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raaaid
05-05-2007, 09:17 AM
http://www.ncac.org/art/20040816~CO-Denver~Groups_Prote...rport_Censorship.cfm (http://www.ncac.org/art/20040816%7ECO-Denver%7EGroups_Protest_Denver_International_Airpo rt_Censorship.cfm)

i was once a little child who longed for other worlds

but im not more a child for i have known fear i have learned to hate...

how tragic, then, is youth which lives with enemies, with gallows ropes

yet, i still believe i only sleep today that ill wake up, a child again, and start to laugh and play

this is the kind of stuff which got removed from denver airport

and it is global censorship since i cant find the removed works anywhere on the net, just crab about reptilians

how offensive, didnt those men fight for freedom where is it?

raaaid
05-05-2007, 09:17 AM
http://www.ncac.org/art/20040816~CO-Denver~Groups_Prote...rport_Censorship.cfm (http://www.ncac.org/art/20040816%7ECO-Denver%7EGroups_Protest_Denver_International_Airpo rt_Censorship.cfm)

i was once a little child who longed for other worlds

but im not more a child for i have known fear i have learned to hate...

how tragic, then, is youth which lives with enemies, with gallows ropes

yet, i still believe i only sleep today that ill wake up, a child again, and start to laugh and play

this is the kind of stuff which got removed from denver airport

and it is global censorship since i cant find the removed works anywhere on the net, just crab about reptilians

how offensive, didnt those men fight for freedom where is it?

raaaid
05-05-2007, 10:03 AM
im offended by the fact that i cant choose to see it and decide by myself if its offensive or not

and that this art has not only be globally removed but anyone who is interesting in its content like me due to my identification with the poem just can find bull about alien lizards and subterranean bases disinformation

of a million pages a million tell the same bull

not a single to say is beatifull art which i think

well at least i just made one

Dizz_
05-05-2007, 10:40 AM
It was called "The Luggage Project" and was first shown in July 2004. You can see the three pieces that were removed here...click on the image to get more pics.

http://homepage.mac.com/heinrichhoffmann/luggageproject/hatza.html
http://homepage.mac.com/heinrichhoffmann/luggageproject/higbeea.html
http://homepage.mac.com/heinrichhoffmann/luggageproject/sadosky-howar.html

Project overview here...
http://www.bernhardgal.com/soundbagism.html

I'll let the individual viewer decide if it's appropriate for an airport.

horseback
05-05-2007, 11:09 AM
Sorry, but I've never understood the idea that if a community or a government refuses to <span class="ev_code_YELLOW">subsidize</span> a form of expression, be it 'luggage' art or photographs or piles of garbage stuck together & titled in a manner expressly intended to insult a large portion of the populace, then it is somehow guilty of "censorship."

If you want to be an 'artist' AND eat, make something that someone will want to buy. Throwing a bunch of cr*p together, giving it the most offensive pseudopolitical title you can think of, and then demanding that the very people you're insulting should pay for it, is childish.

cheers

horseback

XyZspineZyX
05-05-2007, 12:07 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by raaaid:
http://www.ncac.org/art/20040816~CO-Denver~Groups_Prote...rport_Censorship.cfm (http://www.ncac.org/art/20040816%7ECO-Denver%7EGroups_Protest_Denver_International_Airpo rt_Censorship.cfm)

i was once a little child who longed for other worlds

but im not more a child for i have known fear i have learned to hate...

how tragic, then, is youth which lives with enemies, with gallows ropes

yet, i still believe i only sleep today that ill wake up, a child again, and start to laugh and play

this is the kind of stuff which got removed from denver airport

and it is global censorship since i cant find the removed works anywhere on the net, just crab about reptilians

how offensive, didnt those men fight for freedom where is it? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I don't know what you're trying to say with your comments on fighting for freedom and whatnot, but if an art exhibition is displayed in a palce like an airport, and some people don;t like the art, then it is 100% within the rights of the folks who are in charge to remove things that people complain about

Far from "repression" or "freedom of speech", this is a commom sense issue. Censorship? No. There is no censorship here. The city of Denver has not banned the works from being displayed and seen by the public, they have removed them from a place of business that the publci frequents at the request of private citizens who don;t appreciate the way this art is represented, especially at an airport

The political statements made by that art is not something the city of Denver is repressing, they just aren't showing it at the airport. No censorship, no secret police, no nothing

The artist may take that art and display it at a gallery or at another place of business if the owners allow it, but the owners have the Right to take it off display

The artist is not being persecuted, the art is not taboo, and the subject is not against the law

However, it is very much a question of judgement- the city of Denver made a bad judgement call in the first place to allow that art.

the one and only thing that is being violated is an artist's feelings. His or her Rights are not being violated or infringed

As far as "Global Censcorship" goes, it is a bogus comment, raaaid. You have just decided that this is censored by the World (somehow, as if we have one government, or that our governments could agree on the time of day) because you can't find something online.

