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View Full Version : Why is the 190 such a pig?



BaldieJr
09-25-2007, 08:16 PM
I don't understand the engineering behind this plane. It doesn't want to go up. Controls feel heavy. Its like flying a big rubber boot.

Maybe I'm missing something?

BfHeFwMe
09-25-2007, 08:19 PM
Because, if your going to get waxed in the air, they better give you one cool looking ride to do it in. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

VMF-214_Pappy
09-25-2007, 08:28 PM
Its a great plane specially in the D9 form, its not a turn and burner its a energy fighter and you have to be patient to use it how it should be used. You dogfighting la7 and yaks at low at you are gunna die. It flys more like a P47 and a good boom and zoomer and energy fighter. It has one of best roll rates in the game but its not very good in the vertical unless manual pitch is applied.

VMF-214_HaVoK
09-25-2007, 08:34 PM
Originally posted by BaldieJr:
I don't understand the engineering behind this plane. It doesn't want to go up. Controls feel heavy. Its like flying a big rubber boot.

Maybe I'm missing something?

It called trim. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif The FW-190 is a crusher, I absolutely love the thing. A4 smacks the SpitVBs around and calls them Sally. Its almost not fair. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

S!

DrHerb
09-25-2007, 08:36 PM
"The machine is as good as the operator" .....think about it

X32Wright
09-25-2007, 08:37 PM
Pappy is right. The FW is a E-fighter menaing an energy fighter which means u need to BUILD energy and maintain it to fight. This means wide and fast turns and lots of dives and zooming up. IF you have to turn make it at the end of a dive with excess energy and ONLY make a single DIVE turn or CLIMB TURN.

If you want to fight spits then use the A6 since thats a bit more agile. If you want or need more firepower use the A9.

If you want both firepower and turning ability use the hoehenjaeger (Ta-152H).

The Dora is fast and agile enough to hunt late spits but only if you E-fight and have enough alt.

VMF-214_HaVoK
09-25-2007, 08:38 PM
I fly the FW more like a Corsair rather then a P-47. But thats me.

S!

MrMojok
09-25-2007, 08:42 PM
http://www.haverodwilltravel.com/images/Trolling%202.jpg

Von_Rat
09-25-2007, 08:42 PM
this thread is soooo 2005

VMF-214_HaVoK
09-25-2007, 08:45 PM
We know Baldie knows better. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

Davinci..
09-25-2007, 09:11 PM
you know... i've never had a problem with it.
http://www.favacw.dyndns.org/scstat/index.php

it aint the plane.

BaldieJr
09-25-2007, 10:49 PM
lets assume that i like flying more than fighting. i know, the concept is completely lost on some of you, but just bear with me on this.

i don't understand why the 190's saw continued development. they just aren't enjoyably fliers. they need too much stick-work.

fordfan25
09-25-2007, 11:05 PM
Originally posted by BaldieJr:
they need too much stick-work. i know a girl like that

Grand_Armee
09-25-2007, 11:08 PM
Ummm...HELLOOOOO! You're not flying an FW-190 you're flying a simulation.

Yes, I know Oleg (Bless him) put millions of bits of data together from (God knows how many) charts dug up from German and Allied vaults, engineer reports, and memoirs of pilots to 'simulate' these planes. But you're still not flying the aircraft.

Re: Stickwork; You're in a sim. No plane is gonna feel like it did in real life with air currents, air pockets, and an endless number of phenomena which you won't find in Oleg's "air".

Re: Sim; If Robert Stanford Tuck was sitting at your PC instead of you he'd also be saying: "It doesn't feel like an effing Spit".

na85
09-25-2007, 11:39 PM
Originally posted by BaldieJr:
lets assume that i like flying more than fighting. i know, the concept is completely lost on some of you, but just bear with me on this.

i don't understand why the 190's saw continued development. they just aren't enjoyably fliers. they need too much stick-work.

Keep in mind WW2 aircraft designers weren't looking for aircraft that were pleasant to fly. Rather, they wanted effective killing machines.

BaldieJr
09-26-2007, 12:54 AM
i guess she aint my girl then. i just dig flyin. if someone gets in front of me i'll shoot, but most of the time i'm just goofin off. it makes me giggle.

JimmyBlonde
09-26-2007, 01:54 AM
Originally posted by BaldieJr:
I don't understand the engineering behind this plane. It doesn't want to go up. Controls feel heavy. Its like flying a big rubber boot.

Maybe I'm missing something?

It's all guns and engine, made for speed. Don't let yours drop below 400 kph and fight in the vertical. Boom and Zoom, don't mix it up or you'll get nailed every time.

