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View Full Version : My Personal AI AEP Review...



SeaFireLIV
04-01-2004, 02:09 AM
All right, been flying FB/AEP for a good while now and it`s time to place my findings about AI. Before I got AEP I heard all kinds of nonsense as to how crap AI was and that it had not been improved. I asked people to give the good points, but oh, no, they wouldn`t. I`m still somewhat annoyed because the whole impression I had before receiving AEP was that the AI was useless/ not chaged. Don`t believe everything you hear, ESPECIALLY if untested whines, because the changes are BIG.

Here`s what I found. And it`s all true:

OFFLINE AI in Campaign. Using Lagg3` 41, I16`s vs 109s/110s. P40s/Spitfire vs G2s, LA5s, vs FWS, King Cobra vs Jets and FWS D9s, 109s.

1. AI aircraft in formations are more spaced out. This goes for your team too.

2. Collisions greatly reduced. (But not totally eliminated- and they shouldn`t be).

Combat AI:

3. Faster B&Z aircraft will attempt to B&Z you if they can.

4. They will try to AMBUSH you too. While you concentrate on one pair, another pair will stay high and try to make it`s way round and behind then dive on you. (Only just discovered this one).

5. They`ll try to outrun you if faster.

6. They`ll try to drag you to the enemy AF if you`re on them and they`re alone.

7. They`ll avoid a friendly AF if you make it there. But it`s not the AF itself but Flak. In one case I flew to a friendly airfield, but there was no flak, the AI continued after me.
7b. But there avoidance of AF flak is not gauranteed. Once again raced to a friendly AF with plenty of flak being chased by 2 109s and 2 110s. They continued right on through that flak after me. Only one escaped alived. It varies.

8. AI avoidance routines are good in combat and appear much more believable. In my Lagg3`41 I slightly smoked a lone 109, I overshot him as he barreled rolled me, then my 3 wingmen got on his six. I stayed close by. The 109 used it`s speed and looped up high, then hammer headed right and down still being chased by these eager friendlies. He crested the tops of the trees and up again. One of the friendlies hit the trees and exploded. I was impressed, This guy`s good, I thought. He actually got on an AI`s six and fired, And still aggressive! He didn`t seem to want to run (perhaps the situation made it so he couldn`t). Then finally his engine began quitting he slowed and was shot down. I actually felt a bit sorry for that brave skilled AI pilot.

9. 110s and 109s will use speed and try to outdive you if they have the height. Was after a 110 and it dived hard- after a few seconds I had to abort or watch my plane fall apart! Brilliant!

Now all of this varies, so an AI plane won`t ALWAYS do the right manouever. Sometimes they will try to turn where they shouldn`t. That doesn`t make the AI stupid, it makes it seem more human. If AI always did perfect manouevers it would not be believable. Also, their moves seem helped a lot by their experience level, you really can tell a good pilot from a crap one. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Negatives on AI (No such thing as perfect AI, otherwise it`d be Human, You`d have to give it rights! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif )

1. They DO still collide sometimes but this now happens far less and could now be considered human error as in reality.

2. I had one weird situation where my team ( I was number 4) were flying low over the trees on a bombing mission. There was an undulation to the ground... The leader flew with it easily, diving a little then pulling up to avoid the wood, but no 2 & 3 just ploughed straight into the trees. A fault of AI inexperience? Seen twice.

3. Biggest problem. AI kill-stealing. The AI are eager to nick kills. Not a problem when overwhelmed by the enemy. I`ve learned to let them have the kill and to even nick a kill off them to make up for it. Most often I`ll just look elsewhere.

There you go. Like I said a while before Oleg`s work is a lot more than what`s on the surface. The main work is involved and deep, so flying the sim for a bit on QMB then saying the `AI is just the same` is very misleading. One needs to fly the sim in depth in Campaign and the really complex work shines out. Flying against the AI is a joy now, I never know what`s going to happen next. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/11.gif

SeaFireLIV...

http://img12.photobucket.com/albums/v31/SeaFireLIV/Old1.jpg

It`s not about the Machine...
(aka: You CAN teach an old dog new tricks!)

SeaFireLIV
04-01-2004, 02:09 AM
All right, been flying FB/AEP for a good while now and it`s time to place my findings about AI. Before I got AEP I heard all kinds of nonsense as to how crap AI was and that it had not been improved. I asked people to give the good points, but oh, no, they wouldn`t. I`m still somewhat annoyed because the whole impression I had before receiving AEP was that the AI was useless/ not chaged. Don`t believe everything you hear, ESPECIALLY if untested whines, because the changes are BIG.

Here`s what I found. And it`s all true:

OFFLINE AI in Campaign. Using Lagg3` 41, I16`s vs 109s/110s. P40s/Spitfire vs G2s, LA5s, vs FWS, King Cobra vs Jets and FWS D9s, 109s.

1. AI aircraft in formations are more spaced out. This goes for your team too.

2. Collisions greatly reduced. (But not totally eliminated- and they shouldn`t be).

Combat AI:

3. Faster B&Z aircraft will attempt to B&Z you if they can.

4. They will try to AMBUSH you too. While you concentrate on one pair, another pair will stay high and try to make it`s way round and behind then dive on you. (Only just discovered this one).