The city of Denver Colorado does not make US Federal Law or International law. You cannot find any photos of my 1970 Buick at the car shows it's been in, either. has my car been censored on a global scale?

In any case, this is not cencorship. This art should never have been put on display by the city of Denver in the first place.

This part:

"how offensive, didnt those men fight for freedom where is it?"

Bears special mention though. You know I have always been fair with you, and I never make fun or call you names raaid

You really need to learn something about the USA before you comment on it. You know very little about it, aside from what you guess it should be like or feel it should be.

Firstly, you do not have the right to "Not be offended" here, so your 'how offensive' comment about the actions of Denver airport are meaningless- that's your opinion, and that's fine, but no wrong doing has occured since you feel offense. that's how it works here.

An argument COULD be made that this holds true for people who see the art at the airport- they do not have the right Not To Be Offended, either

But that doesn't work in this case- Denver is under no legal obligation to display the art, now are they? Also, Freedom of Speech is not so simple a thing that your art, actions, or words can just be expressed, and that's all fine and good.

I can't yell "there's a fire! There's a fire!" in encloded public spaces, becasue I am creating a dangerous situation in which people can panic and be injured.

I can't strip naked and run down the street, claiming public nudity is how I celebrate my religion

I also can't claim that is how I express myself, and am protected by 1st amendment Rights

However, in some places, I CAN stand naked in my front yard, and wave at people

Denver has removed something that people found in poor taste

That's all. No censorship, no repression, no facism, no totalitarianism, no gag orders on political commentary, no violation of 1st amendmant rights, and no stifling of criticism of the US government

Just a simple common sense decision: removal of art that people find offensive often enough to cause a problem. It is a place paid for by public funds, and if enough people in the public say "I don;t like that, take it down", Denver is required to take it down

Actually, if they didn't do that when enough people complained, THEN you may have evidence of a problem

WWSensei
05-05-2007, 12:18 PM
Also, your inability to find the pictures is not "global censorship". It's more like "I don't know how to use Google". the pictures are readily available through any number of searches as indicated by a previous poster.

Just Google "The Luggage Project" or use this link

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22The+Luggage+Pro...2&btnG=Google+Search (http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=%22The+Luggage+Project%22&btnG=Google+Search)

if that is too much trouble. The leap of logic required to go from you being unable to use Google to thinking there is some sort of worldwide conspiracy requires either a huge chip on your shoulder thinking you can't possibly be at fault for something, or a delusional paranoia.

I hadn't even hear of this issue befre seeing your post and it took less than 5 minutes to find all the information on it--including the pictures. Make even just a little effort before declaring the world is out to get you.

Zeus-cat
05-05-2007, 01:42 PM
The part that offends me the most is that the taxpayers (preumably) paid for this. A 101 Dalmations suitcase with a box cutter for a handle? I don't see the art here.

I don't "get" the vast majority of modern art. On the other hand, I firmly believe in capitalism. If you can make something out of garbage that people will buy, go for it, but don't expect me to call it anything but a pile of ****.

erco415
05-05-2007, 02:07 PM
Now Raaaid, looking at the pictures Dizz_ posted for us, do you feel those are appropriate for display in an airport? Have you considered that Denver was for years the headquarters of United Airlines? Or that they might be a little touchy about such things as boxcutters? What do you think the artists of these pieces were trying to say? I don't even fly for the airlines anymore, and I find it nearly impossible to remain civil when some joker suggests turning my workplace into a crime scene. Good Job Denver!

raaaid
05-05-2007, 03:09 PM
i apologize i provided a disinformation link

from 217000 links on gogling denver+airport+murals all are bull but this one:

http://www.flydenver.com/guide/art/detail.asp?ID=7

actually there were 4 wall of which just 2 are there today:

"Apparently half the original murals have been painted over because people were creeped out. But the other half are still up and still freak people out."