Akronnick
09-26-2007, 02:30 AM
My guess would be because it's being flown by an ape.

Bremspropeller
09-26-2007, 05:13 AM
I fly the FW more like a Corsair rather then a P-47.

Tell me the difference http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif



http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/shady.gif

alert_1
09-26-2007, 05:34 AM
Fw190 isnt a pig its a brick. If it fall on Spit back, it hurts

Manu-6S
09-26-2007, 05:37 AM
Of course A4 vs SpitV it's a joke.

However remember that our Antons have serious slow speed accelleration problems 'caused by the modelled propeller. (it's not an opinion, just look at the FM's data)

Anton to Dora wasn't a so GREAT step like we have in the game.

joeap
09-26-2007, 05:57 AM
Originally posted by Grand_Armee:
Ummm...HELLOOOOO! You're not flying an FW-190 you're flying a simulation.

Yes, I know Oleg (Bless him) put millions of bits of data together from (God knows how many) charts dug up from German and Allied vaults, engineer reports, and memoirs of pilots to 'simulate' these planes. But you're still not flying the aircraft.

Re: Stickwork; You're in a sim. No plane is gonna feel like it did in real life with air currents, air pockets, and an endless number of phenomena which you won't find in Oleg's "air".

Re: Sim; If Robert Stanford Tuck was sitting at your PC instead of you he'd also be saying: "It doesn't feel like an effing Spit".

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/agreepost.gif Yup which is why folks shouldn't burst a blood vessel over FMs or weapon strength etc.

Baldie why not give FSX or FS9 a go if you just liek to fly...loads of fun that is.

Whirlin_merlin
09-26-2007, 06:20 AM
Originally posted by Manu-6S:
Of course A4 vs SpitV it's a joke.

.

In what way?

I find that as long as you keep your head and don't do anything daft the A4 eats the SpitV for breakfast, as it should.

Manu-6S
09-26-2007, 06:47 AM
Originally posted by Whirlin_merlin:
In what way?

I find that as long as you keep your head and don't do anything daft the A4 eats the SpitV for breakfast, as it should.

In that way you describe http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

I mean that if A4 are great against SpitV it doesn't mean that ALL is right. It's still have a **** accelleration at low speed.

ViktorViktor
09-26-2007, 07:03 AM
Baldie, if you really have switched mounts and started flying Fw190s with the object of just flying around, you would be complaining about the view from the cockpit.

But you haven't complained.

I'll bet you're not bald either.

TgD Thunderbolt56
09-26-2007, 07:43 AM
http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/1241.gif

Schpam it is..

C'mon baldie. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/51.gif

faustnik
09-26-2007, 10:29 AM
Did anyone drop a "learn to fly" yet?

Just checking...


http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

SeaFireLIV
09-26-2007, 10:37 AM
Originally posted by BaldieJr:
i just dig flyin. if someone gets in front of me i'll shoot, but most of the time i'm just goofin off. it makes me giggle.


Ah, well there you are. You`ve got the wrong mentality.

You need to think Hawk, attacking innocent pigeon flying below, kill, kill, KILL.

Then you`ll find she flies real good.


The FW is not a pigeon, it`s a hawk.


And I still think it`s a fishing thread.

msalama
09-26-2007, 10:47 AM
http://koti.welho.com/msalama/fish2.bmp

alert_1
09-26-2007, 10:49 AM
In the sim is big diference between Antos and Dora. All antons have very poor acceleration and worse turning perf thenin Rl. For ex. Fw190A8 has the same powerloading as 190D 44 but is mcuh worse..

crazyivan1970
09-26-2007, 10:49 AM
Baldie, this is first IL-2 related topic started by you in like 4 years... what happened?

MEGILE
09-26-2007, 10:51 AM
Originally posted by BaldieJr:
Why is the 190 such a pig?

Because it's porked.

Korolov1986
09-26-2007, 10:52 AM
http://www.mechmodels.com/fbstuff/nancy_chart.jpg

269GA-Veltro
09-26-2007, 11:01 AM
LoL

He he...the Oleg's FS-190 is really a great machine! FS dose mean Flying Stone of course! http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_biggrin.gif

269GA-Veltro
09-26-2007, 11:03 AM
Originally posted by BaldieJr: Maybe I'm missing something?

You are in the russian front...look at the 1946's PDF.... http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_rolleyes.gif

We hope to have it as BoB's addon....but the real one this time.