5. They`ll try to outrun you if faster.

6. They`ll try to drag you to the enemy AF if you`re on them and they`re alone.

7. They`ll avoid a friendly AF if you make it there. But it`s not the AF itself but Flak. In one case I flew to a friendly airfield, but there was no flak, the AI continued after me.
7b. But there avoidance of AF flak is not gauranteed. Once again raced to a friendly AF with plenty of flak being chased by 2 109s and 2 110s. They continued right on through that flak after me. Only one escaped alived. It varies.

8. AI avoidance routines are good in combat and appear much more believable. In my Lagg3`41 I slightly smoked a lone 109, I overshot him as he barreled rolled me, then my 3 wingmen got on his six. I stayed close by. The 109 used it`s speed and looped up high, then hammer headed right and down still being chased by these eager friendlies. He crested the tops of the trees and up again. One of the friendlies hit the trees and exploded. I was impressed, This guy`s good, I thought. He actually got on an AI`s six and fired, And still aggressive! He didn`t seem to want to run (perhaps the situation made it so he couldn`t). Then finally his engine began quitting he slowed and was shot down. I actually felt a bit sorry for that brave skilled AI pilot.

9. 110s and 109s will use speed and try to outdive you if they have the height. Was after a 110 and it dived hard- after a few seconds I had to abort or watch my plane fall apart! Brilliant!

Now all of this varies, so an AI plane won`t ALWAYS do the right manouever. Sometimes they will try to turn where they shouldn`t. That doesn`t make the AI stupid, it makes it seem more human. If AI always did perfect manouevers it would not be believable. Also, their moves seem helped a lot by their experience level, you really can tell a good pilot from a crap one. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif

Negatives on AI (No such thing as perfect AI, otherwise it`d be Human, You`d have to give it rights! http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/blink.gif )

1. They DO still collide sometimes but this now happens far less and could now be considered human error as in reality.

2. I had one weird situation where my team ( I was number 4) were flying low over the trees on a bombing mission. There was an undulation to the ground... The leader flew with it easily, diving a little then pulling up to avoid the wood, but no 2 & 3 just ploughed straight into the trees. A fault of AI inexperience? Seen twice.

3. Biggest problem. AI kill-stealing. The AI are eager to nick kills. Not a problem when overwhelmed by the enemy. I`ve learned to let them have the kill and to even nick a kill off them to make up for it. Most often I`ll just look elsewhere.

There you go. Like I said a while before Oleg`s work is a lot more than what`s on the surface. The main work is involved and deep, so flying the sim for a bit on QMB then saying the `AI is just the same` is very misleading. One needs to fly the sim in depth in Campaign and the really complex work shines out. Flying against the AI is a joy now, I never know what`s going to happen next. http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/11.gif

SeaFireLIV...

http://img12.photobucket.com/albums/v31/SeaFireLIV/Old1.jpg

It`s not about the Machine...
(aka: You CAN teach an old dog new tricks!)

leadbaloon
04-01-2004, 02:18 AM
3. Biggest problem. AI kill-stealing. The AI are eager to nick kills. Not a problem when overwhelmed by the enemy. I`ve learned to let them have the kill and to even nick a kill off them to make up for it. Most often I`ll just look elsewhere.


I played online for the first time in ages last night, the human pilots were greedier than the AI when it came to kill stealing http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_eek.gif

SeaFireLIV
04-01-2004, 02:24 AM
Very true. In many respects (I`ve said before) many onliners I`ve come across in DF servers ARE worse than AI! They`ll all chase one target and shoot through eachother, and these are Humans!? http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/images/smiley/16x16_smiley-very-happy.gif

LEXX_Luthor
04-01-2004, 02:50 AM
Human
Rookie
Average
Veteran
Ace

arcadeace
04-01-2004, 02:55 AM
It was a nice read because I can feel more like a man as an offline player. You're one of my faves here even if once in a while I give you a hard time, but next time you post how about getting a little serious, huh?

I don't have much to add simply because I don't observe much http://ubbxforums.ubi.com/infopop/emoticons/icon_smile.gif I'm glad I got it even though I can't play online. The AI is definitely better. If I set the enemy on aces I usually don't make it back. So far I haven't seen any collisions, not to say they haven't occured. I have had them pursue me to friendly AF with flak on numerous occasions. Sometimes I'm surprised at how fast the 110s give chase.

http://www.onpoi.net/ah/pics/users/222_1080289735_2032.gif

SeaFireLIV
04-01-2004, 03:56 AM
er... serious? wha?

arcadeace
04-01-2004, 04:33 AM
Its obvious you're serious. I was kidding. Sometimes I forget I'm relating in this forum.

Bull-Dog.
04-01-2004, 04:38 AM
yes you are right,the AI is better.
I find that they evade better and have become unpredicable when chased. I have also noticed that even thought they gang up on you, (had 5 on my tail last night) you can evade better as they are not the perfect shots they used to be. All in all, more real, more fun, more challanging. I now find myself flying offline for fun not just practice.

http://mysite.freeserve.com/bull_dog/images/3-picture.jpg?0.7185765628443178