http://www.hipforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3282702

now its a diptic

so as i understand it

a piece of art that suggest that this world where people dies from starvation every 4 seconds is a dream(a nightmare) and in the real world war has been abolished has been:

censored by retiring two of the walls that made it

make it extreamly difficult avalaible on the net(i cant find the two paintings on the missing walls)

through a bunch of bull concerning this peace of art which makes hardly all webs

through even more disinformation pretending that the banned art are crappy luggage art while trully is a piece of art which throws at us the notion of sleeping in a nightmare

so plz dont pretend im more stupid than i really am

i was not refering to that stupid luggage i meant the two missing walls though even myself fell for disinformation with the link i provided

raaaid
05-05-2007, 04:21 PM
plz as you took time to laugh on me showing that luggage picture you could search for me as im not good gogling a single link with the two erased walls by Leo Tanguma

i cant find any though i could show you 217000 links with the worse old propaganda about this murals

so half a piece of art is erased which contains this:

i was once a little child who longed for other worlds

but im not more a child for i have known fear i have learned to hate...

how tragic, then, is youth which lives with enemies, with gallows ropes

yet, i still believe i only sleep today that ill wake up, a child again, and start to laugh and play


whats next erase half guernika and throw bull on what it was about?

and yes i find it offensive is like the gestapo is controlling the web when i research on those beatiful murals

LStarosta
05-05-2007, 04:35 PM
raaaid, go somewhere else if you want to discuss this bullsh*t. **** you you ******* **** ******* ****ing ******ed ****** ******* ***** **** **** ********er!

You didn't even give the common courtesy of putting OT in your topic.

God hates spammers.

LStarosta
05-05-2007, 04:37 PM
LOL funny thing. I just posted the biggest string of swear words hoping that I'd get them all censored in the theme of the thread's title, and alas, it went to "moderator approval". Oops. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/88.gif

deepo_HP
05-05-2007, 05:13 PM
i am a bit concerned about some snoddy answers here.
of course, it is not censorship! since the exhibitions at dia are all on invitational base, it can't censoreing to cancel such.

however, it is just poor behaviour and makes the inetntion of the dia-exhibition projects questionable.
if art is art or not-art, might be a personal decision or view. but if the city, resp airport-administration decides to institute a forthgoing exhibbition series (and as such it had been stated, that the airport is exactly chosen for the public availability and visitation!), and if the exhibitionists are chosen from the very early start of their projects by a jury, it can't be, that such - in terms of art - a 'small' provocation to some people is sufficient to remove the considered project.

for those here, who started posting about their backyards, please read about the denver international airport and his projects (which i found up to now very progressive and remarkable)...
i personally find the pieces not very 'artful' than 'political protest' (but in a pretty artful way). i am furthermore not too much astonished about ignorant visitors running past the pieces (art or not), but with actions like these the whole idea of presentong art (or not art) on an airport doesn't make any sense any more.

deepo_HP
05-05-2007, 10:08 PM
hi bun-bun,

well, you might make a point, if you like http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif and i am not offended...
it only seems, that your point made is not related to what is the subject here.
the 'dia' is running several projects to present contemporary art to public. the idea is (besides, of course, advertising the airport or better, the city of denver to visitors) to use that also in some other aspects very interesting public building for its highly frequented traffic like a gallery!
artists are chosen - and can also ask for being exposed - at a very early state of the process of creation. so the process is under continuous observation by the gremium, which decides, who will be on the concerning exhibition or not.

for the rest of my opinion you might read my above posting...

answering to the subject of your last reply:
i don't know by any means, what art has to do with making us better people! art is not any kind of education...

bun-bun195333
05-05-2007, 11:40 PM
http://home.comcast.net/~argylestransom/Pics/AAJan_Vermeer_van_Delft_001.jpg

raaaid
05-06-2007, 07:35 AM
The emotional energies present here at Terezín is intense to say the least. Terezín, or Theresienstadt in German was a concentration camp located about an hour's ride from Prague on the train. The photograph was taken in an empty room once used as barrack. I tried as much as possible to capture the mood still lingering in each and every room.

On a side note, I recommend the book 'I Have Not Seen A Butterfly Around Here', a collection of drawings and poems from children at Terezin. Here is a poem I will share:

That bit of filth in dirty walls,
And all around barbed wire,
And 30,000 souls who sleep
Who once will wake
And once will see
Their own blood spilled.