SlickStick
09-26-2007, 11:20 AM
Being an avid Spitfire pilot, I do enjoy jumping into a FW-190-A9 and loading up some MK108 wing cannons every now and then. One squeeze, one kill, almost everytime. I usually fly the Spitfires online to a 10 to 1 K/D ratio average. In the A9, it goes to 20 to 1 easily. Not as many kills in the same amount of flying time, but with those cannons and high-speed, it makes for a fantastic B and Z killing machine.

The smart pilot flies a plane to it's strengths and avoids it's weaknesses. I sometimes forget I'm in the FW and start to fly it like a Spitfire. Usually ends up quite bad.

There are certainly a few FW pilots online that can successfully tangle with a Spitfire, using their faster rolling scissors to force a Spitfire mistake during the dogfight, but my rule of thumb is to fly a FW like a FW.

High speed and firepower for hte FW win!!!11!!1!

Brain32
09-26-2007, 11:29 AM
There are certainly a few FW pilots online that can successfully tangle with a Spitfire, using their faster rolling scissors to force a Spitfire mistake during the dogfight
Did I shoot you down? Ooops, sry http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif


He he...the Oleg's FS-190 is really a great machine! FS dose mean Flying Stone of course!
Once you really, really learn to fly it, you realize it's not a stone at all - it's a Flying Brick http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Seriously though, it's not that bad now, ok acceleration is poor, turn time a bit lacking and the gunsight view is ridiculous, but overall it's a great plane and IMO only flyable type on the Luft side. On WW servers it's more than great, it's unbelievable as you can actually see and make low angle deflection tracking shots http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

BaldieJr
09-26-2007, 12:37 PM
Originally posted by crazyivan1970:
Baldie, this is first IL-2 related topic started by you in like 4 years... what happened?


is this il2 related, or FW190 related?

i dont think the two a mutually inclusive. some might say i'm complaining about modeling, but there are other clues into the real-world performance of the 190 (like bomb racks. fighters with bombs aren't fighters, they're a desperate attempt to make a pile of **** usable).

so, in my mind, the 190 was never a good design as a fighter. why didn't they replace the thing with something better? resources? politics? whats the story behind this enigma?

if someone with real knowledge could speak up that would be awesome. the insults aren't necessary i already know i'm a jerk.

msalama
09-26-2007, 12:49 PM
Well pig or not there're nevertheless some folks out there who seem to know how to fly the bugger http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif See this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWNzdomZPJk

You guys have any idea who's the pilot? Jeez, talk about skills eh http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/354.gif

PS. The tracks are from an older game version though, so dunno if you can still do that in 1946...

VMF-214_HaVoK
09-26-2007, 12:56 PM
Originally posted by Grand_Armee:
Ummm...HELLOOOOO! You're not flying an FW-190 you're flying a simulation.

Yes, I know Oleg (Bless him) put millions of bits of data together from (God knows how many) charts dug up from German and Allied vaults, engineer reports, and memoirs of pilots to 'simulate' these planes. But you're still not flying the aircraft.

Re: Stickwork; You're in a sim. No plane is gonna feel like it did in real life with air currents, air pockets, and an endless number of phenomena which you won't find in Oleg's "air".

Re: Sim; If Robert Stanford Tuck was sitting at your PC instead of you he'd also be saying: "It doesn't feel like an effing Spit".

If have not been here long enough to know Baldie is on a fishing trip. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif Thought out reply though.

S!

VMF-214_HaVoK
09-26-2007, 12:58 PM
Ooh wait...Learn to fly nub! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif

Schwarz.13
09-26-2007, 02:59 PM
Originally posted by msalama:
Well pig or not there're nevertheless some folks out there who seem to know how to fly the bugger http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif See this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWNzdomZPJk

You guys have any idea who's the pilot? Jeez, talk about skills eh http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/354.gif

PS. The tracks are from an older game version though, so dunno if you can still do that in 1946...

It's =AFJ=GoodKnight - just read the death messages http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

There's another great FW190 vid by a certain Captain Flushgarden (older version no doubt but still a nice vid):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fOaMY47L_ZA

VMF-214_Pappy
09-26-2007, 03:11 PM
Originally posted by BaldieJr:
lets assume that i like flying more than fighting. i know, the concept is completely lost on some of you, but just bear with me on this.

i don't understand why the 190's saw continued development. they just aren't enjoyably fliers. they need too much stick-work.

Why have u flown the real aircraft?
I have read lots of ace pilots having it top on there list for enjoyable plane to fly.

VMF-214_Pappy
09-26-2007, 03:14 PM
Originally posted by VMF-214_HaVoK:
Ooh wait...Learn to fly nub! http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/10.gif


OMG you didnt go there. More like a NOKE not a nub.

