - so I need to stretch this experience sometimes over more than 1 day/evening ... everything else is demotivation and the game is back to the shelves in a second !

CDragon
05-12-2004, 09:33 AM
I favor a save-anywhere-anytime feature, also.