I was once a little child,
Three years ago.
That child who longed for other worlds.
But now I am no more a child
For I have learned to hate,
I am a grown-up person now,
I have known fear,

Bloody words and a dead day then,
That's something different than boogie man!

but anyway, I still believe I only sleep today,
That I'll wake up, child again, and start to laugh and play.
I'll go back to childhood sweet like a briar rose,
Like a bell which wakes us from a dream,
Like a mother with an ailing child
Loves him with aching woman's love.
How tragic then, is youth which lives
With enemies, with gallows ropes,
How tragic, then, for children on your lap
To say: this for the good, that for the bad.

Somewhere, far away out there, childhood sweetly sleeps
Along that path among the trees,
There o'er that house
Which was once my pride and joy.
There my mother gave me birth into this world
So I could weep...

In the flame of candles by my bed, I sleep
And once perhaps I'll understand
That I was such a little thing,
As little as this song.

These 30,000 souls who sleep
Among the trees will wake,
Open eyes
And because they see
A lot

They'll fall asleep again...

-Hanus Hachenburg, 12.7.1929-10.12.7.1944

http://www.trekearth.com/gallery/Europe/Czech_Republic/photo636759.htm

how offensive it took me 5 hours going through bull to find the origin of this erased piece of art

i really wonder who won wwii

raaaid
05-06-2007, 09:37 AM
all right here are the two walls still standing:

3)
http://www.flydenver.com/guide/art/detail.asp?ID=7

1)
http://www.flydenver.com/guide/art/detail.asp?ID=8

here number 2 erased:

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/imagenes_area51/denver6.jpg

notice the poem by the jewish boy on the bottom right corner, erased as well

and number 4 apparently erased as well:

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/imagenes_sociopol/Denver7.jpg

now plz tell me why i cant find offensive the erasing of the piece of art containing the poem about the jewish boy which denounces genocide
which according the piece of art is practised tday in non arians whom die from starvation at a rate of 1 each 4 seconds

without mentioning the bull throw on this piece of art by the media and the ridicule to which ive been put here with the suggestion i was referring to the luggage crappy art

AKA_TAGERT
05-06-2007, 09:50 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by horseback:
Sorry, but I've never understood the idea that if a community or a government refuses to <span class="ev_code_YELLOW">subsidize</span> a form of expression, be it 'luggage' art or photographs or piles of garbage stuck together & titled in a manner expressly intended to insult a large portion of the populace, then it is somehow guilty of "censorship."

If you want to be an 'artist' AND eat, make something that someone will want to buy. Throwing a bunch of cr*p together, giving it the most offensive pseudopolitical title you can think of, and then demanding that the very people you're insulting should pay for it, is childish.

cheers

horseback </div></BLOCKQUOTE>Agreed 100,000,000,000,000.00%

XyZspineZyX
05-06-2007, 10:56 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by raaaid:
all right here are the two walls still standing:

3)
http://www.flydenver.com/guide/art/detail.asp?ID=7

1)
http://www.flydenver.com/guide/art/detail.asp?ID=8

here number 2 erased:

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/imagenes_area51/denver6.jpg

notice the poem by the jewish boy on the bottom right corner, erased as well

and number 4 apparently erased as well:

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/imagenes_sociopol/Denver7.jpg

now plz tell me why i cant find offensive the erasing of the piece of art containing the poem about the jewish boy which denounces genocide
which according the piece of art is practised tday in non arians whom die from starvation at a rate of 1 each 4 seconds

without mentioning the bull throw on this piece of art by the media and the ridicule to which ive been put here with the suggestion i was referring to the luggage crappy art </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Why you should NOT be offended?

My friend, in the USA you do not have a Right to be "not offended"

You still don't understand: this is a place frequented by the public. The city government runs the place. If they choose to stop displaying some art, be it a wall frescoe, a painting, a sculpture, or a piece of music, then they can do it. There is no censorship

The Denver airport is not an art gallery. It is a place of business

LStarosta
05-06-2007, 10:58 AM
raaaid, go hug some trees already

raaaid
05-06-2007, 11:50 AM
cid i wouldnt like you to go throug the bull i went to find out which pictures got erased in this airport

my point is how media manipulate people which you can see on how 99% of webs on this paintings are bull

ill give you an interpretantion of this art

number 1 and 2 are the real world in which we live where war hunger and disease bring havoc

number 3 and 4 show a dream world were people are children again and eat from a plant that brings enlightenment

the key to understand the two dyptichs lays in the erased poem:

yet i believe ill awake a child again

implying this is actually the world which is just dreamt

this is related with the gnostic believe that matter is ilusory, a prosecuted idea

another odd thing number 1 and 2 walls include dead bodies so it should be logical it was them which got banned but actually they got banned 2 and 4 and 4 is totally innocent

this is an example of censoring not good or bad taste but censorhip of ideas, concretely the gnostic idea that this world is just a nightmare

AKA_TAGERT
05-06-2007, 11:51 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by BBB462cid:
Why you should NOT be offended?