BaldieJr
09-26-2007, 03:28 PM
ask for a history lesson and get penile comparisons instead.

thats why i rarely take this place seriously.

VMF-214_HaVoK
09-26-2007, 03:36 PM
Originally posted by BaldieJr:
ask for a history lesson and get penile comparisons instead.

thats why i rarely take this place seriously.

How long you been flying this sim? Seriously. The people that have been flying this sim as long as you have no problems with the 190 whatsoever and find it to be a devastating aircraft and a joy to fly. This reason along with your past history posting is why you got the comments you did. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif Its very hard to take you serious and I almost got suckered into it with my initial post. http://forums.ubi.com/groupee_common/emoticons/icon_wink.gif

PS. My learn to fly comment was abit of a sarcastic inside joke which Im pretty certain you are familiar with so please dont be offended. I can always delete it if you are. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-sad.gif

S!

SlickStick
09-26-2007, 05:05 PM
Originally posted by Brain32:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> There are certainly a few FW pilots online that can successfully tangle with a Spitfire, using their faster rolling scissors to force a Spitfire mistake during the dogfight
Did I shoot you down? Ooops, sry http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Most assuredly not. Besides, I didn't say they can get my Spitfire, I said they can get a Spitfire. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

Whenever a FW tries to dogfight my Spitfire online, I hope that I can hold back my LOL long enough to wax him before his buddies show up. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

One of my greatest satisfactions flying this game online is when I get the opportunity to Focke-up a Wulf or two. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

Brain32
09-26-2007, 05:20 PM
Originally posted by SlickStick:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Brain32:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> There are certainly a few FW pilots online that can successfully tangle with a Spitfire, using their faster rolling scissors to force a Spitfire mistake during the dogfight
Did I shoot you down? Ooops, sry http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Most assuredly not. Besides, I didn't say they can get my Spitfire, I said they can get a Spitfire. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

Whenever a FW tries to dogfight my Spitfire online, I hope that I can hold back my LOL long enough to wax him before his buddies show up. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

One of my greatest satisfactions flying this game online is when I get the opportunity to Focke-up a Wulf or two. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Was only joking http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif I know that wouldn't pass against even a Spitfire vet. let alone somebody that really knows his stuff. I can tell you one thing though I usually know I will get the guy after the first merge, but if you saw what this guys do with their Spits, then you would really go LOL http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

leitmotiv
09-26-2007, 05:23 PM
As Churchill said about Hitler's claim to wring the English neck like a chicken's: "Some chicken, some neck." Some pig! I'd call it a wild boar.

SlickStick
09-26-2007, 05:25 PM
Originally posted by Brain32:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by SlickStick:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Brain32:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content"> There are certainly a few FW pilots online that can successfully tangle with a Spitfire, using their faster rolling scissors to force a Spitfire mistake during the dogfight
Did I shoot you down? Ooops, sry http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Most assuredly not. Besides, I didn't say they can get my Spitfire, I said they can get a Spitfire. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/winky.gif

Whenever a FW tries to dogfight my Spitfire online, I hope that I can hold back my LOL long enough to wax him before his buddies show up. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/59.gif

One of my greatest satisfactions flying this game online is when I get the opportunity to Focke-up a Wulf or two. http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Was only joking http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif I know that wouldn't pass against even a Spitfire vet. let alone somebody that really knows his stuff. I can tell you one thing though I usually know I will get the guy after the first merge, but if you saw what this guys do with their Spits, then you would really go LOL http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

http://forums.ubi.com/images/smilies/16x16_smiley-wink.gif

M_Gunz
09-26-2007, 09:19 PM
To people who have flown sims in knots and mph, 300 is fast. Not so for FW's and many others
in kph, 300 is SLOW.

SeaFireLIV
09-27-2007, 06:48 AM
Originally posted by BaldieJr:
ask for a history lesson and get penile comparisons instead.

thats why i rarely take this place seriously.

Your problem is you confuse everyone. You`re a long standing member of this forum. Logic dictates that you`ve seen and read some of the zillions of posts on aircraft abilities by player-pilots including the difficulty and discipline needed with 190s...

Yet, you suddenly post up with that `I don`t know anything- red-riding hood in the dark wood innocence` that many find hard to take seriously, especially since 90% of your posts are usually, sarcastic, jokey or far from serious. You are never serious in this forum. Everyone sees you as the joker. Now you are suddenly serious about a plane spoken of a zillion times on its charactersitics?

What are we supposed to think? We will assume you`re pulling our leg again.