My friend, in the USA you do not have a Right to be "not offended" </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Bingo!

Astaldo711
05-07-2007, 05:35 AM
What bug me abount some art, is that an "artist" can paint, draw, sculpt ANYTHING they want and once they call it "art", anyone that criticize it is called narrow minded or a censor. If your "art" is displayed in a public place and most of the people want it removed, it should be removed. You can't just display anything you want and call it free speech...there needs to be a line drawn. If someone put up pictures that were offfensive to a particular race, religion, etc., they would be taken down without question. And rightly so, even if the "artist" claims free speech.

raaaid
05-07-2007, 05:54 AM
i dont get annoyed by the crab luggage art to be removed im annoyed because this was what got censored:

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/imagenes_area51/denver6.jpg



notice on the bottom right this poem:

i was once a little child who longed for other worlds

but im not more a child for i have known fear i have learned to hate...

how tragic, then, is youth which lives with enemies, with gallows ropes

yet, i still believe i only sleep today that ill wake up, a child again, and start to laugh and play

this was written by a jewish boy who was murdered at terezin by the nazis

it not only has been removed but so much bull has been throw by the media on this art...

ive heard people writting what a **** poem influenced by the media

here the other censored image:

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/imagenes_sociopol/Denver7.jpg

and here are the two standing images which still remain but makes no sense with the rest being censored:

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/imagenes_sociopol/Denver2.jpg

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/imagenes_sociopol/Denver4.jpg

tell me honestly should art be censored because some people find annoying the concept that genocide is still practised today proposed by this art

and what freedom do we have when all research on this art tell you bull about reptilian alien subterranean bases and the queen of england

and if this subject is so manipulated by the media why shouldnt be every single piece of info we got access to manipulated as well

Astaldo711
05-07-2007, 06:04 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">reptilian alien subterranean bases and the queen of england </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Uuuuh, WHAT?!?

joeap
05-07-2007, 06:10 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Astaldo711:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">reptilian alien subterranean bases and the queen of england </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Uuuuh, WHAT?!? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

raaaid's improving, he said it's bull, there are actually sites that claim that art is talking about well, google David Icke. Raaaid realises it's just art about genocide regardless if you like it or not. Aynway seems a bit controversial for an airport, though not an art gallery (well private ok, public hmmmm perhaps perhaps not).

The-Pizza-Man
05-07-2007, 06:42 AM
I'd just like to remind people not to dismiss modern art so quickly. Take for example this
http://www.guggenheim.org/artscurriculum/images/buren_L2_l.jpg

It's easy to dismiss, but it isn't just a blue and white banner, it is how you travel around it and see how it transitions from occupying all the space to none of it. It wouldn't work in another gallery.

The point I'm trying to make is that modern art is often very context dependent.

BSS_Goat
05-07-2007, 07:07 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/blink.gif

Freelancer-1
05-07-2007, 07:40 AM
In the states, you can get away with pretty much anything and call it art.

But DON'T MESS WITH THE MOUSE!

That's just askin' for trouble http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y189/Freelancer1/Misc/mouse.jpg

Morteiin
05-07-2007, 09:09 AM
IMO the box-cutter suitcase and the image with the uniformed, sword-wielding, gun-toting figure are too disturbing for display in the context of a post-911 airport. I can understand why people wanted them removed. There was a time when I thought the making of such displays and statements was more important than any disturbance or anxiety they might cause. I've come to see though that forcing such statements upon people is just a different expression of what such statements claim to be speaking against.

horseback
05-07-2007, 09:41 AM
However worthy the intent or message of the 'art', I know that some small children (think 3-7 years old, unable to read or understand the poem, but easily able to see the threatening imagery) would find the images disturbing and possibly nightmare inducing. Any parent who's had a 'sensitive' child will tell you that some of the most surprising things will set them off.

One of my younger brothers was terrified of German bomb raids for weeks after seeing a BBC TV show about the 'Blitz' and then visiting London (where there were still bomb damaged areas visible in 1961) the next day. Being five years old, he couldn't quite make the connection between the war being over for a long time, and the bomb raids ending with it. All he knew was that he saw houses just like the one we were living in burning and falling down after a German bomb raid on TV, and then he went on a trip and saw some buildings that had been bombed with his own eyes. Since we shared a bedroom, I can tell you that the nightmares he had affected the whole family.

The problem for airport administrators is that an airport has to serve every age group and cultural perspective; most of the artistic displays MUST, therefore, be fairly bland and inoffensive. A parent with kids trying to make it to the gate for his or her next flight has no control or warning about what they will see on the way.

cheers

horseback

WWSpinDry
05-07-2007, 09:45 AM
And an airport is a place of business. If you don't like their policies take your business elsewhere. That's your only recourse--as it should be.

XyZspineZyX
05-07-2007, 09:47 AM
I am still waiting to hear why a place of business removing artwork is "censorship"

Raaid, art is not some magical special case. If the people who run the place want something removed, they are 100% in their rights to do it

Capt.LoneRanger
05-07-2007, 10:01 AM
That is not a problem of censorship or forbidding free speech.

Democracy is a form of state, where everybody has the right to express himself and his opinion.

Each of these rights are fully supported by the law until they collide with the rights of another individual, and this is the case here. The logic consequence, is to cancel the exhibition.

That is not censorship, as neither the objects are taken from the artist, nor is the artist prosecuted. Some people found it offending, the exhibition was on somebodies proberty, so everybody got his right.

If you find this is against the right, think of something that would offend you. For example somebody protesting against medical experiments on animals and hanging slaughtered animals at your bus-station, calling it art. Now, don't tell me, raaaid, you'd smile at those and happily watch them rott, just because it is called art?

AKA_TAGERT
05-07-2007, 10:14 AM
Raaaid stick to physics in that it suits you bett..

Hmmm..

On 2nd thought, give it up bud, your worthless.

deepo_HP
05-07-2007, 01:12 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Astaldo711:
What bug me abount some art, is that an "artist" can paint, draw, sculpt ANYTHING they want and once they call it "art", anyone that criticize it is called narrow minded or a censor. If your "art" is displayed in a public place and most of the people want it removed, it should be removed. You can't just display anything you want and call it free speech...there needs to be a line drawn. If someone put up pictures that were offfensive to a particular race, religion, etc., they would be taken down without question. And rightly so, even if the "artist" claims free speech. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

hi astaldo,

it is not like that an artist packs his things and puts it to a public place, writes a piece of paper with the title and a note 'this is art' below!
the airport put those pieces of 'art' there, the 'artist' claimed nothing, and the organisation, which complained about 'censorship' (which i don't believe has happened here) is absolutely independant and did not represent the 'artists'.
furthermore i doubt, that it is sufficient for having things removed from public places, if 'people' want it... nor should it be like that. that's why it is called 'public' and 'public' shouldn't be influenced by lobbyists.
think it over again, and you will realise, that the artist is the least person involved in the debate.

Krt_Bong
05-07-2007, 01:21 PM
Nothing personal but just what does this all have to do with IL-2?

raaaid
05-07-2007, 01:22 PM
http://www.google.es/search?hl=es&q=denver%2Bmurals%2Bairport%2Blizards&meta=

33000 links to say that art included the poem by the jewish boy is discunting

show me just one saying this is beatiful:

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/imagenes_area51/denver6.jpg

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/imagenes_sociopol/Denver7.jpg

if you show me just one ill admit theres some freedom, like you wont show me any ill say with the risk of being banned: allies won the war but nazis slowly infiltrated to keep practicing their genocides ideas

LStarosta
05-07-2007, 01:35 PM
raaaid, YOU are discunting. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/34.gif

raaaid
05-07-2007, 01:56 PM
thats right thats why i try to post new ideas

when i get ban theyll lose the point of view of a crazy person who usually sees what nobody else realized before

just take the negative time compression everybody would love it yet probably noone thought of it before

just imagine 20 minute cruising to bomb a ship and rewind the crucial moment as many times as wanted

bomb it and bomb it till you get so sick that you dont rewind anymore

if it was up to me id make a game with shooting and explosions but everytime you get a kill the game is rewinded prior to the kill, you can shoot as many times as desired but to go forward the only way out is no shooting, you could still make nice passes

well at least as an option so kids can play

AKA_TAGERT
05-07-2007, 02:19 PM
think about this..

what if I could get monkeys with red hats and ray guns to fly out of my but at the speed of light..

Could I than play the piano?

talk about your new ideas!